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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 3:30:26 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

I don't care what they think. They're doing a carnival trick, a very old carnival trick. If not then why has one never survived scrutiny?


Calling someone a "scammer" is more than an insinuation that they are intentionally trying to deceive someone, you were the one that chose this language, not me.

quote:

Peace and pacifism are different concepts. I hope for a world where peace is the rule but fully understand that the ability to wage war will always be the guarantor of that peace.


I want a world of pacifism... I am more than happy to agree to disagree with you, but what I won't well tolerate is that someone is going to make me out to be in denial because this is my desire.


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 3:48:23 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

"Psychics" who talk to the dead are using the old carnival trick called cold reading


Again, some of the time, but that does not mean this is true all of the time




Sooooooooo.............................there really are psychics that can talk to the dead?

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 3:51:23 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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The UN is the body that determines what they will and not enforce when it comes to their resolutions.. for crying out loud, how many resolutions do they have against Israel

Resolution 444: " ... 'deplores' Israel's lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces".
Resolution 446 (1979): 'determines' that Israeli settlements are a 'serious obstruction' to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention".
Resolution 449
Resolution 450: " ... 'calls' on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon".
Resolution 452: " ... 'calls' on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories".
Resolution 456
Resolution 459
Resolution 465: " ... 'deplores' Israel's settlements and asks all member states not to assist Israel's settlements program".
Resolution 467: " ... 'strongly deplores' Israel's military intervention in Lebanon".
Resolution 468: " ... 'calls' on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return".
Resolution 469: " ... 'strongly deplores' Israel's failure to observe the council's order not to deport Palestinians".
Resolution 470
Resolution 471: " ... 'expresses deep concern' at Israel's failure to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention".
Resolution 474
Resolution 476: " ... 'reiterates' that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are 'null and void'".
Resolution 478 (20 August 1980): 'censures (Israel) in the strongest terms' for its claim to Jerusalem in its 'Basic Law'.
Resolution 481
Resolution 483
Resolution 484: " ... 'declares it imperative' that Israel re-admit two deported Palestinian mayors".
Resolution 485
Resolution 487: " ... 'strongly condemns' Israel for its attack on Iraq's nuclear facility".
Resolution 488
Resolution 493
Resolution 497 (17 December 1981) decides that Israel's annexation of Syria's Golan Heights is 'null and void' and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith.
Resolution 498: " ... 'calls' on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon".
Resolution 501: " ... 'calls' on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops".
Resolution 506
Resolution 508:
Resolution 509: " ... 'demands' that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon".
Resolution 511
Resolution 515: " ... 'demands' that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and allow food supplies to be brought in".
Resolution 516
Resolution 517: " ... 'censures' Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon".
Resolution 518: " ... 'demands' that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon".
Resolution 519
Resolution 520: " ... 'condemns' Israel's attack into West Beirut".
Resolution 523
Resolution 524
Resolution 529
Resolution 531
Resolution 536
Resolution 538
Resolution 543
Resolution 549
Resolution 551
Resolution 555
Resolution 557
Resolution 561
Resolution 563
Resolution 573: " ... 'condemns' Israel 'vigorously' for bombing Tunisia in attack on PLO headquarters.
Resolution 575
Resolution 576
Resolution 583
Resolution 584
Resolution 586
Resolution 587 " ... 'takes note' of previous calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw".
Resolution 590
Resolution 592: " ... 'strongly deplores' the killing of Palestinian students at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops".
Resolution 594
Resolution 596
Resolution 599
Resolution 603
Resolution 605: " ... 'strongly deplores' Israel's policies and practices denying the human rights of Palestinians.
Resolution 607: " ... 'calls' on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention.
Resolution 608: " ... 'deeply regrets' that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians".
Resolution 609
Resolution 611
Resolution 613
Resolution 617
Resolution 624
Resolution 630
Resolution 633
Resolution 636: " ... 'deeply regrets' Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians.
Resolution 639 (31 Jul 1989)
Resolution 641 (30 Aug 1989): " ... 'deplores' Israel's continuing deportation of Palestinians.
Resolution 645 (29 Nov 1989)
Resolution 648 (31 Jan 1990)[1] The Security Council extends the mandate of the UN Interim Force in Lebanon until July 31, 1990.
Resolution 655 (31 May 1990)
Resolution 659 (31 Jul 1990)
Resolution 672 (12 Oct 1990): " ... 'condemns' Israel for "violence against Palestinians" at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount.
Resolution 673 (24 Oct 1990): " ... 'deplores' Israel's refusal to cooperate with the United Nations.
Resolution 679 (30 Nov 1990)
Resolution 681 (20 Dec 1990): " ... 'deplores' Israel's resumption of the deportation of Palestinians.
Resolution 684 (30 Jan 1991)
Resolution 694 (24 May 1991): " ... 'deplores' Israel's deportation of Palestinians and calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return.
Resolution 695 (30 May 1991)
Resolution 701 (31 Jul 1991)
Resolution 722 (29 Nov 1991)
Resolution 726 (06 Jan 1992): " ... 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of Palestinians.
Resolution 734 (29 Jan 1992)
Resolution 756 (29 May 1992)
Resolution 768 (30 Jul 1992)
Resolution 790 (25 Nov 1992)
Resolution 799 (18 Dec 1992): ". . . 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of 413 Palestinians and calls for their immediate return.
Resolution 803 (28 Jan 1993)
Resolution 830 (26 May 1993)
Resolution 852 (28 Jul 1993)
Resolution 887 (29 Nov 1993)
Resolution 895 (28 Jan 1994)
Resolution 904 (18 Mar 1994): Cave of the Patriarchs massacre.
Resolution 938 (28 Jul 1994): extends mandate of the United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon until January 31, 1995.
Resolution 1039 (29 Jan 1996)
Resolution 1052 (18 Apr 1996)
Resolution 1057 (30 May 1996)
Resolution 1068 (30 Jul 1996)
Resolution 1073 (28 Sep 1996)
Resolution 1081 (27 Nov 1996)
Resolution 1095 (28 Jan 1997)
Resolution 1109 (28 May 1997)
Resolution 1122 (29 Jul 1997)
Resolution 1139 (21 Nov 1997)
Resolution 1151 (30 Jan 1998)
Resolution 1169 (27 May 1998)
Resolution 1188 (30 Jul 1998)
Resolution 1211 (25 Nov 1998)
Resolution 1223 (28 Jan 1999)
Resolution 1243 (27 May 1999)
Resolution 1254 (30 Jul 1999)
Resolution 1276 (24 Nov 1999)
Resolution 1288 (31 Jan 2000)
Resolution 1300 (31 May 2000)
Resolution 1310 (27 Jul 2000)
Resolution 1322 (07 Oct 2000)
Resolution 1328 (27 Nov 2000)
Resolution 1337 (30 Jan 2001)
Resolution 1351 (30 May 2001)
Resolution 1397 (12 Mar 2002) the first resolution to explicitly call for a two-state solution.
Resolution 1435 (24 Sep 2002) called for an end to Israeli measures in and around Ramallah.
Resolution 1559 (2 September 2004) called upon Lebanon to establish its sovereignty over all of its land and called upon Syria to end their military presence in Lebanon by withdrawing its forces and to cease intervening in internal Lebanese politics. The resolution also called on all Lebanese militias to disband.
Resolution 1583 (28 January 2005) calls on Lebanon to assert full control over its border with Israel. It also states that "the Council has recognized the Blue Line as valid for the purpose of confirming Israel's withdrawal pursuant to resolution 425.
Resolution 1648 (21 December 2005) renewed the mandate of United Nations Disengagement Observer Force until 30 June 2006.
Resolution 1701 (11 August 2006) called for the full cessation of hostilities between Israel and Hezbollah.
Resolution 1860 (9 January 2009) called for the full cessation of war between Israel and Hamas.


So, when do we start enforcing these resolutions?

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to luckydawg)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 4:24:02 PM   
VideoAdminTheta


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Please refrain from making personal attacks on other users. When you find yourself about to respond to another user with a personal attack, please take a few minutes to regain your composure before posting. Strong opinions are allowed and passionate discussion is sure to occur, but when the posts turn away from the topic and towards the poster, we must call a halt.

Those who cannot comply after this warning could very well be under consideration of moderation. If you post while I am posting this and you attack or otherwise break TOS, you may want to do a quick edit.

Thank you

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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 4:29:06 PM   
Jeffff


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dawg?
PUBLIC LAW 107–243—OCT. 16, 2002
AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF MILITARY FORCE AGAINST IRAQ RESOLUTION OF 2002

Do yourself a favor and read that law.

Or not, whatever makes you happy



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"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 4:29:12 PM   
VideoAdminTheta


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To be fair, please see my post on page four.

Edit to add:
Quoting personal attacks are included in the 'do-not-do' list.



< Message edited by VideoAdminTheta -- 8/21/2010 4:39:15 PM >

(in reply to domiguy)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 4:40:15 PM   
Jeffff


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Main Entry: cog·ni·tive
Pronunciation: \ˈkäg-nə-tiv\
Function: adjective
Date: 1586
1 : of, relating to, being, or involving conscious intellectual activity (as thinking, reasoning, or remembering) <cognitive impairment>
2 : based on or capable of being reduced to empirical factual knowledge


Cognitive dissonance is a psychological phenomenon which refers to the discomfort felt at a discrepancy between what you already know or believe, and new information or interpretation. It therefore occurs when there is a need to accommodate new ideas, and it may be necessary for it to develop so that we become "open" to them. Neighbour (1992) makes the generation of appropriate dissonance into a major feature of tutorial (and other) teaching: he shows how to drive this kind of intellectual wedge between learners' current beliefs and "reality".

Beyond this benign if uncomfortable aspect, however, dissonance can go "over the top", leading to two interesting side-effects for learning:

if someone is called upon to learn something which contradicts what they already think they know — particularly if they are committed to that prior knowledge — they are likely to resist the new learning. Even Carl Rogers recognised this. Accommodation is more difficult than Assimilation, in Piaget's terms.
and—counter-intuitively, perhaps—if learning something has been difficult, uncomfortable, or even humiliating enough, people are less likely to concede that the content of what has been learned is useless, pointless or valueless. To do so would be to admit that one has been "had", or "conned".


I hope this helps.

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/21/2010 4:41:38 PM   
VideoAdminTheta


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Time Out

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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 12:32:04 AM   
VideoAdminAlpha


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Ok thread is back up. If you haven't noticed the changes in some users status, I would suggest you heed the moderator's numerous warnings on this thread.

_____________________________


You can't please all the people all of the time.Unfortunately there are times you cannot please any of them :( You can only do your best, and hope they realize that.


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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 12:42:33 AM   
Hippiekinkster


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TY for unlocking this.

Excellent post, jefff. Exactly on point, particularly the last paragraph.

Seems to me there are two ways to resolve cognitive dissonance: either assimilate new information, and change, or reject anything which contradicts one's beliefs, and remain in a state of intentional ignorance. IMO, those who believe in cosmic spooks (other than the FSM) belong in the latter category, as do the majority of conservatives.

_____________________________

"We are convinced that freedom w/o Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism w/o freedom is slavery and brutality." Bakunin

“Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we are saved by love.” Reinhold Ne

(in reply to VideoAdminAlpha)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 12:56:39 AM   
truckinslave


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Inasmuch as it is reliant upon a refutation of the very nature of man, liberalism owes its existence to cognitive dissonance.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to Hippiekinkster)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 1:03:35 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Inasmuch as it is reliant upon a refutation of the very nature of man, liberalism owes its existence to cognitive dissonance.


Please do elaborate.

I'm sure it will be fascinating to hear.

(in reply to truckinslave)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 1:21:59 AM   
truckinslave


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Inasmuch as it is reliant upon a refutation of the very nature of man, liberalism owes its existence to cognitive dissonance.


Please do elaborate.

I'm sure it will be fascinating to hear.




Why take my word for it when you can read The Liberal Mind: The Psychological Causes of Political Madness by Dr. Rossiter??
It is indeed fascinating to read.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 1:27:59 AM   
rulemylife


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Why don't you help me out and give a brief summary, since you brought up the topic.

(in reply to truckinslave)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 1:44:44 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

TY for unlocking this.

Excellent post, jefff. Exactly on point, particularly the last paragraph.

Seems to me there are two ways to resolve cognitive dissonance: either assimilate new information, and change, or reject anything which contradicts one's beliefs, and remain in a state of intentional ignorance. IMO, those who believe in cosmic spooks (other than the FSM) belong in the latter category, as do the majority of conservatives.

It's not just the majority of conservatives its the majority of all people. Liberals are no exception.

Some Conservatives reject AGW or the ToE or believe there were WMD in Iraq but some liberals believe in crystals or some other variety of woo. It might be inetresting to compare the sorts of untrue thngs each side tends to believe in but I strongly disaprove of trying to claim this is solely the province of a single political philosophy.

(in reply to Hippiekinkster)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 2:02:07 AM   
truckinslave


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I don't mean to be shitty, but I really am both too tired and too poor a typist to be Cliffs Notes. You're a thoughtful guy, you'll enjoy it. But I'll warn you it's like More Guns, Less Crime by I Can't Remember, the Fl porfessor who started his study to prove guns caused crime and was shocked that his results proved otherwise. The rejection of those results by liberals despite the absolutely impeccable manner of the study would provide material for any number of theses on cognitive dissonance.

I also love and reccomend to people The Closing of the American Mind... Bloome? Bloom? Blume?
Time for my poker tournament......

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 5:02:31 AM   
StrangerThan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

TY for unlocking this.

Excellent post, jefff. Exactly on point, particularly the last paragraph.

Seems to me there are two ways to resolve cognitive dissonance: either assimilate new information, and change, or reject anything which contradicts one's beliefs, and remain in a state of intentional ignorance. IMO, those who believe in cosmic spooks (other than the FSM) belong in the latter category, as do the majority of conservatives.

It's not just the majority of conservatives its the majority of all people. Liberals are no exception.

Some Conservatives reject AGW or the ToE or believe there were WMD in Iraq but some liberals believe in crystals or some other variety of woo. It might be inetresting to compare the sorts of untrue thngs each side tends to believe in but I strongly disaprove of trying to claim this is solely the province of a single political philosophy.


In the landscape of supposition and partisanship, this is about the closest hard-truth statement I've read in a while. Somewhere in there is a principle or theory that applies to all people. Claiming to be a fort occupied by one segment of the population is as much of an example of cognitive dissonance as any writing that will appear on the subject.

It does however, go well beyond woo for liberals though. Grin. If there is a constant involved in this equation, it is that if either side adopts a position, the other will counter it, and both will use some science to deride the other.




_____________________________


--'Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform' - Mark Twain

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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 7:33:24 AM   
DCWoody


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ITT - One person suggests some psychics really can really talk to the dead, another person claims WMD was not the reason given for Iraq. They proceed to point out the stupidity of each others positions.

Later on, someone claims that liberalism is essentially a mental illness.


It's a fascinating thread certainly.

(in reply to StrangerThan)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 10:36:06 AM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: StrangerThan

In the landscape of supposition and partisanship, this is about the closest hard-truth statement I've read in a while.

Seconded.

K.

(in reply to StrangerThan)
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RE: Cognitive Dissonance and the avoidance of Facts - 8/22/2010 12:26:36 PM   
Hippiekinkster


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Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

TY for unlocking this.

Excellent post, jefff. Exactly on point, particularly the last paragraph.

Seems to me there are two ways to resolve cognitive dissonance: either assimilate new information, and change, or reject anything which contradicts one's beliefs, and remain in a state of intentional ignorance. IMO, those who believe in cosmic spooks (other than the FSM) belong in the latter category, as do the majority of conservatives.

It's not just the majority of conservatives its the majority of all people. Liberals are no exception.

Some Conservatives reject AGW or the ToE or believe there were WMD in Iraq but some liberals believe in crystals or some other variety of woo. It might be inetresting to compare the sorts of untrue thngs each side tends to believe in but I strongly disaprove of trying to claim this is solely the province of a single political philosophy.
I can't disagree with the fact that many non-cons believe in New-Agey hooey, but you'll find just as many cons who believe in Area 51 (a classic conspiracy theory) or colloidal silver or magnets or homeopathic (water) remedies.

There have been studies which correlate education with a tendency towards Progressivism. Also with more education comes a correlation with disbelief in a higher power, and other myths. I infer, therefore (and I may very well be wrong; I don't know of any studies correlating political orientation with UFOs and such), that Progressivism correlates with disbelief in conspiracy theories, alternative medicine and other junk science, and the various New Age beliefs.


_____________________________

"We are convinced that freedom w/o Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism w/o freedom is slavery and brutality." Bakunin

“Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we are saved by love.” Reinhold Ne

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 60
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