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UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 3:25:43 AM

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From: Tamaris
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Well, this is the latest unwise remark by a conservative government senior advisor, which might very well indicate the attitude the party holds towards the poor in this country, an attitude many have described as out of touch ;

Howard Flight a former Conservative party deputy chairman now recommended for a peerage to the House of Lords said;

He told the London Evening Standard: "We're going to have a system where the middle classes are discouraged from breeding because it's jolly expensive. "But for those on benefits, there is every incentive. Well, that's not very sensible."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11837538

And it is not the first of such politically embarrasing gaffes by those in power and attached to it, for this latest one came only a week after Lord Young said;

Most Britons "had never had it so good" during the "so-called recession".

Yet more examples of stupid people revealing their inner thoughts but what is scary, is these people are advisors to those governing this country and if those advisors other comments are being taken on board, well, one can only wonder at what the conservative party mentality really is, I believe we shall come to see that in time.

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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 3:29:53 AM

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Cameron has already dealt with this days ago. To suggest it is current Conservative thinking is absurd.

(in reply to Aneirin)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 3:38:13 AM

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But do you not agree it presents a worry if it is these people feel so sure of their beliefs that they are willing to say such things in the public arena, where they will be picked up on ? Are they correct of stupid and if the latter does the synopsis create positive thought or negative thought towards our government ?

But at the end of the day, it could depend upon a persons views and indeed who they voted for as surely pro tory must hold similar ideals.

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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 3:40:39 AM

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It gets better. Tory MP Claire Perry has questioned whether poor people are fit to have children.

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 4:02:56 AM

hertz

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The Tories never change. Not really. Whatever the media-friendly mouthpiece says, behind him stand ranks of snobs and inbred monied buffoons.

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 4:21:21 AM

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I never really saw it before, for in the past I have voted tory, but now I am beginning to see the difference;

Vote tory if you have money, and vote other if you haven't, but one thing I am also beginning to see, is those who have money are interested in making as much as possible, there is never enough and with that desire comes distasteful actions towards other people.

Britain used to have it's own power, communications, industry and transport systems, but now most of it is in foreign hands, for the tories sold it off to the highest bidder, and we wonder why we have very little in this country, everything that was built up for the people has gone with a mentality of so we have it, lets sell it and make money for ourselves and our cronies.

And we wonder about British Industry, how the hell can we ever get anything going again, when the mentality is, as soon as a thing makes a profit or a loss, sell it off, do not invest in the future.

Now someone said we have a government system that lurches from one direction to another more or less every four years, for neither of them past or present can agree to invest in a future for this country, a future something that with every term of office just grows for the benefit of the future people.

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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to hertz)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 6:22:47 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

And we wonder about British Industry, how the hell can we ever get anything going again

Re-nationalize and that would take a revolution.

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(in reply to Aneirin)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 6:35:46 AM

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I am for re nationalisation of our commodities, under the belief it is ours and in our interest to make it the best it can be for us to use and for our future people to use, but to re nationalise, perhaps the price is too high, someone somewhere will make a mint on it as they did when it was first sold off.

But as to privatisation of our commodities, have we seen the improvemments we were promised would take place I wonder, or is it just a cash cow for others who do the minimum to stop their profits leaking away.

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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 11:13:31 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz

The Tories never change. Not really. Whatever the media-friendly mouthpiece says, behind him stand ranks of snobs and inbred monied buffoons.

Well, if the Tory party was just the monied buffons, it makes you wonder why Labour were unable to win the election.

Politicians of both parties spout nonsense, to suggest otherwise is naive.

(in reply to hertz)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 11:23:13 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

And we wonder about British Industry, how the hell can we ever get anything going again

quote:

ORIGINAL: allthatjazz
Re-nationalize and that would take a revolution.

Nationalisation didnt work for the car industry or the shipbuilders, why would it work now ? Both industries failed due to strieks and bad management. Millions of tax payers pounds was pumped into them to no avail, eventually leading to both industries all but vanishing from the UK.

My opinion is manufacturing needs to be encouraged, both with tax incentives and decent wages. The energy companies and the railways would be better off nationalised, and run as reasonable profit making organisations. The profits being ploughed back into research and new investments. Foreign companies should never have been able to gain control of the energy supply or the railways.

PFI contracts also need to be looked at as manor that Brown signed off were a bad deal for the tax payer. Coventry Hospital was quoted as costing £30 million yet the final cost was over £400 million. Brown made the deals because PFI contracts were able to be kept off the national deficit. Major shares the blame for having introduced them in the first place.

Edited to fix quotes.

< Message edited by Politesub53 -- 11/29/2010 11:31:15 AM >

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 11:27:25 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
My opinion is manufacturing needs to be encouraged, both with tax incentives and decent wages. The energy companies and the railways would be better off nationalised, and run as reasonable profit making organisations. The profits being ploughed back into research and new investments. Foreign companies should never have been able to gain control of the energy supply or the railways.

I think you're missing a fairly basic point, there: the reason the rail systems were nationalised was because they couldn't run at a profit in the first place. I'm of the opinion that the stockholders should be paying weregeld whenever there's a train crash now. Most of these are happening because corners are being cut to keep their dividends flowing, after all.

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(in reply to Politesub53)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 11:43:49 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I think you're missing a fairly basic point, there: the reason the rail systems were nationalised was because they couldn't run at a profit in the first place. I'm of the opinion that the stockholders should be paying weregeld whenever there's a train crash now. Most of these are happening because corners are being cut to keep their dividends flowing, after all.

Im not missing anything, the car industry and the shipbuiding industry were both making a loss as private concerns. Both continued to do so after nationalisation.

Railtrack was an accident waiting to happen caused by the Converatives not selling each network wholesale, as well as an inital lack of strong regulation. I think if each company had bought both the track and rolling stock franchise things would have been better.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 11:49:36 AM

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No argument with that.
Although British Steel, at least, seemed to be doing a lot better than the nationalised shipbuilding. It would have been interesting to see what would have happened if the NCB had been privatised, rather than shut down...

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 12:51:18 PM

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Yep, the New media-friendly veneer of the ConArtivists is showing the cracks already, trying desperately to take money from legions of Dukedoms who finance them, yet keep them quiet in this age of political correctness.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 12:58:07 PM

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Still, at least they've pretty much destroyed the libdems over the last six months. That's something when you look at how Clegg has been behaving.

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 1:33:12 PM

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From: Tamaris
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Whats wrong with national commodities just being what they are as a service to the UK citizens and breaking more or less even, why has profit always got to be the concern ? If profit is the sole motivation of a commodity, it is like saying to the population you own it, you pay for it's upkeep, but it's ripping you off.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 1:36:55 PM

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That's good, back to a two horse race in future the withs vote tory, the withouts vote labour, no abstainers in between, a simple yes or no will suffice.

But with that, unless a miracle happens, we are stuck with the same old shite year in year out for eternity. If people desire change, then it will be the last one out, turn off the lights as they seek a more progressive country.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/29/2010 4:51:31 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

No argument with that.
Although British Steel, at least, seemed to be doing a lot better than the nationalised shipbuilding. It would have been interesting to see what would have happened if the NCB had been privatised, rather than shut down...

I am wondering how well you know the history of coal. It was at its peak in the UK Circa 1915. It certainly went into mass decline after WW2 more so after we found North Sea Gas, then oil in the 70s. It just became unprofitable to supply, as most things do after a period of time. Nothing to do with politics, just a sharp drop in demand.

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RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/30/2010 6:48:08 AM

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Not quite: it just became cheaper to import it than to pay people to dig it up. The political thing was more down to the wicked witch seizing on that as an excuse to pick a fight with one of the country's most powerful unions and destroy it, though. That's true enough.
Of course, demand and price for coal has risen since the turn of the '90s.

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I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to Politesub53)

RE: UK Poor encouraged to breed - 11/30/2010 8:02:22 AM

kdsub

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I have no knowledge of the UK’s inner politics or the workings of your welfare system but if it is anything like ours some years ago we also had politicians making the same comments.

There was a perception and in some cases reality where the system was encouraging and rewarding women on welfare to have children out of wedlock. Women were having children for money but not marrying the fathers. This was increasing the population of welfare children at the expense of the tax payer at a time when middleclass families were decreasing in size because of the tax and economic burden. Perhaps the same is happening in your country.

If so I find his comments insensitive but not necessary incorrect. It should be a wakeup call to you as it was to us and not taken as racism.

Butch

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