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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 3:23:38 PM

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quote:

You cannot fix him. It would be wonderful if we could fix people, but we cannot. We can encourage them and support them, but we cannot fix them.

I think as Dommes, sometimes we think we can do this even more because, being in a position of authority. But we are just as powerless in front of a man that doesn't want to face his issues as any other woman on the planet.

- LA

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(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 3:25:25 PM

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Thanks everyone, Im going to try to talk to him. Wish me luck.

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(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 3:27:29 PM

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I both wish you luck and send you strength :-)

- LA

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 3:28:11 PM

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ditto!

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 3:32:59 PM

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Fast huh? All I got was silence. Oh well. Thanks for all your help and support.
Guess its time to get down and dirty.

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The thing about music is, when it hits you, you feel no pain- Bob Marley

The treehugger formerly known as Domahpet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMnjF1O4eH0

''ahhhh you gonna take me home tonight....''

(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 5:30:02 PM

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Well if you are really ready for down and dirty, perhaps read the predicament bondage thread for some ideas, then pick one, get him into it and leave him in it until he admits what has his panties all in a twist. Not exactly the nice way to get to the bottom of it, but I would imagine an effective one.

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Women and cats will do what they please. Men and dogs need to relax and get used to the idea.

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 5:40:48 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ladynslave
Well if you are really ready for down and dirty...

I tend to not mix fun play with relationship issues, but then again, I tend to date mature men who aren't looking for a disciplinarian but rather a woman to serve.

That said, I have a few reservations about your suggestion. I would say, that if it the relationship was going through a bump and that he was his normal self, but holding something back, play might work as a way of releasing that, sure. But he seems to be hostile towards her. The last thing I would want to do is take a hostile man and put him in a lose/lose situation. His reaction might be less than pretty...

I'll all for pushing buttons, but sometimes we need to take a little distance and make people accountable for their behaviour.

As always, YMMV.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 6:05:43 PM

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Redwoodgirl,

Once, there was this guy who fell down a manhole cover that was open. He couldn't get out. His doctor was happening by, and the man cried out "Doct, I'm down here, please him me!" The doctor wrote out a perscription and threw it down the hole and walked on. Minutes later, the man's holy man came by. "Father, please help me!" The holy man writes a prayer, and throws it down the hole and walks on. Then Joe (no relationship to me), came by the hole. "Joe!" the man cried out, "Please help me down in this hole". Joe jumped down the hole. The man looked at him puzzled "Why did you do that, now we are both stuck in this hole." And Joe replied, "Yes, but I've been down this hole before, and here's how you get out."

Not my story, just something I heard about...

This has nothing to do with D/s, or SM, or BDSM. Your boy's troubles sound like something is seriously wrong. But as a guy, he'll be to macho to admit to being human, or dare I say it, mortal. I had to take everything you said, Redwoodgirl, and put it on a sheet of paper and just study it. And study and thought on your words. It sounds like you really do cherish and love him. But you do not have the knowledge or wisdom to understand. And no one blames you. Let that be known. You are not to be blamed, but you might, be his savior. No, you dont need to use religion (unless your boy holds a deep religious faith). Read on, but first, take a deep breath, and relax. Do it twice more.

You can not help him, if you push him away. You can not help him, if you punish him. You can not help him, if you ignore him.

quote:

Happy, helpfull, handsome, horny, everyhting you'd want in a boy :)

Sounds like myself. He must be a wonderful guy!

Here's my impression, based on what your saying. It sounds like he has Depression (note the big D). Which kind of Depression, I don't know, but a trained profession could. Everyone gets depressed from time to time. Such is how life is. We can not know joy, without also feeling depressed. Depression suffers come from every walk of life. They could look healthy externally, and internally. Their family life can be no living relative, to a huge extended family. Rich, poor, starving, and well fed. Doesn't matter. One's genes, life events, and even trauma (PTSD), can bring about Depression. To them, Depression is a way of being, as they have no way of knowing what its like to be anything else. They can smile, be helpful, and even happy from time to time, but Depression is always there.

Its an unrelenting foe, that attacks him, without hesitition or mercy, every hour of his life. It wants him to feel hopeless, helpless, uncaring. To a Depression suffer, upholding responsiblities becames a mighty task. Simply chores become over-whelming tasks. To consider his mindset, if he's Depressed, try solving the cure for cancer before the end of this post of mine. Not easy, is it? Dont push him away or punish him. But you don't know how to help. I can not be a doctor and help you. But, I'm sure his doctor could have him see a therapist and get a proper diagnosis.

quote:

Defensiveness, blame laying, redirecting, he has suddenly become a pro at all of it.

Yeah, that sounds like a Depression suffer. I'm no expert, but I've had to see it in my family. There's a book, "Talking to Depression" by Claudia Strauss. Its a book for people around the person with Depression. It'll explain things better then I could here. There's stuff to say, and stuff not to say. If he's silent, or you ask a question, and its met with silence...DONT...punish, get impatient, or bitchy (yes, bitchy). He want's to get help, he just doesn't know it yet.

Get him to his doctors. Don't make up or lie to him. He trusts you, and that will help him with what ever could be effecting him. Do NOT compremise your trust between him and you. Maybe its Depression, maybe its something else. Have him go and get a physical. Say it would be something that pleases you. If he asks or gets defensive, say you are clean and nothing is wrong, or sexually passed. You just feel he's sounding 'under the weather', and want 'peace of mind'. If you do get to the doctors, while he's inside, talk to the nurse, and ask about depression and say what you have been noticing of his behavior. If the nurse is on the ball, she would tell the doctor, and then its up to him.

Above all, love him, listen to him, be patient, considerate. Someone who feels life is against them, needs reassurance that someone is their friend, and looking out for them. You have those abilities right now. I know you'll do fine.

(in reply to redwoodgirl)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 6:13:22 PM

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Sudden rage? Get him to a doctor, now. It could be depression. It could just as easily be thyroid. Is he losing weight?
Get the physical first, go with him to the doctor, get the medical directive so you can talk to his doctor. If the physical is ruled out, get a referral to a clinical psychologist who can give tests to diagnose depression and other problems.

Insist on him getting help. Doesn't matter if you make the appointment and take him to it, just get him there.

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(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 6:15:18 PM

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Joether, Not everyone gets depressed and hits a wall, refuses to talk and blame everything else. Those are danger signals. If he won't talk to her, do you really think he is going to go to a professional?

If he were simply depressed and didn't answer that depression with a fist... standing by him might be wonderful... but I would never encourage someone to stand by someone who talks with his fist. She could be the wall the next time.

That was highly irresponsible advice. Don't believe me... call a women's shelter... check out some abuse sites or even the local police web sites.

You can help people from a distance. You don't help them by coddling them at a certain point. Holding them accountable, you might stand a chance. If he gets away with temper tantrums... what next?

< Message edited by Lockit -- 1/10/2010 6:16:14 PM >

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 6:22:04 PM

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You're probably right. And it could also get ugly the next time they switch roles.

_____________________________

Women and cats will do what they please. Men and dogs need to relax and get used to the idea.

If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning.

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 7:33:05 PM

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It's very easy to say "he isn't living up to his end of the agreement, dump him." I guess if someone doesn't have much of a bond with their mate, no problem. Now if someone is abusive, that's a different story.

In any case, while Lockit is right that those who are taking the little bit you said and calling "depression," it is irresponsible regardless of how much they may have dealt with it.

You aren't ready to leave this relationship, that's clear. However, while people are wrong saying he needs treatment for depression, they are right that you need to point him in the direction of a doctor. I wouldn't suggest trying to get a medical directive either. He is your partner, not your child and until it might be necessary for you to talk with a therapist, it would be counterproductive for HIM if you were talking with the doctor, unless it was couples counseling.

You have tried being nice, you have tried being supportive. You are both switches, and you indicate that the dynamic in your relationship is not such strict D/s. It is, however, a "romantic" type relationship. So now it is time to be straight with him. Basically telling him that you love him and want to help him, but his behavior is NOT acceptable and that he either needs to be straight with you about what is bothering him, or get his ass to a therapist if the relationship is going to continue. Then stick with it.

(in reply to redwoodgirl)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 7:45:41 PM

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I hate to point this out but if this is new and sudden behavior it merits a physical exam possibly including an MRI for tumour. Not my expertise by any means but a sudden change in behavior is especially suspect of physical disorder.

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 7:49:24 PM

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quote:

Its getting to the point where I am seriously thinking about dropping him, tho I do love him and want to help.

Sounds like this is really what you need to do. Why continue on a course that you are not happy with and creates unrest or an uneasy environment? Some subs/slaves feel like they can often act that way b/c they think you need them more than they need you.

Re-eval and release as necessary.

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(in reply to redwoodgirl)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 7:49:33 PM

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Lockit, this isn't between you or me. This is someone else and their slave.

Your right, not everyone that gets upset, has depression. Not everyone who punches well, is depressed. Someone who has responsiblities, and now, over a short period of time, can not seem to keep up with them, may not be a depression suffer. Someone that gets defensive, could just be their personality, and not depression. Yes, there *IS* alot of factors, and thats why its important to have a trained professional, whether it be a medical doctor, a nurse practioner, or a therapist, talk to him. At the very least, maybe she should talk to one of these individuals and get advice.

Maybe life has just gotten tough on him, and he'll pull through. Snap out of it. Pull himself up by the boot straps. I've heard the lame things people say. And stuff like that does more harm then good. It takes alot of courage, Lockit, for a guy to admit there's something they can not fight or fix on their own. Someone drinking Alochol, is consuming a depressant. Now, what do you think would happen to someone, who suffers depression symptoms, drinking a depressant? I can speak from expereince, its not good.

Redwoodgirl,

Talk to medical doctor, a nurse practioner, or a psychologist/psychologist. Tell them what is going on. That is the most I can give you. I wish you the best, and hope things get better.

(in reply to Ladynslave)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 7:57:23 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

I hate to point this out but if this is new and sudden behavior it merits a physical exam possibly including an MRI for tumour. Not my expertise by any means but a sudden change in behavior is especially suspect of physical disorder.

True that! Blood sugar comes to mind.

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 8:14:32 PM

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I am not saying he isn't depressed or that he doesn't need medical attention. I would think it a very good idea.

But... when someone, for whatever reason is hitting walls, it is best to error on the side of safety until you know what is going on. If he will not talk about it... it doesn't matter what is going on... he has used his fists rather than talking, admitting or anything else. That is the key factor until he does get some help with this.

In many situations like this... whatever the cause... if someone pushes them to talk, there could be a rage to follow. If he has a couple drinks and is numbing himself in any way, lots of things could happen.

I will stick with my belief that if someone is showing signs of these things, it is irresponsible to tell someone to stay in the situation and be their possible salvation if they are not addressing the situation themselves. He is not. Unable... willfull... who the hell cares, the bottom line is he is in denial and defensive and uncommunicative and violent when he gets pushed too far for whatever reason.

I have done enough hospital visits with women who didn't think 'he' would ever go there and who understood and stood by a guy who wasn't doing his own medical or emotional homework. Safety first... help and loyalty second when it comes to a man unwilling or unable to make the right choices.

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RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 8:35:56 PM

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OK, Here's the thing, if it isn't blood sugar or a tumor or something like that, and he refuses to get any counseling to work through his problems, then I would tell him that while you love and care about him, being together is enabling hiim to NOT focus on his issues, and you are going to step back or walk away if he can't get things under control.

Joether, I think the main thing I read in your post that I took issue with is the whole "being someone's saviour". You know, women are trained to be Wendy to the men in our lives Peter Pan...Beauty to his Beast. If we love and trust and never give up, we will have a happy ending. And do you know what? In my case, it was true...so far. But more often, when there is buried rage, it is important to make sure that WE are physically safe, THEN we can deal with helping him out of his pit.

Redwoodgirl, I will tell you what I would do. I would go to a public place like a Denny's or something, sit him down, and tell him that his behaviour is NOT acceptable, and that while you love him, you will not sit by and take his emotional abuse. He has X amount of time to schedule a physical with a doctor, and if nothing shows up there, then he must schedule a visit with a psychologist.

If he loves you and values your relationship, then he will comply. If he does not, it's time for one of you to pack up and say buh bye. I've found that being shown the door can really cut to the chase. Oh, and I would not be alone if packing up or packing him up. Be safe!

Best of luck.

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(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 9:01:12 PM

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Something no one has really mentioned (and exdomapet (sorry, I couldn't remember your new nic)...I care about you but have to say it) is a lot of times when people act the way he is acting, it is either because they have found someone else and/or they just don't want to be in *this* relationship any longer. They behave that way because they are not mature enough to just say it, so they push the other person to do so.

I know you really love him, and I hope it's something else, but it is something to consider. Better than being blindsided, yanno? Listen to your inner voice; it won't steer you wrong.

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(in reply to SweetPoosy)

RE: Need advice on a rebellious boy - 1/10/2010 9:49:09 PM

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I was thinking along the same lines, Christina. This behavioural change seems to have coincided with the move. A move in the same town shouldn't be all that stressful, so I wondered if it made it harder for him to see someone he was interested in, and he's behaving this way out of frustration. An unhappy situation all around, certainly, and difficult to know what to recommend without knowing what is motivating him.

(in reply to xxblushesxx)

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