RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ?

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RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/21/2009 9:54:40 AM

Posts: 11766
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quote:

...how can females submit to men when we are so flawed essentially, so tainted...

by not putting a prejudiced gender bias into the equation...she doesn't believe that either men or women are inherently flawed or tainted, simply because of their gender.

this slave has met some really awful examples of human beings in both sexes...but doesn't blame it on which color booties they wore as an infant.

people are flawed...and people are also valuable.

quote:

...But the problem is that I just feel it odd when i see female subs, I hadn't seen one in my life till this year so I am still itching and getting goosebumps because of it...

this slave had never seen an adult couple in an intimate relationship who aren't biologically related refer to the male partner as "Daddy" before six years ago and it was shockingly repulsive, the first time this slave encountered it.
with time, she learned there are folks who are fulfilled by it, it makes them feel all warm and fuzzy and loved...besides, it really isn't this slave's place to knock them and call them derogatory names over something that repulses her, personally, is it?

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/21/2009 6:53:03 PM

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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quote:

Is it something permanetly wrong in me or it can be fixed ?

Yeah, there is. It's called either "seflishness" or "parochialism". Look, you KNOW that no matter what the scene looks like, it is just a scene. Yet you insist on painting your own emotions and feelings which you KNOW to be totally incorrect onto the situation. My advice is to open your eyes... look at the scene... and REALLY REALLY SEE what it is that is happening there... not what your inappropriate viewpoint is painting.

For the record, I sympathize totally. I'm not a sadist and had many of these same issues. I just understood that the issue was entirely and solely within me. I seldom get squicked out by stuff anymore although I haven't become any more of a sadist than I ever was.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 12:17:50 PM

Posts: 148
Joined: 12/13/2008
From: Barranquilla city, Colombia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

Is it something permanetly wrong in me or it can be fixed ?

Yeah, there is. It's called either "seflishness" or "parochialism". Look, you KNOW that no matter what the scene looks like, it is just a scene. Yet you insist on painting your own emotions and feelings which you KNOW to be totally incorrect onto the situation. My advice is to open your eyes... look at the scene... and REALLY REALLY SEE what it is that is happening there... not what your inappropriate viewpoint is painting.

For the record, I sympathize totally. I'm not a sadist and had many of these same issues. I just understood that the issue was entirely and solely within me. I seldom get squicked out by stuff anymore although I haven't become any more of a sadist than I ever was.

I guess I should, it's just that....well, I must admit that the lady in the Dom/Sub couple called me and we talked about a couple of hours about the issue....and I do see some things now, but it's still odd to me...I guess it's more like the way a woman would feel if she suddenly had to live under the Shahria or Islamic Law and cover herself with a burka or chador instead of just being who she is in the Western world. I just feel so...out of place, against the very nature of what i belñieve when I see women submitting..I do accept it takes great strenght, sometimes more than a man's to submit because our submission is different in a small part which can be a great counterweight and release valve, but it's something I am still exploring and learning. And the Dom is healing fine, I took the liberty to prescribe him some treatments and talk to some friends to speed up his recovery and I guess it does make up for a little of it.

_____________________________

Power without Purpose is the same as an Artist without a Brush

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 12:22:16 PM

Posts: 148
Joined: 12/13/2008
From: Barranquilla city, Colombia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

...how can females submit to men when we are so flawed essentially, so tainted...

by not putting a prejudiced gender bias into the equation...she doesn't believe that either men or women are inherently flawed or tainted, simply because of their gender.

this slave has met some really awful examples of human beings in both sexes...but doesn't blame it on which color booties they wore as an infant.

people are flawed...and people are also valuable.

quote:

...But the problem is that I just feel it odd when i see female subs, I hadn't seen one in my life till this year so I am still itching and getting goosebumps because of it...

this slave had never seen an adult couple in an intimate relationship who aren't biologically related refer to the male partner as "Daddy" before six years ago and it was shockingly repulsive, the first time this slave encountered it.
with time, she learned there are folks who are fulfilled by it, it makes them feel all warm and fuzzy and loved...besides, it really isn't this slave's place to knock them and call them derogatory names over something that repulses her, personally, is it?

I guess I must learn my tolerance. Sorry, it's just that in our culture, it's not like we cultivate the seeds of tolerance and understanding so dedicatedly as we should.....which would explain why we've had a war for more than half a century....but anyways, I guess it's somewhat right. If I told a lady here of my BDSM fantasies, even though my people after the dividing decided to choose a more gynocratic path, I'd most likely face expulsion and alienation at the least, if not a public repudiation and to be disowned by my family. It's simply something that repulses women here, even if they want an enjoy their position of power, as they would see it as disgusting and pathetic weakness....so yes, I see your point, what we are and do is ours to enjoy and for others to just accept or tolerate.

_____________________________

Power without Purpose is the same as an Artist without a Brush

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 12:32:56 PM

LillyoftheVally

Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
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Is culture used as an excuse? See because I think if you are aware that it is a cultural thing then it is pretty easy to transcend it. Culture isn't nature.

The thing is why do you need to learn to tolerate it? What would you do without this lesson?

I am well aware that in the western world men are meant to be strong and masculine and therefore male subs must be weak and pathetic (actually an idea really reinforced by some subs) but my awareness of this means I can question it. D/s is not about abuse, or weakness or anything like that, it is about doing what feels right for you as an individual, for that reason you need to live and let live, that does not mean you have to want it for yourself or even want to think about it it means simply that it is none of your business.

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 2:54:05 PM

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Joined: 5/13/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan
It's simple to me, that submission is something different for everyone, but it's just that I don't see much how can females submit to men when we are so flawed essentially, so tainted.

Here's your problem right here. You're squarely in the 'women are superior' camp. That's fine (I guess). There are some who agree with you.

What you have to understand is there is at least an equal amount who believe the exact opposite of you -- that females are inferior.

And there is yet another equal amount who feel that it doesn't matter what a person's got between their legs, they are all equal.

And yet there is another group that just doesn't give a rat's ass either way.

The simple solution is to do as you like, and let others do as they like. Look at it from a Dominant/submissive view rather than a male/female view.

_____________________________

"'Till the roof comes off, 'till the lights go out
'Till my legs give out, can't shut my mouth."

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 2:57:16 PM

LillyoftheVally

Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
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I agree with ^^

Also in relation to the quote he used then, it is concerning to me that you think only men are flawed when indeed that is a human trait

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

(in reply to Loki45)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 5:15:37 PM

Posts: 76
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Lancashire, UK
Status: offline

I struggled with it for a while- I don't think anyone is inherently superior, yet seeing maledom was difficult for me. But basically, taking the time to get more knowledge about the subject, and desensitizing myself seemed to work. I'm now quite happy to watch a M/f scene, in fact I managed to flog a female sub friend of mine at a club, just for fun.

Remember that she enjoys it. If it's in the proper place, be happy for her, that she's lucky enough to be in a situation she enjoys with a man she trusts.

(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 7:42:24 PM

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Joined: 6/8/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Since when do South American women hold higher power in society and family than their men do?
Except maybe in Cali, which is renowned for the beauty of their women.

Certainly not in Ecuador where Lorena Bobbitt is practically a patron saint to previously downtrodden women who for the first time can gain some power by reminding him he has to sleep sometimes and she has the sharp knives at her disposal.

I'm submissive, but I am not beaten, abused or humiliated.

And if these people get off on doing this in public, in front of people who haven't consented to see it, they deserve to go to jail - not you.

People who find rough sex to whatever degree exciting should do it at home, not in the grocery store. If I see some guy backhand his kid or wife in the store I'm not going to believe they're in a d/s relationship and as HOH he can do whatever he wants. I will call the cops.

First of, Cali, in Colombia, my country, is kind of a bad example since in latter years they have been contaminated a lot by the gene-trash of the Andes region with their customs, but my people tend to hold woman in a respected place. I am part of the caribbean region, but my people predate the palenques and others cultural groups as I descend from what soem may call gypsies.

Contaminated by the gene-trash of the Andres region? Those damn Indians just keep screwing things up for good people, don't they? So backwards and ignorant. They should stay in the interior where they belong.

*Yes, my response is sarcastic.
*Yes, racism AND classism piss me off.

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/22/2009 7:56:11 PM

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Joined: 6/8/2008
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And I was so annoyed by the gene-trash comment I forgot to add the rest of my post.

I am submissive to him but not less than him. We are partners with different roles and responsiblities. I don't know this for a fact but would venture a guess to say a decent percentage of fem-dom relationships work under the same principal. Unless, of course, the folks involved do believe that one is actually a superior being to the other and that's ok too. How someone else defines their relationships is not my business or concern. I'll worry about mine, you worry about yours, and we'll end up just fine.

(in reply to newone11)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/23/2009 5:36:24 PM

Posts: 3991
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

It absolutely does NOT set "the fem. movement back" in any way whatsoever. Anyone with a brain knows the fem. movement was about CHOICE. And so, any woman submitting to a man has made that CHOICE. Neat how that works, huh?

Those men that see a woman on her knees and think "Ah-HA! I KNEW they were all needy, cock-craving sluts inside!" Those that thinking being called a bitch, cunt or slut a cutsey endearment don't realize that there are those men that can't keep it in the context of play and actually believed we all find it acceptable.

There's no great mystery behind your opinions... your profile openly states, "Traditionally Married for 36 years" (i.e., man in charge), while here you identify as a Domme (i.e., woman in charge). Obviously there were some issues that make these things hot-buttons for you, adding bias. I don't know your experience, but certianly you've encountered male subs who also wish to be referred to in less than ideal ways... maybe as part of humiliation play or something else, yes? Are ALL male subs who kneel in front of you "needy, cunt-craving, wimps inside" simply from the act of kneeling? As with most, your past appears to be influencing your present. They are not victims any more than the male subs who submit to you.

And here's a shocker... some femsubs/femslaves ARE "needy" and seek a Dominant to care for and set boundaries for them; and unless they're gay, obviously "crave" (i.e., desire) a man's cock.... all under the guise of CENSENT and CHOICE. Not part of any theoretical "link" of any "chain" or anything else... just two kinky people that enjoy their particular dynamic.

_____________________________

It's only kinky the first time!!!

(in reply to LotusSong)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/23/2009 9:42:50 PM

Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan
it's still odd to me...I guess it's more like the way a woman would feel if she suddenly had to live under the Shahria or Islamic Law and cover herself with a burka or chador instead of just being who she is in the Western world. I just feel so...out of place, against the very nature of what i belñieve when I see women submitting

Wow - this is *WAY* more demeaning and derogatory toward women than consensual female submission is! Being subjected to the sight of a woman being *consensually* humiliated isn't anything like having to live under laws which would sentence you to being stoned to death for showing your ankle!

< Message edited by Andalusite -- 7/23/2009 9:43:20 PM >

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 7:28:52 AM

Posts: 98
Status: offline

We are perverts remember? Often what appears is not the gist of the situation or relationship.

Example: He thinks his submissive is just peachy. He knows she's bright, educated, sensual and she makes terrific blueberry waffles every morning. He adores her. He adores her so much and it's mutual. She admires him so much she listens intently, hanging on every word, she takes his advice to heart, she lusts loves cares passionately and feels a need to demonstate her loyalty, affection.
You may see him appear to be treating her like shit - but it's a spin. Backwards and a mindfuck on us all but they know and understand. We perverts are something, huh?

take care now

(in reply to Andalusite)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:12:42 AM

Posts: 148
Joined: 12/13/2008
From: Barranquilla city, Colombia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: newone11

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Since when do South American women hold higher power in society and family than their men do?
Except maybe in Cali, which is renowned for the beauty of their women.

Certainly not in Ecuador where Lorena Bobbitt is practically a patron saint to previously downtrodden women who for the first time can gain some power by reminding him he has to sleep sometimes and she has the sharp knives at her disposal.

I'm submissive, but I am not beaten, abused or humiliated.

And if these people get off on doing this in public, in front of people who haven't consented to see it, they deserve to go to jail - not you.

People who find rough sex to whatever degree exciting should do it at home, not in the grocery store. If I see some guy backhand his kid or wife in the store I'm not going to believe they're in a d/s relationship and as HOH he can do whatever he wants. I will call the cops.

First of, Cali, in Colombia, my country, is kind of a bad example since in latter years they have been contaminated a lot by the gene-trash of the Andes region with their customs, but my people tend to hold woman in a respected place. I am part of the caribbean region, but my people predate the palenques and others cultural groups as I descend from what soem may call gypsies.

Contaminated by the gene-trash of the Andres region? Those damn Indians just keep screwing things up for good people, don't they? So backwards and ignorant. They should stay in the interior where they belong.

*Yes, my response is sarcastic.
*Yes, racism AND classism piss me off.

YES, the gene-trash from the Andes region, the people from Bogota, Medellin and the areas surrounding their provincial territories are that. And they are NOT Indians. In my country, everything bad comes from them: Guerrilla rebels and kidnappers, paramilitary death squads, oppressive army/police officers and soldiers, drug cartels, child prostitution, horrible crimes.

¿ Who do you think invented the chainsaw massacre ? They did.

In our culture, we wouldn't take a chainsaw to eviscerate the fetus of a pregnant woman. They do.

Different regional ethics and traditions, they are just a horde of rats and vermin, a swarm of locusts or a pack of hungry and rabid dogs.

So forgive me for hating them, I killed enough of their trash during our war, as all men must serve in the military here for a year and a half to 2 years and I did not enjoy the action, but yes, the result of putting a stop to the spread of their disease, their culture and identity, I hate them and will always do.

You cannot understand it, the same way you couldn't understand hatred between Palestinians and Israelis, or Pakistanies and Indians, because you aren't here and even if you were, you do not belong to any of the factions so please don't try to see me as racist because it's nott he whole issue, even if there is a truth in the term.

< Message edited by Dastan -- 7/24/2009 8:15:43 AM >

_____________________________

Power without Purpose is the same as an Artist without a Brush

(in reply to newone11)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:18:42 AM

Posts: 148
Joined: 12/13/2008
From: Barranquilla city, Colombia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan
it's still odd to me...I guess it's more like the way a woman would feel if she suddenly had to live under the Shahria or Islamic Law and cover herself with a burka or chador instead of just being who she is in the Western world. I just feel so...out of place, against the very nature of what i belñieve when I see women submitting

Wow - this is *WAY* more demeaning and derogatory toward women than consensual female submission is! Being subjected to the sight of a woman being *consensually* humiliated isn't anything like having to live under laws which would sentence you to being stoned to death for showing your ankle!

I tried to use an example as how did I feel MYSELF out of place in the concept that to my view, accepting the female submission is a yoke as heavy and tiresome as to chaff under it the same as if a woman from teh free world had to change her dress for a Burkha in Afghanistan, but maybe you had your head so far high up your ass you didn't get the metaphor.

_____________________________

Power without Purpose is the same as an Artist without a Brush

(in reply to Andalusite)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:21:12 AM

LillyoftheVally

Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline

Dastan, you are basically saying that women do not have the right to choose what makes them happy, that makes you more oppressive to women than any consensual D/s relationship could ever be

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:22:34 AM

Posts: 148
Joined: 12/13/2008
From: Barranquilla city, Colombia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

I agree with ^^

Also in relation to the quote he used then, it is concerning to me that you think only men are flawed when indeed that is a human trait

Well, the fact is that as a man, and seeing humanity at its worst, i know for a fact that man is more of a force of nature, an almost exclusively/purely instinctive creature capable of descending to the depths of inhumanity than a woman is. I saw war and although I saw my share of attrocities commited, instigated or even planned by women, those were a grain of sand in the dune of male-led actions, and I know full well the nature of manhood in its darkest rooms and corners.

I just don't see women as persons who can be at our level. I don't feel inferior to women, but I do feel they operate on a higher level in some areas of their souls and hearts. I must say it is why I think that I have an strong aversion to see women touched by some of the filth in the world, and why I consider them a better part of humanity.

_____________________________

Power without Purpose is the same as an Artist without a Brush

(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:23:54 AM

Posts: 1436
Joined: 9/21/2007
From: OK
Status: offline

Dastan, as a woman who is also a Mistress, besides being submissive,

You have a LOT of pent up anger issues to deal with before being able to be in a happy and healthy relationship. thats my advice anyway, that you should look into some counceling.

_____________________________

Resident Hell Cat

(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:26:17 AM

LillyoftheVally

Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan

quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

I agree with ^^

Also in relation to the quote he used then, it is concerning to me that you think only men are flawed when indeed that is a human trait

Well, the fact is that as a man, and seeing humanity at its worst, i know for a fact that man is more of a force of nature, an almost exclusively/purely instinctive creature capable of descending to the depths of inhumanity than a woman is. I saw war and although I saw my share of attrocities commited, instigated or even planned by women, those were a grain of sand in the dune of male-led actions, and I know full well the nature of manhood in its darkest rooms and corners.

I just don't see women as persons who can be at our level. I don't feel inferior to women, but I do feel they operate on a higher level in some areas of their souls and hearts. I must say it is why I think that I have an strong aversion to see women touched by some of the filth in the world, and why I consider them a better part of humanity.

Then you have never been in a female pub toilet.

Defining characteristics based on genitals regardless of which sex you are favouring is a flawed method of classification. Your war example falls flat as women have fought in wars, and if you want to see attrocities committed by women look up Thatcher. Sorry but I find you rather offensive to be fair.

< Message edited by LillyoftheVally -- 7/24/2009 8:27:00 AM >

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

(in reply to Dastan)

RE: How to Learn to Tolerate Females Dominated by Men ? - 7/24/2009 8:39:36 AM

Posts: 1307
Joined: 9/3/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dastan
. I just feel so...out of place, against the very nature of what i belñieve when I see women submitting..

This may sound a bit strange, but in your way you are in a position where you are wanting only to see women dominate. Becasue of your view, you see it as wrong. Youa re now imposing your will over their enjoyment. So, they are still under a man's will. You, instead of the dom. You want a woman you revere to give up what brings her pleasure becasue it makes you uncomfortable? Then you are no better to her than the Dominant you believe is mistreating her.

If you cant watch, then look away. Not everyone is cut out to have voyeuristic tendancies. Public play isnt for you, and youd be more comfortable keping your kink to yourself and not trying to fit into a mixed community where the submissive women are highly visible.

DV

_____________________________

Separately we are DiurnalVampire and DVsFox

10/18 Wedding date. 1 year and still blissfully happy

10/13/10 3 year anniversary of his becoming my Fox

Talk impolitely to me, baby - Thanks sunshinemiss

(in reply to Dastan)

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