RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun?

RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (Full Version)

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allthatjaz -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 2:54:28 PM)
this thread is fucking laughable

hertz -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:05:06 PM)
Mixed response and good stuff, mostly, with the odd exception. Working back through the posts, I guess I would argue that just because it's the Internet doesn't mean that it 'doesn't matter'. Everything matters. And being accused of racism purely on the grounds that someone disagrees with a point of view matters more than most things, in my opinion. But I guess I could just fall in with the oh so modern attitude that nothing is wrong, there are no problems, and if one sees a problem then it is you who needs to change and not the thing you see as a problem. I wish I had that sort of confidence in the status quo. Regarding telling tales, I am reminded of many of the people I have worked with who hold to the honour code - never snitch to the Police. It never ceases to amaze me that the very people who are most likely to be victimised by criminals, are bound by a code which removes the only shred of protection they have. The report button here is here for a reason. I can't see why anyone would choose not to use a facility which is designed to protect them from abuse. My experience tells me that if one gives up the environment to abusers and liars, then the environment ends up belonging to them. I hate the way bullies gang up and go into attack mode purely to shut someone up or drive them away. It happens a lot on the net. It's as if the brakes come off, and people feel it is their right to club together and form a posse. It's especially noticeable when some users join a thread for no other reason than to add an insult, or make a point of calling names, or, as Jeffffff has done in this thread, simply to carry on a previous disagreement with a subtle bit of theatre. LadyPact, Termyn8or - thanks. I have 4 people on hide at the moment. I tend not to leave people there forever. Maybe that's where I am going wrong... Is growing a thick skin the right answer? Really? Is it entirely necessary to see every last bit of feeling and emotion blunted and muffled in order to be here? I understand why this is good advice in the short term, but long term, I think getting a thick skin has as many disadvantages as advantages. I've tried the infantile responses thing. I have hoped, on more than one occasion, that the other side might see the irony in it. They never do. Ever. Yeah, I don't need to let this bother me. And I can walk away. But it's good to talk about it as well. I'm interested in other points of view. Thanks, all of you.

TheHeretic -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:12:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jeffff Sometimes, what seems like name calling, is just accurate identification. I'm with big nose on this one.

AquaticSub -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:18:59 PM)
~Fast Reply~ Eh... I'm of different minds on this one. I have certainly called people out or publicly questioned why they decided to speak to a poster in a particular manner. And there have been people that I have reported and simply left it in the moderators hands. And there are certain people on here where I simply shake my head and more or less ignore them for various reasons. Only a handful of people have actually gone on ignore during my years here but there have, and still are, people who I just don't read. At the same time, I'm quite aware that there are people on this forum who find me... less than enjoyable company, shall we say? [;)]

allthatjaz -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:27:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hertz I hate the way bullies gang up and go into attack mode purely to shut someone up or drive them away. It happens a lot on the net. It's as if the brakes come off, and people feel it is their right to club together and form a posse. It's especially noticeable when some users join a thread for no other reason than to add an insult, or make a point of calling names, or, as Jeffffff has done in this thread, simply to carry on a previous disagreement with a subtle bit of theatre. The great thing is though, if you meet these people in rl, as I did with one particular woman who believed that bullying people on the web wasn't real and so it didn't really matter, they become shrinking violets! I like nothing more than a good fight with a bully but I'll do it face to face.

stef -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:32:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TribeTziyon I think threatening to reort people makes one sound like a tattler. It brings on a whole grade school vibe. And being a whiny douche by repeatedly posting "I reported you" further compounds that. If you're being seriously offended by what complete strangers say online then maybe it's time to get off the net for a while. ~stef

hertz -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:44:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stef quote: ORIGINAL: TribeTziyon I think threatening to reort people makes one sound like a tattler. It brings on a whole grade school vibe. And being a whiny douche by repeatedly posting "I reported you" further compounds that. If you're being seriously offended by what complete strangers say online then maybe it's time to get off the net for a while. ~stef Just FYI, stef, I have never threatened to report anyone. If I think someone needs reporting, then I hit the report button and tell them what have done. Because you have just called me a 'whiny douche', and the last four encounters I have had with you have all been about you calling me names (I don't believe we have had an interaction where you have not called me a name), you'll be delighted to hear that I have just reported you again. As for getting off the net if I am offended by strangers, did it not occur to you that much as I find your continual harrassment annoying and irritating, I am not prepared to let you decide where I can go or not go?

VaguelyCurious -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:45:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hertz Working back through the posts, I guess I would argue that just because it's the Internet doesn't mean that it 'doesn't matter'. Everything matters. No. Not everything matters. Your opinion, for example, does not matter to me on any fundamental level, because you're a bunch of pixels. I mean, for all I know you think marmite is a valid foodstuff-which would invalidate anything you could possibly say. [8D] And if (in your said opinion that doesn't matter to me outside the fact that you stating it is enabling me to communicate with you) everything matters, how on earth do you have the energy to get het up about this, of all things? Surely there are a thousand things that matter more. quote: And being accused of racism purely on the grounds that someone disagrees with a point of view matters more than most things, in my opinion. Does it? The opinion of a stranger on the internet matters 'more than most things'? I could think of a thousand an one things that matter more, starting with my real life family and ending maybe somewhere around the increasing price of lemonade in my local corner shop. If the opinions of strangers are so important to you that you would say they matter more than most things then your priorities are screwed. quote: I can't see why anyone would choose not to use a facility which is designed to protect them from abuse. That's an easy one: because they understand that it's designed to protect them from abuse, and they think (unlike you, obviously) that namecalling doesn't constitute abuse. quote: Is growing a thick skin the right answer? Really? Is it entirely necessary to see every last bit of feeling and emotion blunted and muffled in order to be here? No. It's entirely necessary to have a sense of proportion to be here. And probably a little less tendency to melodrama, if you want to be taken seriously. I mean, 'every least bit of feeling and emotion blunted and muffled'? Really? Could you be any more over the top if you were trying? Let's not overcomplicate or romanticise this-people are calling you names, and you're reacting to them. This is not a deep, touching drama of the heart, it's a messageboard squabble.

TheHeretic -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:46:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stef And being a whiny douche by repeatedly posting "I reported you" further compounds that. If you're being seriously offended by what complete strangers say online then maybe it's time to get off the net for a while. ~stef I'm with the mean girl, too. This is getting complicated.

AquaticSub -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:53:17 PM)
Seriously - why do you feel the need to tell someone that you've reported them? That's just... juvenile. Trust me, if the mods have an issue with the post they will say something to the poster. Your commentary that you've reported them is just pointless and fanning the flames.

DesFIP -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:57:38 PM)
I haven't seen anyone attack the op. I have seen him/her being told repeatedly that their opinion is wrong/laughable/etc. Saying that you've said something stupid is not the same as saying that you are stupid. And since I will admit that I've said the former on multiple occasions to multiple posters including the op, but I have never been moderated, I have to assume that I am staying on the right side of the line. I would suggest that the op go to fetlife and find some of the strictly moderated groups where any bluntness or disagreement is frowned upon. Since his/her skin is too thin for CM.

Rule -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 3:59:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hertz And being accused of racism purely on the grounds that someone disagrees with a point of view matters more than most things, in my opinion. What is wrong with being a racist? The Koran says: "O people, we created you from the same male and female, and rendered you distinct peoples and tribes, that you may recognize one another", so the higher beings are racists. If someone calls me a racist, I say: "Why, thank you!" quote: ORIGINAL: hertz I am reminded of many of the people I have worked with who hold to the honour code - never snitch to the Police. The report button here is here for a reason. I can't see why anyone would choose not to use a facility which is designed to protect them from abuse. I can tell you why. I reported someone a single time and afterwards swore to never do that again. I had started a scientifically very successful and popular fat poll, when one rude fellow started to offend the participants in the thread in a sickening way in many posts. When I reported him, the whole thread was pulled - without notifying me so that I might save the valuable and significant results of the poll. Such disrespect for science in my eyes is utter barbarism. I still want that fat poll reinstated. quote: ORIGINAL: hertz My experience tells me that if one gives up the environment to abusers and liars, then the environment ends up belonging to them. I hate the way bullies gang up and go into attack mode purely to shut someone up or drive them away. It happens a lot on the net. It's as if the brakes come off, and people feel it is their right to club together and form a posse. To be fair: such victims often have it coming to them. They then are like unbalanced dogs that are corrected or torn to pieces by the pack. (I have watched the dog whisperer this past half year.) quote: ORIGINAL: hertz It's especially noticeable when some users join a thread for no other reason than to add an insult, or make a point of calling names, or, as Jeffffff has done in this thread, simply to carry on a previous disagreement with a subtle bit of theatre. He said that name-calling sometimes is an accurate identification. He is right. It is your choice to take offense at what he said or not. In this case you made the wrong choice; never mind the previous disagreement and the bit of theatre. quote: ORIGINAL: hertz I have 4 people on hide at the moment. I tend not to leave people there forever. Maybe that's where I am going wrong... Indeed. I once lifted Hide from one woman, responded to a post of hers in a well-intentioned way, and the evil bitch turned around and viciously bit me, resulting in me getting moderation for two weeks. (I was too disgusted at that altercation to protest the moderation.) That taught me to not lift Hide from those hidden. quote: ORIGINAL: hertz I've tried the infantile responses thing. I have hoped, on more than one occasion, that the other side might see the irony in it. They never do. Ever. You know what? Before replying to such posts, consult me first by cmail.

SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:00:49 PM)
This says it all [image]local://upfiles/963036/25EAA8C36D7D40FE90F87BDA2A679821.jpg[/image]

AquaticSub -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:03:16 PM)
I love that cartoon.... [:)]

Rule -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:07:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hertz Just FYI, stef, I have never threatened to report anyone. If I think someone needs reporting, then I hit the report button and tell them what have done. Because you have just called me a 'whiny douche', and the last four encounters I have had with you have all been about you calling me names (I don't believe we have had an interaction where you have not called me a name), you'll be delighted to hear that I have just reported you again. As for getting off the net if I am offended by strangers, did it not occur to you that much as I find your continual harassment annoying and irritating, I am not prepared to let you decide where I can go or not go? Simply put him or her on Hide. I did that years ago.

PeonForHer -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:07:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: allthatjaz The great thing is though, if you meet these people in rl, as I did with one particular woman who believed that bullying people on the web wasn't real and so it didn't really matter, they become shrinking violets! I like nothing more than a good fight with a bully but I'll do it face to face. I don't hold with the 'it's all pixels on a screen' idea. I did once, but not anymore. Eventually, you get to know people's vulnerabilities and they get to know yours. Relationships on forums become real relationships and people demonstrably do get hurt as a result. Prior to the Internet, many, many experts of the mind pondered about why some people were aggressive and some people weren't. One thing they didn't talk much about - because it was considered trite and self-evident - was the fact that aggressive people are often aggressive because they could be aggressive. They were big, they were strong, and sometimes they even carried weapons. On forums, everyone is big and strong, and those who are good with words now have the weapons. That, for me, is the bulk of the answer: people are shitty mostly because at last,with the Internet, they can be shitty.

VaguelyCurious -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:14:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer I don't hold with the 'it's all pixels on a screen' idea. I did once, but not anymore. Eventually, you get to know people's vulnerabilities and they get to know yours. Relationships on forums become real relationships and people demonstrably do get hurt as a result. I'd go with this to some extent, but I don't think it has anything to do with this discussion-the OP is not talking about friends or people he has a real relationship with, he's talking about arguments on the politics forum, and there's a difference between the two. That's like saying that because I have a real human friendship with you, lovely one, the opinion of [insert the name of someone I've never done anything but bicker with] is just as valid because we communicate through the same medium. They're pixels on a screen, you're pixels on a screen with all sorts of emotional and personal details attached. Not the same thing.

PeonForHer -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:20:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious I'd go with this to some extent, but I don't think it has anything to do with this discussion-the OP is not talking about friends or people he has a real relationship with, he's talking about arguments on the politics forum, and there's a difference between the two. But that's my point, hon. On the politics forum, especially, people put their real feelings into what's being said. They do that, then they're on their way to having real relationships with one another. Hertz is a strong example of this: from what I've seen, he throws himself - his real self - into it. I don't, on that forum, or at least not much (for reasons you know).

stef -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:28:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hertz Just FYI, stef, I have never threatened to report anyone. Just FYI, hertz, I have never claimed that you did. quote: If I think someone needs reporting, then I hit the report button and tell them what have done. Because you have just called me a 'whiny douche', and the last four encounters I have had with you have all been about you calling me names (I don't believe we have had an interaction where you have not called me a name), you'll be delighted to hear that I have just reported you again. Did I mention you in that post? No. Grow the fuck up already instead of being such a crybaby. By the way, I thought you blocked me? Infantile and a liar, what a bang-up combination. You must have to beat off women with a stick! quote: As for getting off the net if I am offended by strangers, did it not occur to you that much as I find your continual harrassment annoying and irritating, I am not prepared to let you decide where I can go or not go? You mistakenly assume that I care what you are or are not prepared to do. Now go ask mommy to change your nappy and put you down for the evening. ~stef

hertz -> RE: Name-calling - forbidden, or fun? (12/4/2010 4:38:49 PM)
PeonForHer... Exactly my dilemma. I'm not very good at being anyone else. I am who I am, and I am who I am, here. Maybe some of you are playing by different rules - that's fine, but I'd like you to accept that some of the people you are mixing with here are real people, with real feelings and real principles and ideals. Don't confuse me with the pixels you see on the screen, or the internet persona you may encounter elsewhere. This is the real deal. The relationships I form here are just as real to me as any others I have. The only difference is that if you hurt me, you don't have to deal with it as you might have to in the real world. But I still do. Maybe that's at the root of this? Maybe it's about a difference of opinion about whether or not this actually matters. I say it does, but the scornful responses from some suggest that this is not the universal opinion. I feel a poll coming on...

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