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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 4/29/2007 7:25:17 AM

Lucidian

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Owning weapons, and practicing with them... is a lot different than having to use one to survive. I have always despised guns, and I own a few quality blades that I keep on my person at all times.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/2/2007 11:33:07 AM

craftyape

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My question is do you, as a Master, feel it's important to be conversant with weaponry whether it be handguns, swords, knives what have you.. in order to protect that which belongs to you? Do you feel it's important that your partner be equally well versed or at least know enough about weaponry to protect themselves?

If not, what steps do you take to ensure that your property (not necessarily a slave, but perhaps just your home) is safe and secure from intruders?

Yes it is critical that one be able to and actively defend their property. I was a competitive martial artist for many years as well as a competitive wrestler. Given that I am still a practicing martial artist and a power lifter I have little issue with defending me or mine against whomever would take it on a fist fighting kind of basis. I have ensured that those that I love and that belong to me are advancing in martial arts at this time, not just the normal stuff but how to use a knife properly that they are required to carry....

Also as a person who has had very significant training in firearms, I am quite comfortable with carrying a concealed handgun and do so at almost all times. My women were required to learn to be vastly more than proficient with them as well and are also required to carry. While I do not mind giving a lot of slack in a lead on some matters, there is no option in this regard. They are mine and as such are expected to keep my property safe and secure.
As for the home we have spent rather a lot more money than I care to think of for security measures in the form of alarms, sensors, lighting, cameras and a couple of other do dads. Plus there are yippy little dogs that while not threatening are very good alarms in their own right. If anything sets off the counter measures be they hi tech or fur tech, that anything would be met by two (usually three but we are seeking currently) heavily armed and very annoyed people.

The one time that I had to deal with an intruder I was lucky enough to be in the cottage out back when a motion detector went off.... I drew my weapon and peeked quietly outside. I could see a guy trying to get his tire iron wedged into the crack in the back door so as to pry it open. I slipped back in and called my wife's cell phone. Told her to arm herself and our girl and give our girl a phone and have her call 911. Also for her (wife) not to come out till she knew I had it in hand, but just to watch from a bedroom window that gave a good view of the yard.
I then snuck up behind the little weasel that was now in process of damaging my french windows and put a foot into the back of his knee and a arm round his throat to do a take down. I screwed my weapon further in his ear than could have been recommended by the manufacturer and said something in my best tough guy voice. After I had him calmed down and on knees and fingers interlaced behind head I had my wife come out and keep a gun on him while I cuffed him..... you know there are advantages to our lifestyle.... lots of folks have play time crap quality bedroom cuffs.... This guy got the benefit of the real thing.... considered showing off by tying his ass up all nice and fancy but did not want to get too much attention from the cops.

Anyway the local PD was there at nearly the same time I was slapping the cuffs on the tardo in question. I unlocked the back gate and yelled for the guys to come round back.
Had to spend about a hour talking to them at the station but fortunately one of my friends that is on the force was on shift and made it easy. Then a couple months later went to court to give my testimony.
Turns out the guy had a record of breaking and entering and aggravated sexual assault.

End result and the lesson today boys and girls..... bloody well be prepared and then deal with what ever comes at you. To do otherwise is foolish.

Crafty Ape called man.

p.s.

Swords? I fenced as well and love my long blades, but lets be practical here..... do we really want to be thought of as a bunch of dorks? Plus think of the legal issues trying to defend running someone through in court. Bugger me.... be better off whacking him with a sjambok (if you have felt one you would know) so that they would just run away.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/3/2007 7:38:31 PM

Slavetrainer2007

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I use a flak 88mm,.50 cal gatling gun, 20 mm cannon, gernade launcher and mine field to protect whats mine. I also got a sherman tank( fully operational with ammo) parked in the garage for those really tough opponents.

Ok maybe not. Realistically i was born and raised in the country, guns nor people waving them all about bother me. People waving knives or sword i would more than likely laugh at.

Though most people where i live dont lock their doors or even take the keys out of their car my perferred weapon is anything not nailed down. someone with a knife or sword would have to completely catch me buy surprise which is unlikely since i have a good guard dog that warns me if anyone even gets within 10 feet of my house. In self defense everything is a weapon. if you can pick it up you should be throwing it.

Gun wise, gun of choice 12 ga pump with a mod or open choke. i like bird loads they tend to hold pattern better. rock salt loaded in shells is a great alternative if your worried about killing someone. i pelt you at 10 yds with rock salt and it has about the same affect as a taser and you dont have to be near as accurate. Which is another thing i like about a shotgun. i dont have to be accurate good for use in the dark unless you can see in the dark. I rather have lights out and wait for a muzzle flash and then shoot. while rifles and pistols will shot through walls. shotguns at close range will blow sections of walls away again you dont have to accurate. The pump itself is scary to most people. you here the cha ching of a pump and yuour more likly to go running than try to shoot me. Also shotguns can be used to fire single bullets( slugs) a 12 gauge slug at 40 yds will put a hole all the way through a washer big enought to stick your thumb in. Over all for protection the shotgun is the best weapon of choice imo. The range and size of bullets also means its alot less likely your going to kill someone you dont want too. its a short range gun and while it will blow through interior walls at close range it wont travel much further than the other side of the room. a high cal pistol or rifle i can shoot clean through a house with.

a friend of mine as a nice little toy that shoots about a .177 cal bullet. from the size of the bullet and the size of the gun you would laugh. it looks like pellet gun. but it shoots a ballistic tip bullet that will drop a deer dead in his tracks at 100 yds. the entrance wound is the size of a pen and the exit wound the size of a coke can. its more quiet than a .22 and does as much damage as a 30/06 or 30/30.

while im a pretty good shot( use to do alot of clay bird shooting and live bird shooting) my weapon of choice is anything in reach. i dont need a gun or martial arts to feel i can defend me and mine.. all i need is a kitchen chair, a glass, ashtray , hell a candle, even a full bottle of water ,spoons, fork knives ,coffee ,my dogs chew bone, pillow, ottoman , microwave if i feel froggy, left overs out of the fridge, bottle of tide, telephone... bottle of clorox( take the cap off for a dirty bomb:P), soup cans. trash can... the list goes on and on and on. As long as i can keep them on the defensive even if its throwing a pillow to keep them distracted until i can pick up something else.. they cant get on the offensive. fortunately i have a pretty accurarate and stong arm.

the best weapon is to have the mentality everything can be used as a weapon. i could even kill someone with a plastic straw

( no joke) They say a man defending his home is worth 10 men trying to take it.

But i really dont have to worry about any of that. we havent had a murder or armed robbery in my county in probably over 10 years. its more likely a farmer will die because he got caught in farm machinery here than it is for someone to get murdered or robbed.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/3/2007 7:42:56 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

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I would love to see some one waving a blade around as I was letting the hammer down on my 45, now who do you think would win and yes everyone in the house is well versed in using a weapon...bounty

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/3/2007 8:56:03 PM

spanklette

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~Fast Reply~

I grew up in the South. There were guns in the house and we all, including the children old enough to reach them knew how to use them, for snakes mostly. Eventually when we were old enough we took fire arms training courses for my mother's sake.

One of the only things I remember out of all of that was my Dad telling me that no possession in our house was worth someone's life. He said, "If they can live with it then I can live without it."

His tried and true rule was never to shoot unless someone was in mortal danger. If they want the TV...let 'em have it. I'd rather have to buy a new TV than live with the knowledge that I took someone's life over an inanimate object.

Right now, Daddy does have several unloaded guns locked up safely in the house. They were handed down to Him and I have no real issues with them being here. Honestly, even growing up in a gun toting family...I really wouldn't be comfortable with a loaded weapon in our home. Too many UM's are traipsing through to make me feel like that would be a wise decision.

Aside from all of that...we live right across the street from the Police Station...I'm feeling pretty protected.

I did think about getting a taser, until a girlfriend of mine reached into her purse and accidentally tased herself. So, I'm pretty much over the taser thing.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/3/2007 11:59:42 PM

Shanghaid

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

My question is do you, as a Master, feel it's important to be conversant with weaponry whether it be handguns, swords, knives what have you.. in order to protect that which belongs to you? Do you feel it's important that your partner be equally well versed or at least know enough about weaponry to protect themselves? If not, what steps do you take to ensure that your property (not necessarily a slave, but perhaps just your home) is safe and secure from intruders? Burglar alarms? Dogs? Bat? Martial arts training?

Knives & guns are all very good but difficult to bring through detectors and oftentimes illegal. While swords are lovely (in a nice D&D retro sorta way), most anything can be used as weapon. Hell, just watch any Jackie Chan (whoever) movie to see them bounce about with chairs, ladders and all manner of whatnot.

You have a sword, I have a (looking about) a wastepaper basket. I will beat you.

<now I'm gonna hear it from the sword lobby!>

I'm a 230lbs 6'4" former Marine who studied (mixed) martial arts for about 15 years. Believe me when I say I'll kick your ass with that wastebasket.

I took martial arts 'cuz I liked the movies. I started off as a bully and they took me away from that. You don't bully when you know what you can do. You're actually a helluva lot more calm. With most masters I know, it takes just about heaven & hell together to get them riled. It happens but rarely. Likewise I don't fight (pre-agreed upon sparring with friends aside) and I DON'T consider myself a master. I can just take care of myself - and whoever I'm with.

That's what I want. Competence and being able to offer my protection to those I'm with. The confidence is part of being a dom and stops fights. A lot of folks here will know what I mean - a drunk guy at a bar can recognize confidence of that sort and walks away. It doesn't remove fear but it lessens it.

For home protection, live in a safe neighborhood. Get good locks. Be well-lit at night. I had a nice 9mm when I lived in a not-safe neighborhood (Former Marine - I'm a good shot). I sold it when I moved. I slept better when I moved. Ammo was freakin' expensive too.

Knives and guns are generally illegal when you're walking around. Martial arts trains your body and mind. It makes you healthier - all good stuff.

Should my sub be trained? My Stateside sub went to my kickboxing class with me and while it was rockin' for her body, I don't know whether she could use it effectively against an attacker - probably (she's feisty). However, she didn't NEED to, I can take care of her. I could offer her my protection. The same as I do whenever I'm out with friends. They're safe - with me.

Misc thoughts/crap.

SH'd

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/4/2007 12:31:06 AM

Lordandmaster

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Christ, what a bore.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/4/2007 11:05:33 PM

Slavetrainer2007

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucidian

Owning weapons, and practicing with them... is a lot different than having to use one to survive. I have always despised guns, and I own a few quality blades that I keep on my person at all times.

i could shoot the cap off a soda bottle witha rifle at 50 yds without using a mount/pod. i can shoot something the size of your fist 40-50 yds out flying at 40-50 mph ( say a bird) and miss less than 10% of the time.

Becuase ive practiced since i was a child and i know my way around a gun and because im use to guns since i grew up around them i dont have the panicky fear most would around them.

The weapon of choice for most people will be a pistol its small and easy to manuever its also inaccuate especially in the dark and i know this. since i know the capablities of rifles, pistols and shotguns because i am familar with all, my confindence that im more than likely going to hit you before you hit me is quit high. its like comparing a nuclear bomb( shotgun) and a smart bomb( pistol) to me. I dont have to be accuate to be deadly. a pistol does. thats why smart people pass over the pistol for home protection and especially for (most) women get a .410 or 20 ga shot gun either auto load or punp. when scared you will shake trying to be precise is going to be hard( as your difference comes in to play here) . shot gun you dont have to be precise. point and shoot hell most you can fire off the hip and get fairly close. Best all purpose weapon they ever invented. If you cant kill it or stop it with a shotgun you better get a rocket launcher or run.

Practice does play a large part. you cannot use a gun in a stressful situation if you are scared of guns. and if you havent been around guns much and your nto afraid of them i would say your not all their. The practice is important in self defense. you need to have the loading , safety( switch), aiming and firing down to something you can do without thinking because it will be the last thing on your mind if someone with a gun is looking to hurt you. and those seconds would be critical that you spend fidging trying to remember how that weapon your holding works. So yeah practice does play a very large part of it.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/7/2007 7:40:13 AM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

I would love to see some one waving a blade around as I was letting the hammer down on my 45, now who do you think would win and yes everyone in the house is well versed in using a weapon...

A blade is only useful at close range, obviously. At close range, however, your 45 can be avoided: they don't have to dodge a bullet, they just have to dodge your line of fire, or move your line of fire. I've seen people disarm skilled firearms handlers up close, but I've yet to see anyone avoid serious-to-fatal injuries in disarming or restraining a skilled bladist with a proper knife.

Of course, at longer ranges, I'd prefer a gun or something else that has the appropriate range, but that isn't legal where I live, nor is it particularly useful the way crimes tend to go down around here, which is usually fairly simple: either it's up close and personal, or only inanimate objects are at risk unless someone does something stupid.

All in all it depends on the person doing the defending. To paraphrase slavetrainer; your commitment is your main weapon. A gun that you're committed to using will stop the attacker. A gun you're not committed to using will only be fired at yourself. Same for knives, improvised weapons, and so forth.

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/7/2007 6:31:00 PM

MercTech

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Thoughts for your consideration....

I remember one thing clearly I was taught young. Never carry a weapon you have no intention of using. If you aren't comfortable with firearms, a nice large chef's knife might work better. What can you use and use effectively if you need to. What would you do if someone kicked in your door and yelled for you to get on the floor.
I have a home that is a bit rural. On a good day, it would be a half hour before a police officer could arrive. I consider a 12 gauge pump shotgun a good choice for the home. Buckshot doesn't go a half mile to the neighbor's house and go through the wall it only does surface damage to close targets. If the shotgun isn't immediately available, a 4 foot oak riot baton is behind the door and a 42 inch Patton sabre is on the wall next to the other door. I'm responsible for the home and those that dwell there and I take my responsibilities seriously.

I've seen this debate so many times. There are many pardigms to consider and many with strong beliefs don't consider other possibilities. What works right for Manhattan is often totally unacceptable for Montana. What we don't want to lose is the freedom to make our own decisions. Decisions that should be made individually and collectively as in local ordinances. We don't need some blanket rules from on high that are neither universal in applicability nor acceptability.

"Though shalt not own a firearm to protect thy rural home" is neither an acceptable nor enforceable concept.
"Don't carry firearms in the grocery store" is much more reasonable a concept. <part of a city ordinance in Jackson, MS>

One thing the test of time has proven over and over is that there is no government agency that is going to protect your life or property. There are government agencies that will arrest and attempt to punish perpetrators of violence and theft. But none are going to protect you as an individual.
You can decide for yourself what you, as an indidual, will do to protect your life, health, and loved ones. But don't even think of dictating what I am allowed to do in defense of myself and those I care about. It isn't your decision.
Most fear of honest citizens owning firearms appears to me to stem from fear over what someone MIGHT do and not what they will do. If you take that mindset to the end of that logic chain you would close all the hardware stores in the country because someone MIGHT go get the parts to make bombs and toxic gas weapons. (Yes, you can make bombs and toxic gas from readily available items from the grocery and hardware store.) The original Uzi submachine gun was designed to be built with plumbing supplies and tools. You can always get weapons if you want to and are willing to do what it takes, no matter what country you are in. No gun control law is going to keep weapons out of the hands of a determined criminal. Weapons are too easy to make. They only give you more crimes to charge the criminal with once he is caught.

I hope I've shared some food for thought,
Stefan

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RE: Weaponry, protecting what's yours - 5/7/2007 6:41:15 PM

SimplyMichael

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quote:

The original Uzi submachine gun was designed to be built with plumbing supplies and tools.

The WWII British Sten is the gun you are thinking of although it wasn't built with plumbing supplies although two different steam boiler companies made them, LongBranch in Canada and I can't think of the British one but they made the Mk III.

The Jews in Poland managed to make copies of the sten in the basements of the Warsaw Ghetto. Odd thing, I love Jewish women and most of them love firearms...my ex shot everything from belt fed MG42s to silenced Sten MkIIs submachine guns and shot them DAMN well.

The Uzi is actually a sophisticated SMG copied from the Czech CZ26. The Uzi magazine is a copy of the Beretta SMG mag which originated for the Villa Perosa of WWI fame and is still with us with the current Beretta Model 12 and is one of the better SMG magazine designs, the other of course being the Finnish Suomi.

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