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ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
One could write a thesis but no one is going to read a thesis on a thread but to try to be concise, politics tends to be based on selfish interest and like any political theory so is feminism and those women that espouse feminism tend to be interested in their own interests and not the interests in women in general or interested in the interests of women in general as long as it suits their own interests. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with that, selfish interest motivates the majority of us but to put a veneer of idealistic sisterhood on it and putting themselves on a pedestal as though they believe in some higher cause, well nooo!

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ORIGINAL: amayos

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ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Alright, I just have to ask, what is "the feminist movement?"

An admittedly more subtle yet arguably more persuasive and numerous faction of mindset than the first, the supporters of which constitute radical liberal politicians and their well-meaning and not-so-well-meaning supporters, more than one college curriculum which has often taken on the role of disseminating doctrine and intellectual propaganda on behalf of the aforementioned political body (in the name of equality and 'well-roundedness'), the massive Hollywood and entertainment media femisinformation influence seen virtually everywhere which repeatedly enforces a women rule, men drool satirical—and sometimes not so satirical—content, and (my personal favorite) heady, smarmy intellectuals who contain a ponderous bias in support of liberal feminist politics yet often pretend to pursue "fairness" and "balance" in literary, radio, television or internet-based discourse.

For examples on that last point cloudboy, take a look in the mirror.

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ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

I will just say that generally, activism is very thankless, hard, non-tangibly rewarding work and people who engage in it consistently are pretty remarkable people.

And I haven't seen anyone here suggest feminism as some idealistic sisterhood or putting anyone on pedastals.

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ORIGINAL: Tristan

Many have written about how they do not understand why some people get angry with feminism.  I think there were many good posts explaining the reasons.  I think that the basic reason is that feminism, in general, promotes a negative attitude toward a particular gender in order to promote a political agenda.  I think it's that simple. 

Feminism is the only movement that can do this too.  If any other movement used negative statements about another group (with the exception of muslims or arabs), they would not get positive media attention.  You can say things about men that you can not say about any other group.  How do people who talk about fairness justify these negative statements and attitudes? 

I think what many who crisized feminism are saying is that they want fairness and balance.  This is what I hear most often as feminism's main critism.  No matter how angry or how many issues you have with the opposite gender, don't forget that you have a 50/50 chance of having children of that gender.  We as a species seem to have a strong desire to divide labor based on gender.  That doesn't mean we still can not have fairness in this division of labor.  However, fairness is not going to happen with the promotion of negative attitudes toward a particular group.

Tristan

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ORIGINAL: Tristan

Feminism is the only movement that can do this too. If any other movement used negative statements about another group (with the exception of muslims or arabs), they would not get positive media attention. You can say things about men that you can not say about any other group. How do people who talk about fairness justify these negative statements and attitudes?

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ORIGINAL: Tristan

Many have written about how they do not understand why some people get angry with feminism.  I think there were many good posts explaining the reasons.  I think that the basic reason is that feminism, in general, promotes a negative attitude toward a particular gender in order to promote a political agenda.  I think it's that simple. 

Feminism is the only movement that can do this too.  If any other movement used negative statements about another group (with the exception of muslims or arabs), they would not get positive media attention.  You can say things about men that you can not say about any other group.  How do people who talk about fairness justify these negative statements and attitudes? 

I think what many who crisized feminism are saying is that they want fairness and balance.  This is what I hear most often as feminism's main critism.  No matter how angry or how many issues you have with the opposite gender, don't forget that you have a 50/50 chance of having children of that gender.  We as a species seem to have a strong desire to divide labor based on gender.  That doesn't mean we still can not have fairness in this division of labor.  However, fairness is not going to happen with the promotion of negative attitudes toward a particular group.

Tristan

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ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Someday, you'll have to tell me what "faction of mindset" is.

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ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

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ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
One could write a thesis but no one is going to read a thesis on a thread but to try to be concise, politics tends to be based on selfish interest and like any political theory so is feminism and those women that espouse feminism tend to be interested in their own interests and not the interests in women in general or interested in the interests of women in general as long as it suits their own interests. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with that, selfish interest motivates the majority of us but to put a veneer of idealistic sisterhood on it and putting themselves on a pedestal as though they believe in some higher cause, well nooo!

I will just say that generally, activism is very thankless, hard, non-tangibly rewarding work and people who engage in it consistently are pretty remarkable people.

And I haven't seen anyone here suggest feminism as some idealistic sisterhood or putting anyone on pedastals.

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Wow you must live in a very different reality than I then.

Most social movements, in fact I can't think of a single one that does not fit this, say negative things about the opposing views or the opposing arguments -- whether its about race, religion, gender, legal or civil rights, there will always be extreme views in any social movement. That's part of rhetoric in fact (not the best practices in it but still part of it).

To claim that feminism is the only one seems very unrealistic.

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ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
Hmm many a feminist/misandrist/pissed off bitch has got herself rich and well known by writing a provocative book that if mirrored by a male would be condemned as misogynist..

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As for activists being remarkable people, let's think of a few, Osama Bin Laden, Lenin, Moa, Marx....I guess it just depends which side of the fence you are on as to whether someone is remarkable of not.

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ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Hmm many a feminist/misandrist/pissed off bitch has got herself rich and well known by writing a provocative book that if mirrored by a male would be condemned as misogynist..

As for activists being remarkable people, let's think of a few, Osama Bin Laden, Lenin, Moa, Marx....I guess it just depends which side of the fence you are on as to whether someone is remarkable of not.

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ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

You're playing the same hyperbole card you tried before and it's just as irrelevant.. 

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ORIGINAL: Tristan

Many have written about how they do not understand why some people get angry with feminism.  I think there were many good posts explaining the reasons.  I think that the basic reason is that feminism, in general, promotes a negative attitude toward a particular gender in order to promote a political agenda.  I think it's that simple. 

Feminism is the only movement that can do this too.  If any other movement used negative statements about another group (with the exception of muslims or arabs), they would not get positive media attention.  You can say things about men that you can not say about any other group.  How do people who talk about fairness justify these negative statements and attitudes? 

I think what many who crisized feminism are saying is that they want fairness and balance.  This is what I hear most often as feminism's main critism.  No matter how angry or how many issues you have with the opposite gender, don't forget that you have a 50/50 chance of having children of that gender.  We as a species seem to have a strong desire to divide labor based on gender.  That doesn't mean we still can not have fairness in this division of labor.  However, fairness is not going to happen with the promotion of negative attitudes toward a particular group.

Tristan

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ORIGINAL: Real0ne

This hatred of feminism wasnt so much from the men as it was from the majority of the women, who the minority dragged into the feminist way of life against their will.

How many feminists that have been in the news do you know married and had a happy life? family? i can name pages of non feminists who have.

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the tragic effects that feminism has had on society as a whole

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ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Hmm many a feminist/misandrist/pissed off bitch has got herself rich and well known by writing a provocative book that if mirrored by a male would be condemned as misogynist..

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ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

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ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

You're playing the same hyperbole card you tried before and it's just as irrelevant..

"All men are rapists and that's all they are" -- Marilyn French, Author, "The Women's Room"

"I feel that 'man-hating' is an honorable and viable political act, that the oppressed have a right to class-hatred against the class that is oppressing them." -- Robin Morgan, MS. Magazine Editor

"I believe that women have a capacity for understanding and compassion which a man structurally does not have, does not have it because he cannot have it. He's just incapable of it." -- Former Congresswoman Barbara Jordan

"I claim that rape exists any time sexual intercourse occurs when it has not been initiated by the woman, out of her own genuine affection and desire." -- Robin Morgan

"Heterosexual intercourse is the pure, formalized expression of contempt for women's bodies." -- Andrea Dworkin

"And if the professional rapist is to be separated from the average dominant heterosexual [male], it may be mainly a quantitative difference." -- Susan Griffin "Rape: The All-American Crime"

"The institution of sexual intercourse is anti-feminist" -- Ti-Grace Atkinson "Amazon Odyssey" (p. 86)

"When a woman reaches orgasm with a man she is only collaborating with the patriarchal system, eroticizing her own oppression..." -- Sheila Jeffrys

In order to raise children with equality, we must take them away from families and communally raise them." (Dr. Mary Jo Bane, feminist and assistant professor of education at Wellesley College and associate director of the school's Center for Research on Woman).

"The simple fact is that every woman must be willing to be identified as a lesbian to be fully feminist." -U.S. National organization for Women Times.

"The end of the institution of marriage is a necessary condition for the liberation of women. Therefore it is important for us to encourage women to leave their husbands..." -Declaration of Feminism

"A good part-and definitely the most fun part-of being a feminist is about frightening men." --Julie Burchill (b. 1960), British journalist, author. Time Out (London, 16 Nov. 1989).

...rape is the perfected act of male sexuality in a patriarchal culture-- it is the ultimate metaphor for domination, violence, subjugation, and possession. -- Robin Morgan

The list is endless.

Osama bin laden is hardly hyperbole. He's a pussy cat!

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ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

Otherwise I could cite numerous "Christian" statements that are equally as nasty about women, about minorities, about politics and about other religions and claim all Christians are this way.