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RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 12:23:52 AM

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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Do I find the difference between Muslim culture and Muslim dogma difficult?

No, I've been pointing out the difference all these times you've flip flopped between the 2 as though they were a single monolithic thing, and all Muslims were clones.

But you are right on one point... sticking to reality, citing facts, using valid resources, and catching you contradicting yourself even in your own quotes...

Yeah, that's about all I've got.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Oh posh.

Do you really find that unclear? Really??? Especially since I gave numerous examples of what muslim theology stands for? Death to apostates and idolators. Lack of religious freedom. Bow ties forbidden. Dancing forbidden. Music Forbidden.

How about you answer the question asked 23 times now - instead of searching pages and pages of quotes for wordings that support your nvective.

IS MUSLIM THEOLOGY consonant with western civilization?

Look man- why don't you just admit you have no intention of answering the question? You can't defeat the premise with quotes, with logic so you pound the table quibling if "the values espoused in muslim theology" is the same as "is muslim theology".

Really? Thats the *best* you've got?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Which question is that again?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Do you think the values espoused in the Muslim religion are consonant with western civilization. Yes or No?
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4499778

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Sorry still here. Still posting the same answers which you will ignore again. Once again I am not interested in values. The question - now repeated for the 22nd time. Is muslim theology consonant with western civilization.

I told you were free to use any mainstream Islamic theology. For example, Sunni, Sufi, Druze, Shia.
I told you were free to use any G-7 civilization.

You've distorted, avoided, mixed the question - and basically flat out chose not to answer the question asked.

Have a nice day.

So which is it again? Values or theology? Culturally don't allow music and dancing, or fanatic zealots use religious dogma to ban those things?

Who to believe, who to believe?

You aren't even trying to keep up the appearance of honesty.

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 12:34:34 AM

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

quote:

Phydeaux

I wonder what claims you think I have advanced that are "diametrically opposed" to history.

See my post #183, where I examined your claim that Muslim attitudes towards women were not 'consonant' with 'western civilisation'. I found that for almost all of western history the 'values' you claimed were Muslim were an integral part of 'western civilisation'. Therefore your claim is diametrically opposed to the historical record. Or, if you prefer, your claim is flatly contradicted by the historical record.

quote:

let me turn the question around on you - why are you so unwilling to even discuss the point that muslim theology *might* be a contributing cause?

Thus far in this thread, I have described your claim as "stupid" "ill informed" "hypocritical" "too stupid to merit examination" "ideologically driven" and a few other pointed adjectives. Check out what the terms mean in a dictionary and you'll find the answer to your question.

Until you can supply a good argument, backed with credible evidence, that political and economic factors - the obvious place to look for explanations of political issues - are irrelevant, it's pointless to examine other potential explanations especially the kind of ideologically driven drivel you have presented here. If and when you do this, I will be happy to assess the argument you present.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 7/26/2013 12:37:57 AM >

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(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 12:39:47 AM

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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Not to mention the claim that Muslims are *culturally* opposed to music and dance... an amazing denial of reality.

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to tweakabelle)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 1:05:47 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
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Let's paint an ideal world...

there is no doubt by anyone the muslimpopulation is growing in the west right?
No figures just common sense. We(my ancestors) had to combat the christian church for well over 1500 years. And still those damn churchbells every sunday. But we got used to it.
Now muslims love the same rights right? Cause its all about freedom here.

So now you live next to a mosk in manhatten lets say for the sake of argument and the won a petition for muslim rights.
Now every day we non crack believers have to wake up by somebody shoutin cause i cant call it singing of a minaret every fuckin day WALLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAcKBAAAR
Not once But 5 fuckin times a day to call for prayer.
In an ideal world
IS MUSLIM CULTURE COMPATIBLE WITH NYC?

some people just dont know how to run an argument, Im just here to help

(in reply to Powergamz1)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 1:22:03 AM

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Joined: 9/3/2011
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I live near a mosque, and their muzzeuin does not use external loudspeakers.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

Let's paint an ideal world... there is no doubt by anyone the muslimpopulation is growing in the west right?
No figures just common sense. We(my ancestors) had to combat the christian church for well over 1500 years. And still those damn churchbells every sunday. But we got used to it.
Now muslims love the same rights right? Cause its all about freedom here.
So now you live next to a mosk in manhatten lets say for the sake of argument and the won a petition for muslim rights.
Now every day we non crack believers have to wake up by somebody shoutin cause i cant call it singing of a minaret every fuckin day WALLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAcKBAAAR
Not once But 5 fuckin times a day to call for prayer.
In an ideal world
IS MUSLIM CULTURE COMPATIBLE WITH NYC?

some people just dont know how to run an argument, Im just here to help

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 2:00:08 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
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Good one, no speakers, but some can bellow for almost a mile without spekers, just because of the resonance in the minaret.
I take it you don't mind people are called out for prayer 5 times a day.
It does not disturb your peace?
Cause it very much disturbes my peace. I got very sensitive ears.

(in reply to Powergamz1)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 2:05:32 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
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But let's take another one.
Let's say I work in a western company with a seperate praying room for muslims. I only get 3 breaks a day but muslims get 5 breaks a day just to pray.
We both work from 9 to 5 but he works less and prays more. This is real life experience. Can I pay him less cause he works less hours?
But besides that it sets a precedent I will convert to Islam just to get more breaks.
Is this compatible with western work ethics?

What I mean is can I fire or dont hire muslims because they work less hours during my day. In short am I allowed to discriminate my workforce on those grounds?

< Message edited by MrBukani -- 7/26/2013 2:07:50 AM >

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 2:13:36 AM

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Joined: 4/18/2010
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Another one, it's ramadan right now and muslims are fasting. He comes into work every day very tired and only produces half the products in comparison to my western workforce. Can I fire him for making me loose money?

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 3:44:05 AM

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Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

Another one, it's ramadan right now and muslims are fasting. He comes into work every day very tired and only produces half the products in comparison to my western workforce. Can I fire him for making me loose money?

Oh goody. Hypothetical bullshit instead of your normal bullshit.

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 5:35:57 AM

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Joined: 1/22/2012
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It is not good practice, to allow different protocol for different individuals doing the same job for the same money. People will harbor resentment.

I believe if you expect special treatment, or require it, then a job on commission, or one that fits your individual believes is more tailored for you. My personal opinion is it is your job to find the right fit, not to go into an established protocol that works, and expect it to change for you. That to me is crossing the line. Its not fair, to anyone. Respect others rules.

< Message edited by chatterbox24 -- 7/26/2013 5:37:26 AM >

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My crazy smells like jasmine, cloves and cat nip.

(in reply to Politesub53)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 7:49:25 AM

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Joined: 4/18/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani
javascript:void(AddText(''))
Another one, it's ramadan right now and muslims are fasting. He comes into work every day very tired and only produces half the products in comparison to my western workforce. Can I fire him for making me loose money?

Oh goody. Hypothetical bullshit instead of your normal bullshit.

You really got it comin friend callin me a bigot and racist a couple of times. Let's pound through your WISDOM and make you look stupid. Expect the worst of me denegrating YOUR belief.

editted with a big smile cause you been challenging me for some time now. I love it when a plan comes together you big troll

< Message edited by MrBukani -- 7/26/2013 7:51:50 AM >

(in reply to Politesub53)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 7:58:58 AM

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline

Do what Toyota does with their Muslim workers from the Sudan in Tennessee... give everyone the same amount of break time, and let them spend it however they see fit. There is no requirement for extra time to pray.

And the 5 prayers a day don't fall between 9AM and 5 PM, nice try though.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

But let's take another one.
Let's say I work in a western company with a seperate praying room for muslims. I only get 3 breaks a day but muslims get 5 breaks a day just to pray.
We both work from 9 to 5 but he works less and prays more. This is real life experience. Can I pay him less cause he works less hours?
But besides that it sets a precedent I will convert to Islam just to get more breaks.
Is this compatible with western work ethics?

What I mean is can I fire or dont hire muslims because they work less hours during my day. In short am I allowed to discriminate my workforce on those grounds?

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:02:29 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline

you still dint answer my question if it doesn't bother you so shut up and answer first. Then I will explain european law to you instead of dutch law.

On the other thread about freedom FYI

I dont give out my knowledge for free.

< Message edited by MrBukani -- 7/26/2013 8:05:36 AM >

(in reply to Powergamz1)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:03:56 AM

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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Same thing that Western schools and employers have been doing for centuries... same thing that uslim military, police, hospitals, etc. do... set the standard, and let the employees figure out how to balance Ramadan duties. I had a student 2 years ago who had a root canal without anesthesia during Ramadan, and he waited until sundown to take a drop of water, or pain medication.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

Another one, it's ramadan right now and muslims are fasting. He comes into work every day very tired and only produces half the products in comparison to my western workforce. Can I fire him for making me loose money?

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:06:05 AM

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline

You are once again babbling nonsense. Your question was based on false assumptions, there is no 'answer'. You may as well have posted 'I have a bunch of Dutch employees and all they do is smoke hashish and wear those wooden shoes on the factory floor, why can't I fire them?'.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani in reply to Powergamz1

you still dint answer my question if it doesn't bother you so shut up and answer first. Then I will explain european law to you instead of dutch law.

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:07:32 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline

you really wanna dive in don't you.
No prob
Let's get hypothetical.
I got some more for you dont worry but 1 at a time and clearcut answers.
That people solve probs in tennessee doesnt affect me here. comprende?

(in reply to Powergamz1)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:09:07 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline

dont play gamie
1 at a time I will answer you or it stops here.
My time is too valuable for people who dont listen.

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:10:27 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

You are once again babbling nonsense. Your question was based on false assumptions, there is no 'answer'. You may as well have posted 'I have a bunch of Dutch employees and all they do is smoke hashish and wear those wooden shoes on the factory floor, why can't I fire them?'.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani in reply to Powergamz1

you still dint answer my question if it doesn't bother you so shut up and answer first. Then I will explain european law to you instead of dutch law.

I see are you questioning my picture of the hague too?
answer first.

(in reply to Powergamz1)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:13:17 AM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
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Pretty stupid to bring up drugs cause now I have to tell you how much dope arabs smuggle into europe and how many arabs deal drugs.

(in reply to MrBukani)

RE: Why Arabs Don't Like the U.S. - 7/26/2013 8:22:58 AM

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline

Ahhh, so this is a turf war for you?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

Pretty stupid to bring up drugs cause now I have to tell you how much dope arabs smuggle into europe and how many arabs deal drugs.

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to MrBukani)

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