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Fightdirecto -> RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... (5/10/2012 11:17:30 PM)
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ORIGINAL: BamaD
The Davidians didn't have 50's and it was never proven they had machine guns. Feds fried any evidence along with the Davidians.
Big Rifle A Terrorist Tool?
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"Clearly, it is a very powerful weapon. We saw what it could do as far as going through armor," says Kelly. "It would be a weapon that could do a lot of damage – no question about that."
This is exactly what the FBI learned in 1993 at Waco when Branch Davidians fired a Barrett .50-caliber sniper rifle at them.
In response, the FBI deployed Bradley fighting vehicles for protection. But even that wasn't sufficient, and heavier armor was brought in.
What happened at Waco was one of the arguments made for banning the weapon in California.
Criminal Use of the 50 Caliber Sniper Rifle
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"The simple fact is that .50-calibers have not been used in crimes,"
- NRA spokesman Andrew Arulandam, Associated Press, August 18, 2004
* Branch Davidian cult members at a compound in Waco, Texas, fired 50 caliber sniper rifles at federal ATF agents during their initial gun battle on February 28, 1993. The weapons' ability to penetrate tactical vehicles prompted the agency to request military armored vehicles to give agents adequate protection from the 50 caliber rifles and other more powerful weapons the Branch Davidians might have had. Four ATF agents were killed. [Source: ("Weaponry: .50 Caliber Rifle Crime," GAO Office of Special Investigations letter, August 4, 1999)]
* On April 28, 1995, Albert Petrosky walked into an Albertson's grocery store in suburban Denver, Colorado, and gunned down his estranged wife and the store manager. Armed with an L.A.R. Grizzly 50 caliber sniper rifle, an SKS Chinese semiautomatic assault rifle, a .32 revolver, and a 9mm semiautomatic pistol, Petrosky then walked out into the shopping center parking lot, where he exchanged fire with a federal IRS agent and killed Sgt. Timothy Mossbrucker of the Jefferson County Sheriff's Department. Petrosky, who was known to his friends as "50-cal Al," fired all four weapons, including the 50 caliber rifle, during his murderous rampage.
* On March 19, 1998, following an undercover investigation, federal law enforcement officers arrested three members of a radical Michigan group known as the North American Militia. The men were charged with plotting to bomb federal office buildings, destroy highways, utilities, and public roads, and assassinate the state's governor, senior U.S. Senator, federal judges, and other federal officials. All three were ultimately convicted. A 50 caliber sniper rifle was among the weapons found in their possession.
* In April of 2000, convicted felon Wayne Frank Barbuto of Salt Lake City, Utah, was charged with attempting to sell two 50 caliber sniper rifles to undercover federal agents. The government believes Barbuto manufactured the guns himself. During a search of Barbuto's home, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) agents discovered more than 32 firearms and thousands of rounds of ammunition.
* In June of 2000, Robert W. Stewart of Mesa, Arizona, a convicted felon, was charged with felony possession of firearms for being in possession of Maadi-Griffin 50 caliber "kit guns" he was selling from his home, along with other firearms alleged to be in his possession. Stewart has become a folk hero among hard-line gun advocates and 50 caliber enthusiasts. He was distinguished, among other things, by his assertion that convicted felons have the right to possess firearms: "I don't care if he's a mass murderer, he killed 50,000 people. He still has a right to have a gun. A gun is just a tool."
* In February of 2004, Donin Wright of Kansas City, Missouri, lured police officers, paramedics, and firefighters to his home where he shot at them with several guns including a Barrett 50 caliber sniper rifle. Authorities discovered at least 20 guns, thousands of rounds of ammunition, and the makings of 20 pipe bombs inside Wright's home.
* In June of 2004, Marvin Heemeyer of Granby, Colorado, plowed a makeshift armored bulldozer into several buildings in response to a zoning dispute and fines for city code violations. Heemeyer armored his 60-ton bulldozer with two sheets of half-inch steel with a layer of concrete between them. He methodically drove the bulldozer through the town of Granby, damaging or leveling 13 buildings before taking his own life. Heemeyer mounted three rifles on the bulldozer, including a Barrett 82A1 50 caliber sniper rifle.
* In May of 2006, a White Supremacist gang was indicted in Arizona on drug and weapons charges, including the sale to undercover officers of a stolen 50 caliber sniper rifle. The rifle was represented by the gang as powerful enough to destroy an armored car or shoot down a Phoenix Police helicopter.
* In August of 2006, William Gerald Thomas of Gainesville, Georgia was charged with aggravated assault with a deadly weapon and use of a firearm while under the influence of alcohol for brandishing a rifle and then a machine gun at a bystander after the parents of two 14-year old girls intervened to stop Thomas from harassing the girls at a motel pool. When police executed a search warrant on Thomas' SUV, they found 38 weapons including 50 caliber sniper rifles, assault weapons, and 2,000 rounds of ammunition.
* On September 11, 2007, a Salem Oregon man was arrested on charges of second-degree criminal mischief and reckless burning after starting a wildfire by firing armor-piercing incendiary ammunition from a 50 caliber sniper rifle into a tree stump. The fire took days to extinguish and caused major damage to private forest land.
* On April 4, 2008 a Florida man was arrested on federal charges of using the internet to make threats to recreate the 2007 massacre at Virginia Tech that left 32 people dead. The man had amassed an arsenal that included a 50 caliber sniper rifle along with 13 other firearms and 5,000 rounds of ammunition, including 50 caliber rounds.
* On February 10, 2009 federal authorities arrested a Plattsburgh, New York man on federal gun charges. Michael Moccio is suspected of dealing in guns without a license and of selling guns to convicted felons. It is believed he charged felons higher prices than non-felon customers. A 50 caliber sniper rifle was among the 44 guns seized by authorities. One of the guns sold by the suspect turned up at a murder scene.
* Anti-government extremist Ed Brown admitted in court in July 2009 that he pointed a .50 sniper rifle at U.S Marshals who were executing an arrest warrant on his property in New Hampshire. Brown and his wife, Elaine, are charged with 11 felonies in connection with a nearly nine-month standoff with federal agents. The couple amassed an arsenal that included 22 pipe bombs, dozens of gunpowder grenades, 10 booby trap devices, and two .50-caliber sniper rifles. They issued repeated threats against law enforcement agents.
The .50 Caliber Rifle
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The Brady Campaign provides a list of situations in which criminals have had access or attempted to acquire these weapons. Only one of the instances was used to kill Americans: during the Branch Davidian raid in Waco, Texas, a .50 caliber rifle was used to kill four Federal agents.
United States General Accounting Office Office Of Special Investigations B-282666 (.pdf)
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The Branch Davidians fired a 50 caliber semiautomatic rifle at the ATF agents attempting to exkcute a search warrant at their compound in Waco, Texas. During the investigation, ATF suspected that Vernon Wayne Howell, aka David Koresh, had acquired 50 caliber rifles. ATF therefore requested from the Department of Defense Bradley Fighting Vehicles, which were believed to have sufficient armor to withstand .50 caliber fire. Those vehicles were to be used during the execution of the search warrant.
However, according to the ‘Report of the Department of the Treasury - Investigation of Vernon Wayne Howell + known as David Koresh,” ATF did not use the armored vehicles during the execution of the search warrant. Four agents were killed. Autopsies of two of the dead agents showed they had been killed by .50 caliber fire.
Report to the Deputy Attorney General on the Events at Waco, Texas - U.S. Dept. of Justice
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Immediately following the April 19 fire the Texas Rangers, working with the FBI, arranged to take command of the remains of the compound for purposes of conducting a thorough crime scene search. In addition, an arson team consisting of experts from throughout the United States was assembled to determine the cause of the fire. The search lasted approximately three weeks. The arson report was completed on July 13, 1993. Autopsies were conducted on the bodies recovered from the scene.
by May 3 the Texas Rangers had recovered 305 firearms from the compound, and approximately 1.9 million rounds of "cooked off" or spent ammunition. Among the firearms found were at least 20 fully automatic AK-47 assault rifles; at least 12 fully automatic AR-15 assault rifles; at least two .50 caliber semi-automatic rifles; and anti-tank armor-piercing ammunition.
Yeah - "The Davidians didn't have 50's" -
How do you put a .50 caliber hole in a federal agent without using a .50 caliber firearm - shoot them twice in the exact same spot with a .25 caliber and add them together?
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