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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/18/2012 5:00:52 PM

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Ha ha .. I would consider YOU guys to be below average in looks. Thats awesome when I see Quasimodo's calling other people Quasimodo's.

In my view you are the text-book definition of the POT calling the KETTLE black.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/18/2012 5:23:24 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lthrpup
Most people were not day laborers, and when they left their homes--no matter how modest--and walked along the avenues, they were well dressed. Stock footage street scenes (often used for rear projection back at the studio) and newsreels were not staged. Repaired clothing (most of which was much more durable than today's clothing was common when wardrobes were smaller could be quite presentable.

Did you grow up in the city? Because I did and there were huge sections of very poor that were unsafe to go into. Even as late as the mid 70s when I was spending time at the NY Library's annex in Hell's Kitchen I needed to remember to be out before dark. Today I would take an apartment there any day. Back then it wasn't safe.

Next time you're in, go up to the Museum of the City of New York, make an appointment with an archivist and ask for books telling about how people really lived.

And back then Manhattan was ringed with working piers unloading cargo ships. And standing in a gang, hoping to get picked up was how it was done. On The Waterfront shows a realistic picture of back then.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/18/2012 5:24:20 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BootyBoy
You guys are fairly attractive, but not monumentally so, at least not in a big city. One of the things that you may learn is that attitude goes a long way in BDSM. There are too many attractive people who expect their looks to be enough for anybody, and end up being monumentally boring to scene with. I feel sure that many have had this experience.

Both these sentences are true, and this is as far into the thread as I intend to read.

That said, I agree that there is a higher body-mass index at munches, and on kink sites, than in the general population. As one anecdote, a retired Asian prodomme in San Francisco who told me, "Attractive people don't date within the scene because they don't have to." As another anecdote, there was a thread here a few years ago about an obese woman who decided the pain was worth enduring during a scene so she could have some physical attention. It was a very sad read, and I'm not going to try to find the link. That thread is reflective of people I know in real life.

But this brings me to my final point, which perhaps many people have already made in the intervening pages. There is something a lot of men don't understand about fat jokes. If they tell fat jokes, that pisses off thin women. The OPs of this thread are, I am certain, destroying their chances to make it with hot chicks by giving off body facism radar. Why should a fetish model sleep with them when she can sleep with someone who is equally physically attractive and far more emotionally attractive?

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/18/2012 7:16:08 PM

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here is my four cents worth, first i did not know that we were all applying for a job for you! second where on earth did you learn your manners third do you not think or read other message boards before you post some thing that is so nasty none of these are nasty at all i would just like to understand where you think you are coming from you knew you were starting a fire with gas when you first posted so if you knew that why did you push the send button

you would not want to know my opioion of you because what i think of you is none of your business

please if someone gets this in error it is meant for the OP

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/19/2012 8:08:12 AM

lostinmyownmind

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To the OP- Did you ever stop to think that there might be a reason for the way some people look? Yeah, I'm overweight. I have a thyroid imbalance due to some medication I was on, but I am TRYING to get the extra weight off. It takes time. No, I do not wear make-up. I'm allergic to the crap, all of it and I see no reason to put myself through hell because some shallow prick thinks I should paint my face. If you want to only be around "attractive" people, that's your thing, do what you want to do. You will be missing out on a lot of good, interesting people with your attitude. I am into BDSM because I like it, not because I can't get a date in the vanilla world.
Oh and Danielle- If you don't want to look like a jerk, don't agree with one, even if he is your husband. Both of you need to learn a little tolerance for other people that are not like you.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/19/2012 10:02:26 AM

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quote:

No, I do not wear make-up. I'm allergic to the crap, all of it and I see no reason to put myself through hell because some shallow prick thinks I should paint my face.

I have chemical sensitivities and can't use most commercial beauty products but I do have good luck with products from Whole Foods, etc. Regular lipstick is just yuck, but I can use Burt's Bees, etc.

I support you in being paint-free, just wanted to let you know my experience in finding brands that work for me.

Also see http://www.ewg.org/skindeep/

EWG's Skin Deep is an online safety guide for cosmetics and personal care products, launched in 2004 to help people find safer products, with fewer ingredients that are hazardous or that haven't been thoroughly tested. Skin Deep combines product ingredient lists with information in more than 50 standard toxicity and regulatory databases. The database provides easy-to-navigate safety ratings for tens of thousands of personal care products.

http://www.ewg.org/skindeep/myths-on-cosmetics-safety/

Myth – If it’s for sale at a supermarket, drugstore, or department store cosmetics counter, it must be safe.

Fact – The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has no authority to require companies to test products for safety. FDA does not review or approve the vast majority of products or ingredients before they go on the market. The agency conducts pre-market reviews only for certain color additives and active ingredients in cosmetics classified as over-the-counter drugs (FDA 2005, 2010).

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/19/2012 10:37:47 AM

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I have been to munches and I have been to Walmart. There was a higher % of overweight people at Walmart. Bottom line, anywhere you go in America, you are going to see lots of overweight people. I don't think the % in BDSM is any higher.

< Message edited by Iamsemisweet -- 1/19/2012 10:38:54 AM >

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/19/2012 11:04:30 AM

LillyoftheVally

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Well I don't fit the description in the OP I am 25 for one and tbh most 25 year olds in possession of a vagina don't find it all that difficult to 'pull' should the need arise.

However I think there are some people on the scene who may FEEL that they are on the scene out of necessity, I know that low self esteem is a common trait of many many people and I also know, having spoken to people, that this is something that some people feel occasionally (hell there was a time I thought it myself)

However there is no common denomiator where I am, people look average because that is what average people look like, I don't meet many massively above average looking people because well average is the most common isn't it? Bit of a no brainer imo

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/19/2012 8:02:26 PM

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The BDSM community is as diverse as the general public. You are going to have EVERYONE here of all weights, eye colors, races and ect. I suggest you get used to that fact and not be surprised when you see someone you find less than attractive. Also if you think the kink world is the only way that any woman ( " fat " or not) can get some attention then you are just plain dumb.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/20/2012 4:42:07 PM

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I'm going to avoid reading what others have written and just respond because I'm sure I'll be considered a fool at best and a judgmental bitch at mid-worse. Meh.

ORIGINAL: Dscouple7383

What is the percentage of people (on this site in particular) are into bdsm out of necessity? What I mean by that, is I wonder how many people on here have discovered that the ONLY way to be with someone is through d/s?

Necessity? I *need* to work, to create, to breathe, to laugh, to feel productive, to connect with others. wiitwd and necessity - no. There have been times in my life when yes, I have been in d/s relationships in order to get something else that was not available in any other way that I could see *at the time*. Thankfully, I learned that eating dirt when one is starving is not pleasant and to make sure I don't allow myself to get to a place of starvation.

We have started to reach out into our local community here, and even communities that are a drive for us to get to. And we are shocked at what we are finding. Most women we have come across look the same. Nearly ALL of them are moderately to severely overweight, and honestly have looked like they have stopped caring. Hair that isn't styled or attempted to be styled....no makeup....and just looked like they rolled out of bed.

The men are no better, believe me. I've never seen so many men who don't take care of themselves, and don't do ANYTHING to make themselves presentable. Yet, they call themselves doms.

So, I know it sounds mean, but is bdsm (and especially in the community) mostly for people who CAN'T find someone on their own, and they use the d/s construct just to get attention that they couldn't almost PAY for in the vanilla world?

I have found the same thing in certain communities. It is not the same in all communities. There are norms in every group. It sounds like you may have found one in which a different standard than what you are accustomed to is what is the norm. Not right or wrong, good or bad. Grooming choices are different for different people.

There are some people that need the structure of d/s in order to be in a relationship. Of course there are, and it is a good fit for them. Good on 'em. If it works for them, who am I to quibble? Mostly? I don't think so, but the "community" is more than just the people that show up at the local events. I think sometimes people attend events and the others who are there make you uncomfortable. Who hasn't been to an event in which the people as a whole felt icky to you? If you don't follow the same standard (whatever it is) you have three choices. A. Conform. 2. Be comfortable in non-conformance, or III. Stay away. I actually don't go to the local munches because I don't like the norms in the group. The people are generally a good bit younger than I am, more promiscuous, and there is a lot more drama than I am comfortable with. Does it mean their youth, promiscuity, and drama are bad? No. They just are not generally what I want to have in my life at this point. I choose to read a book instead of meeting with them and doing what feels like wasting my time. I do however meet with some of the individuals whom I have found have similar POVs on a number of things. While the group is not comfortable for me, some of the individuals are.

I know that looks aren't everything, and I am no super model myself. Hell, I could even stand to lose a few pounds as well. BUT, I at least put forth an EFFORT to make myself look as desirable as possible. When I'm looking for a sub/slave, I am FIRST going to be drawn to their appearance. Is that shallow? I don't care. It's NATURE!! I'm sick of people saying that looks don't matter. Appearances don't matter. That's horsecrap!! You don't go to a job interview looking like cat puke, so what gives?

Of course appearances matter. I just had this conversation with a person who has Asperger's about why pajamas were not what should be worn for a dinner get-together. However, if you are running the party, you get to set the dress code. If you are not, then you get to choose whether you attend an event that has a spoken or unspoken dress code.

So, I'm FIGHTING having the feeling that bdsm and the lifestyle are MOSTLY relegated to really old, really fat, and really unattractive people who couldn't get their dog to play with them otherwise.

Am I the only one frustrated out there?

You are not. However, I think you might have worded this a mite differently. I appreciate your POV. Any number of people have had similar discussions with me about comfort level and other standards - hygiene, education, ability to socialize, politics, money, socio-economic class, etc. We all have our standards with which we are comfortable. This topic is no different.

good luck,
Really Old, Really Fat, and Really Unattractive
Actually Lying about the previous line
Sunshine
who is going to go take the dogs for a walk.

*edited for wordiness

< Message edited by sunshinemiss -- 1/20/2012 4:59:14 PM >

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 8:10:26 AM

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I stopped going to general night clubs by the time I was 25. By that age I considered myself too old. I loved dancing, loved loud upbeat music and I still felt like an 18 year old but when you are 18 you think a 25 year old is ancient and because most of club land was full of 18 year old's I became very self conscious about that.
Many years later I found the scene and with the scene came the gregarious fetish clubs and BDSM events. I was hugely conscious of my age when I first dressed up and ventured through its doors but to my delight I received a warm welcome from those younger than me, older than me, bigger than me and thinner than me. Nobody looked at me strangely or avoided talking to me. So many personalities, so much color and vibrancy. It was like a huge carnival of life with no restrictions on age, weight or sexuality.
One thing I am certain of is, I will never be too old for the scene. There is no 'sell by date'
There will always be a small number of scene goers that whisper and snark about the importance of looks, weight and age. Fortunately their numbers are low and they are pretty irrelevant to those of us who enjoy the scene for what it really is.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 2:22:15 PM

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Ok, well......lesson learned.

Never get on a message board first thing in the morning when you are NOT a morning person! LOL

I understand my OP was mean spirited in tone, and I have apologized for that already.

Judging by the response, it's a valid topic, I just shouldn't have been so mean and in a bad mood when I typed the post in the first place.
Because people took what I said WAY out of context.
So, I will TRY to set the record straight, and if you still think I'm an asshole, then so be it.

First off, I would like to point out that in no way do I think that I am all that plus a bag of chips, nor did I ever say that I thought I was. In fact, the post was MORE about people around MY AREA ONLY who appear to not care about themselves or their appearance.
Now....if that's how they want to be, then GREAT!! That doesn't make them worse than me, and it sure doesn't make me better than them. What it DOES do, is makes us different. I'm also not "frustrated" at not being able to find anyone to play with or whatever, as someone earlier tried to imply.

What I AM frustrated with, is not being able to find people near me who share the same kind of mindset. And by the same kind of mindset, I mean people who make an effort to take care of themselves. THAT'S IT!!!

There is a HUGE difference (no pun intended) on a woman OR MAN who is overweight and BEAUTIFUL, compared to an overweight SLOB who just doesn't give an f about anything, including themselves.

So, yes....I seem to be running into the latter, as opposed to the first. I think anyone who kept reaching out in the local community, and all they seemed to find were people who were more slobs than people who work hard and may not have the nicest clothes, or manicured nails or whatever, would get frustrated after a while.

I don't care whether you are ugly or supermodel. I don't care whether you are morbidly obese or if you are unhealthily skinny. I don't care if you are rich or poor. But what I DO care about is having a shred of pride in yourself. OR, having a shred of pride in your partner, to not allow them to just be a slob. And slob doesn't mean FAT!!! I've met plenty of skinny slobs.
So this isn't about weight EITHER!!!!!! It isn't about women or men. It's about a mentality. And I'm frustrated that I haven't, as yet, found people in our local community who share that same mentality.

And the reason for my question about how many people or what percentage of people are in this lifestyle out of necessity, ALSO falls in line with the same people (dominant and submissive) who email you and get incredulous when you don't respond to them. It's almost as if the very fact that they are submissive or dominant, means that you are automatically interested in them, no matter what they look like, how old they are, what kinks they are into, etc. And THAT is where looks and appearance DO have a little bit of importance.
To me, it's the same type of mentality.
And again, TO ME, just because you affix a label to you, doesn't just grant you access to everything. Anything worth doing takes EFFORT. It takes WORK. And I'm not finding people with the same motivation. I think if everyone were honest with themselves, you can understand how that MIGHT be a touch frustrating.

Granted, that doesn't give me license to generalize the way I did, and to be mean spirited. I DO understand that.
The saving grace to me, is that I didn't call anyone out specifically. I only referred to the people who I have met in my previous local community, and I've only started to see signs of the same type of mentality in the local community where I am now. If you are locally in my community, and I've met you and you have met me? Then I can understand you taking issue with my comments, and I will be happy to have further discussions with you. But if you are in my local community and I haven't met you, then I am OBVIOUSLY not talking about you!!!

Maybe there are others out there who have the same type of motivation, drive, and mentality that my fiance, our sub, and I have. But at the time I wrote my original post, I was starting to feel like there aren't any people out there close to us who we can talk to, meet, share ideas, stories, etc.
We aren't looking to "hook up", and I'm NOT frustrated with that. We never have had problems with "hooking up" if we wanted to do things like that, or play. So, for all those who think I'm frustrated with not being able to "find" someone, I will be getting married on March 4th to the love of my life! And yes, I met her on this site. AND we met our sub on this site as well.
So, we are HAPPY and don't NEED to "find" people for any reason other than to socialize and to rub elbows with people of like mind.

It's just that people of like mind are few and far between.
I got frustrated.
I am human.

Apologies to anyone who was DIRECTLY offended at what I had to say, because there really wasn't any intent on attacking any PERSON individually, but rather a mindset that I am finding to be more prevalent than I had anticipated.

Take care,

Derek

(in reply to MariaB)

RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 2:42:17 PM

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Well good luck the three of you. Remember caffeine is you friend.

(snark free btw)

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 2:59:27 PM

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I do not care about "political correctness," as the OP mentions. This is not a political issue, except for the fact that the poster is a hetero male who is posting about bi females.

So, the issue is whether it is an accurate portrayal of BDSM as a refuge for fat women (implied) who cannot get a man any other way.

Well, some are not so limited by physical appearance in their preferences. And by the way, hetero men who are so obvious in their preference for thin women are the most "politically correct" people ever. I suspect the number of women who can "get" a man while being heavy in the vanilla world is the same as on this site.

Why do you bother to make it an issue? That's just stupid.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 3:15:35 PM

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Actually, the poster is a bisexual male, referring to MOSTLY men, actually. SHOCK!!!!
And if I'm posting about bi females only, then I'm in a ton of hot water with my fiance, because she is a bi female. On top of that, our sub is a male, so.....yeah, you have me TOTALLY pegged!! ;)
Derek

quote:

ORIGINAL: whatisthewhat

I do not care about "political correctness," as the OP mentions. This is not a political issue, except for the fact that the poster is a hetero male who is posting about bi females.

So, the issue is whether it is an accurate portrayal of BDSM as a refuge for fat women (implied) who cannot get a man any other way.

Well, some are not so limited by physical appearance in their preferences. And by the way, hetero men who are so obvious in their preference for thin women are the most "politically correct" people ever. I suspect the number of women who can "get" a man while being heavy in the vanilla world is the same as on this site.

Why do you bother to make it an issue? That's just stupid.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 3:31:54 PM

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 3:40:29 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dscouple7383

I know of a few femdoms who might challenge everything you say here, DSC . . . but these happen to be precisely those kinds of femdoms who'd go to extraordinary lengths to look their best before a meet with a potential partner - not just intensive visits to beauticians, but ultra-Spartan diets and military-style exercising.

You know how it is. People don't like to show how much effort they've truly made. Me, in the picture to your left, I was four pounds lighter. Now, I feel like a slob. I'm desperate to lose those four pounds before Friday when I meet up with a few old friends from the BDSM world.

Another thing: I do think there are extremes about this issue. People can indeed give up, I think - or, they can become fanatical. Neither will announce it, though. Bad form. Very, very bad form, either way.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 3:41:53 PM

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Actually DScouple, I think you have taken enough flack. Yeah, your first post was a hornets nest but you have kept your calm and you have retracted a lot of what you first said even if you don't mean it

. I think a lot of people do think like you do but they just don't voice it to anyone other than close friends. Truth is, you don't like fat, old or slobs. Tell us that and expect a colorful reaction, don't tell us that and nobody will ever know!!

Congrats on your forthcoming marriage by the way but do yourself a favor and don't wear a black shirt with a white tie... Its so yesterday darling!!

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 3:44:35 PM

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You bitch!

I like you. Lots.

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RE: BDSM out of necessity? - 1/21/2012 3:45:27 PM

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I would prefer that people speak their minds, even if the views are less than popular. I want to know if I'm dealing with a bigot up front, or just a garden variety snob (which I admit to being, absolutely).

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