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RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/8/2017 11:46:03 PM

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

I know I'm going to regret unblocking you, but he posted this link in #48:

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/climate-change-global-sea-level

You're right, I missed that one. Mea culpa.

But the fact remains that attributing the rise to CO2 lacks evidence. From Church and White:

The period of relatively rapid sea-level rise commencing in the 1930s ceases abruptly in about 1962 after which there is a fall in sea level of over 10 mm over 5 years.

In other words, no CO2 signal.

K.

You're talking about a period of 5 years, which is far too short to constitute a climate trend. You would have to look at those 5 years to determine what caused the reversal. It could be volcanic activity, it could be other human influences, it could be dust storms.

I don't know how you have arrived at the conclusion that a brief reversal in sea level rise back in the 1960s somehow negates the long-term trend or discounts CO2 as a climate driver. What exactly are you arguing here?

Yes, unexpected natural events occur that produce short-term effects... so what? Your article mentions that the eruption of Pinatubo affected the rate of sea level rise for about 4 years... do you think that admitting this puts them at odds with the consensus? This somehow debunks AGW theory?

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/8/2017 11:55:53 PM

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Ha... it doesn't surprise me you're one of those 'CO2 is plant food' people.

Well, since pizza is human food I guess you should just keep eating more and more of it until you die. At the same time, I will increase the temperature in your room until it's so hot you collapse before you can eat even more pizza.

Then the world will be a better place.

You're a charmer, that's for sure.

K.

At least I wrap my insults in analogies that pertain to the topic at hand.

Since I don't even know if you understood what I was getting at, my point is that you can't just keep feeding plants more and more CO2 and expect them to get healthier and healthier. They have a limit of how much CO2 they can take, and then past that limit it starts to hurt them. We are now at the point where they are capable of absorbing the CO2 and the earth is greening-- this has all been correctly predicted.

But beyond this is the stage where there is too much CO2 and the plants and the soil won't be able to absorb all of it. The soil-based microbes that the forests depend on for life could die, and then the soil will become inhospitable. Throw in the fact that the climate will shift ever more dramatically, and temperatures will shift past the point where they can adapt... and there isn't much hope for biodiversity.

Some species may thrive and fill in the gaps left by their extinction, and I'm sure your favorite oil company/Heartland propaganda will eagerly point this out-- but there will be more losers than winners. And the thing about ecosystems is that biodiversity is essential to their long-term survival. Without that diversity, species will not be able to adapt... or they will suffer adverse effects of the sudden changes to their diets and relationships with the species that will die out.

< Message edited by heavyblinker -- 4/8/2017 11:59:36 PM >

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 12:03:24 AM

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Since I don't even know if you understood what I was getting at, my point is that you can't just keep feeding plants more and more CO2 and expect them to get healthier and healthier.

Since I never said or even implied any such a thing, I'll leave you alone to enjoy the sound of your voice.

K.

(in reply to heavyblinker)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 12:13:28 AM

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

But the fact remains that attributing the rise to CO2 lacks evidence. From Church and White:

The period of relatively rapid sea-level rise commencing in the 1930s ceases abruptly in about 1962 after which there is a fall in sea level of over 10 mm over 5 years.

In other words, no CO2 signal.

You're talking about a period of 5 years

I could be mistaken, and I know you're terribly intelligent, but I don't think 1930-1962 is five years.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 4/9/2017 12:23:31 AM >

(in reply to heavyblinker)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 1:54:02 AM

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: InfoMan
ORIGINAL: thompsonx

https://www2.usgs.gov/climate_landuse/glaciers/glaciers_sea_level.asp

Water levels have been rising ever since we've began observing them,

Not according to the site you posted.

We didn't start observing ocean levels in 21,000 BC... considering that at that time our ancestors where living in caves,

You have no clue as to where our ancestors were living 20,000 years ago.

it was kinda hard for us to 'start observing them' at that time.

Why do you believe that homo sapians became sentient day before yesterday?

Observation of the Oceans for the United States began in 1880-ish through the Coastal Survey Group, which eventually became National Water Level Observation Network, and was later combined with several other smaller groups to form the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration or NOAA.

You do not seem to recognize or understand the difference between "record keeping" and observation.

And while there have been minor fluctuations in ocean levels on a month to year basis where you see small dips through out the time line, the over all trend that has been observed by NOAA is that the oceans have been consistently rising as time goes on:

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/climate-change-global-sea-level

https://www2.usgs.gov/climate_landuse/glaciers/glaciers_sea_level.asp

it has been projected that ocean levels have risen ~400 feet in the past 21,000 years,

Your site does not say that either.

again you prove your illiteracy.

No...I consistantly prove yours.

4th text block:
About 21,000 years ago, during the last glacial maximum (LGM), sea level was about 125 meters (about 410 feet) lower than it is today.

it was lower by 400 feet then it is today...
which also means that between now and then - it has risen 400 feet.

I know logic is difficult for you, but at least try next time.

This from your site:

Following the LGM (beginning ~ 15,000 yr B.P.), continental glaciers retreated and sea level began to rise. By ~ 6,000 yr B.P. sea level reached its current height. It has fluctuated ever since.

Your own cite says that you are off by a factor of 5000 years dumbass.

There are plenty of ancient coastal cities which have been lost to the sea for hundreds of years because of rising ocean levels that all occurred well before we started burning coal for power.

There have been plenty of coastal cities that have experienced just the opposite as the cite I listed shows.
Is it possible that there is more than one phenomenia at work here?

Emergent coasts are Plate Tectonics in which a subduction zone pushes another plate upward, causing uplift zones along the area. That has absolutely NOTHING to do with ocean levels

I did not say that it did. I pointed out your use of the word of water level and your analogy of submerged cities. I also pointed out that there was another phenomenia at work in addition to rising sea levels namely plate tectonics.

and is a well known and observed geological event. What's more - there is no citation that you have presented which shows or even presents the idea of any coastal city, ancient or modern, that has risen above sea level. It talks specifically about emergent coasts and the development of the 'coastal cliff' feature.

try again.

The body of land, that was once a coastal city, is now miles inland and above sea level would seem pretty convincing proof that it has risen above sea level. You have already acknowledged that it happens and now you want to stomp your foot and make noise with your mouth.
Jesus you are phoquing stupid

(in reply to InfoMan)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 2:07:37 AM

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
Since I never said or even implied any such a thing, I'll leave you alone to enjoy the sound of your voice.

You said:

quote:

On the plus side, we can adjust to higher temperatures and shoreline changes, and the increase in CO2 has done a spectacular job of greening the Earth, which shouldn't be ignored, because we have a lot of mouths to feed.

So you do recognize that the greening is temporary and that we will have far more mouths to feed in the future?

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 2:31:12 AM

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

But the fact remains that attributing the rise to CO2 lacks evidence. From Church and White:

The period of relatively rapid sea-level rise commencing in the 1930s ceases abruptly in about 1962 after which there is a fall in sea level of over 10 mm over 5 years.

In other words, no CO2 signal.

You're talking about a period of 5 years

I could be mistaken, and I know you're terribly intelligent, but I don't think 1930-1962 is five years.

K.

Okay you're going to have to explain to me why you think this negates CO2 as a driver of sea level rise because I don't have any ideas.

The article I linked to previously explains that CO2 has only been the primary driver of sea level rise since the 1970s.

< Message edited by heavyblinker -- 4/9/2017 2:49:08 AM >

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 2:33:08 AM

Posts: 223
Joined: 3/15/2015
Status: offline

Since everyone on the left is sooooooo good at predicting the weather, I'm planning a family outing on Labor day this year. Can someone tell me if it's going to rain or be clear in Houston Tx for the picnic. Thank you in advance.

(in reply to heavyblinker)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 2:52:21 AM

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterBrentC
Since everyone on the left is sooooooo good at predicting the weather, I'm planning a family outing on Labor day this year. Can someone tell me if it's going to rain or be clear in Houston Tx for the picnic. Thank you in advance.

I can't predict the weather, but I can predict whether or not your next comment will be as dumb as the last.
My prediction is that it will be.

(in reply to MasterBrentC)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 3:29:32 AM

Posts: 223
Joined: 3/15/2015
Status: offline

You admit you can't predict the weather but you're sure that in 100 or 200 years the Earth will be uninhabitable due to the temperature being hotter and the seas rising. That's about the stupidest thing I've heard. Tell you what, look me up in 100 years and prove you're right. Until then, shut the fuck up.

(in reply to heavyblinker)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 3:38:06 AM

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: MasterBrentC

You admit you can't predict the weather but you're sure that in 100 or 200 years the Earth will be uninhabitable due to the temperature being hotter and the seas rising. That's about the stupidest thing I've heard. Tell you what, look me up in 100 years and prove you're right. Until then, shut the fuck up.

Until you figure out the difference between weather and climate how about you shut the fuck up.
Jesus you are phoquing stupid.

(in reply to MasterBrentC)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 3:49:55 AM

Posts: 223
Joined: 3/15/2015
Status: offline

If you are sooooooo worried about the CO2 levels rising in the atmosphere, you have my permission to stop breathing. Thank you.

(in reply to thompsonx)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 4:02:19 AM

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: MasterBrentC

If you are sooooooo worried about the CO2 levels rising in the atmosphere, you have my permission to stop breathing. Thank you.

"No one here gets out alive"

(in reply to MasterBrentC)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 4:28:33 AM

Posts: 471
Joined: 2/20/2017
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Yet again, whatever the reason it's happening, that it's happened would seem to indicate taking prudent steps (whatever you conceive those to be) rather than insisting it's not happening at all, which is the official position of the US government (but thankfully not the military, which likes to prepare for actual events, not beliefs).

I am not insisting that it is not happening at all - i am stating that spending time, money, and effort in the fruitless task of trying to stop a naturally occurring event from naturally occurring is a waste. You may as well be attempting to glue together the San Andreas Fault Line.

I believe that thinking that Global Warming is Our Fault as humans and thus Our Responsibility to fix is no different then thousands of years ago sacrificing virgins, live stock and first borns to appease the gods, sky spirits, or ancestors. The language may of changed - but still it was always our fault for a lack of faith, respect, or morality which brought forth such calamity, and thus our duty to prevent it from happening in the future by any means necessary.

Ridiculous.

Your own links blatantly stated that anthropogenic emission levels will determine how much the sea level rise will be. You trust them with their data and yet mistrust their conclusions?

Why do you know so much more about this than NASA, NOAA, etc?

I don't know more... it is a personal analysis of the data and reaching my own conclusion of that data. Further more, the IPCC - Independent Panel on Climate Change - doesn't support prevention or reversing the climate change trends found through out the world, but instead provides warnings and strategies on how to adapt to it.

http://www.ipcc.ch/news_and_events/docs/factsheets/FS_what_ipcc.pdf

So this sentiment of 'trying to fix it is stupid' isn't just my own - the leading international body on research into the subject also supports that approach as well.

I did throw my own flavor into it making the correlation between an actual common trend humans have in which in our own hubris we seemingly denote things which are well outside of our sphere of influence as being our fault and our duty to fix - and we've done it for thousands of years.

The earth shook? The earth spirit is angry! we must sacrifice this virgin to the fire mountain!!
It didn't rain? we did not properly please the fertility goddess, we must sacrifice 10 goats and dance in her name to please her!
Suffering from crippling illness? it is your immoral behavior that brought this on yourself, repent your sins and pray to your savior!!

all of that is no different then:

Ice Caps melting? It is All our Fault! We must stop burning fossil fuels and force everyone else to abide by our rules!

(in reply to heavyblinker)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 6:03:22 AM

Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterBrentC

Since everyone on the left is sooooooo good at predicting the weather, I'm planning a family outing on Labor day this year. Can someone tell me if it's going to rain or be clear in Houston Tx for the picnic. Thank you in advance.

Usually children learn about the difference between weather and climate in grade school.

(in reply to MasterBrentC)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 6:10:24 AM

Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Yet again, whatever the reason it's happening, that it's happened would seem to indicate taking prudent steps (whatever you conceive those to be) rather than insisting it's not happening at all, which is the official position of the US government (but thankfully not the military, which likes to prepare for actual events, not beliefs).

I am not insisting that it is not happening at all - i am stating that spending time, money, and effort in the fruitless task of trying to stop a naturally occurring event from naturally occurring is a waste. You may as well be attempting to glue together the San Andreas Fault Line.

I believe that thinking that Global Warming is Our Fault as humans and thus Our Responsibility to fix is no different then thousands of years ago sacrificing virgins, live stock and first borns to appease the gods, sky spirits, or ancestors. The language may of changed - but still it was always our fault for a lack of faith, respect, or morality which brought forth such calamity, and thus our duty to prevent it from happening in the future by any means necessary.

Ridiculous.

Your own links blatantly stated that anthropogenic emission levels will determine how much the sea level rise will be. You trust them with their data and yet mistrust their conclusions?

Why do you know so much more about this than NASA, NOAA, etc?

I don't know more... it is a personal analysis of the data and reaching my own conclusion of that data. Further more, the IPCC - Independent Panel on Climate Change - doesn't support prevention or reversing the climate change trends found through out the world, but instead provides warnings and strategies on how to adapt to it.

http://www.ipcc.ch/news_and_events/docs/factsheets/FS_what_ipcc.pdf

So this sentiment of 'trying to fix it is stupid' isn't just my own - the leading international body on research into the subject also supports that approach as well.

I did throw my own flavor into it making the correlation between an actual common trend humans have in which in our own hubris we seemingly denote things which are well outside of our sphere of influence as being our fault and our duty to fix - and we've done it for thousands of years.

The earth shook? The earth spirit is angry! we must sacrifice this virgin to the fire mountain!!
It didn't rain? we did not properly please the fertility goddess, we must sacrifice 10 goats and dance in her name to please her!
Suffering from crippling illness? it is your immoral behavior that brought this on yourself, repent your sins and pray to your savior!!

all of that is no different then:

Ice Caps melting? It is All our Fault! We must stop burning fossil fuels and force everyone else to abide by our rules!

You don't think you know better . . . It's just your personal analysis with your own flavor.

Ending with the straw man of stop burning fossil fuels and force everyone else too. Who exactly holds that position?

Fossil fuels and their alternatives is not an either or proposition. The "international body" you've chosen as arbitrator is at odds with the the consensus of the scientific community, not a bunch of virgin sacrificing fertility goddess prayer advocates. Your own opinion vs. more straw men.

And that's the position you're using to pretend all others are clueless in the face of what you actually appear to belief is superior reasoning.

A remarkable demonstration of irony, poor logic, and self-delusion.

(in reply to InfoMan)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 6:12:45 AM

Posts: 10663
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterBrentC

Since everyone on the left is sooooooo good at predicting the weather, I'm planning a family outing on Labor day this year. Can someone tell me if it's going to rain or be clear in Houston Tx for the picnic. Thank you in advance.

Usually children learn about the difference between weather and climate in grade school.

Or little boys like you learn the differences right here

"Weather" is when events prove that the global warming hype is way overblown, and the prophet Gore's sermons failed to predict the future

"Climate" consists of events that Marxists think they can use to enforce total control over society to the benefit of Hillary Clinton and her crony investment banker friends

_____________________________

Hunter is the smartest guy I know

(in reply to Musicmystery)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 6:14:49 AM

Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline

Everything's easier when you just make shit up.

Interesting you bring up children in that context. Pre-schoolers usually learn the difference between real and make-believe.

(in reply to BoscoX)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 6:16:22 AM

Posts: 10663
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterBrentC

If you are sooooooo worried about the CO2 levels rising in the atmosphere, you have my permission to stop breathing. Thank you.

They would give up every modern convenience and go live like monkeys in the forest rather than live as large as possible like their prophet preacher Al Gore, with his $30,000.00 utility bills and his limos and his private jet service

Seems like all of their Dear Leader types live that way, while preaching their 'End Is Near' doom-and-gloom sermons

_____________________________

Hunter is the smartest guy I know

(in reply to MasterBrentC)

RE: "Inconvenient Sequel" hits theatres July ... - 4/9/2017 6:18:33 AM

Posts: 10663
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Yet again, whatever the reason it's happening, that it's happened would seem to indicate taking prudent steps (whatever you conceive those to be) rather than insisting it's not happening at all, which is the official position of the US government (but thankfully not the military, which likes to prepare for actual events, not beliefs).

I am not insisting that it is not happening at all - i am stating that spending time, money, and effort in the fruitless task of trying to stop a naturally occurring event from naturally occurring is a waste. You may as well be attempting to glue together the San Andreas Fault Line.

I believe that thinking that Global Warming is Our Fault as humans and thus Our Responsibility to fix is no different then thousands of years ago sacrificing virgins, live stock and first borns to appease the gods, sky spirits, or ancestors. The language may of changed - but still it was always our fault for a lack of faith, respect, or morality which brought forth such calamity, and thus our duty to prevent it from happening in the future by any means necessary.

Ridiculous.

Your own links blatantly stated that anthropogenic emission levels will determine how much the sea level rise will be. You trust them with their data and yet mistrust their conclusions?

Why do you know so much more about this than NASA, NOAA, etc?

I don't know more... it is a personal analysis of the data and reaching my own conclusion of that data. Further more, the IPCC - Independent Panel on Climate Change - doesn't support prevention or reversing the climate change trends found through out the world, but instead provides warnings and strategies on how to adapt to it.

http://www.ipcc.ch/news_and_events/docs/factsheets/FS_what_ipcc.pdf

So this sentiment of 'trying to fix it is stupid' isn't just my own - the leading international body on research into the subject also supports that approach as well.

I did throw my own flavor into it making the correlation between an actual common trend humans have in which in our own hubris we seemingly denote things which are well outside of our sphere of influence as being our fault and our duty to fix - and we've done it for thousands of years.

The earth shook? The earth spirit is angry! we must sacrifice this virgin to the fire mountain!!
It didn't rain? we did not properly please the fertility goddess, we must sacrifice 10 goats and dance in her name to please her!
Suffering from crippling illness? it is your immoral behavior that brought this on yourself, repent your sins and pray to your savior!!

all of that is no different then:

Ice Caps melting? It is All our Fault! We must stop burning fossil fuels and force everyone else to abide by our rules!

You don't think you know better . . . It's just your personal analysis with your own flavor.

Ending with the straw man of stop burning fossil fuels and force everyone else too. Who exactly holds that position?

Fossil fuels and their alternatives is not an either or proposition. The "international body" you've chosen as arbitrator is at odds with the the consensus of the scientific community, not a bunch of virgin sacrificing fertility goddess prayer advocates. Your own opinion vs. more straw men.

And that's the position you're using to pretend all others are clueless in the face of what you actually appear to belief is superior reasoning.

A remarkable demonstration of irony, poor logic, and self-delusion.

"You you you"

Ever make a post without using that word, little troll boy?

_____________________________

Hunter is the smartest guy I know

(in reply to Musicmystery)

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