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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 8:21:01 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: twisted999

.In other words, it's much easier to start a conversation with someone I don't know if we both have an anomalous affinity for the Smashing Pumpkins than by discussing the sexual preferences we have listed on the profile. Sorry, but most people aren't that comfortable with strangers!
...
When you find that match though, how do you begin talking to them?

This is a very good point. I like to post "random thought" journal entries that provide a pretty good hook for vanilla conversation. I frequently get cmails responding to my journal entries which are just friendly "not trying to hook up just writing to say I liked what you wrote." I think having those sorts of friendly "real people" exchanges keeps me in a positive mindset about connecting with people on the other side.

Also, I will always cherish Psychonaut's response to the entry "Do They Know it's Christmas vs. We Are the World. Discuss." It was just wrong in every possible way.

(in reply to twisted999)

RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 8:35:05 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucienne

quote:

ORIGINAL: twisted999

.In other words, it's much easier to start a conversation with someone I don't know if we both have an anomalous affinity for the Smashing Pumpkins than by discussing the sexual preferences we have listed on the profile. Sorry, but most people aren't that comfortable with strangers!
...
When you find that match though, how do you begin talking to them?

This is a very good point. I like to post "random thought" journal entries that provide a pretty good hook for vanilla conversation. I frequently get cmails responding to my journal entries which are just friendly "not trying to hook up just writing to say I liked what you wrote." I think having those sorts of friendly "real people" exchanges keeps me in a positive mindset about connecting with people on the other side.

Also, I will always cherish Psychonaut's response to the entry "Do They Know it's Christmas vs. We Are the World. Discuss." It was just wrong in every possible way.

I agree 100%...especially with the bolded part. My journal entries have pretty much always been non-kinky in nature and I love when someone takes the time to comment on something I've written. I've been forunate to meet more than a few people in person simply because of a conversation that started about either my journal or his.

I actually don't have as many musings posted as I used to. I like to clean things up every once in a while just to keep it fresh. Same goes for the photos...I used to post shots of myself but I find things like my current pic to be more interesting and can be a good conversation opener. I'll share a photo of myself but I like when a man has to be more original and find a common interest beyond my outer shell.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 10:52:54 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: MargueriteV

The length of my reply depends on how many things I can comment on in the message.

Wisely said. When I get an email which is 200 words of praise on my profile, the only thing that comes to mind is *thank you*.

Oh, did you want to engage me? Then engage me! Ask me questions! If I'm interested, I often use the first few emails to ask questions. If they don't ask me any in return, I can comment on the questions asked, but that's pretty much it.

And to be honest, a man that doesn't show me that he's inquisitive by asking questions is a turn off. A man that asks too many questions is overwhelming. I'd say 1-3 questions per email in a well thought out email is a good balance to get a nice conversation going.

- LA

Bolded emphasis is mine. This is a big pet peeve of mine and never know how to deal with it. When a sub contacts me, I am intrigued, so I write back and start and exchange and begin asking questions, and by the 3rd or 4th round, it's just me asking questions, him answering (albeit, quite excitedly/pleasantly/obviously enjoying it). But it's just me asking questions and there's no real exchange going on - the man knows nothing about me other than what he's read, and he isn't even asking about my hobbies or interests or anything.

Where I get stuck is what to do next. I had an exchange recently with a guy who really seemed to intrigue me, and it was going this way. When I pointed it out, and said I wasn't really interested in continuing because it felt one-sided, he responded like a lot of subs do - by saying he didn't know the protocol and if it was "ok" to ask questions. I always feel like if I have to tell a guy to ask me something or spell it out for him, then he's probably asking out of obligation and really doesn't care. If it's forced, how real can it be? But then again - what if he honestly did want to ask questions but was afraid to say anything? If the exchange has been casual and light, I don't see how a man could believe there's some protocol in place.

At the end of the day though, I don't know how I feel about getting involved in an exchange where the man is only asking me questions because I told him to.

I have a handful of very rewarding, rich friendships with sub men that are not really "play" relationships, but we have great exchanges. They usually start because he reaches out to me as a person and we connect as friends, and we have a healthy banter back and forth. I am much more tight lipped and paranoid now than I used to be, because of past issues with crazies and stalkers, but I still do long for friendships with men (is it possible?! yes!) who don't see me as a fetish object, don't necessarily want to submit to me (at least not initially) and like to just know how my brain works. And in turn, I get to see the inner workings of a male sub's brain, too. I have a man I am meeting for lunch next week who I've had this kind of exchange with for more than 10 years online (and we get together a few times a year for a meal), and another who I adore tremendously despite knowing less than a year and online only, but he's a gem. These kinds of exchanges can only develop if there's a good amount of back and forth. Subs, don't be afraid to ask questions!

Akasha

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 11:04:31 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CarrieO

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucienne

quote:

ORIGINAL: twisted999

.In other words, it's much easier to start a conversation with someone I don't know if we both have an anomalous affinity for the Smashing Pumpkins than by discussing the sexual preferences we have listed on the profile. Sorry, but most people aren't that comfortable with strangers!
...
When you find that match though, how do you begin talking to them?

This is a very good point. I like to post "random thought" journal entries that provide a pretty good hook for vanilla conversation. I frequently get cmails responding to my journal entries which are just friendly "not trying to hook up just writing to say I liked what you wrote." I think having those sorts of friendly "real people" exchanges keeps me in a positive mindset about connecting with people on the other side.

Also, I will always cherish Psychonaut's response to the entry "Do They Know it's Christmas vs. We Are the World. Discuss." It was just wrong in every possible way.

I agree 100%...especially with the bolded part. My journal entries have pretty much always been non-kinky in nature and I love when someone takes the time to comment on something I've written. I've been forunate to meet more than a few people in person simply because of a conversation that started about either my journal or his.

I actually don't have as many musings posted as I used to. I like to clean things up every once in a while just to keep it fresh. Same goes for the photos...I used to post shots of myself but I find things like my current pic to be more interesting and can be a good conversation opener. I'll share a photo of myself but I like when a man has to be more original and find a common interest beyond my outer shell.

Thanks for posting this. I was wondering if it was appropriate to send e-mails to compliment profiles or posts/journal entries that I like, without having it be interpreted as some kind of creepy e-mail or a come on. The last thing I'd want to do is bother someone or come off looking like some kind of sleazeball. I'm a bit reserved anyway, so I have to muster up the courage and fret over every little thing I write. I don't send out too many e-mails anyway, but if they don't respond, I just accept it and move on. Even if I have impure thoughts from time to time, my sense of personal honor would forbid me from harming or intruding upon the lives of others.

(in reply to CarrieO)

RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 11:12:21 AM

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Akasha... that post really sets off bells! lol I think I started a thread about it once. It's kind of like they are able to talk to you at first and then enter's some dynamic either they feel is there or you start or agree to, to start things rolling and then silence. (Hey what happened to that other guy I was talking to? Where did he go?)

I do believe this is misconception of what a submissive man thinks he is supposed to be sometimes, but I do tend to believe that some feel they have the dominant, now she will run with that. It seems a very lazy or a lack of real feelings that comes across.

I don't mean this as a bitch! Not at all. It is something that I wish to figure out as well. I want to know the minds of the men I am talking to. I want to know their heart. Who is this? That doesn't stop when there is some dynamic! It should actually, in my opinion, become more a flame.

We want thinking, talking men who understand that we do want thinking, talking men. I have encouraged them and talked to them to the point of thinking it is too much work to hold a relationship with myself while another is supposed to be in it too. I tend to just let it slip away and wonder if I am letting someone who could turn into someone special if I hadn't. That second gussing is what I turn away now. If I am confused about it.. or the person... I am not willing to go much further. They must step up and continue or I will say no thank you because I can't see a flow to things and won't play the guessing game.

< Message edited by Lockit -- 1/28/2010 11:14:16 AM >

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 11:58:02 AM

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Actually, I think I can answer this, or at least I can see the perspective. A submissive man has an image of what a relationship with a dominant woman should be like. Often, we see that relationship as something of a mirror of the submissive woman/dominant man. In other words, as dominant (or seemingly dominant) men, we are expected to "dominate" the dialog and courtship. We ask for the dates, we plan the restaurant, we lead the conversations and establish the ground rules. As submissives, we sort of see the entire role as a reversed. Now, if I was supposed to do the "courting" as a dom man, then as a sub man, I should be following her lead. Now, when we find ourselves initiating conversation and leading the discussion by coming up with leading questions for a woman to answer.... we sort of feel as though we are "topping from the bottom". Hence, the post about "I didn't think it was appropriate for me to ask questions". After all, to our minds, YOU are supposed to be the leaders now. YOU are supposed to ask the questions and offer information according to YOUR timetable.

If we have to initiate the discussion, ask the questions, set the dialog and essentially conduct the template for a relationship, at what point do you step into the role as leader? After all, at least for me, that is what makes the whole thing so,uh, well, shall I say, appealing?

Now, all of the above might be true if a dominant woman were the same as a dominant man. But (thank God, in many ways) it isn't exactly the same. The dynamic is still that we have the stronger drive (in the beginning) and we are still vying for attention. Thus, yeah, even though you are the dominants, we still kind of sort of have to initiate the courtship (for want of a better word).

(in reply to Lockit)

RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 12:35:30 PM

Domin8tingUrDrmz

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While I appreciate a man who wants to follow my lead in a conversation, I still expect him to participate. Often times, after a few emails, it seems the submissive man will answer in short quick replies without offering anything further. Until an actual agreed upon dynamic is in place (and quite honestly, even after the fact), I want a man to stimulate my mind. If he is incapable of doing that, then I really have no use for him.

While I may be the one to choose when kink is brought up, I still expect him to fully engage in the art of conversation. I am not a dentist and don't want to pull teeth.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 12:36:39 PM

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I can lead a man without taking his voice away. I don't see a big difference in male dominant's with female submissive's and how we do things when it comes to communication. I believe you could have a lot of female submissive's jumping in here and stating that they freely speak or will ask if it is okay to speak about a topic. Not every communication is d/s oriented.

What is happening is that before things are really a full on relationship, something is changing in how some submissive males are communicating. For example... I have many starts that go no where for different reasons, but I do believe that some have stopped becasue I didn't aggressively persue them. I did not feel we were at a place to have any dynamic's and there wasn't a foundation for them. At first these men talked about all sorts of things and at some point I believe started to feel submissive towards me. I didn't feel we were ready for that and would not dominante in any way. I am not playing games with men's heads and acting as if something could happen if I didn't believe yet that something could happen.

Because of my medical situation and life, many men could lose interest or find it too difficult to deal with and might just opt out. I won't chase a man for many reasons, but this is one of them. I will maybe make contact if there was more going on and go from there, but I won't assume that because it looked good, that it looked good to both of us. There has to be a time when something more than chit chat getting to know one another is understood in a way where we are on the same page. What often happens I think is that there isn't a conversation about something and as good as we can be at expecting things, we can't read minds. If the man feels submission and there isn't a foundation for it and he hasn't told us, we are going to miscommunicate. Not every submissive is the same and we can't be expected to project and assume as part of the situation. It must be expressed.

Then we have those where we might start persuing a relationship and might add some dynamic's. Such as daily contact and what to call us and see how that goes. All of a sudden rather than responding to what we might be saying, they say yes ma'am, yes ma'am and we get the nods and listening rather than taking part in the conversation like once before and how we were attracted in the first place.

The problem I see is that some may have some concept of what a d/s or bdsm relationship should be and that can get us going off in directions that will be wrong to go in because each relationship is different. Each person is different. It will take communication to sort it out and if anyone isn't communicating... well... doomed... nothing can be worked out.

I have a headache... so please bear with me if this is off.

< Message edited by Lockit -- 1/28/2010 12:37:55 PM >

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 12:44:53 PM

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When I spoke of a dominant man and submissive woman, I wasn't speaking in the scope of D/s, but in the scope of normal relationships in a somewhat paternalistic world. Nor was I speaking to the issue of men not answering women. It was my understanding from your initial post that your concern was why men do not initiate conversation in the way that Akasha (who you replied to) discussed. From there, my post will make a bit more sense, I think, I hope, maybe?

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 12:53:02 PM

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LOL.. with me and a headache... I may be missing something here.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 12:54:27 PM

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Stop writing people on the internet and get out into your local community.

Join a Munch, find a group, visit the local SM club, and stop pinning your hopes on meeting the Domme of your dreams on the internet.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 1:02:07 PM

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I don't understand why everyone says to go in person and find munches and such to find someone and act as if online isn't a viable source of meeting people. When we have a number of people who have met online or on this site, who have been together for years and are even married.

I think both ways are viable in their own way and neither should be discredited. One might be better than the other in some ways or for some people, but that shouldn't discredit the other.

Besides I am not sure the op said where he met her. He could have met her either way... in person... online or at the grocery store and still the same thing could have happened.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 1/28/2010 1:17:00 PM

Domin8tingUrDrmz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

Besides I am not sure the op said where he met her. He could have met her either way... in person... online or at the grocery store and still the same thing could have happened.

*Gives Lockit two Aleve and a cup of Jasmine Tea* Hope your headache goes away.

The OP did mention replies to emails of the one - two line variety which suggests it is an online communication.

I do agree that online is just as valid as in person for 'meeting' someone. I met my current b/f of 8+ years through Yahoo.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 2:55:44 PM

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I know this thread has been "sleeping" for a ong time now but I just wanted to say that it's very precious and a good read.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 3:17:37 PM

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I have written a few couple sentence messages and people (though not necessarily just Dommes) have written back (well aside from one person who just did a delete:unread =/, but then I guess I tend to write fairly casually about things of interest or question. The idea of sending a formal page long email giving out all the reason why I should be considered seems rather silly to me, considering I know as little about them as they do about me.

Pfft

Edit: Sorry thread necro again - blame Morik

< Message edited by SuperHappyTime -- 8/16/2011 3:19:25 PM >

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 3:23:56 PM

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I used to get long drawn out emails from men, I'd read them, scratch my head and wonder what exactly they want me to say. There was nothing to respond to. So I'd write back with "oh ok" or "thanks" or "you're welcome" or "and?".

They'd respond angrily wondering why I'm so cold to them. Weeeelllll.....give me something to respond to! I can't send a really good email to you based on the loveliness of my one eye covered with hair.

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 3:44:38 PM

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FR

<pedantry>

It's not hypocrisy anyway.

Saying 'I will not accept one-line emails' and 'I think it's ok for me to send one-line emails' simultaneously is not hypocritical; saying 'I think nobody ought to send one-line emails' and 'I think it's ok for me to send one-line emails' would be hypocritical. Hypocrisy isn't not practising what you preach, it's claiming to hold one set of beliefs while actually holding another.

</pedantry>

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 4:06:37 PM

CynthiaWVirginia

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Morikvendi

I know this thread has been "sleeping" for a long time now but I just wanted to say that it's very precious and a good read.

I have a fondness for certain necrothreads, Morikvendi. If I had seen this before...I would have responded to subrob1967's post. All past subs of mine were from CollarMe. I have never been to a Munch...

My boy hooked my interest through his letters to me. Enough so that when he had asked someone r/t for training and was owned...I waited four months for him, until he was free to date.

Sometimes through letters, incompatibility shows up right away and a long letter from a prospective male sub cannot undo the writing on the wall.

It was good to read posts from people I don't see posting here anymore. When I finally make a sig, I might copy the two links that someone used to post in her sig.

*****
Edited to fix typo.

< Message edited by CynthiaWVirginia -- 8/16/2011 4:09:23 PM >

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 4:40:47 PM

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A question .. does it irk you more or less to have your carefully crafted, tailor made email completely ignored? Since no stranger on the net is obligated to another stranger on the net, it stands to reason one should have no expectation of a stranger on the net. Personally, I'd say it's damn courteous if the dom/me responds at all. {A statement you agree with in line one.}

ORIGINAL: joether
Now, if I get a reply back, I count myself lucky. <~ Please, remember this when we get to "The end."

The length of the reply is usually a sentence or less. <~ Which is, as you stated, fine because you're lucky to get any response.

The hypocricsy comes, when on these individual's own profiles and journals, it says they dont like one sentence replies. <~ This isn't hypocrisy, it's her stating her personal preference.

And yet, they do it themselves! <~ And yet .. I suspect this is the crux of your difficulty. In forgetting that people {including you} get to conduct themselves in any manner the see fit. Even if, much to your dismay, they contradict a statement in their journal and/or profile.

I like the ones that can think and give intelligent replies. <~ This is you stating your personal preference. {But I would assume this to be true of everyone NOT looking to dry hump their desk chair. After all, I doubt many set out chanting a mantra like "Ima find me a mouth breather .. wooowee!"}

Just food for thought. <~ "The end." {^Please, look up there ^}

ETA .. "of"

< Message edited by TheShrew -- 8/16/2011 4:43:52 PM >

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RE: The Hypocritical Domme - 8/16/2011 11:16:27 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: MargueriteV
The length of my reply depends on how many things I can comment on in the message.
Wisely said. When I get an email which is 200 words of praise on my profile, the only thing that comes to mind is *thank you*.

Oh, did you want to engage me? Then engage me! Ask me questions! If I'm interested, I often use the first few emails to ask questions. If they don't ask me any in return, I can comment on the questions asked, but that's pretty much it.
- LA

Agreed! You regurg back about me, I say thanks, than your move next. You tell me about you, than I have something to go on. M

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(in reply to LadyAngelika)

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