RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot

RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

Hippiekinkster -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:38:04 PM)
So let me try and understand this. In general, the righties are saying that some headcase who has posted anti-government paranoid ramblings on teh interwebs just happened to be locked and loaded, and just happened to wander into a store where a Dem Congresswoman was having a community meet n greet. Just entirely coincidental. He just happened to be in the neighborhood when he got the urge to murder. Is that accurate? Okey-dokey.

Lockit -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:39:27 PM)
Have you ever sat with a woman that had just lost her child? What thought do we give to those that are actually, on this day, going through the horror of losing a loved one? How wonderful we all are when someone comes here and announces that so and so died... but oh no... anything else is up for debate and examinations to see who caused it. The left, the right... what the fuck does any of that have to do with a grieving loved one? I, just Polly Anna like, thought maybe we could show a little respect here in America. Shows what I know.

RapierFugue -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:43:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster Is that accurate? No, it's not. Not even close. What he's saying is that the nature of American politics ATM is so divisive and "febrile" (his word, not mine, although it's a good one) that speculation on the net immediately seemed to polarise purely along party lines, rather than, as Lockit suggested, and as I was commenting on, that people might look on it first and foremost as a tragedy within their (your) country, and wait for the morning light before rolling out the blame-storming agenda. Hope that clears up any confusion.

kdsub -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:46:09 PM)
Lets not limit volatile politics to America ... It is a world wide phenomenon that has always been with us but exaggerated by the easy access to the media in today’s world. This disaster could be a political motivated one and to expect people not to comment on what they believe the reason for these actions is silly. Below are comments by the Pima County Sheriff…if people directly investigating the murders are talking about politics why should we not. Butch "The sheriff pointed to the vitriolic political rhetoric that has consumed the country as he denounced the shooting that claimed several of his friends as victims, including U.S. District Judge John Roll. The judge celebrated Mass on Saturday morning like he does every day before stopping by to say hello to his good friend Giffords. "When you look at unbalanced people, how they respond to the vitriol that comes out of certain mouths about tearing down the government. The anger, the hatred, the bigotry that goes on in this country is getting to be outrageous," the sheriff said. "And unfortunately, Arizona I think has become the capital. We have become the mecca for prejudice and bigotry."

Hippiekinkster -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:48:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RapierFugue quote: ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster Is that accurate? No, it's not. Not even close. What he's saying is that the nature of American politics ATM is so divisive and "febrile" (his word, not mine, although it's a good one) that speculation on the net immediately seemed to polarise purely along party lines, rather than, as Lockit suggested, and as I was commenting on, that people might look on it first and foremost as a tragedy within their (your) country, and wait for the morning light before rolling out the blame-storming agenda. Hope that clears up any confusion. My error for using the quote button as though I were responding to you. I weren't. My remark is aimed at those who try to claim that this wasn't a political murder.

KatyLied -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:48:22 PM)
n/m

Lockit -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:50:54 PM)
kdsub, when I first posted, they were not talking about politics. I felt it would be good to get information out there, see what was going on and in some way recognize the pain that many were suffering on this day. Yet, before any real information could be put out, some had the answers as to why it happened. I guess when people think they know what happened... it's okay to talk about it and lose the fact that a child died today... many parents grieve, many spouses have no spouse and some kids lost their parent. I guess in the big scope of the big bad world... that doesn't matter.

TheHeretic -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:52:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda Especially if one of the people who she targets with one of those gunsights gets shot in the head by a conservative. I'd like to know where you are getting that the (alleged) shooter is a conservative, Panda. From what I saw of the internet postings, and have heard from the sketchy news reports, is that this character is just a perma-baked nutcase. It's interesting how the details evolve. At one point, early today, CNN was saying he was a military veteran who had served in the middle east, now the story is he was rejected when he tried to join the Army. Surely you aren't just assuming he was conservative because he put a bullet in a Democrats brain? I'll ask again. What are you basing this "conservative" assumption on?

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:55:03 PM)
Lockit, Maybemaybenot.... I don't know exactly who you're talking about, so I don't know whether to agree with you or defend myself. So I'll just assume you're not talking about me, and say, "Right on, sisters! I'm with you all the way!"

RapierFugue -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 6:56:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lockit kdsub, when I first posted, they were not talking about politics. I felt it would be good to get information out there, see what was going on and in some way recognize the pain that many were suffering on this day. Yet, before any real information could be put out, some had the answers as to why it happened. I guess when people think they know what happened... it's okay to talk about it and lose the fact that a child died today... many parents grieve, many spouses have no spouse and some kids lost their parent. I guess in the big scope of the big bad world... that doesn't matter. You actually changed my mind. I'll admit that, when I first saw some posts, in a Political forum after all, I was going to chip in. Your comments made me realise there's all the time in the world for that, another day. Today's a day for grieving if one is involved and showing sympathy if one is not. Oh, and cheers for changing my mind. It happens rarely enough that it's a genuinely interesting feeling when it does occur.

JstAnotherSub -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 7:02:17 PM)
fast reply I am sorry for the loved ones of the folks killed and sorry for the injured and their families. Gawd, at the risk of sounding like my mom, I gotta say, some days I feel like we are headed to hell ina handbasket.

kdsub -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 7:07:22 PM)
I hope no one is forgetting that people died today...and trying to figure how someone could so callously take life, politically motivated or not, is human nature and nothing wrong with it. I was speculating as to the reason myself and still am…if I were to of revealed my thoughts earlier it would have been no disrespect to the murdered and would not expect to be chastised for it. I would not have said my views were facts just speculation as to the possible reasons…there has to be a reason not matter how warped. If we wait till we have all the facts we will never comment in this environment don’t you think. Maybe you are right...maybe all the murder and mayhem every day in this world has desensitized me and I don’t feel the depth of emotion I should… I hope that is not the case. Butch

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 7:17:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster Or just maybe if the public gets outraged enough and speaks up right after shit like this happens, the right-wing agitators will cool their rhetoric and the unhinged will be less likely to believe they received a message from Palin or Beck to go murder a Dem Congresswoman or some innocents in a church in Knoxville. Spot on, as usual. And I'll take your reasoning a step further - I'm shaking my head in bewilderment here, because it doesn't seem to have occurred to any of these people that maybe - just maybe - the reason that some of us are so outraged and outspoken right now is specifically because we are furious about the senseless loss of innocent life. I mean, jesus christ... a fucking nine year old child goes to the store with her parents and gets her fucking head blown off by a fucking lunatic. A nine year old child. It's fucking horrifying, and god damn it, it's fucking infuriating. I would think that to most people, it would go without saying that we are appalled and sickened by the tragedy and the horror of it. But apparently, unless we recite it out loud as though it's some sort of secret password, the only conclusion that can be drawn is that we are unfeeling monsters, and have no right to discuss the issue at all. Well, fuck that. I've been literally sick to my stomach all day from the mental image of that dead little girl, and the unimaginable grief of the people whose loved ones were blown away by this worthless piece of dog shit - and I still feel like discussing the political aspects of the crime. So I'm going to. Because I have yet to see anyone offer a single rational reason I shouldn't.

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 7:20:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Maybe you are right...maybe all the murder and mayhem every day in this world has desensitized me and I don’t feel the depth of emotion I should… I hope that is not the case. Butch No, Butch. It is not the case. You do feel it. Why? Because you are who you are, and you are motivated by what always motivates you. You are not capable of not feeling it. Maybe it's on a level you can't quite recognize, and maybe it's at a stage that is unfamiliar at the moment, but there's no way in the world that you, of all people, are not feeling this. It wouldn't be possible. I wouldn't sweat this for a moment, if i were you.

Lockit -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 7:22:32 PM)
I am not protesting the outrage or even speaking of it now... it was just early on before any real facts could be presented as truth to anyone... people knew what happened and seemed to care little about the loss of life rather than that ever more important political battle. Have at it... But for me and mine... we are just sick thinking that someone could go shopping unaware maybe that a political event was taking place in a store and could be killed... just like that. This was political... the crazy guy was talking political stuff as well as crazy stuff... somewhat like we see around here every day. I really don't live in a Polly Anna world and I don't like denial... but to think that anyone really knows within hours, what happened and who was involved... is a bit of crazy talk in my opinion.

Zevar -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 7:55:18 PM)
~FR~ The tragedy today, which was perpetrated on those who have died and all of those wounded, indeed was a causality of murderess actions. No person deserves such callous actions, regardless of their personal beliefs and values. The individual who perpetrated this murderess act has place himself into the role of a contemptible person, by way of his chosen actions. The trauma experienced as a result of this tragedy is unspoken in its fullness, due to the actions of a young lad who chose to do unto others what he surely would not have done unto himself. Nonetheless, the trauma occurred and has egregiously impacted many people. This sort of murderess pillaging does not come by way of a casual choice. Instead the act of murder planned with 30 rounds or so of ammunition speaks loudly of the sorrow and grief perpetrated on innocent victims. Political affiliation has not much to do with hate and ignorance. No! These vicious and malicious attributes, hate and ignorance, have been among humanity since time began. At this point it is immature to point fingers and assign blame, aye! However, the murderess actions of this young lad has unnecessarily brought forth a dark night of the soul for many people. I bid peace where there is turmoil. Strength where there is weakness. Calm where there is anxiety. Wisdom where hate tempts for revenge. Love where hate and anger is running amuck. And above all courage where there is a desire to relinquish toward anything less than the Healing power of all that is derived from the Light of that which does shine forth into this world, when we believe it so, even amidst the ashes of a tragedy such as this. I bid all well!

EternalHoH -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 8:51:04 PM)
A second 'person of interest' is being sought. Pima Co Sheriff does not believe he was acting alone. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032619/#40982343

Hippiekinkster -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 9:02:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda quote: ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster Or just maybe if the public gets outraged enough and speaks up right after shit like this happens, the right-wing agitators will cool their rhetoric and the unhinged will be less likely to believe they received a message from Palin or Beck to go murder a Dem Congresswoman or some innocents in a church in Knoxville. Spot on, as usual. And I'll take your reasoning a step further - I'm shaking my head in bewilderment here, because it doesn't seem to have occurred to any of these people that maybe - just maybe - the reason that some of us are so outraged and outspoken right now is specifically because we are furious about the senseless loss of innocent life. I mean, jesus christ... a fucking nine year old child goes to the store with her parents and gets her fucking head blown off by a fucking lunatic. A nine year old child. It's fucking horrifying, and god damn it, it's fucking infuriating. I would think that to most people, it would go without saying that we are appalled and sickened by the tragedy and the horror of it. But apparently, unless we recite it out loud as though it's some sort of secret password, the only conclusion that can be drawn is that we are unfeeling monsters, and have no right to discuss the issue at all. Well, fuck that. I've been literally sick to my stomach all day from the mental image of that dead little girl, and the unimaginable grief of the people whose loved ones were blown away by this worthless piece of dog shit - and I still feel like discussing the political aspects of the crime. So I'm going to. Because I have yet to see anyone offer a single rational reason I shouldn't. Well said, Komrade. Anger was my SECOND response. My first was sympathy for those who suffered such a horrible loss - not only the victims, but their families, their friends, and indeed anyone who knows them. Tears started coming to my eyes (well, I'm an unabashed and unapologetic Liberal - we have those sorts of reactions. As a chronic pain sufferer, I have great empathy for those who have to endure pain, whether physical or psychological), but my emotions quickly morphed to fury at a portion of our society that urges, goads people into going out and murdering for their political beliefs and actions (even if such goading isn't blatantly overt; just overt as in the "crosshairs" adverts). The attempts at deflection I've read (well, it wasn't political, he's just newtshit crazy; or "people use language like "crosshairs" and "targets" and "take them out" and "shoot 'em dead, burn the corpses, and salt the ashes" all the time") are pure and simple horsepucky. THAT deflection, and the refusal to take responsibility for their words, are revolting to me. The Weeper of the House quoted that sick fuck Beck as saying something like, "politicians on the other side use the same language..." Yeah? I haven't heard it. Have any of y'all? Not only deflection, but a flat-out lie by that sonofabitch Beck. Crickets chirp in the background as I impatiently await the rightard apologists to own their shit.

Hippiekinkster -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 9:09:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zevar ~FR~ The tragedy today, which was perpetrated on those who have died and all of those wounded, indeed was a causality of murderess actions. No person deserves such callous actions, regardless of their personal beliefs and values. The individual who perpetrated this murderess act has place himself into the role of a contemptible person, by way of his chosen actions. The trauma experienced as a result of this tragedy is unspoken in its fullness, due to the actions of a young lad who chose to do unto others what he surely would not have done unto himself. Nonetheless, the trauma occurred and has egregiously impacted many people. This sort of murderess pillaging does not come by way of a casual choice. Instead the act of murder planned with 30 rounds or so of ammunition speaks loudly of the sorrow and grief perpetrated on innocent victims. Political affiliation has not much to do with hate and ignorance. No! These vicious and malicious attributes, hate and ignorance, have been among humanity since time began. At this point it is immature to point fingers and assign blame, aye! However, the murderess actions of this young lad has unnecessarily brought forth a dark night of the soul for many people. I bid peace where there is turmoil. Strength where there is weakness. Calm where there is anxiety. Wisdom where hate tempts for revenge. Love where hate and anger is running amuck. And above all courage where there is a desire to relinquish toward anything less than the Healing power of all that is derived from the Light of that which does shine forth into this world, when we believe it so, even amidst the ashes of a tragedy such as this. I bid all well! Beautiful sentiments. I am in full agreement. But, at some point, the hand-wringing and the "Give Peace a Chance" sentiments need to include standing up and saying "enough is enough". Stand up and let the Palins and Becks and Angles of the nation know that their hatred is not acceptible. "All that is necessary for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing."

TheHeretic -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/8/2011 9:22:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster I haven't heard it. Have any of y'all? It seems like there is at least one, hate-filled, bitter, individual around here who likes to call people he disagrees with, "Refucklinazis," or something like that. Any idea who that might be, Hippie?

Page: << < prev 4 5 [6] 7 8 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2024

Terms of Service

0.09375