The good times never last

Join Our Community

Collarchat.com

Home Login Search

The good times never last

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Alternative Lifestyles in the News >> The good times never last

Page: [1] 2 3 4 5 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

The good times never last - 9/9/2010 10:27:51 PM

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

Mo. man accused of keeping woman as sex slave

Notice how she gets labelled as "mentally deficient" by the prosecutors.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

RE: The good times never last - 9/9/2010 10:46:17 PM

Posts: 288
Joined: 8/16/2010
Status: offline

"Bagley is accused of giving her marijuana and ecstasy and sexually abusing her while she was a minor"

If this is true then a horrendous crime was committed against a minor. If at 18 she signed a sexual slave contract against her will then another horrendous crime was committed. I am unsure as to why the authorities labeled her as mentally deficient...that may be correct...as the details of the case come forth we will find out.

_____________________________

"I tried self-restraint once, but I couldn't close the forth handcuff."

A closed profile = tired of stupid cmail's.

Member, of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's
Member: Lance's Fag Hags
Member: Bitch With Tits

(in reply to TheHeretic)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 7:22:34 AM

Posts: 158
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

I am fairly certain that the girl had emotional difficulties ( ie bi polar, which sometimes manifests in a way that you may not realize how dangerous the activity you are doing can be, such as walking alot the edge of a tall wall like a friend of mine did he broke his leg, not realizing he could be injured) She could also have been removed from her home due to some sort of abuse. however I would view that emotionally unstable versus mentally deficient. I posted a link with the attached arrest affidavit in a post a little while ago.

_____________________________

game store owner tattooed chick and resident sadist who is in pain alot.... life is fun!

(in reply to Mistletoe)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 8:05:17 AM

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

I noticed we had another thread on the case. This 'puter has Adobe issues, so I couldn't read the link over there.

My take on what I have seen in this case is that you could draw any realtime 24/7 slave on this site, put her in a room with DA's and a court appointed pshrink to talk about her sex life, and you'll get an announcement that she is mentally deficient, and that her dom is a monster.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Lizbetbathory)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 5:42:36 PM

Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

I noticed we had another thread on the case. This 'puter has Adobe issues, so I couldn't read the link over there.

My take on what I have seen in this case is that you could draw any realtime 24/7 slave on this site, put her in a room with DA's and a court appointed pshrink to talk about her sex life, and you'll get an announcement that she is mentally deficient, and that her dom is a monster.

Here is the link to the original story: http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=215878

She was 16 when this began.

Since you can't read the indictment, you miss the part about forced abortions, the various punishments/tortures including clamping off a catheter, use of electricity, killing animals in front of her by shooting them and telling her she was next.

Too bad you can't read about the rest of the "good times".

_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
(as deemed by He who owns me)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3234821/tm.htm

30 fluffy points!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQjuCQd01sg

(in reply to TheHeretic)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 7:42:33 PM

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

The thread title was intended to be ironic, AngieJ. The facts of the case will be for a jury to decide, and they'll have a bit more to look at than a press release from the prosecutor.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to angelikaJ)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 7:56:22 PM

CynthiaWVirginia

Posts: 1915
Joined: 2/28/2010
From: West Virginia, USA
Status: offline

From age 16! Holy cr*p!

Killing animals in front of her sounds like my dear old dad, may he rest in peace, and yes, I don't count that as anything BDSM, just plain old abusive.

This entire thing doesn't sound consensual so too bad it is linked with the lifestyle at all. Some people are into r/t nonconsensual slavery and I cannot equate that with what we do.

If I read that link I would need sedatives tonight.

(in reply to angelikaJ)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 8:06:24 PM

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

Judging by the hit count on the other thread, I'd say at least a few people are finding it an interesting read.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to CynthiaWVirginia)

RE: The good times never last - 9/11/2010 8:37:47 PM

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

There's really three separate issues with this. One being if this was an abusive situation or not after the age of 18. It absolutely was prior to that (the second) when she was a minor. The third being the constant reminder that, no matter how we as a community use the word 'consent', the law doesn't recognize that for our activities.

Anybody involved with this girl before her eighteenth birthday absolutely should be prosecuted. If she was not a legal adult, I absolutely believe that a crime was committed. The girl wouldn't have a leg to stand on signing any other type of contract before she is an adult. Any adult having sex with her before the age of 18 should be aware of the laws in their state.

We really can't kid ourselves on the rest. A lot of what we do isn't legal. I could be prosecuted for doing some of the very same things to clip over the years. Cracking out the wand really is the same thing as 'electro-torture' and I don't even want to waste the space to discuss everything else. I hate to see all of the charges that someone could find to bring against Me if I ever got nailed for BDSM.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to TheHeretic)

RE: The good times never last - 9/12/2010 3:34:20 PM

Zevar

Posts: 801
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Mo. man accused of keeping woman as sex slave

Notice how she gets labelled as "mentally deficient" by the prosecutors.

Opinion:

How tragic for this young woman who suffered at the hands of these loathsome debased abusive bastards. I wonder how many of those mentioned would have been the 1 willing to take what they dished out to this young woman? Bastards! Total debased bastards!

If my young adult daughter who is a few years older than the young woman mentioned in the article were to ever be treated in this manner the vile bastards would never see the light of day after prosecution.

“ Among the charges, all five defendants face one count of commercial sex trafficking. If convicted of that charge, the minimum sentence is 15 years in prison without parole, and the maximum penalty if the case involves aggravated sexual abuse is life in prison.”

The good times have yet to begin. Look out good ole boys because Bubba & his boys awaits your arrival! Welcome Home - Cell Block A-Pod Section - XYZ, oops maybe they’ll get housed elsewhere. Say what, General Population? One can hope for over-crowed conditions!

Prison yard conversation ensues at their arrival:

“ Hey boys ? See him over there? That really BIG dude? The one who is crushing that pipe with his hands? He is the owner of the new boys on the Block. Go on over there with Bubba and do exactly what he commands. You know like you did to that young girl? You remember don’t you? Go get your memory refreshed! Go on, go see the BIG dude he‘ll do you right. Welcome Home boys. ::::whistles::::: Come to Papa, boys! ”

This ends my Free Speech public opinion & analogy of what tends to happen to those who violate minors in the U.S.A. when incarcerated, that is!

(in reply to TheHeretic)

RE: The good times never last - 9/16/2010 5:09:05 PM

Posts: 21
Joined: 9/11/2010
Status: offline

The only thing I'm certain of is that none of the certainty posted above has any merit.

There has been no evidence presented.
There is only accusation which would and could be made regardless of her consent.

There hasn't even been an accusation that they had sex or engaged in sexual slavery with her as a minor.

And NONE of the charges are related to rape. Not one. If she was never raped, even as a minor, then that means she was able to consent and did consent. If she consented to sex then why can't she consent to bondage, TPE, or sexual slavery? The answer is that she did consent, but the DA is wanting to make a career of this case. And you guys are buying into it.

Every charge leveled at these men can be leveled at any of us on the website. You should consider that before you catch a ride on the moral bandwagon leading to your own destruction.

(in reply to Zevar)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 12:42:29 PM

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

I think you are basing your reference on different laws than I am.

As far as I am aware, a person can not legally consent to being assaulted. There aren't special clauses that say it was BDSM, so it was ok. You may get an understanding police officer that isn't going to bust you because the cop gets that you're just into kink, or a jury that will let you off the hook because there is evidence presented that the parties were doing these things because they wanted to and they ignore the letter of the law. That's as good as it's going to get. If you are prosecuted under the letter of the law, you don't really have recourse.

I'll be very blunt. If anybody laid a hand on this person prior to her being a legal adult, I have no problem with them being convicted. I have always held that position and I continue to do so. I don't care if it was tying her up, engaging in S/m play, or anything else. If she was not of the legal age of consent, any person who played with her deserves what they get.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to Shoshone)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 1:11:05 PM

Posts: 2504
Status: offline

Just a friendly reminder... topics like this can degenerate quickly. Let's think carefully before we post.

Thank you.

_____________________________

If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

(in reply to LadyPact)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 2:43:30 PM

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CynthiaWVirginia
From age 16! Holy cr*p!

Killing animals in front of her sounds like my dear old dad, may he rest in peace, and yes, I don't count that as anything BDSM, just plain old abusive.

This entire thing doesn't sound consensual so too bad it is linked with the lifestyle at all. Some people are into r/t nonconsensual slavery and I cannot equate that with what we do.

If I read that link I would need sedatives tonight.

You dont know what really happened. Law enforcement and police lie all the time to bolster their cases. We dont know what she is claiming versus what the FBI is alledging.

_____________________________

(in reply to CynthiaWVirginia)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 3:48:11 PM

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

There's really three separate issues with this. One being if this was an abusive situation or not after the age of 18. It absolutely was prior to that (the second) when she was a minor. The third being the constant reminder that, no matter how we as a community use the word 'consent', the law doesn't recognize that for our activities.

Anybody involved with this girl before her eighteenth birthday absolutely should be prosecuted. If she was not a legal adult, I absolutely believe that a crime was committed. The girl wouldn't have a leg to stand on signing any other type of contract before she is an adult. Any adult having sex with her before the age of 18 should be aware of the laws in their state.

We really can't kid ourselves on the rest. A lot of what we do isn't legal. I could be prosecuted for doing some of the very same things to clip over the years. Cracking out the wand really is the same thing as 'electro-torture' and I don't even want to waste the space to discuss everything else. I hate to see all of the charges that someone could find to bring against Me if I ever got nailed for BDSM.

In general, what people do in the BDSM community is not illegal. There are 50 states and 51 sets of laws, that are constantly in flux, so it is very hard to say anything with 100% certainty. I am not attorney, and not allowed by law to give legal advice. Hence, I do not give legal advice. I do have a right to state what I believe to be the truth. They have been several BDSM cases tried in the US, and in every case I am aware of the Defendant has been found "Not Guilty." Where he alledged victim admited to not using her "safe word," the Defendant was found "Not Guilty." If someone touches you without permission that is battery. If you give them permission to touich you, they are not guilty of committing the crime of battery. Biting, scratching, hair pulling, slapping, pinching, anal sex, flogging etc can all be considered part of consensual sex. A male sought out someone to castrate him. Things went badly and the guy almost bled to death. Police didn't file charges for days. They couldn't think of a valid legal theory to charge the guy with until they finally decided to charge him with praticing medicine without a license. The did not charge the Defendant with battery or aggrevated battery. This is an extreme case, and still no charge of assualt or battery. Anyone can bring any charge for any reason. The requirement for filing charges is very low compared to the requirements to find someone guilty. It is very hard for the state to prove that a top went too far. If tops want to protect themselves they should get their play partners to provide them a notorized document. The document should be as specfic as possible. It should give the date of play, the practices the bottom will allow, the hard limits of the bottom, the bottom's safe word, and an estimated start and end time. It should include a maxium number of floggings. This may sound silly. But armed with such a document few prosecutors are gong to take such a case to trial. IF you do something that is not in the contract, the bottom my say they never gave you consent to do that. So everything you do should be in the contract. Spelling things out in this way in a contract also eiminates a lot of possibilities for misunderstandings and bad memory. A sub my night remember giving persion for something he have permission for. Slave contracts really protect both parties. If one party changes their mind it should be written in the contract that it is their resonsiblity to make this known in writing to the other partner. This does not mean an oral revocation is not valid. But if it is stated in the contract courts will presume revocation was not given unless it can be documented that it was. If a sub wrote to a Dominatrix asking her to do x, y, z to him, and she ignored his safe word, and left nipple clamps on him much longer than he really wanted, if she flogged him extra long without leaving marks, there is really very little he could do to prove she violated his safe word. The burden of proof would be on him to prove he used his safe word and she didnt listen. Judges and juries have a right to use common sense.

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 9/18/2010 4:06:32 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to LadyPact)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 3:59:30 PM

Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

I thought you weren't a lawyer and wouldn't give legal advice. You just did.

From where I'm from... and that would mean a number of different states, in which I worked in domestic abuse... you can't agree to something unlawful, in contract or not and plan on getting away with something that is unlawful and it is unlawful to do much of what we do. In most places contracts are null and void if they break a state law. I would go to a lawyer before I considered I could make my own rules and I wouldn't listen to you.

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!

(in reply to WhipTheHip)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 4:38:37 PM

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit I thought you weren't a lawyer and wouldn't give legal advice. You just did. From where I'm from... and that would mean a number of different states, in which I worked in domestic abuse... you can't agree to something unlawful, in contract or not and plan on getting away with something that is unlawful and it is unlawful to do much of what we do. In most places contracts are null and void if they break a state law. I would go to a lawyer before I considered I could make my own rules and I wouldn't listen to you.

A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.

You dont understand the law. Just because someone can not give legal advice does not mean they can not state their legal opinion. Everyone has a first ammendment right to state their opinion. If a particular person here gave me specific facts, and I legally advised them to do such and such, that would constitute legal advice. Making genenral statements about the law is not the same as giving legal advice, or practicing law without a license. There are several elements to practicing a law without a license and they all must be proved for someone to be guilty of such an offense. In the instant case, not one of those elements are present. Rape is unlawful, but consent is a valid defense to rape.

You wrote: "You can't agree to something unlawful, in contract." This is true. You can't give someone permission to cut-off your arm. One partner can not give another permission to batter them, unless the battery was part of consensual sexual activity. You can't give your partner permission to bite you, scratch you, pull your hair or slap you if it is part of a pattern of physical abuse. You can give your partner permission to do these exact same things as part of foreplay. In first instance, it is not a form of play. In the second instance it is. Context is very important here. Judges and juries are not stupid. Normally speaking a spouse cannot condone physical abuse, but if that is something that turns her on sexually and she seeks it out, it is not necessarily unlawful. It is not unlawful to do much of what we do. You are wrong about this. Most contracts contain a close that state the remainder of a contract is enforceable even if part of contract is found to be unlawful.

You cant sign a contract giving another person permission to engage in domestic abuse. Slave contracts are not legally binding. You do have a right to sign a document saying you like sex that has light punching, flogging, whipping, slapping, anal sex, nipple biting, scratching and hair pulling. You do have a right to consent to rough sex, and specifiy just how rough you like your sex, and what fetishes you allow and which you don't. There is no state law that says rough sex is illegal, that you cant flog your partner to get her turned on if that is what turns her on. The law is not the stupid, undifferentiating beast you think it is. The law can differentiate between true domestic abuse, and BDSM conduct. If a female who was never into BDSM signed a document saying she is into BDSM and gives her partner permission to beat her that probably would not hold up in court. The court would see through that attempt, and claim the document was pretextual, was a ploy and a legal pretense. If a female was into BDSM relationships her whole life and she tried to file charges agaisnt her partner for putting a clothespin on her nipple, she might have a hard time finding a prosecutor wiilling to take her case.

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 9/18/2010 4:48:09 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Lockit)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 4:53:12 PM

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

This case is not being tried in state court but in Federal Court where it is easier to convict defendants, and defendants have fewer rights. The FBI worked this case in conjuction with an angry group of survivors whose agenda is ending human trafficing. If you are a carpenter everything either looks like a hammer or a nail. This group wants to find human trafficers so they can personal satisfaction punishing low-down dirty scum-bag rats. They see human trafficing everywhere.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shoshone

The only thing I'm certain of is that none of the certainty posted above has any merit.

There has been no evidence presented.
There is only accusation which would and could be made regardless of her consent.

There hasn't even been an accusation that they had sex or engaged in sexual slavery with her as a minor.

And NONE of the charges are related to rape. Not one. If she was never raped, even as a minor, then that means she was able to consent and did consent. If she consented to sex then why can't she consent to bondage, TPE, or sexual slavery? The answer is that she did consent, but the DA is wanting to make a career of this case. And you guys are buying into it.

Every charge leveled at these men can be leveled at any of us on the website. You should consider that before you catch a ride on the moral bandwagon leading to your own destruction.

_____________________________

(in reply to Shoshone)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 5:19:57 PM

Posts: 1088
Joined: 10/6/2006
From: Washington State
Status: offline

I'm in shock. I can't believe what is being written here.   When is the line crossed?
Does it happen about the time you threaten someone with death?   After reading the case report, rape is the least offensive act mentioned. Selling another human for profit, ( I don't care if it's only for a pack of cigarettes) is illegal, period, no signed piece of paper will suffice in court. If you feel otherwise, please let me know when you are planning to present a "slave" signed contract to a Federal judge. I want to be there.

Shooting animals that the girl was fond of and then threatening with the same, is also going to be hard to defend in court.

Under state criminal codes, which vary by state, it is an offense to knowingly utter or convey a threat to cause death or bodily harm to any person. It is also an offense to threaten to burn, destroy or damage property or threaten to kill, poison or injure an animal or bird that belongs to a person.

http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/death-threat/

I'd say on those two subjects alone, the men involved should get used to wearing state issued clothing.

No, we don't know the woman, nor were we there to witness the atrocities she claimed, however, if only 1/3 of what she stated is true, then I wouldn't shed a tear if the men were removed from society.  That would be an act of kindness, which they don't deserve.

_____________________________

Just an old flower child, trying to survive in today's chaos and confusion.

(in reply to WhipTheHip)

RE: The good times never last - 9/18/2010 5:39:59 PM

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

The female in this case carried her own gun, had her own cell phone, interactrf with police on a regular basis, worked at a local strip club, and was on the July 2007 cover of Hustler Taboo. Accordig to the FBI anyone who shows another fetish porn is grooming them and brainwashing them. Anyone who suffers depression or has a slightly below average IQ is mentally deficient. She was and is considered legally competent to conduct her own financial affairs. She was never deemed incompetent by a court of a law. She was not too mentally defecient to serve in the US military, and give her life for your country. She was not mentally deficient with regards to being tried as an adult criminal for any crime she committed, and sentence to die in the electric chair. The guy she stayed with did not believe he was doing anything illegal. He did everything out in the open. He did not attempt to conceal anything he did. Just the opposite, he broadcast everything he did to the world. I do not think edge play is sane. I do not think what this guy did was right, but what he did is no different than plenty of the stuff that goes on in the BDSM community. No one is prosecuting guys doing the exact same thing he did to their 18 year old subs. No one cared about this female when she was a homeless drug addict.

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 9/18/2010 5:43:15 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to WhipTheHip)

Page: [1] 2 3 4 5 next > >>

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Alternative Lifestyles in the News >> The good times never last

Page: [1] 2 3 4 5 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2024

Terms of Service

0.766