RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal.

RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (Full Version)

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MusicalBoredom -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:08:06 AM)
I think my point is that isn't it remotely possible that our problems are caused by a great number of people on both sides of the political spectrum? Notice I said both. I'm not suggesting the people on the right are evil or that people on the left are evil. I think if we continue to just blame the "other side" then we never address the problem and we just sit around and yell sound bites at each other. As a point here, I own some mineral rights to some land that has oil. The oil companies drill and pay for oil every so often. I asked them last year why they weren't pumping because frankly I wanted the income. They said that they knew there was oil so they didn't have to explore. It was already drilled so they didn't have to work to get it out but that they didn't want to take it out until they had to for economic reasons. Do I think they right to do that? Yes I do! I don't think they have to right to do that then say the reason they aren't drilling is because of the environmental regulations or because they can't drill in the gulf. I'd rather them say "we have oil but we aren't going to produce it yet because it makes better financial sense for us to wait." I think business, innovation, industry and our consumers are part of what make us great. I don't think anything that I have posted has been anti-business but it has been about us looking at problems and solutions in a realistic rather then rhetoric based viewpoint.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:09:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom Willbeur I probably don't agree with you politically but I do agree that $250K isn't some tremendous amount of income. To those who are struggling on $25K it seems like a fortune but at $25K you are probably not paying for 4 years of collage for your kids. Nobody like financial stress. Nobody likes it when the bank calls. I'm not sure what income provides for stress free living but I'm pretty sure that it isn't $250K. And that doesnt mean that we cant look at it the opposite way and understand that 25k in SoCal is under a lot more stress than 250k. In fact once I got my ass off of friends' floors I was sleeping on and then out of the Army my income in todays dollars was probably about $28k in pre-gentrification Hoboken. It was a struggle without a roommate and no car needed. I cant imagine having to live on that in SoCal, where a car is nearly mandatory to get to work.

MusicalBoredom -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:14:18 AM)
Locked I think I layed the blame on the people rather than on any president. On all people? No. I don't think I had any political leaning in any of my posts. I think my posts are about hoping that we all take personal responsibility for our own actions.

lockedaway -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:14:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom Willbeur I probably don't agree with you politically but I do agree that $250K isn't some tremendous amount of income. To those who are struggling on $25K it seems like a fortune but at $25K you are probably not paying for 4 years of collage for your kids. Nobody like financial stress. Nobody likes it when the bank calls. I'm not sure what income provides for stress free living but I'm pretty sure that it isn't $250K. And that doesnt mean that we cant look at it the opposite way and understand that 25k in SoCal is under a lot more stress than 250k. In fact once I got my ass off of friends' floors I was sleeping on and then out of the Army my income in todays dollars was probably about $28k in pre-gentrification Hoboken. It was a struggle without a roommate and no car needed. I cant imagine having to live on that in SoCal, where a car is nearly mandatory to get to work. Wow...I remember pre-gentrification Hoboken! Back in 1984, I was riding the PATH train from Harrison to World Trade. I had a Series 7 and was 20 yrs old and I lived in an apartment in Kearney that got so hot it set the fire alarms off. I saw the ads on the Path to invest in Hoboken and I remember thinking, that place is really going to take off. Now it is some of the most expensive real estate in the State. I missed Hoboken, I missed Jersey City in the NewPort section, I missed the lower east side but I didn't miss the Jersey Shore. So at least I got in on one of them.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:15:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom I think my point is that isn't it remotely possible that our problems are caused by a great number of people on both sides of the political spectrum? Notice I said both. I'm not suggesting the people on the right are evil or that people on the left are evil. I think if we continue to just blame the "other side" then we never address the problem and we just sit around and yell sound bites at each other. As a point here, I own some mineral rights to some land that has oil. The oil companies drill and pay for oil every so often. I asked them last year why they weren't pumping because frankly I wanted the income. They said that they knew there was oil so they didn't have to explore. It was already drilled so they didn't have to work to get it out but that they didn't want to take it out until they had to for economic reasons. Do I think they right to do that? Yes I do! I don't think they have to right to do that then say the reason they aren't drilling is because of the environmental regulations or because they can't drill in the gulf. I'd rather them say "we have oil but we aren't going to produce it yet because it makes better financial sense for us to wait." I think business, innovation, industry and our consumers are part of what make us great. I don't think anything that I have posted has been anti-business but it has been about us looking at problems and solutions in a realistic rather then rhetoric based viewpoint. And not to pick on one particular group, the greenies, but to sacrifice energy independence because the cross eyed three toed long tailed purple goateed tadpole is endangered is ludicrous. Biodiversity is great, but it grows up into one ugly frog anyway.

lockedaway -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:18:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom Locked I think I layed the blame on the people rather than on any president. On all people? No. I don't think I had any political leaning in any of my posts. I think my posts are about hoping that we all take personal responsibility for our own actions. Well......fuck....(extends an hand to help Musical cross the aisle) you aren't going to make any friends amongst the libs on this board talking shit like THAT, young man!!! I talk about personal responsibility, self determination, ambition and I am castigated. I don't want to label you....but you belong on this side of the room; the well dressed, financially independent, able to leave a tip for the waiter side of the room. :)

Lucylastic -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:21:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lockedaway quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic Locked, , LMAO You cannot refute what I have said so you just rubbish my post by saying Im stupid. What is stupid is you not being able to see other peoples lives and realities , only what you expect, Oh and its you that knows nothing, you are guessing and hitting WRONG every time. Thats some STUPID ASSumptions Don't be an idiot, of course I addressed your post. Jobs exist at the discretion of the job provider. If I can employ a skeleton work force and make the same profit as I did when I had a huge work force, I am going to have a skeleton work force. That directly addressed the moron stupidity in your post. You believe that CEO's have a duty to hire people.........to hire them. To get them off the street. You are, as usual, wrong. The company hires people to help them make money and increase the bottom line.....period. THERE IS NO OTHER REASON. And if you can't recognize that I said that in my response to you, you need an english class in addition to an economics class. Once again you simply cannot read .Show me where I said CEOS have to hire people. You just ASSume thickhead

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:23:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lockedaway quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom Willbeur I probably don't agree with you politically but I do agree that $250K isn't some tremendous amount of income. To those who are struggling on $25K it seems like a fortune but at $25K you are probably not paying for 4 years of collage for your kids. Nobody like financial stress. Nobody likes it when the bank calls. I'm not sure what income provides for stress free living but I'm pretty sure that it isn't $250K. And that doesnt mean that we cant look at it the opposite way and understand that 25k in SoCal is under a lot more stress than 250k. In fact once I got my ass off of friends' floors I was sleeping on and then out of the Army my income in todays dollars was probably about $28k in pre-gentrification Hoboken. It was a struggle without a roommate and no car needed. I cant imagine having to live on that in SoCal, where a car is nearly mandatory to get to work. Wow...I remember pre-gentrification Hoboken! Back in 1984, I was riding the PATH train from Harrison to World Trade. I had a Series 7 and was 20 yrs old and I lived in an apartment in Kearney that got so hot it set the fire alarms off. I saw the ads on the Path to invest in Hoboken and I remember thinking, that place is really going to take off. Now it is some of the most expensive real estate in the State. I missed Hoboken, I missed Jersey City in the NewPort section, I missed the lower east side but I didn't miss the Jersey Shore. So at least I got in on one of them. And in 84 Hoboken gentrification was largely underway. HUD loans started in the late 70s as I recall and property values took off then. My first real job was literally burning pajamas 8 hours a day at Arkansas Chemical Company, the shell of which is still standing on Route 1. I lived on Pierce St. in Jersey City, an area ungentrifiable! NewPort was still a vision in some developers dream.

mnottertail -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:24:28 AM)
somebody has to cite their sources for their views for once. Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act (thats what repealed Glass-Steagall (a democratic law)) a bill by republicans; yanno, saying that beneficent corporations of bankers and wall streeters would not rape and pillage american society, which they steadfastly went out and accomplished post haste. Senate 90–8 (one not voting) and in the House: 362–57 (15 not voting). Thats what passed that bill and both houses republican majority. Geez, I wonder if Clinton would have vetoed it if they could trim down the vote to 2/3rds to pass it over his veto? What cha think? And later when folks wanted to put Glass-Steagall back in, republicans overwhelmingly decried that socialism, John McCain leading the way. And when Obama tried to get at least certain provisions of it reinstated on january 2010, guess who was the party of no?

MusicalBoredom -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:24:55 AM)
I agree with not loosing our mind over things Willbeur. I just want there to be an honest and fact based discussion about those things. If a company says that they want to completely poison 10 acres (but only 10 acres) of land but it will generate 1000 jobs and put $100M into the economy then I'd likely go for that. If they said they want to poison an entire states water supply so they can double their profit then I would NOT go for that. What I typically hear is an argument that sounds like "it's bad for the environment" verses "we will create jobs." I can't make any opinion at all on that kind of nonsense. I need to know how bad for the environment and how many jobs and I need the real and honest data for that. I don't need to hear one news source saying we are all going to die of cancer tomorrow because of Company A and another news source saying that the entire worlds economy is going to fall apart if Company A doesn't get to do whatever it's trying to do.

tazzygirl -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:29:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom Locked I think I layed the blame on the people rather than on any president. On all people? No. I don't think I had any political leaning in any of my posts. I think my posts are about hoping that we all take personal responsibility for our own actions. locked seems to speak for alot of people... when he shouldnt. Your posts echo alot of my own thinking. Heaven forbid a liberal thinker actually believe that a budget should come from both sides.

tazzygirl -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:32:45 AM)
quote: Well......fuck....(extends an hand to help Musical cross the aisle) you aren't going to make any friends amongst the libs on this board talking shit like THAT, young man!!! I talk about personal responsibility, self determination, ambition and I am castigated. I don't want to label you....but you belong on this side of the room; the well dressed, financially independent, able to leave a tip for the waiter side of the room. :) no, locked, you talk about lazy people and how they are sucking on your teats. you are one of those "finacially independent" people who bring a bottle of wine to a restaurant then bitch about the 15 dollar cork fee. or complain about the 1.50 upcharge for a drink on the rocks.

MusicalBoredom -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:47:51 AM)
To label myself, I am socially a liberal and financially a conservative. I don't tend to vote or support things along party lines simply because a particular party says something. I try my best to gather as much information as I can and make decisions based on that information in light of my own morals and ethics.

tazzygirl -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:51:10 AM)
Welcome to what I call the new liberal party!

lockedaway -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 8:59:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail somebody has to cite their sources for their views for once. Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act (thats what repealed Glass-Steagall (a democratic law)) a bill by republicans; yanno, saying that beneficent corporations of bankers and wall streeters would not rape and pillage american society, which they steadfastly went out and accomplished post haste. Senate 90–8 (one not voting) and in the House: 362–57 (15 not voting). Thats what passed that bill and both houses republican majority. Geez, I wonder if Clinton would have vetoed it if they could trim down the vote to 2/3rds to pass it over his veto? What cha think? And later when folks wanted to put Glass-Steagall back in, republicans overwhelmingly decried that socialism, John McCain leading the way. And when Obama tried to get at least certain provisions of it reinstated on january 2010, guess who was the party of no? He should have vetoed it...right? That is leadership. Instead, it was signed into law by our favorite babysitter, WJC.

lockedaway -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 9:01:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Well......fuck....(extends an hand to help Musical cross the aisle) you aren't going to make any friends amongst the libs on this board talking shit like THAT, young man!!! I talk about personal responsibility, self determination, ambition and I am castigated. I don't want to label you....but you belong on this side of the room; the well dressed, financially independent, able to leave a tip for the waiter side of the room. :) no, locked, you talk about lazy people and how they are sucking on your teats. you are one of those "finacially independent" people who bring a bottle of wine to a restaurant then bitch about the 15 dollar cork fee. or complain about the 1.50 upcharge for a drink on the rocks. She is back everyone!!! With her hand out! Championing not the rights of the poor but their desire for what you have. Welcome back, honey. :) OH...you should let me take you to dinner and then you will see just how big daddy actually acts, 'k princess? I won't be like nottertail that limits you to the dollar menu or Julia, who invites you to dinner and then demands that you pay.

tazzygirl -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 9:06:35 AM)
Ive been back, if you dragged your head out of the sand you would have known. Instead, you are so worried that someone will take a nickle of your money our of your pocket, you are missing your dollars sneaking out the back door. As far as dinner, you could not possibly surpass the experiences of my past. [:D] Sorry dear, I have no desire to go to McDonald's with you. Burger and fries just wont work.

lockedaway -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 9:09:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom To label myself, I am socially a liberal and financially a conservative. I don't tend to vote or support things along party lines simply because a particular party says something. I try my best to gather as much information as I can and make decisions based on that information in light of my own morals and ethics. Well...define socially liberal. I mean I consider myself a socially liberal guy too. I am all for gun rights which is a freedom but the libs say that is conservative. I was all for domestic partnership agreements but the libs say that is conservative also. While I don't support Roe v. Wade, I support it more than all of the expansions for abortion and I have no fear that it will be repealed anytime soon even though it REALLY is a matter of state's rights....but I'm called conservative for that view as well. So...what does it mean to be socially liberal? OH for the lib fools out there, I spoke with a woman from HUD the other day. In addition to Section 8 housing, free schooling, food stamps, utility vouchers, bus pass, etc. I was advised that for some of their clients, house keeping is provided on your tax dollar. :) And more. A lot of these people get to use legal aid to fight an eviction. All paid for by you. So, Musical, do you think that people collecting social services, who are not physically or mentally disabled, should have to work at least 4 hours per day to receive them?

lockedaway -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 9:11:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Ive been back, if you dragged your head out of the sand you would have known. Instead, you are so worried that someone will take a nickle of your money our of your pocket, you are missing your dollars sneaking out the back door. Believe me, baby, I'm not missing dollars sneaking out the back door. I catch your proverbial hand in my pocket every day!!!!! :)

tazzygirl -> RE: Almost everyone lost on the budget deal. (8/4/2011 9:17:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lockedaway quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Ive been back, if you dragged your head out of the sand you would have known. Instead, you are so worried that someone will take a nickle of your money our of your pocket, you are missing your dollars sneaking out the back door. Believe me, baby, I'm not missing dollars sneaking out the back door. I catch your proverbial hand in my pocket every day!!!!! :) ~smirks Im after the nickles. You are indeed missing the dollars, princess.

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