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Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 1:52:54 PM

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A question for the ages... Does being older mean you have more experience, or that you are a better Dom/me or Master/Mistress?

I seem to come across that speed bump quite a bit. I'm 25, and have been involved with the Lifestyle for a little more than a decade. I started young, discovered early what I like, did my research and found like minded girls to explore ourselves with. When i first came across the term Dom, I obviously didn't know what it truly meant, and what all it entailed. Since then, however, I have grown, and I have learned what it means to be a true Dom and a True Master.

And here's the point where many say "Bullshit, you're only 25, you're not old enough." Honestly it makes me laugh. I see a lot of people on here in their mid thirties, mid forties, and 50+ who claim to be dominant (both male and female), yet their behavior speaks volumes to the contrary.

Now, I'll be the first the tip my hat in respect to my elders, just on principle, being how I was raised. However, quite a few of them are going through mid-life crises, just getting out of a nasty divorce, or in some other way jaded about their life or just plain perving on kinky people. I throw my hands up in disgust when I see these people get the same blanket respect and adoration that their "peers" do, when said peers have lived this lifestyle longer than I've been alive. Its annoying.

Those are my two cents, what are yours?

P.s. - To all those Dom/mes who have been involved in the lifestyle for as long as I've been alive, and particularly the ones who have been in a 24/7 LTR for as long is I've been in the lifestyle, I would love to hear your thoughts here, and hopefully pick your brains more in depth elsewhere.

- Wulfe

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 2:52:38 PM

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In my opinion a lot of things matter in life in general... intelligence, wisdom, experience, maturity, strength, honor, etc. Whether they matter in THIS context depends a lot on what context you're talking about. For me, I have taken ownership of a human being. In my case "ownership" does not mean "kinky datings". It means I own a human with all of the rights & privileges and care & feeding requirements which go along with that. It's just like owning a dog or a horse but a lot more complicated. This particular human (my wife) happens to be 56 years old. I need to be able to manage the entire life of a person in that life stage. I would not trust you to do so through simple lack of life experience (not BDSM experience). Would I trust you to take ownership of someone 25-ish? Yes (at least that's my default until given some reason otherwise). You have life experiences which would match that person's likely circumstances.

If you're talking just plain kink then again, I'd need to know what sort of experience we're talking about. At 25 had you spent the last year working with a single-tail diligently, attending safety classes, and in general bettering yourself in that skill then I see no reason to think you wouldn't be able to wield it well and understand the safety issues involved.

In terms of respecting me (your elder), I don't want or ask for your respect. You don't know me. How could you possibly respect me in any meaningful way? I prefer to reserve both respect and trust for situations in which it is actually earned and this isn't one of them. I have earned nothing from you. Nor have I earned anything from all the [almost] strangers to me on this site. I don't particularly see why my age ought to matter in terms of that. Carol respects me and trusts me because she's known me for 18 years and seen both my best and my worst. She has sound footing for her decision. Everyone else??? not so much.

There is a poster here, LadyPact, who is somewhere in my broad age bracket (never checked) and has a lifestyle resume a mile long. I respect her a great deal but not because of her age or her resume. I respect her because I've seen some of the innards of her decision making process and I believe her to be an honorable and trustworthy person who at least tries to do the right thing insofar as she can figure that out. There's at least two posters here who are much younger than I, female, and sub/slave. I respect them a great deal also and for similar reasons.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that age is an indicator of possible experience gain which possibly translates to wisdom and/or knowledge. It's a stronger indicator for lack of certain life experiences when the age is much younger than the life experience (how much time have you spent working on retirement issues for instance?). But each human needs to be evaluated for who they are. Indicators are just that... not "facts". Generalities, by their nature, are always wrong in specific.

edited to add:
Now that I've looked at your other postings and your profile I would not trust you with the ownership of anyone. That has nothing to do with your age. It has to do with the evident lack of experience, knowledge, and wisdom that is prevalent. Just ponder the phrase "a complete psychological wipe". Seriously? Fantasy owning is best done in fantasy play space. Reality has a nasty habit of being more dominant than me or you.

< Message edited by JeffBC -- 10/31/2012 3:19:28 PM >

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(in reply to wulfelaw)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 3:16:00 PM

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quote:

Does being older mean you have more experience, or that you are a better Dom/me or Master/Mistress?

Not necessarily, but being younger means you are less likely to have adequate experience for someone like me (not that I'm in YOUR desired age range either.)

I prefer to date men who are at least 40, but have made a few exceptions for 20 somethings. However, I never considered them relationship material - ~ 20 years is just too great a gulf.

< Message edited by kalikshama -- 10/31/2012 3:31:21 PM >

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(in reply to wulfelaw)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 3:35:41 PM

Kana

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Speaking for no one but me, I'm a whole lot better person than I was at 20, 25. Which of course means I'm a better dom.
Now, I wouldn't have believed that then (Sure as I was that I was the apotheosis of excellence and that nothing and no one could come close-I had a kinda big ego then, let's be kind and blame it on the massive amounts of drugs I was indulging at the time), but looking back I see a man who was selfish, naive,idealistic, cynical, sarcastic, immature, deluded, depraved, self centered, valueless, mindlessly hurtful, blindly unaware of so many things.
The lilone and I used to talk about it quite a bit back when there were lots of newbie young types coming on the board making similar comments as the OP. Not knocking ya, not saying anything against you, but so much of life has to be lived to be learned, and sadly, only time can teach those lessons.
And the kicker, the real irony, is that no way in bloody hell would I have believed that then. I would have pointed to my brutal childhood, living on the streets, being self responsible and utterly self reliant financially and emotionally from about age 14, and said I was remarkably mature for my age.
Now I look back and wonder what the hell I thought. heck, I don't even understand how the hell I thought the things I did, much less operated on them as guiding truths in life.
And sadly, there ain't no way to convince anyone young of that (I mean, heck, what else is the point of being young except having blind confidence in yourself)but my bet is one day in the not so distant future you look back at this post and think, "If I only knew then what I know now"...and realize how brash it was to see yourself as mature at 25

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(in reply to kalikshama)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 3:40:02 PM

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Kana, I agree but I have a question.

At 20 & 25...the women you were with saw you as dominant, yes?
They also would not (being the mirror image of your maturity) have seen the qualities you now have as virtues, yes?

(in reply to Kana)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 3:49:24 PM

Kana

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Kana, I agree but I have a question.

At 20 & 25...the women you were with saw you as dominant, yes?
They also would not (being the mirror image of your maturity) have seen the qualities you now have as virtues, yes?

Yep. That they did. And naaah, I doubt they would have seen the qualities I admire now as needed, much less excellent.
Course, grins, in restrospect, they were far crazier than I ever was-I was stuck with me while they voluntarily and of their own mind and will picked me out of a whole lotta better choices!

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 3:58:32 PM

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Someone older would naturally have more life experience, but that doesn't mean that they're using it.

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(in reply to Kana)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 4:07:27 PM

absolutchocolat

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age in and of itself doesn't bring necessarily beget wisdom. however, learning to absorb lessons from folks who live this life, regardless of age, is something that doesn't take much effort and can only help in the long run.

also, "experience" is a pretty relative term, and besides talking to someone's former mates, i'm not sure it can be proven outside of play.

< Message edited by absolutchocolat -- 10/31/2012 4:15:30 PM >

(in reply to wulfelaw)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 4:10:39 PM

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I have to agree with you Jeff. I read his profile and it sounds like it was written by someone who loves porn and fantasy, but has little, if any, real life experience.

OP You continue to mention true Dom/mes, subs and slaves. There is no such thing as a 'true' anything. Everyone has a different opinion of what is right (true) for them and good luck finding two people with same definition.

I hate to burst your bubble OP, a slave can up and leave you anytime they feel it necessary. I also disagree that a slave can't have limits.

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RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 4:24:43 PM

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1.) Obviously somewhere with more years under their belt has more life experience, but I'm not referring to life experience, I'm referring to Lifestyle experience. I say Lifestyle, because I do not mean BDSM specifically. Anyone worth their salt on this website, and in these forums, knows that there are an infinite number of sub-sects, styles, preferences, etc within the Lifestyle as a whole.

2.) I'm not claiming maturity. And yes, Kana, thee was a time, and not very long ago, I would furrow my brow at scoff at those who mocked my youth and lack of life experience because "they didn't know my life, my childhood, what I've been though, etc". It wasn't until recently (the last couple of years) that I realized all of that is ultimately irrelevant. Again, I'm not claiming unsurpassed emotional maturity, or life experience equal to that of those twice my age. This post is about Lifestyle experience.

3.) Yes, I am looking for a sub and slave my age or younger because, as its been said a couple times now, equitable life experience is appropriate. And I'm just otherwise not interested in persuing a relationship with a female that is not my type, age included.

4.) Jeff... "evident lack of experience, knowledge, and wisdom..." Wisdom typically comes with age, and I do not claim to be wise beyond my years. Knowledge comes from exposure, research, inquiries, etc.... and I do not claim to know all there is to know. Experience comes with time and practices, and I do not claim to have a lifetime full of that as well, just more than most my age. However, I would hope that with your apparent abundance of experience, knowledge, and wisdom, you would recognize and appreciate that most people in this Lifestyle want different things, and for everyone that wants something, there is another who fits. Whether or not you agree with my style of slavery (as you read it) is as irrelevant as my approval of yours.

That being said, I have removed that portion of my profile for revision, due to several instances where I have had to further explain my intentions. Hopefully with the revision, people will understand more clearly and not make inaccurate assumptions.

(in reply to MsLadySue)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 4:27:58 PM

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I have read many posts here and have never responded, but I must admit that when something is written by Kana, it is rare that I don't find myself saying, "yup that is correct". Now is no different. Life experience counts for a lot more than Lifestyle experience. Being my age I can relate to things that a 25 year old is going through, why? I have been through it or have known someone who has or have the training to empathize with it. Conversely, at 25 I can definitively say that I was not able to relate to anything except job/education, partying and sex (none of which are bad and all of which helped make me who I am today).

I read a great post recently about what makes a good Master. If you want to know which one I am talking about ask Kana, he wrote it!!!

So Wulfe to answer your question, yes I think age and experience makes a big difference in being a "Master". However, I am not sure it matters in being a "Top", there lifestyle training and experience counts. But in my humble opinion there is a world of difference between a "Top" and a "Master".

BTW never met Kana and don't know him except for his writings.

(in reply to Kana)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 4:53:56 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wulfelaw

1.) Obviously somewhere with more years under their belt has more life experience, but I'm not referring to life experience, I'm referring to Lifestyle experience.

Here's the thing: Life experience will teach you how to deal with life and regardless of how you live the "lifestyle", real life happens. Just because you have "lifestyle" experience doesn't mean you're equipped to deal with everything that life throws at you.

Part two is that experience is subjective. Some people learn nothing from experience. You could be doing something wrong for 30 years which means you've just wiped out the value of that experience.

< Message edited by OsideGirl -- 10/31/2012 5:10:40 PM >

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 5:01:55 PM

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Using fast reply.

It's not My age that means I have experience. It's My experience that means I have experience.

When I was 25, I didn't have that experience. Before I had a relationship that lasted for five years, I didn't have that experience. I wouldn't take advice from any supposed, "experienced" person who hasn't lived with their relationship other for five years. Topping, or supposed 'reputation' as a so called 'dom' doesn't mean shit if you can't make it work in real life.

The side track of young, dumb, full of cum doesn't mean anything to Me. I'd ask Jeff for advice far sooner than a lot of folks out there. Know why? He knows what it's like to have a long term relationship, rather than just somebody who can get a chicks panties wet. Fuck! I can do that and I'm straight.

Here's what you do. Understand in the great scheme of things, longevity matters. It's folks like Jeff that you should take a page from. Kana's another. Resident Sadist, Master Obsidian, KM Dave, and other men who can teach you.

The great remedy for age/lack of experience is time.

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(in reply to absolutchocolat)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 6:33:48 PM

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As someone who teaches "lifestyle" classes, skill is VASTLY overrated!

Vanilla abilities like communication, clarity, openess, honesty are FAR more important but are much harder to teach.

Which I why what Kana wrote about being a Master in that other thread had almost nothing kinky in it.Er

(in reply to LadyPact)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 8:04:09 PM

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Kana and SimplyMichael have it right. I have been with all ages of men and experience has nothing to do with it. I even say all that in my profile.

That is why when younger men complain that they are not taken seriously as Doms I always tell them, it is the complaining and expectations that is the issue. If men just approached women with empathy, finesse, understanding and self awareness, then age and experience would not matter that much.

Honestly, the hottest times I have ever had with Doms, were men who were first time Doms. I was able to communicate with them on a level that led to the experiences being great. It does take two to make this happen, which is why I never put it all on a Dom. I am just as integral to the success of this as a Dom is.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 8:17:45 PM

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FR-
In addition to what others have said, the girls you are looking at are ,lets say, between 18-25.

Meaning, they don't necessarily benefit from "experience" anyway.

There is a time in life when not having experience, and going out and gaining it yourself- or with a loved one who is in your same age range- is essential.

Putting so much emphasis on the Dom having "experience" assumes the submissive is just a blank slate, someone without their own agency and strengths and weaknesses.

(in reply to sexyred1)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 9:44:11 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wulfelaw

When i first came across the term Dom, I obviously didn't know what it truly meant, and what all it entailed. Since then, however, I have grown, and I have learned what it means to be a true Dom and a True Master.

That you even imagine there is such a thing as a "True Master," let alone that you have learned what it is, should be cause for a good deal of humble reflection -- and ideally some embarrassment.

K.

(in reply to wulfelaw)

RE: Age and experience... - 10/31/2012 9:58:18 PM

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I'm well over a decade older than my girl. She has more experience than me. We still fit very nicely, above and beyond the obvious tab A and slot B, because of things outside of "the lifestyle" and not just within it. In short, look at the sum of the person, not their so-called credentials.

To the part of your post addressing divorces and personal crisis, these things can happen at any age. They are not necessarily a reflection of the quality of the person going through hardship. That's because life happens.

"Better" is a subjective term. If you're seeking an ideal, look at yourself and what you want, then do it. The rest will come naturally.

I hope this gives you a few new perspectives to ponder.

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RE: Age and experience... - 11/1/2012 8:49:08 AM

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i prefer older for that reason

(in reply to RemoteUser)

RE: Age and experience... - 11/1/2012 10:15:04 AM

lizi

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The one thing I find missing from young people is a sense of being humble or understanding that they could be wrong/mistaken. When you gain enough experience to become humble, realize you could be wrong from time to time, and see that there usually isn't a clear definition to anything, is when there is enough experience regardless of how many years you've been on the planet.

Young people may have skill and strength, but they are usually too full of themselves to be a true leader. It isn't a slam, it's how our brains develop and personalities mature. It actually takes years of development to be able to self reflect enough to gain wisdom- people will less years alive aren't there yet. No shame there. Not to say that that maturity and leadership necessarily comes about with age, but there is more of a chance that it'll be there with someone older that realizes that they don't know everything.

(in reply to wulfelaw)

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