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RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 12:10:19 PM   
Real0ne


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Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
-snip-


Attempting to take a phrase out of context in order to produce a very narrow meaning which was never actually said is deceitful and sign of both ignorance and illiteracy.

For instance you are attempting to imply that i only said this:
search and seizure of property
be secure in their persons

in turn implying that 'People = Property'

Except you take both lines out of the context.

in post 392 I make the statement:
quote:


the 4th Amendment protects specifically against unlawful search and seizure of property and goods by the government against it's citizenry.


in reply to post 381
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
The right of people to be secure in their persons...


In it, i contend that the Amendment does not protect a person to be 'Secure in their persons' which is a statement itself taken out of context of the language of the amendment itself. Later on i address this specifically to you - which i point out in post 446 - as each statement in the sentence is a sort of condition which the action applies.

that you cannot simply take the phrase 'Secure in their persons' and assume it to mean that they are entitled security of themselves.


Now - having traced everything back to their points of origin...

let us address what you've said:
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
since you made such a dumb assed statement that I crayola'd for you I asked you what the fuck a person is and who owns it. and your answer is to quote the 4th, that qualifies for got you by the balls and you know it, or you are one ignoramus fuck take your pick.


You have taken what I have said intentionally out of context.
You have credited a statement i didn't make to me.

... and some how you seem to think that you've 'got me by the balls'?

If anything it has displayed your raw determination to argue just for the sake of arguing... You don't even understand what you are arguing - you are simply arguing.



'Secure in their persons'


and of course it never occured to you to think about why it is plural either did it





_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to InfoMan)
Profile   Post #: 461
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 12:21:30 PM   
tamaka


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Good point.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 462
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 12:53:33 PM   
WickedsDesire


Posts: 9362
Joined: 11/4/2015
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what happened then?

tasered - but lying face up or face down? And then they shot him, in the back or front?

_____________________________

wE arE tHe voiCes,
We SAtuRaTe yOur aLPHA brain WAveS, ThIs is nOt A DrEAm The wiZaRd of Oz, shoES, CaLcuLUs, DECorAtiNG, FrIDGE SProcKeTs, be VeRy sCareDed – SLoBbers,We DeEManDErs Sloowee DAnCiNG, SmOOches – whisper whisper & CaAkEE

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 463
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 12:53:39 PM   
Real0ne


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well what he is saying is 180 out from what the 4th means.

terry v ohio



The distinctions of classical "stop-and-frisk" theory thus serve to divert attention from the central inquiry under the Fourth Amendment—the reasonableness in all the circumstances of the particular governmental invasion of a citizen's personal security. "Search" and "seizure" are not talismans. We therefore reject the notions that the Fourth Amendment does not come into play at all as a limitation upon police conduct if the officers stop short of something called a "technical arrest" or a "full-blown search."

In this case there can be no question, then, that Officer McFadden "seized" petitioner and subjected him to a "search" when he took hold of him and patted down the outer surfaces of his clothing. We must decide whether at that point it was reasonable for Officer McFadden to have interfered with petitioner's personal security as he did.[16] And in determining whether the seizure and search were "unreasonable" our inquiry *20 is a dual one—whether the officer's action was justified at its inception, and whether it was reasonably related in scope to the circumstances which justified the interference in the first place.

III.

If this case involved police conduct subject to the Warrant Clause of the Fourth Amendment, we would have to ascertain whether "probable cause" existed to justify the search and seizure which took place. However, that is not the case. We do not retreat from our holdings that the police must, whenever practicable, obtain advance judicial approval of searches and seizures through the warrant procedure, see, e. g., Katz v. United States, 389 U. S. 347 (1967); Beck v. Ohio, 379 U. S. 89, 96 (1964); Chapman v. United States, 365 U. S. 610 (1961), or that in most instances failure to comply with the warrant requirement can only be excused by exigent circumstances, see, e. g., Warden v. Hayden, 387 U. S. 294 (1967) (hot pursuit); cf. Preston v. United States, 376 U. S. 364, 367-368 (1964).

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/27/2017 12:54:46 PM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to tamaka)
Profile   Post #: 464
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 1:27:20 PM   
InfoMan


Posts: 471
Joined: 2/20/2017
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

'Secure in their persons'


and of course it never occured to you to think about why it is plural either did it



Everything is plural in the sentence.
This is because the law is referring to a plural group.

The People.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects

You are again taking things out of context.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 465
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 1:42:02 PM   
InfoMan


Posts: 471
Joined: 2/20/2017
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

well what he is saying is 180 out from what the 4th means.

terry v ohio


And the point of this is what?

That you can seize an individual?
Yeah that is called Detainment or Arrest.

But you didn't say that - you said:


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

now thats interesting, if you dont own your 'person' who the fuck does?

Do you have any idea what that is even?




(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 466
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 2:11:50 PM   
Real0ne


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well you need to be able to add 1 + 1 and come up with 2 along with actually looking into the matter helps prevent you from looking not too bright.

You have a blood and breath private person, the name your mother gave you, you have your sole-corp, the name the gubmint gave you as part of your body politic franchise, and then you have any number of artificial persons known as joint corps, llc, assoc trusts etc. Lots of persons all over the place.


Lip service gives: The blood and breath private person the greatest level of security, the sole corp next, and last all the other persons you may have, which of course in todays world that pecking order has been all but reversed in the name of judge dredd and precrime theory.

yeh plural because you can have many persons, houses, effects, properties, all of which you are siezed and the proper title owner or holder. Its the states duty to protect property rights.

Does that help or you need me to crayola it more than that for you?


< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/27/2017 2:12:14 PM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to InfoMan)
Profile   Post #: 467
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 5:59:46 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

in fact the word 'person' is one of my favorite playgrounds because its one of the words that has been used to fuck us over, and illegally reduce our rights by none other than the corporation entrusted to defend our rights. the US.


Blackstone ridiculed what was done as much as he could without getting hung.

The king is, and ever has been, a corporation sole'; that corporation sole; a corporation is an artificial person that never dies 4; that is invisible, and exists only in intendment and consideration of law; that has no soul, and cannot therefore be summoned before an ecclesiastical court or subjected to spiritual censure; that can neither beat or be beaten in its body politic, nor commit treason or felony in its corporate capacity; that can suffer no corporal punishment or corruption of blood, and can neither be imprisoned or outlawed, its existence being merely ideal5. So far he will be satisfied that the King of England, as described in law books, is in some sense an ideal personage. It may be said, indeed, that the King is not more an ideal personage than a parson or other corporation sole; that it is merely the office, which is converted by a fiction of law into a person ; and that the object of this transmutation is to have the same identical rights kept on foot, and continued for ever by a succession of individuals, possessing the same privileges, and charged with the same duties. But, on reflection, it will appear that there but differ, is a wide difference between the King and other porpora- other corporations sole. Derations

' Blackstone, i. 271. iv. 2. 2 Ibid. i. 252. 257.
3 Ibid. i. 469. 472. 4 Ibid. i. 467, 468. 5 Ibid. i. 477. , . o i i o

There is therefore something higher, more mysterious,and more remote from reality, in the conception which the law of England forms of the King, than enters into Ideal theory the notion of a corporation sole.

The ideal King of the english common- law represents the power and majesty of the whole community. His fiat makes laws2. His sentence condemns. His judgments give property, and take it away. He is the state'. It is true, that in the exercise of these powers, the real King, to whom they are necessarily entrusted, is advised, directed, and controlled by others.

But in the contemplation of law the sovereignty and undivided power of the state are in the King.
' Attorney-General's Speech in Hardy's Trial. Howell's State Trials, xxiv. 246.

2 In an argument before the Court of King's Bench, in 23 Edw. III. it was said, " Que le roy fist les leis par assent dez peres et de la commune, et non pas lez peres et la commune." Y. B. 23 Edw. III. i. 3. b.

8 " The person of the king, in name, is the state.

He is to all intents and purposes the sole representative of the state." Solicitor-General's Speech in Hardy's Trial. Howell's State Trials, xxiv. 1183.

It is not my intention to dispute the truth or reality of this view of the constitution of England.



The difference of course and the fraud is that the king with his sole corp wont personally suffer since the distinction is upheld between 'the man' and 'the artifice', however for the rest of us that distinction between our sole corp shackles they placed around our ankles and the living (wo)/(man) is ignored and if you fight for it in court they will make sure you go to jail to shut you up. the sleight of hand with the lil ole word person is what splits the man and grants the gubmint title and legal jurisdiction over who and what owns your body, legal shackles. That is why they immediately made the slaves citizens of the federalgubmint since we cant have a bunch of black sovereigns running around now can we! Its a big club and you aint in it.



The conversion of rights of man equal to the state to privileges under the state.


Art. XIV. g 1. ""No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty or property, without due process of law."

That the first ten articles of amendment were not intended to limit the powers of the state governments in respect to their own people, but to operate on the National Government alone, was decided more than a half century ago, and that decision has been steadily adhered to since.

Hanson v. Baltimore, 32 U. S. 7 Pet. 243,247 [8:672,674];
Livingston v. Moore, Id. 469, 552 [8:751, 781];
Fox v. Ohio. 46 U. S. 6 How. 410, 434 [12: 213, 223];
Smith v. Maryland, 59 U. S. 18 How. 71, 76 [15: 26S, 2711;
Withers v. Buckley, 61 U. S. 20 How. 84, 91 [15:816, 819];
Pernear v.Commonwealth, 72 U. 8. 5 Wall. 475, 479 [18:608, 6091;
Twitchell v. Commonwealth, 74 U. 8. 7 Wall. 321, 325 [19:223, 224];
The Justices v. Murray, 76 U. S. 9 Wall. 274, 278 [19:658, 660];
Edicard» v. Elliott, 88 U. S. 21 Wall. 532, 557 [22:487, 4921;
Waller v. Sawinet, 92 U. S. 90 [23:678];
U. 8. v. Cruikshank, Id. 542, 552 [23: 588, 5911;
Pearson v. Tewdall, 95 U. S.294,296 [24:436,437];
Daridton v. New Orkan», 96 U. 8. 97, 101 124:616, 618];
Kelly v. Pittsburgh. 104 U. S. 79 [26: 658];
Presser v. Illinois, 116 U. S. 252, 265 Í29: 615, 619].

It was contended, however, in argument, that, "though originally the first ten amendments were adopted as limitations on federal power, yet in so far as they secure and recognize fundamental rights—common-law rights —of the man, they make them privileges and immunities of the man as a citizen of the United States, and cannot now be abridged by a State under the Fourteenth Amendment. In other words, while the ten amendments as limitations on power only apply to the Federal Government, and not to the States, yet in so far as they declare or recognize rights of persons, these rights are theirs, as citizens of the United States, and the Fourteenth Amendment as to such rights limits state power, as the ten amendments had limited federal power."

It is also contended that the provision of the Fourteenth Amendment which declares that no State shall deprive "any person of life, liberty, or property without due process of law" implies that every person charged with crime in a State shall be entitled to a trial by an impar [167] trial jury, and shall not be compelled to testify against himself.


and if you read that king part very carefully it will give you cluees to the origins of many other legal constructs that we take for granted, most of which are technically unconstitutional but work great for 'lording' over the masses and keepint them under da mobacracies thumb.





Oh they fuck ya to the left they fuck ya to the right, they fuck up they fuck ya down they fuck ya otta sight!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-diB65scQU


< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/27/2017 6:36:13 PM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to InfoMan)
Profile   Post #: 468
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/27/2017 6:21:24 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

'Secure in their persons'


and of course it never occured to you to think about why it is plural either did it



Everything is plural in the sentence.
This is because the law is referring to a plural group.

The People.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects

You are again taking things out of context.




You might want to educate yourself before spewing your puke all over the thread.

Heller:



1. Operative Clause.

a. "Right of the People." The first salient feature of the operative clause is that it codifies a "right of the people." The unamended Constitution and the Bill of Rights use the phrase "right of the people" two other times, in the First Amendment's Assembly-and-Petition Clause and in the Fourth Amendment's Search-and-Seizure Clause. The Ninth Amendment uses very similar terminology ("The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people"). All three of these instances unambiguously refer to individual rights, not "collective" rights, or rights that may be exercised only through participation in some corporate body.[5]

Three provisions of the Constitution refer to "the people" in a context other than "rights"—the famous preamble ("We the people"), § 2 of Article I (providing that "the people" will choose members of the House), and the Tenth Amendment (providing that those powers not given the Federal Government remain with "the States" or "the people"). Those provisions arguably refer to "the people" acting collectively—but they deal with the exercise or reservation of powers, not rights. Nowhere else in the Constitution does a "right" attributed to "the people" refer to anything other than an individual right.[6]




anything else you would like to tell us about the cosntitution today?

yep snotty has you by the balls


Oh and since we are having so much fun with law toady, who can find in that tiny excerpt where the court is fucking lying through its teeth to impress readers the state grants us rights instead of the fact we reserved our rights from state oversight? Sneaky bastards. Anyone






< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/27/2017 6:28:27 PM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to InfoMan)
Profile   Post #: 469
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 5:26:05 AM   
InfoMan


Posts: 471
Joined: 2/20/2017
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

'Secure in their persons'


and of course it never occured to you to think about why it is plural either did it



Everything is plural in the sentence.
This is because the law is referring to a plural group.

The People.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects

You are again taking things out of context.




You might want to educate yourself before spewing your puke all over the thread.

Heller:



1. Operative Clause.

a. "Right of the People." The first salient feature of the operative clause is that it codifies a "right of the people." The unamended Constitution and the Bill of Rights use the phrase "right of the people" two other times, in the First Amendment's Assembly-and-Petition Clause and in the Fourth Amendment's Search-and-Seizure Clause. The Ninth Amendment uses very similar terminology ("The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people"). All three of these instances unambiguously refer to individual rights, not "collective" rights, or rights that may be exercised only through participation in some corporate body.[5]

Three provisions of the Constitution refer to "the people" in a context other than "rights"—the famous preamble ("We the people"), § 2 of Article I (providing that "the people" will choose members of the House), and the Tenth Amendment (providing that those powers not given the Federal Government remain with "the States" or "the people"). Those provisions arguably refer to "the people" acting collectively—but they deal with the exercise or reservation of powers, not rights. Nowhere else in the Constitution does a "right" attributed to "the people" refer to anything other than an individual right.[6]




anything else you would like to tell us about the cosntitution today?

yep snotty has you by the balls


Oh and since we are having so much fun with law toady, who can find in that tiny excerpt where the court is fucking lying through its teeth to impress readers the state grants us rights instead of the fact we reserved our rights from state oversight? Sneaky bastards. Anyone




So are you saying that Papers, Houses, and Effects are 'Rights' now?
And not the act of having them or using them - But the Objects themselves are by definition 'Rights'.

Because that is what you're attempting to say in the language you're using.

That because Heller said:
Nowhere else in the Constitution does a "right" attributed to "the people" refer to anything other than an individual right.

Then obviously when talking about Objects such as Papers or Arms - such as seen in the 2nd and 4th Amendments - those things are Individual Rights.


This willful ignorance you display about everything just to be argumentative is just taxing.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 470
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 5:28:54 AM   
InfoMan


Posts: 471
Joined: 2/20/2017
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

well you need to be able to add 1 + 1 and come up with 2 along with actually looking into the matter helps prevent you from looking not too bright.

You have a blood and breath private person, the name your mother gave you, you have your sole-corp, the name the gubmint gave you as part of your body politic franchise, and then you have any number of artificial persons known as joint corps, llc, assoc trusts etc. Lots of persons all over the place.


Lip service gives: The blood and breath private person the greatest level of security, the sole corp next, and last all the other persons you may have, which of course in todays world that pecking order has been all but reversed in the name of judge dredd and precrime theory.

yeh plural because you can have many persons, houses, effects, properties, all of which you are siezed and the proper title owner or holder. Its the states duty to protect property rights.

Does that help or you need me to crayola it more than that for you?



Considering that you read at a level that you may as well be using a crayon... go ahead, 'crayola' everything up.
Papers are Rights now according to your ignorance and illiteracy.

so, please continue to explain how you are obviously correct in your ignorance by taking things out of context, referencing Single lines in statements, and not being able to read complete sentences. As taxing as it is, it is funny to see how stupid you are.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 471
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 11:23:57 AM   
WickedsDesire


Posts: 9362
Joined: 11/4/2015
Status: offline
reduce our rights

Perhaps there is hope for you after all.

Although I did admire the humour implying the brain dead zombies had any rights left.

Now, who is they and why?

_____________________________

wE arE tHe voiCes,
We SAtuRaTe yOur aLPHA brain WAveS, ThIs is nOt A DrEAm The wiZaRd of Oz, shoES, CaLcuLUs, DECorAtiNG, FrIDGE SProcKeTs, be VeRy sCareDed – SLoBbers,We DeEManDErs Sloowee DAnCiNG, SmOOches – whisper whisper & CaAkEE

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 472
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 11:35:03 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
hope for me? LOL
I am the one who posted the creemee supremees dicta explaining to disinfo tard boy how snotty handed him his ass, that the forth is an individual not a right restricted to a group.
There may be hope for disinfo tard however since when he realiazed how stoopid he looks he did eventually come to that conclusion, unfortunately not before I stuck it square up his ass.


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to WickedsDesire)
Profile   Post #: 473
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 11:58:50 AM   
InfoMan


Posts: 471
Joined: 2/20/2017
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

hope for me? LOL
I am the one who posted the creemee supremees dicta explaining to disinfo tard boy how snotty handed him his ass, that the forth is an individual not a right restricted to a group.
There may be hope for disinfo tard however since when he realiazed how stoopid he looks he did eventually come to that conclusion, unfortunately not before I stuck it square up his ass.



By taking things horribly out of context, showing a complete lack of understanding of the English Language bordering on illiteracy, and an unbridled determination to argue for the sake of arguing regardless of how ignorant it makes you.

Oh you sure did show me!

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 474
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 12:03:26 PM   
WhoreMods


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Joined: 5/6/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

hope for me? LOL

You're quite right: he's fooling himself. There is no hope for you. The jewish conspiracy, and its nigger slaves are going to get you (and your dad).


_____________________________

On the level and looking for a square deal.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 475
RE: BLM NOT SO MUCH - 5/28/2017 1:39:04 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: InfoMan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

hope for me? LOL
I am the one who posted the creemee supremees dicta explaining to disinfo tard boy how snotty handed him his ass, that the forth is an individual not a right restricted to a group.
There may be hope for disinfo tard however since when he realiazed how stoopid he looks he did eventually come to that conclusion, unfortunately not before I stuck it square up his ass.



By taking things horribly out of context, showing a complete lack of understanding of the English Language bordering on illiteracy, and an unbridled determination to argue for the sake of arguing regardless of how ignorant it makes you.

Oh you sure did show me!




snotty actually deserves the credit, I just did a better job articulating your fuck up, the same fuckup many other constitutional tards make when they think the right to bear arms is restricted to a 'group', the militia rather than an individual right. Oh and having the the scrotus dicta handy that spells it out for you idgits is convenient as well. Now if you hadnt called me names I would have simply dropped it, but since you want to piss against the wind I am more than happy to insure you get a good shower.


Now before I forget for those into advanced legal and it doesnt look like anyone here is.....regarding the bullshit the court pulls to push their unconstitutional progression of the state as dictatorial overlords the answer to the question:

quote:

Oh and since we are having so much fun with law toady, who can find in that tiny excerpt where the court is fucking lying through its teeth to impress readers the state grants us rights instead of the fact we reserved our rights from state oversight? Sneaky bastards. Anyone


Where they said:


The first salient feature of the operative clause is that it codifies a "right of the people."


That is total bullshit, it codifies nothing, congress and legislatures codify, what it actually does is memorializes (iow-records) the elements the rights we reserved to ourselves and the state agreed to in the contract. The difference, codify is state, reserved right is people, and the word people means individually when used in this sense, not group or plural for all the commie tards who think nothing exists without permission from some 'group'. I digress.




_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to InfoMan)
Profile   Post #: 476
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