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Israel is "now at war" - 10/8/2023 9:04:36 AM

wickedsdesires

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After the fall of the ottoman empire Zionists were offered a homeland in Africa by the British. They refused and claimed "ancestral homeland" we would like to go there. Despite it already been occupied by an eclectic mix of religion's, including Jews, who seemly all got along before the formation of the Zionist state. The State was originally split almost equally, into 2 equal parts 50-50. Since 1967 Israel has systematically seized: the capital, Holy sites, fertile land, all drinking water, resources and effectively controls all access of that to Palestine, including power, food, aid and the likes.

The Gaza Strip is one of the most densely populated areas in the world and has been under a blockade for 16 years, preventing civilians from leaving. Since 2008, Première Urgence Internationale teams have been working tirelessly to ensure access to essential services for the civilian population of Gaza.

It is effectively a concentration camp.

Post #: 1

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 10/8/2023 1:04:17 PM

JVoV

Posts: 3617
Joined: 3/9/2015
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I would have expected rockets and tanks, given the thread title. But this seems like standard European antisemim. Quite hypocritical, considering the history of any other country.

The Holy Land of 3 major religions is there. I don't believe OpIsrael's leaders do everything perfectly, and the Palestinians absolutely deserve a homeland that is safe. But so do the Israelis.

What a dumb place to put a bunch of Jews anyway. It's too damn hot.

< Message edited by JVoV -- 10/8/2023 1:21:54 PM >

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 2

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 10/8/2023 6:10:32 PM

wickedsdesires

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> I would have expected rockets and tanks, given the thread title. But this seems like standard European antisemim. Quite hypocritical, considering the history of any other country.

I am at a loss?

Theodor Herzl
Austrian Zionist leader?

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Theodor-Herzl

I have been known to scorch earth

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodor_Herzl

Dumb immigrant American of hate

(in reply to JVoV)

Post #: 3

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 10/9/2023 1:56:27 AM

JVoV

Posts: 3617
Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online

Name calling isn't really the best way to make friends.

I can trace my maternal line back to the Mayflowerhere in America and we've been in Florida for 9 generations. So the term immigrant really isn't accurate.

The use of the word Zionist is key to understanding the context. A point about a country's leadership decisions can be made without the need for anything else.

I'm not sure what you're accusing me of hating.

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 4

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 10/10/2023 9:43:59 AM

wickedsdesires

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Joined: 10/25/2008
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Gaza is a concentration camp. They are treated worse than animals in the over crowded cage that is Gaza. Many countries have appealed to Israel to stop treating them as subhuman. As defined by the UN the belligerent Israel is committing war crimes for decades. That is not Antisemitism. Gaza has been reliant on international aid for long as I can remember. Gaza has been walled in and aid, food, medicine and power are controlled by Israel.

Israeli settlements or colonies are civilian communities where Israeli citizens live, almost exclusively of Jewish ethnicity, built on lands occupied by Israel since the Six-Day War in 1967. The international community consider Israeli settlements to be illegal under international law, though Israel disputes this.

As of January 2023, there are 144 Israeli settlements in the West Bank, including 12 in East Jerusalem. In addition, there are over 100 Israeli illegal outposts in the West Bank. In total, over 450,000 Israeli settlers live in the West Bank excluding East Jerusalem, with an additional 220,000 Jewish settlers residing in East Jerusalem. Additionally, over 25,000 Israeli settlers live in the Golan Heights. They have also stolen the best land and resource rich land.

The creation of new Palestine or Israel was perceived behind pure Zionist Ideology. It has existed less than 100 years. I wonder if many Jews can trace their ancestry back there. In a way we can all trace our ancestry back to probably Africa, or Adam and eve and the likes if you believe in that shit.

You can also argue the orange loon was partly responsible for this not those mistreated caged animals or Iran.

Impressive you can trace your ancetry back to the ENGLISH mayflour.

It will be interesting to see if America gives Israel aid and not Ukraine. You have some double standards going on over there (fucked up understatement) and that is me omitting the replacement theory from this comment. I don't hate you or really anyone out with the likes of Putin, Trump, Vlad etc and their fans.

Neither am I using those tortured subhumans were justified in their appalling actions. Subhuman will explain why many of them had been radicalized to that extent and you can use that well worn argument through the ages of Revolution and for the likes of the Rise of Trump although that one is down to hate and bigotry, in the main.

(in reply to JVoV)

Post #: 5

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/11/2024 3:57:57 PM

JVoV

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Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online

South Africa has gone to the ICJ to accuse Israel of genocide. The UN's International Court of Justice hardly seems adequate, without the US stepping in anymore, but if the US steps in, it generally isn't in court.

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 6

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/13/2024 8:03:56 AM

torturedfacepillow

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The United Nations is an American organization, to fraud Britain on education standards, Russia on mercantile standards, and China on committee standards.

It's an old Oppenheimer model, called "Smear the Queer", the Model United Nations, Taiwan as China; the Security Council.

You're supposed to spend cheap, not frugal, and throw away food you can't eat, for the rats, not the nigrish, the cats and dogs.

Otherwise, you get nuked.

(in reply to JVoV)

Post #: 7

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/13/2024 2:07:04 PM

MasterJaguar01

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quote:

ORIGINAL: torturedfacepillow

The United Nations is an American organization, to fraud Britain on education standards, Russia on mercantile standards, and China on committee standards.

It's an old Oppenheimer model, called "Smear the Queer", the Model United Nations, Taiwan as China; the Security Council.

You're supposed to spend cheap, not frugal, and throw away food you can't eat, for the rats, not the nigrish, the cats and dogs.

Otherwise, you get nuked.

The United Nations is actually an organization designed by a small group of Abyssinian asses. They are wild African asses. They formed this organization to protect their homeland. You should eat lots of fresh Pomelos drizzled with dijon mustard.

(in reply to torturedfacepillow)

Post #: 8

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/13/2024 4:03:17 PM

MasterJaguar01

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wickedsdesires

After the fall of the ottoman empire Zionists were offered a homeland in Africa by the British. They refused and claimed "ancestral homeland" we would like to go there.

The British didn't just OFFER a homeland in Africa.
Theodore Herzl of the Zionist Congress made the request of the British back in 1903 to occupy part of Uganda. It was a horribly stupid idea, and he realized it after visiting there. This was back in 1903!

quote:

Despite it already been occupied by an eclectic mix of religion's, including Jews, who seemly all got along before the formation of the Zionist state. The State was originally split almost equally, into 2 equal parts 50-50.

Yes, this is an accurate description of the 1947 UN Resolution.

quote:

Since 1967 Israel has systematically seized: the capital, Holy sites, fertile land, all drinking water, resources and effectively controls all access of that to Palestine, including power, food, aid and the likes.

True, but you leave out the fact, as soon as Israel declared independence in 1948, they were attacked by local Arabs, and then armies from Egypt, Jordan, Iraq, Styria, and Lebanon.

Also, following this war, and the armistice that followed, the Arabs in Palestine could have declared an independent Arab state as the Jews had done with their territory, but were told NOT to by the local Arab nations, until the Arabs had wiped the Jewish state off the map. (Also left out)

And you leave out the 1967 Six-Day war, in which Israel was attacked by Egypt, Syria, Jordan, and Iraq. The Egyptians were using the Gaza strip as a launch point for tanks and artillery assault into Israel, and the Syrians were firing artillery from the Golan Heights. For these reasons, Israel seized part of the West Bank as a security buffer, and the Golan heights and Gaza.

These territories were not "systematically seized", but rather seized as a response to an Arab effort to annihilate the state.

And then you leave out the 1973 Yom Kippur War where Egypt and Syria attack Israel.

Of course you leave out the Black September movement, and the PLO, the string of airplane hijackings by the PLO (keep in mind the PLO IS the Palestinian government at the time), then of course, Entebbe, and lets not forget the Munich Olympics!

Then we get to the Camp David accords, in which Egypt participated in a peace deal with Israel (and has lasted to this day), where the Arabs in Palestine would have full autonomy in the West Bank and Gaza within 5 years, and could pursue statehood IF they renounced terrorism. The five years passed. The PLO never renounced terrorism, and Israel kept grabbing more land in the West Bank.

Then you leave out the 1988 Intifada, in which Palestinian Arabs were killing Israelis with firearms and rocks, and the year Hamas was born.

Then we have Oslo and Oslo II, which identified territory for a Palestinian state.

The Palestinian Authority was formed. The Palestinians had a police force (trained by Israelis), documented governing laws, a capital in Ramallah. (And they got Gaza back)

Oslo fell apart with Rabin assassinated, the Israeli government exacerbating the problem by continuing grabbing more land in the West Bank.
Hamas was using Gaza as a military fortress, smuggling arms in from Egypt and other countries, continuously launching attacks and killing Israelis.

The constant importing of guns and rockets by Hamas into Gaza caused the Israelis to blockade it, further turning it into the shithole it has become.

Then of course the Palestinian Legislative Council elections!!!! Hamas, a KNOWN terrorist organization got more votes than Fatah, the party working on a sovereign Palestinian state. Because they could not agree on how to share power, Fatah (the Palestinian Authority) governed the West Bank, and Hamas governed Gaza (as was the residents' CHOICE!!!!)

The PA built the West Bank into a respectable Arab territory (hopefully soon to be a state) with a capital in Ramallah. Hamas turned Gaza into the horrible shithole it has become. They turned the schools into anti-semitic propaganda houses. They clamped down on any innovation and much entrepreneurship. They built their terrorist headquarters underneath a hospital. A gainst the Geneva convention, they launch deadly rocket attacks from the center of urban civilian areas, using the residents, and HOSPITAL PATIENTS as human shields. As a result, it is way overcrowded, and there is not much economic activity. Compared to Gaza, the West Bank is a paradise. People live in a blockaded strip of land (thanks to Hamas) and are fed a constant stream of anti-semitic propaganda by their government, who to this day doesn't give a shit about them, and uses them as human shields when they launch deadly attacks to kill people.

quote:

The Gaza Strip is one of the most densely populated areas in the world and has been under a blockade for 16 years, preventing civilians from leaving.

1. Yes one of the mose densely populated
2. Under a blockade (thanks to Hamas, the government of Gaza)
3. Not preventing anyone from leaving. Gazan Palestinians have been coming and going for decades. That is just false.

quote:

It is effectively a concentration camp.

This is just absurd. I have visited a concentration camp (in Dachau). Nothing in Gaza even slightly resembles any concentration camp.
This is a nonsensical statement.

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 9

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/14/2024 6:15:54 AM

wickedsdesires

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That was pretty impressive, no promises I wont thieve chunks.

1967 was a first strike by Israel.
Israel was out gunned and trigger happy, hence the first strike and let god worry about the mayhem and who carried out the first strike later. They were highly trained and yet honed their training further, being able to run 3 sorties a day, fuel, maintenance, and ordnance. Versus the Arab world, who could manage one a day, if that. It may have even been 1 week. The arab planes were out in the open, parked ducks.
1967 USS Liberty incident, six day war, was when Israel tried to blow the USS Liberty to kingdom come. The combined air and sea attack killed 34 crew members (naval officers, seamen, two marines, and one civilian NSA employee), wounded 171 crew members, and severely damaged the ship. At the time, the ship was in international waters. Fair game for the Israelis.

Was it Uganda. I guess the JOA Jewish Autonomous Oblast, Russia was too cold for the picky zionists.

Gaza I have heard it was nice. Just one big bomb crater filled with rubble and bodies of innocent children, women, men, and 6 hamas.
My definition of a concentration camp. Under siege and blockade meets my criteria :(

Israel was responsible for the Rise of Hamas and the assignation of their own PM Yitzack Rabin. They even funded Hamas, purpose being to destroy, or weaken PA, and end the Oslo accords. I never looked at the result but Hamas did not receive 50% and as you know half of Gaza was under 18 when Hamas came to power. Hamas did start of as credible and peaceful in the 1980s. Hamas doesn't even have 40,000 troopers. 10,000 at most. The other 30K will manage gov, edu, proganda, brainwashing. yes, they are extreme radicalized now.

Over the last 100 years Israel purpose has always been to reset and key backwards the potential of Palestinians while nicking more of their land. 8 million Palestinians cannot go home. I am one of a handful of people I have seen still favouring a one state solution.

Israel is worse than Hamas. The figures speak for themselves. Israel have come full circle since the Nazis and then some. Nazis started by herding them into an area/district. After that they went full hitler and goebbels on them trying to wiping them from the face of the planet. there are uncanny similarities
In 1947, dunno much about, but I believe the Jews turned on everyone even us the UK and we tossed it to the UN to fix.

I wouldn't like to hazard a guess at the number of UN rulings made against Israel.
Hamas are evil animals
Jews, you know the ones I mean - right wing Zionists types, are barbaric animals.

preventing civilians from leaving? How many have left? Do you mean for cheap labour, marry jewish, rejected citizen ship and votes.

Hamas is not Gaza. It never was. It is like blaming Russian and north Koreans for being under the thumb of mad dictators.

The blocked is illegal no matter how you look at it (UN ruled on it too). It includes water and air. Or 7 miles of the coast if your going to be pedantic on details.

25,000 dead and 50,000 injured Gaza's, at least. That would equate to 100,000 dead Israelis and 200,000 injured. I watched the jews use that logic with 9/11 on the first few days of their annihaltion of Gaza.

The attacks on schools residential are deliberate. One reason they will pretend to use - hopefully Gaza will overthrow Hamas.

Israel had no interest in peace, two state solution, they never did. 1947 sums it up aptly and they now have the most right wing government they have ever had. They would nuke Gaza if they could but with the fallout they wouldn't be able to move in for a few thousands years. There position on settlements and ever expanding them tells the same story.

Do you have a solution or ideas?

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 10

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/14/2024 8:12:33 AM

MasterJaguar01

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Joined: 12/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wickedsdesires

1967 was a first strike by Israel.

Israel was out gunned and trigger happy, hence the first strike and let god worry about the mayhem and who carried out the first strike later. They were highly trained and yet honed their training further, being able to run 3 sorties a day, fuel, maintenance, and ordnance. Versus the Arab world, who could manage one a day, if that. It may have even been 1 week. The arab planes were out in the open, parked ducks.

Ummm NO. Nasser had closed the Gulf of Aqaba, blockading Israeli shipping. Nasser was trigger happy and wanting0 to demonstrate to the Arab world how tough he could be on Israel. He then demanded that the UN remove its forces from the Egypt-Israeli border.. Mossad intelligence determined Nassar was already planning an air and land attack across the border

quote:

1967 USS Liberty incident, six day war, was when Israel tried to blow the USS Liberty to kingdom come. The combined air and sea attack killed 34 crew members (naval officers, seamen, two marines, and one civilian NSA employee), wounded 171 crew members, and severely damaged the ship. At the time, the ship was in international waters. Fair game for the Israelis.

The Liberty incident is a tragedy and a mystery. Israel compensated the families of the fallen crew.

quote:

Was it Uganda. I guess the JOA Jewish Autonomous Oblast, Russia was too cold for the picky zionists.

Yes, it was Uganda.

quote:

Gaza I have heard it was nice. Just one big bomb crater filled with rubble and bodies of innocent children, women, men, and 6 hamas.
My definition of a concentration camp. Under siege and blockade meets my criteria :(

Sad, but accurate description of Gaza. But nothing like a concentration camp.

quote:

Israel was responsible for the Rise of Hamas and the assignation of their own PM Yitzack Rabin. They even funded Hamas, purpose being to destroy, or weaken PA, and end the Oslo accords.

This is 100% true and tragic.

quote:

Israel is worse than Hamas.

Israel does not set out to slaughter innocent civilians. Hamas does.
Israel does not toss military grenades into a crowded room of hiding civilians. Hamas does.
Israel does not behead women, children, and infants. Hamas does.
Israel does not capture and rape random civilians. Hamas does.
Israel does not fire automatic weapons at fleeing unarmed random civilians. Hamas does.
Israel does not take civilian hostages and use them as bargaining chips. Hamas does.
Israel does not launch military operations from densely populated civilian areas, using their own citizenry as human shields. Hamas does.
Israel does not kidnap, rape and torture and eventually kill their own citizens they suspect are not sufficiently loyal. Hamas does.
Israel cares about and protects its citizens. Hamas does not do the same for its citizens.

quote:

The figures speak for themselves.

Sure. But they are far from telling the whole story. See above.

quote:

Israel have come full circle since the Nazis and then some. Nazis started by herding them into an area/district. After that they went full hitler and goebbels on them trying to wiping them from the face of the planet. there are uncanny similarities
In 1947, dunno much about, but I believe the Jews turned on everyone even us the UK and we tossed it to the UN to fix.

Israel has been behaving badly, with their annexation of land, and bulldozing Arab homes. As horrible as that is. It is not even CLOSE to what the Nazis did. It is an uninformed opinion worthy of the nonsense spewed on college campuses today.

Yes the Jews turned against the UK, as did the entire Arab world for taking over the middle east during WWI, and creating countries out of thin air, and putting in puppet leaders who would support British and US oil interests. The Jews wanted an independent state in the area of ancient Palestine, which the British called "Palestine". The Arabs living there COULD have wanted one as well. But the Arab states told them to hold off, while they militarily obliterated the Jews, and then they can have the land all the way to the sea.

quote:

I wouldn't like to hazard a guess at the number of UN rulings made against Israel.
Hamas are evil animals
Jews, you know the ones I mean - right wing Zionists types, are barbaric animals.

Yes. I know the ones you mean. They have sinned against G-d.

quote:

preventing civilians from leaving? How many have left? Do you mean for cheap labour, marry jewish, rejected citizen ship and votes.

Prior to 10/7/23, Gaza residents (with proper documentation) came and went all the time.

quote:

Hamas is not Gaza. It never was. It is like blaming Russian and north Koreans for being under the thumb of mad dictators.

The majority of Russians did not vote for Putin. No one voted for Kim Jong Un. The residents of Gaza VOTED for Hamas, and did NOTHING for decades to remove them for decades.

quote:

The blocked is illegal no matter how you look at it (UN ruled on it too). It includes water and air. Or 7 miles of the coast if your going to be pedantic on details.

Not sure that is true, as Hamas has been smuggling arms in from all over the world, in violation of the agreement that gave them control in the first place. Even with the blockaded, Iran has been arming them to the teeth.

quote:

25,000 dead and 50,000 injured Gaza's, at least. That would equate to 100,000 dead Israelis and 200,000 injured. I watched the jews use that logic with 9/11 on the first few days of their annihaltion of Gaza.

This is a horrible tragedy caused by Hamas. If Hamas REALLY gave a shit about Palestinians, they would surrender and release the hostages IMMEDIATELY. But they don't.

quote:

The attacks on schools residential are deliberate. One reason they will pretend to use - hopefully Gaza will overthrow Hamas.

That is because Hamas DELIBERATELY uses schools and residential areas as hideouts and the children as human shields.

quote:

Israel had no interest in peace, two state solution, they never did. 1947 sums it up aptly and they now have the most right wing government they have ever had. They would nuke Gaza if they could but with the fallout they wouldn't be able to move in for a few thousands years. There position on settlements and ever expanding them tells the same story.

Rabin had that interest.

quote:

Do you have a solution or ideas?

YES. Israel needs a leader like Tzipi Livni. Had she been Prime Minister instead of Netanyahu...

1. There would be a sovereign Palestinian Arab state with its capital in Ramallah, and a covered bridge connector to Gaza.
2. Hamas would be a fringe kook organization like the KKK

As the extreme right wing dies off in Israel, and the country votes in a competent leader, coupled with a strong leader in the US, and perhaps the UK, we can see the natural progression from Oslo and Oslo II to a full Palestinian state, accountable for its actions.

As SOON as Hamas is eliminated and hostages are free, Israel needs to:

1. Boot Netanyahu out the door
1a. Elect a leader like Tzipi Livni
2. Work with Palestinian leader to rebuild and strengthen the PA
3. Begin autonomy for the newly reformed PA to govern the West Bank and Gaza (Let's see how pro-peace Gazans really are)
4. Have a SET timeline, if the PA:
a. Prevents terrorist attacks
b. Prevents the importation of arms
c. Does not cooperate with a or b above in any way
5. Define a border close to 1967. Do not remove any Israeli settler homes. Give the setllers the choice of not moving, and living in a Palestinian teritory (and future Palestinian state). Or compensate them fairly to move.

BTW: Tzipi Livni (her party) in one of the elections won a plurality of the votes, which in turn gives her party a plurality in the Knesset. However, in Israel, similar to many European countries., citizens vote for a party. That party's representation in the Knesset represents the proportionality of citizen votes. But it is the Knesset that votes for the Prime Minister, and a plurality won't cut it. You need to have a majority, and can build a colition to do it. Tzipi Livni could not build a big enough coalition to get a mjority. Netanyahu, was given an opprtunity and swopped in and took over.

SAD.

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 11

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/14/2024 12:10:09 PM

wickedsdesires

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The Liberty incident is a tragedy and a mystery. Israel compensated the families of the fallen crew.
I think you justified everything with that statement. War crime.

Are the Jews discussing comp for 25,000 innocent children and woman dead, or the 50,000 injured? As the jews unleashed hellfire 9/11 did they give the figures and ratio?

Your post was 80%. A knowledge like that could have tried to damage me. Start a few discussions.

The mystery of Liberty.
Next you will be going on about Iran Air Flight 655.

You seem sensible. How many Hamas are there? I have no idea myself. I would like you to understand this Hamas was all Israel's doing and even Benjamin Netanyahu.

I haven't absorbed your solution. The part I did 1967. They can not go back to those borders. Hopefully those jew monster's didn't expand since 67 or the last 100 days.

I never confuse humanity with the likes of Hamas or Benjamin Netanyahu.

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 12

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/14/2024 12:34:37 PM

MasterJaguar01

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Joined: 12/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wickedsdesires

The Liberty incident is a tragedy and a mystery. Israel compensated the families of the fallen crew.
I think you justified everything with that statement. War crime.

I am not justifying anything. It may very well be a war crime.

quote:

Are the Jews discussing comp for 25,000 innocent children and woman dead, or the 50,000 injured?

You should ask that question of Hamas who is responsible for this. It is HAMAS who is hiding among these people.
Is Hamas discussing comp for ANYONE?

quote:

Your post was 80%. A knowledge like that could have tried to damage me. Start a few discussions.

My post was 100%

quote:

I would like you to understand this Hamas was all Israel's doing and even Benjamin Netanyahu.

This is nonsensical. Israel did not create Hamas. However by not following through with the Oslo accords (even though the Palestinians had already violated them) created the perfect environment for Hamas to thrive.
You are wayyyyy off here.

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 13

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/14/2024 5:34:49 PM

wickedsdesires

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You should ask that question of Hamas who is responsible for this.

Hamas killed 25,000 women and children of Gaza? Those are the ones they can find and sling into a mass grave.

Netanyahu covertly funded Hamas to play them off their more organized and legitimate rival, the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank.

Do you dispute that statement?
Or any of my others?

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 14

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/15/2024 6:45:33 AM

MasterJaguar01

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Joined: 12/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wickedsdesires

You should ask that question of Hamas who is responsible for this.

Hamas killed 25,000 women and children of Gaza? Those are the ones they can find and sling into a mass grave.

100% absolutely. When you come across a border slaughtering 1200 civilians (beheading infants, raping women) and take hundreds of hostages and hide AMONG millions of innocent civilians. You are killing those civilians. Hamas knows this. That's why they hide in schools and hospitals, so they can get the most propaganda value out of any attempts to eliminate them.

Hamas killed 25,000 women and children of Gaza and would gladly kill 25,000 more.

In the US, we have the "felony murder" rule for that very reason. Hamas is directly responsible for their deaths.

quote:

Netanyahu covertly funded Hamas to play them off their more organized and legitimate rival, the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank.
Do you dispute that statement?

Yes. I dispute it.
It is not Israeli money flowing to Gaza, it is Qatari money. (flowing directly through Israeli territory with Netanyahu's blessing for the exact sick and disturbed reasoning you mention)

And BTW: That money was supposed to be humanitarian aid to Hamas (which remember is the duly elected government of Gaza). Hamas instead spent it on massive arms, instead of its own people (leaving local Gazans to live in a shithole with a badly depressed economy). (More death and misery to Palestinian Gazans at the hands of Hamas)

quote:

Or any of my others?

Read my earlier posts, I disprove and dispute many assertions you make.

I will say this: Netanyahu is one of the biggest disasters in the middle east of our time.

< Message edited by MasterJaguar01 -- 1/15/2024 7:31:31 AM >

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 15

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/15/2024 9:13:39 AM

JVoV

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Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online

I don't see much point in limiting the discussion to the last 60 years when there are grudges still held from Old Testament times. Without intervention, there can likely never be peace unless one side is annihilated. It really doesn't matter who started it, much less how, when, or why. This isn't a road trip with children in the backseat.

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 16

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/15/2024 5:35:54 PM

MasterJaguar01

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Joined: 12/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

I don't see much point in limiting the discussion to the last 60 years when there are grudges still held from Old Testament times.

Before the 1947 UN agreement ending the British mandate, it goes back to the British, and before that the Ottoman Turks. (None of which is relevant to the modern day scenario. So there is appropriate to limit the discussion to this timeframe.

quote:

Without intervention, there can likely never be peace unless one side is annihilated. It really doesn't matter who started it, much less how, when, or why. This isn't a road trip with children in the backseat.

It's important to know the events and timeline up until the present in order to understand a solution.

(in reply to JVoV)

Post #: 17

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/16/2024 9:30:06 AM

wickedsdesires

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quote:

100% absolutely. When you come across a border slaughtering 1200 civilians (beheading infants, raping women) and take hundreds of hostages and hide AMONG millions of innocent civilians. You are killing those civilians. Hamas knows this. That's why they hide in schools and hospitals, so they can get the most propaganda value out of any attempts to eliminate them.

You are approaching me to the point of nonsense or are you settling? Would you like me to go everything quote by quote.

Why is Israel, what is settlers? How many were beheaded and raped, and murdered? Settlers, or Israelis if you prefer, not that you gave a figure or proof. I reckon 25,000 dead Gaza children, woman and men are enough. 50,000 Wounded. That is a Jew ratio of over 1:100. You also omitted how many of those fallen Jews worked for security forces. Everyone over 18.

How many millions are in Gaza, then, how many of them are Hamas?

Gaza is 25 miles by 6 miles. Where do you want Hamas to "hide" I will overlook their own airspace and sea is not an option. Feel free to differentiate if I mean Gaza or Hamas with that one or you could refer to the UN on that matter and many others.

How many Hamas were found in schools and hospitals?
Did Hamas bomb and kill 25,000 Gaza? Show me

Israel was also pre warned of this very strike. By their own security forces.

All my comments are based on your one quote. That was some of my comments to it.

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 18

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/16/2024 12:07:50 PM

JVoV

Posts: 3617
Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online

I highly doubt it's personal at all, wicked. MJ just does that. Really, answering a post in such a way allows not only the poster to keep their thoughts organized and limited to just the one point, while also allowing the read to know wtf they're talking about.

But I don't see the back and forth as much different than siblings fighting in the backseat during a long road trip. Right now, it doesn't even matter who started it, when, or why. All that matters to me is how does the violence end now?

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 19

RE: Israel is "now at war" - 1/16/2024 7:12:00 PM

MasterJaguar01

Posts: 2340
Joined: 12/2/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: wickedsdesires
You are approaching me to the point of nonsense or are you settling? Would you like me to go everything quote by quote.

I have no idea what this means. You are welcome to respond how you like :)

quote:

Why is Israel, what is settlers?

I am not sure what this means. I THINK you meant "What is Israel? What is settlers? Maybe not.
I THINK you are trying to say, these were settlers (aka land grabbers) and they therefore deserved to be slaughtered by Hamas???

I doubt very many (if ANY) were settlers. Settlers grab land on the east end of Israel. This attack was on the west side of Israel on the nearby kibuttzim.

quote:

How many were beheaded and raped, and murdered? Settlers, or Israelis if you prefer, not that you gave a figure or proof.

It is hard to obtain exact figures. I do not know.

quote:

I reckon 25,000 dead Gaza children, woman and men are enough. 50,000 Wounded. That is a Jew ratio of over 1:100.

Jew or Arab. All deaths are caused by Hamas. Hamas could have surrendered and released the hostages 25,000 dead, and 50,000 wounded ago. They didn't really give a shit about them.

quote:

You also omitted how many of those fallen Jews worked for security forces. Everyone over 18.

This is sick and twisted. WTF?????? A Jew is over 18 therefore works for "security forces" therefore deserves to be slaughtered by Hamas?

quote:

How many millions are in Gaza, then, how many of them are Hamas?

I don't know

quote:

Gaza is 25 miles by 6 miles. Where do you want Hamas to "hide" I will overlook their own airspace and sea is not an option. Feel free to differentiate if I mean Gaza or Hamas with that one or you could refer to the UN on that matter and many others.

How about not HIDING at all? How about not coming across the border, slaughtering 1200 innocent people and then running and hiding? How about having a conscience and SURRENDERING and releasing the hostages and saving the lives of millions of Palestinian Arabs?

quote:

How many Hamas were found in schools and hospitals?

Likely NONE. They are NEVER FOUND in schools and hospitals. They hide there until their hideout is destroyed and enough children and the sick are killed are injured and they scurry like rats.

Just as a note: Al Jazeera has been covering the war with a HUGE slant toward Hamas. They were in an emergency room in Gaza where man with a horrible shrapnel wound was being interviewed by Al Jazeera. The man noticed Hamas terrorists posing as wounded HIDING IN THAT VERY ER taking up valuable space needed for real patients. The man said loudly into the microphone (translated from Arabic). "They are hiding right here in this room among us! May Allah send them to hell!"

Just then the Al Jazeera reporter cut his microphone and Al Jazeera cut the feed.

quote:

Did Hamas bomb and kill 25,000 Gaza? Show me

No. They attacked and killed 1200 innocent unarmed civilians in a country with a strong military and hid among their own civilian population in hospitals schools and residences.
Which is wayyyyyy WORSE.

< Message edited by MasterJaguar01 -- 1/16/2024 7:13:11 PM >

(in reply to wickedsdesires)

Post #: 20

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