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RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/20/2009 12:59:04 AM

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And... sadism is a subset of narcissism. A narcissist lacks empathy, and compulsively seeks reaction or attention as self validation. The more extreme the response, the more personal validation is experienced. A narcissist thrives on power/energy transfer, because they feel an absence of it within themself. A narcissist is dependent on their enabler, who in turn is co-dependent on the narcissist. NPD is like a plague in the "lifestyle." And by its very nature, a narcissist will deny it.

See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder
http://www.narcissism101.com/

< Message edited by aldompdx -- 9/20/2009 1:01:27 AM >

(in reply to Acer49)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/20/2009 8:01:28 AM

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i would endure the pain to show my Master my devotion. Whether i liked it or not.

(in reply to Acer49)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/20/2009 11:08:12 AM

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well this is something that touches me in a personal way.

First... Not all Tears are created Equal.

Faking pain/tears are a major turn off .... just like a fake orgasm/pleasure would be a huge turn off... in fact... such action would be a huge breach of trust in my relationship with my girls. Integrity is of huge importance to me and this relationship.

Reasons behind the tears are much more important to me than the tears themselves. Crying because a parent passed away would only make me sad with them and I would open my compassion and seek to support them through the pain of it. Tears cause by me without my intention would also not be something that I find particular pleasing. However... tears caused by my actions within my motivation and intention to cause such pain is FUCKING HOT!!! It not only gets me hot knowing I caused them with intent... but also can control and affect it's duration. Then the thing that gets me even more aroused.. is they come to me for comfort! I cause it... I keep it going... and they seek comfort from me. Sometimes they might beg for it to end... that really doesn't do it... it's that comfort ..... the paradox of the giver of pain and comforting of the pain is absolutely delicious!

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to worthlesstrash)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/20/2009 11:11:37 AM

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You know, for someone who is not a masochist, that made a LOT of sense to me KOM, thanks!

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War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

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(in reply to KnightofMists)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/20/2009 10:09:33 PM

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Well, I was a good lil slave and I took every bit of it. I cried, I moaned, and I let him do whatever he wanted. When one thing was too much, he switched to something a tad different to help me take more. I can assure him my tears were real, but I am grateful he was pleased. I talked to him about building things up because we haven't really done too much in this area and he understood. I am glad we are now able to talk things out, I am sure it will make a world of difference.

thank you so much for your responses..I have been trying to catch up from being gone most of the weekend..but wanted to let you know I appreciated them.

_____________________________

~anne

This girl is a slave, but she is also a woman full of love, life, and who has a ton of interests.
Don't judge a book by it's name, judge it by it's content..

His since 10/06/2006
SLRN 166-164-858

(in reply to puella)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/21/2009 7:56:30 AM

CreativeDominant

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quote:

ORIGINAL: worthlesstrash

I have wondered about this before, but another thread brought it to the forefront of my mind again.

Sometimes M hurts me so bad that I cry. I cry from the pain, I cry from trying to figure out why he wants to hurt me, and I cry just because the stupid tears start and I can't stop them.

I'm a bit confused here...haven't read all the way through the thread yet and it is Monday morning but...if you are referring to scening, which the reference to pain would seem to indicate, then why are you trying to figure out why he wants to hurt you? If he is an out-and-out sadistic dominant or even a dominant with sadistic tendencies, then you should already KNOW why he wants to hurt you. As for why he wants to see tears, some sadistic folks like that...I know I do.

quote:

He is such a caring person, honestly. When we get done, he always asks if I am okay and all of that and really means it. It's just as he is doing it, the crying turns him on more and he certainly doesn't make him stop the act.

Again...why would it? Unless you have set up the act of tears as your safeword, why should the fact that you are crying stop a SADISTIC dominant from inflicting pain? And how does the fact that he revels in sadistic pleasure take away from the fact that he cares about you? It seems to be that you are confusing the psychological definition of a sadist with the BDSM definition of a sadist. In psychological circles, a patient diagnosed as a sadist is someone who gets off sexually on causing pain to someone. They do not care whether or not consent is given, they do not care about their partner, their pleasure and their purpose is all about them. They do not care about "safewords" (naturally...if they don't care whether or not their partner consented, then why would they bother with safewords?). They don't care whether or not their partner enjoys receiving pain...as a matter of fact, I would think that a clinical sadist would find it preferable if their partner did not like pain...it would make the receiver's reaction that much more of a turn-on to the sadist.
A BDSM sadist, on the other hand, oftentimes wants a partner who enjoys at least some level of pain. While in most cases, the turn-on from inflicting pain is sexual, the BDSM sadist is able to differentiate between the mental and emotional and sexual aspects and enjoy one or two without necessarily enjoying the other. The infliction of pain is often tied to the D/s aspect of the dynamic...it is a way of demonstrating control over the submissive partner. Sometimes it is a way of taking control of a submissive partner who has been "slacking" or a way of regenerating excitement or even a way of delivering punishment. In the BDSM/ D/s sense though, none of this has to preclude caring about your partner.

quote:

I know there probably isn't some pat. answer to this, but I am curious what about it does "it" for you?

For me, tears are a turn-on. What they mean can vary from submissive masochist to submissive masochist. With my first submissive, her tears were often an indication of a cathartic release of anger over various things in her earlier years. With my second submissive, they were an indication of a processing of the pain. In her case, they indicated she had gotten past the point of just feeling the pain and was beginning to feel the pleasure that the pain brought her as a masochist.

(in reply to worthlesstrash)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/21/2009 9:32:12 AM

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I think I have just not really been around very many sadists really more than just for a scene or two here and there. M has not really shown me this part of him much, so it's just something new I am experiencing. I am glad he is letting me see all parts of him and what really brings him pleasure, I would never want my M to hold back making me to fulfill his needs.

At first I just didn't get it, but as we have done more and more together this week, I am starting to understand him a bit more. I am finding that during it rather than feeling put upon, or letting myself go into an emotional place, I close my eyes and just relish in the fact he is sharing so much of himself with me..and that he chose me to serve him.

_____________________________

~anne

This girl is a slave, but she is also a woman full of love, life, and who has a ton of interests.
Don't judge a book by it's name, judge it by it's content..

His since 10/06/2006
SLRN 166-164-858

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/22/2009 4:01:40 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kccuckoldmist

I am a sadists and I very much can have a natural reaction of it just turns me on. Now I can also feel sorry or wish I was not causing pain but that does take a seat to my natural arousal.

Another attraction to seeing my slave take pain for me is it is a phenomenal touching thing to see how much they care for me to take it. That certainly tugs at the heart strings and goes to part of the arousal.

Yup we need a "What She Said" smilie.

I get sexual arousal from tears, that they care for me enough to take it is secondary but it is nice to comfort them after I release and have calmed down some.

(in reply to kccuckoldmist)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/22/2009 5:13:11 PM

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~ Fast Reply ~

quote:

Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry?

#1 - I am a sadist, a 'sexual sadist' at that. Neither proud or embarrassed to say so, but I am. Not to be confused with the CSI or Law & Order version of the use of the term; usually followed by one or more of the following modifiers; 'psychopathic', 'dysfunctional', 'predator'.

I have been extremely fortunate to have found a partner who is a compatible masochist. Our desires and sensation stimulation are very compatible. I have made her cry many times as a result of those sensations; however her tears are inconsequential. They are not a desired goal going into any exchange, but if they are the result it doesn't affect, or change, what I'm doing. I can represent confidently that generating tears is not a matter of intensity or type of play. beth has cried over a hand spanking and not uttered a sound when hit with a paddle. The only unique response was using one particularly nasty paddle made for me by 'WyldHrt' which got its name from beth's vocal reaction. It's called; "Master! - I think I shit myself!" paddle. Well, she didn't and her twice breaching third person speech earned her two more swats with it. But thats not on topic. On topic - interestingly enough - she didn't cry.

Tears don't make me more excited, or make the exchange more erotic. beth tells me they are purging and cathartic and although I can usually tell when she needs a 'good spanking'; I can't always predict if that spanking will or won't generate tears. We feel if they come they were necessary on some level that even after all this time, we've yet to understand.

beth is a masochist. Probably more extreme in her desire for masochistic sensation than I am extreme in my sadistic desire, at least in consideration of the physical. On the mental, emotional aspects I think we are at least equal, with me getting maybe a little edge in that regard. We have one big thing in common besides each other. Until we met both of us heard from any number of partners and potential parters; "you are sick!" Well - I guess together we have the masochistic, sadistic version of a leper colony. Don't visit if you don't want to catch the disease.

I'm always amazed how many people shy away from being labeled a 'sadist'. Why? It doesn't make you a bad person as long as you take on the responsibility that goes with it. It is distinguishable from Dominant; because dominance infers control. Ideally if you run into a sadist he's also dominant over himself. As any dominant should be before attempting to project their dominance on another individual.

How do you tell you are hanging out with a sadist? Do they like the 'Three Stooges'? Thinking about it, that may be too antiquated a show. Well, if someone trips, they are the first to laugh. Do they take off the tops of salt shakers at restaurants leaving them for the next party at the table? They may say 'whoops!' and 'sorry' if they put a clamp on too tight, or hit a tender spot; but if you listen closely - you'll hear them giggle a little under their breath.

Hey - sadists are people too! We need love and affection!

< Message edited by Mercnbeth -- 9/22/2009 5:14:08 PM >

(in reply to CougarStud)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/22/2009 9:01:27 PM

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quote:

The only unique response was using one particularly nasty paddle made for me by 'WyldHrt' which got its name from beth's vocal reaction. It's called; "Master! - I think I shit myself!" paddle.

quote:

Well, she didn't and her twice breaching third person speech earned her two more swats with it. But thats not on topic. On topic - interestingly enough - she didn't cry.

I did.
Unfortunately for me, the "I shit myself!" paddle has a little brother that lives in my toybag.

_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
"We've had complaints about 'orgy noises'. This is not the neighborhood for that kind of thing"- PVE Cop

Resident "Hypnotic Eyes", "Cleavage" and "Toy Whore"
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(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/22/2009 9:17:07 PM

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I was going to leave this thread alone until I saw a couple of entries. As KnightofMists mentioned, this is only regarding tears during play.

I used to play with a gal back in GA that I was very fond of. When the tears would fall down her face, it was a great release for her. Every tear that she cried when we played together made Me feel closer to her. That was her way to her "happy place" and I was on the other end of that. When her tears would fall, it was like the ignition to blast off for space.

I taste the tears of any bottom who cries when we are playing together. They are Mine and they belong to Me. I enjoy each and every one of them.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

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Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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(in reply to WyldHrt)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/23/2009 7:23:56 AM

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wow, I really enjoyed your post. It was very thought provoking and honest, I got a lot out of it. It made me think about M being a sadist. I guess I just never realized he was one, honestly. I mean, I knew he liked to hurt me some or make me struggle, but I never knew that he actually wanted to see tears, or cause me a lot more than he has over the years. I wonder now after reading your post if he was a bit afraid to admit that part of himself, even with me. Maybe he thought it would turn me off or scare me off, I really don't know. Maybe in my own way I am afraid of it, though not afraid of him.

I worry that although I want to please him so very much, I won't ever be the masochist he is wanting. That doesn't mean I won't take what he dishes out, but I can't say that it will bring me pleasure for the most part. I have been reminding myself that it's not my pleasure that's important though, it's his. I want him happy and pleased, I want him to be free to be what he is, I love that he will let go that way with me. I think I am relishing in those moments and they are starting to make the other times not seem so bad. He says he believes I really am turned on by the pain as my body is reacting in ways he doesn't see it doing if I wasn't. I don't know, maybe I am in some ways, though probably not in the typical way. It's not really the pain that gets me, I think it's the fact I have no control over it, I am being used, I am at that moment nothing, and everything to him all at once.

I just don't know.

edited to add: Just in case I have ever given the wrong idea. My M never likes to see me cry in any other situation..sad, upset, etc. It's only during our play..just wanted to clear that up.

< Message edited by worthlesstrash -- 9/23/2009 7:24:56 AM >

_____________________________

~anne

This girl is a slave, but she is also a woman full of love, life, and who has a ton of interests.
Don't judge a book by it's name, judge it by it's content..

His since 10/06/2006
SLRN 166-164-858

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/23/2009 7:50:03 AM

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quote:

It's not really the pain that gets me, I think it's the fact I have no control over it, I am being used, I am at that moment nothing, and everything to him all at once.

anne,
I think the above part of your post is the heart of the issue.

You are not "nothing" you are the object of his attention; consider it an 'honor'. You earned his time, his desire, his effort. I don't represent I know how 'sub space' works; but I have heard it represents a mindset of 'body abandonment'; an internalized processing of the sensations resulting in pleasure, a pleasure derived from being 'used'. All people get there in different ways, that is just one of them.

Tears, well you can't rely on them to tell you anything. Like many have said, if I come home and find beth crying on the bed, I'm going to find out what's wrong and try my best to comfort her and make it right. During play, they are just one of many potential, and likely, body fluid exchange.
Have Fun! Good luck!

(in reply to worthlesstrash)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/23/2009 7:55:11 AM

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quote:

You are not "nothing" you are the object of his attention; consider it an 'honor'. You earned his time, his desire, his effort.

Thank you! I will hold onto the above and remember it each and every time. I think as we do this more, I will open up and keep finding more pleasure in just being chosen his. That he would be himself in such a way, open himself up by sharing this with me..it is an honor.

_____________________________

~anne

This girl is a slave, but she is also a woman full of love, life, and who has a ton of interests.
Don't judge a book by it's name, judge it by it's content..

His since 10/06/2006
SLRN 166-164-858

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/25/2009 8:54:18 PM

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For most of the subs and slaves I have worked with, crying was part of their release. It was just a natural part of what they were experiencing at the time. They love the pain of the whip, but yes, it hurts and they cry. The flow of tears and the tension and release of their muscles in response to the stimuli of whatever implement you are using all combine to relieve their stress and allows them to release pent up and often painful emotions. They return clean, clear, and in a state of surrender that would not have been achieved had they not completed that release.

Seeing them cry is not the turn on, although I will admit I love to taste her tears on her cheeks as I caress and calm her following her beating. The turn on is knowing that they are going to that wonderful place that allows them to be that magical creature I love so much. The creature they can only truly become when they have let go of all of life's misery and surrender to my will. The crying and sobbing stops soon enough when they are released from their bonds and fall to the floor at my feet, kissing them and thanking me for what I have just done.

No, most people will probably never understand it. But there's no need to read too much into it.

(in reply to Acer49)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/29/2009 8:52:31 AM

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As a very reluctant submissive/switch, I will say when I cry it means it has gotten to a different level. I like control. I like to keep myself in control. I like to never show weakness. If he can get me to that crying part..I HATE IT. I hate him for getting me there, but it also means he has won. It means he is truly in control of me and that is my fondest desire. I need a man who can ultimately control me, and he realizes all that. Plus the sadist in him relishes it for w/e reason I'm sure. I'm not a masochist and hate the pain but am coming to grips w/the fact I hate the loss of control yet it is what I need the most.
Your post made alot of sense and I think the exact same way you do/analyze/etc. Good luck!

(in reply to inevertell)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/29/2009 1:06:37 PM

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Perhaps he doesn't really enjoy - could just be the consequence of the situation. If he tells you that he does enjoy it and this continues to bother you, that's probably a sign that the relationship will not last.

(in reply to worthlesstrash)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 9/30/2009 3:37:30 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: worthlesstrash

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

He told you, it turns him on. Why does anything turn us on? It's pretty common if that helps.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacryphilia

haha..true, he did tell me that much. I guess I am an analyzer, it can't be helped. I suppose I can't pinpoint why certain things turn me on either. I guess because it's something I don't feel myself, I am trying to understand it. I would never want to see someone I love cry, so maybe it's beyond me.

im going to assume youre with him cos you love him, you knew what you were getting into and to some degree or another this whole situation does it for you a bit too, it has to, otherwise you just wouldnt be there .

im not a masso either and i have cried buckets in the past under extreme pain and duress. i went through it because the man i was with expected me to and by dint of that my submission was his and the cartharsis afterwards was my reward. thats my story and i suspect subs/slaves like me have had or have a similar premis.

launching into huge levels of pain without warm up or attempting to teach youre body to accept pain gradually is clearly where youre M is at. he is clearly a sadist and enjoys hurting you, therefore helping you to accept pain would go against his needs and pleasures. its unlikely therefore that he will be interested in helping you become more of a masso.

i completely understand youre dynamic, ive been in one like youres and the fact that he is loving and caring afterwards goes a long way in making this type of relationship doable in the long term. im guessing, in the end, you need this level of sadism too, to satisfy youre need to struggle and cry and hurt. its how youre made and wired.
.

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to worthlesstrash)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 10/15/2009 10:22:48 PM

sirslittleredass

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quote:

ORIGINAL: aldompdx

Abusive people are very common. That does not make it good or right for you.

A key is accepting your personal responsibility for the choice you freely make to remain engaged in the process of enduring pain for his "satisfaction," which will continually escalate and never be enough. Since pain is not your primary motivation, and it is his, there seems to be a lack of fundamental connection between you two.

Remember, he is not your source of love and fulfillment. Love arises in the only place you ever feel it, your very own heart. It is neither given nor taken, but is shared. Love cannot be purchased or exchanged in a bargain of giving to get. Obviously for you, pain is not the key to unlocking your heart and sharing intimacy.

aldompdx- that was extraordinarily, beautifully well said. thank you.

(in reply to aldompdx)

RE: Why do you enjoy seeing him/her cry? - 10/17/2009 9:21:26 PM

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Admittedly tears are a turn on for me but only up to a point. I don't want to break anyone. When it ceases to be fun use a safe word, use your drop object, whatever it is you do to let him know you've had enough.
Some people find pain and crying cathartic so if you are not enjoying that part of your play then tell him.

(in reply to Acer49)

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