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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:35:30 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

That said, there's a pretty big difference between speeding and invading a country


The first tends to lead to accidents and kill people; the second doesn't ...?

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:37:54 PM   
DaddySatyr


Posts: 9381
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From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

That said, there's a pretty big difference between speeding and invading a country


The first tends to lead to accidents and kill people; the second doesn't ...?


Kate Steinle would disagree, but ask her family members. They're still alive.





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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:40:16 PM   
MasterDrakk


Posts: 321
Status: offline 		https://cis.org/Vaughan/Waiting-List-Legal-Immigrant-Visas-Keeps-Growing

its just not a priority, we need the wall to keep them in.

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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:42:11 PM   
WinsomeDefiance


Posts: 6719
Joined: 8/7/2007
Status: offline 		I don't think America allows for dual citizenship. With family ties and perhaps other complications (like land or whatnot), it may have been a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" scenario.

My brother in law is from Russia, he had to denounce his ties/citizenship to Russia and undergo years of jumping through hoops and meeting qualifications to become a citizen of America.

I don't know what the qualification are for a green card, but as they were already here and over a decade it had worked, I'm guessing the general consensus was to not rock the boat.

That's my guess.

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:48:16 PM   
Wayward5oul


Posts: 3314
Joined: 11/9/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
Illegal aliens broke the law, just by dint of how they got here. We don't need to import criminals.


Anybody who drives breaks the law every day, by dint of doing 36mph in a 35 zone. (Business Law 101.)

We are a nation of criminals.





Entering the US illegally is a crime punishable by no more than 6 months in prison however the vast majority of undocumented workers in this country are here as a result of overstaying visas which is not a crime, but rather a civil offense. Unlawful presence does not make one a criminal.

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:50:37 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
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Its not up to the "TPS ers" to change the status of temporary.
Trump just did.
He's cleaning out refugees, and other brown groups...simple, like it or not.
Im ambivalent, because of the dangers in el salvador, and so many are kids who arent eligible to do anything about their situation.
Previous TPS ers were promised there would be a way to citizenship, but it didnt pass.


PS regarding sponsoring an employee, not as simple or cheap as it sounds.
https://resources.lawinfo.com/immigration/how-can-i-help-my-employee-become-a-us-resi.html

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 2:57:41 PM   
ThatDizzyChick


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Citizenship is slavery.

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 3:03:50 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterDrakk
circular argument, nope. And thats one parent what about the other? But the law was, as long as your nose is clean, you can stay. (sort of like the takeback coming on taxes) it sunsets, and if congress doesnt do anything.......


Then why did it have to be renewed every 18 months? You do know what TPS stands for, right?



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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 3:32:14 PM   
Edwird


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick
FR
Citizenship is slavery.


Ain't it, though.

Real one says likewise, and I'm not far behind him on that point, whatever his other wackiness.

But just out of curiosity; if that's your estimation, then why do you advocate communism?

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 3:36:38 PM   
Edwird


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterDrakk
circular argument, nope. And thats one parent what about the other? But the law was, as long as your nose is clean, you can stay. (sort of like the takeback coming on taxes) it sunsets, and if congress doesnt do anything.......


Then why did it have to be renewed every 18 months? You do know what TPS stands for, right?


Just like we know what "Temporary assistance" to the banks meant 8 yrs. ago, right? The US Treasury had hankies at the ready, to make sure the bankers' noses were clean.



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Profile   Post #: 30
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 3:49:22 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterDrakk
circular argument, nope. And thats one parent what about the other? But the law was, as long as your nose is clean, you can stay. (sort of like the takeback coming on taxes) it sunsets, and if congress doesnt do anything.......

Then why did it have to be renewed every 18 months? You do know what TPS stands for, right?

Just like we know what "Temporary assistance" to the banks meant 8 yrs. ago, right? The US Treasury had hankies at the ready, to make sure the bankers' noses were clean.


Are you in favor of temporary meaning temporary?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 4:07:52 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		I am usually a social liberal but I have to agree with the OP and DaddySatyr on this. I am not against immigration and believe illegal immigrants are not necessarily criminals are bad people. But... there have been several chances for these people to apply for citizenship and if they made no attempt to do so then they should forfeit there right for residency. The only difference is I would require a registration and a way to apply for some small amount additional time to arrange their own transportation.

Butch

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RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 4:31:59 PM   
Edwird


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Are you in favor of temporary meaning temporary?


I am in favor of productive and contributing members of society being accommodated in that endeavor.

All this hoo-hah about legalization, "temporary status," etc. is meaningless as far as what is good for economy and country.

Consider the legal temporary status of politicians, in that capacity, vs. temporary status of immigrants in their contribution. Who does more harm vs. more good in the USA?

That's what I go by, if I care anything about my country.

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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 4:35:20 PM   
Edwird


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I am usually a social liberal but I have to agree with the OP and DaddySatyr on this. I am not against immigration and believe illegal immigrants are not necessarily criminals are bad people. But...
Butch


Then you are in fact not with daddysap at all.

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 4:41:26 PM   
Wayward5oul


Posts: 3314
Joined: 11/9/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I am usually a social liberal but I have to agree with the OP and DaddySatyr on this. I am not against immigration and believe illegal immigrants are not necessarily criminals are bad people. But... there have been several chances for these people to apply for citizenship and if they made no attempt to do so then they should forfeit there right for residency. The only difference is I would require a registration and a way to apply for some small amount additional time to arrange their own transportation.

Butch

But have they been given chances to apply for citizenship? After reading up on the link Lucy posted, it seems doing it through employee sponsorship is very limited, and contrary to popular belief people with children born here do get deported.

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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 4:50:11 PM   
Edwird


Posts: 3558
Joined: 5/2/2016
Status: offline 		I already made a post a couple of weeks ago about Trump trying to make it even more difficult to apply for citizenship, links and the whole shebang.

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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 10:13:38 PM   
DaddySatyr


Posts: 9381
Joined: 8/29/2011
From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance

I don't think America allows for dual citizenship. With family ties and perhaps other complications (like land or whatnot), it may have been a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" scenario.

My brother in law is from Russia, he had to denounce his ties/citizenship to Russia and undergo years of jumping through hoops and meeting qualifications to become a citizen of America.

I don't know what the qualification are for a green card, but as they were already here and over a decade it had worked, I'm guessing the general consensus was to not rock the boat.

That's my guess.


I am 99.9% positive that the U.S. does allow dual citizenship. In fact, I almost never gamble, but I'd bet a whole $1 that I am correct. But it is a bit complicated:

The U.S. has taken no official position on in-coming immigrants/potential naturalized citizens as far as those people retaining citizenship in other countries, when they become naturalized, here.

I believe that is a mistake and the government should take a position on the issue. I believe it stems from the whole "citizen of the world" mentality, but even if it doesn't, it makes no sense, to me.

This is extremely relevant when one realizes what the oath of naturalization says:

quote:


"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty, of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God."


How the U.S. canNOT take a position is kind of silly, except they have no authority over how the immigrant's home country('s/ies') views the in-coming immigrant.

It's insanity, on its face.





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Screen captures (and pissing on shadows) still RULE! Ya feel me?

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 10:47:12 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

they arent illegal



they were here on a "temporary" immigration program, the key operative word being "temporary."


You know, kinda like temporary house guests that over stay their welcome?

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/9/2018 10:59:40 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance

I don't think America allows for dual citizenship. With family ties and perhaps other complications (like land or whatnot), it may have been a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" scenario.

My brother in law is from Russia, he had to denounce his ties/citizenship to Russia and undergo years of jumping through hoops and meeting qualifications to become a citizen of America.

I don't know what the qualification are for a green card, but as they were already here and over a decade it had worked, I'm guessing the general consensus was to not rock the boat.

That's my guess.



The United States does not formally recognize dual citizenship. However, it also has not taken any stand against it, either legally or politically. Typically, no American will forfeit his or her citizenship by undertaking the responsibilities of citizenship in another country.
Dual Citizenship - FindLaw
immigration.findlaw.com/citizenship/dual-citizenship.html



quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

FR
Its not up to the "TPS ers" to change the status of temporary.
Trump just did.
He's cleaning out refugees, and other brown groups...simple, like it or not.
Im ambivalent, because of the dangers in el salvador, and so many are kids who arent eligible to do anything about their situation.
Previous TPS ers were promised there would be a way to citizenship, but it didnt pass.


PS regarding sponsoring an employee, not as simple or cheap as it sounds.
https://resources.lawinfo.com/immigration/how-can-i-help-my-employee-become-a-us-resi.html



Actually, lucy, there are ways to citizenship for TIP residents, especially if they had children born in the US.

And the TIP program was never meant to be a lifetime stay in the US when it was established, Congress extended the deadline on a few occasions.

And the numbers quoted in the story covered all people here under that program, some being here since the 1990's.


And the law in question was part of the Immigration Act of 1990, P.L. 101-649, Congress established a procedure by which the Attorney General may provide temporary protected status to immigrants in the United States who are temporarily unable to safely return to their home country because of ongoing armed conflict, an environmental disaster, or other extraordinary and temporary conditions.

Those affected are 2500 from Nicaragua, 263,280 from El Salvador, and 45000 from Haiti, and 86000 from Honduras.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

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(in reply to WinsomeDefiance)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: So, instead of trying to become citizens they just ... - 1/10/2018 1:24:31 AM   
Edwird


Posts: 3558
Joined: 5/2/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
Pretty sweeping generalization, there.


It's how our president got elected. Just going with the flow, here.

quote:

That said, there's a pretty big difference between speeding and invading a country,


Indeed. There are actually a few who don't speed, but there is no one on this continent originating from Europe who isn't an invader.

So . . .

Once the immigration rules are enforced to the letter, I'm looking at having to move back to either somewhere just south of Leeds (UK) or somewhere in County Limerick (Ireland), how 'bout you?

Meanwhile, I keep digging further back into the family tree hoping I come upon some place in southern France or Vienna, Austria.






< Message edited by Edwird -- 1/10/2018 1:25:23 AM >

(in reply to DaddySatyr)
Profile   Post #: 40
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