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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 11:43:36 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Just something I thought of to add here which might be relevant- I’ve always in my life been HIGHLY attracted to males who had abusive or non-expressive parents, and were thus very emotionally closed off and dealt with problems by shoving them under the rug.
I think it’s partly due to a compatibility with how I process but also because I think I am a balance to their equation- we had loud scream fights, we had loud laughter fit, physical loving contact was an everyday occurrence, and emotions were very much accepted and encouraged in my family growing up.  I give my partners what they lack in that regard and am able to teach them that it’s ok and good.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to raiken)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:09:25 PM   
raiken


Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
Status: offline 		LA ... understood and kindred thought here in this, your thoughts mirror almost exactly those of my own.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:13:13 PM   
Homestead


Posts: 1005
Status: offline 		I have no difficulty with expressing emotion or thoughts. What I DO have difficulty with, is someone not being able to process them in an appropriate and rational manner. I can easily trace roots of my issues back, and make adjustments for them. I realize that everyone differs, and that past people I have known are not the current ones. But there is always that subtle muse of mine that tempts me to pry at seams in armor-and see how much I can strip away.

Coupled with my natural curiosity that makes me want to shock the monkey-and see how it reacts. I guess I'm still a kid at heart in some ways. And when I feel my buttons being pushed, I can now go......hmm he/she is trying tactic"x". Let's counter with reposte "z" and see how it works out. It can be an amusing game.

I'm a bit like juliet's Dom. I want to see the cloth an individual is cut from. Is it iron, or is it tissue paper? The fire will decide.

< Message edited by Homestead -- 9/1/2006 12:14:13 PM >

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:16:10 PM   
Homestead


Posts: 1005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Just something I thought of to add here which might be relevant- I’ve always in my life been HIGHLY attracted to males who had abusive or non-expressive parents, and were thus very emotionally closed off and dealt with problems by shoving them under the rug.
I think it’s partly due to a compatibility with how I process but also because I think I am a balance to their equation- we had loud scream fights, we had loud laughter fit, physical loving contact was an everyday occurrence, and emotions were very much accepted and encouraged in my family growing up.  I give my partners what they lack in that regard and am able to teach them that it’s ok and good.


That sounds good to me LA.

It's great to have someone provide a means to chill out and come out of thier shell. Acceptance and time is often all that is needed.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:19:40 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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Joined: 10/25/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead
I'm a bit like juliet's Dom. I want to see the cloth an individual is cut from. Is it iron, or is it tissue paper? The fire will decide.

Well there is something to be said for one's character being revealed in times of stress.  As said in Firefly ""Live with a man for 40 years. Eat the same meals, speak with him on every subject, then tie him up and hold him over the mouth of a volcano. On that day, you will meet the man."

But I think one's true character can shine and be revealed even in the quiet, normal, happy moments just as much. 

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Homestead)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:21:31 PM   
Homestead


Posts: 1005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead
I'm a bit like juliet's Dom. I want to see the cloth an individual is cut from. Is it iron, or is it tissue paper? The fire will decide.

Well there is something to be said for one's character being revealed in times of stress.  As said in Firefly ""Live with a man for 40 years. Eat the same meals, speak with him on every subject, then tie him up and hold him over the mouth of a volcano. On that day, you will meet the man."

But I think one's true character can shine and be revealed even in the quiet, normal, happy moments just as much. 


Yes, and acceptance is also the best cure for insecurity.

The vast majority of us like to be valued for who we are-not who we are expected to be.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:31:47 PM   
raiken


Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
Status: offline 		LA and Homestead...well said! Took the thoughts right outta my head. (hehehe....i just made a rhyme! LOL)
 
i am one who is always up for the challenge of intelligent and even cunning tactical exhange and the like...mainly because i am always on some sort of a quest at times, to prove to myself what cloth i am made of.  This is how i learn to trust in my gut and in my deeper intuition.  It has saved me on more than one occasion.  i love the fact that i have learned so much, and have found a deep fulfillment through practicing unconditional acceptance of others.

< Message edited by raiken -- 9/1/2006 12:32:45 PM >

(in reply to Homestead)
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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:34:07 PM   
onestandingstill


Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline 		Wow, for me my perspective of what a mental sadist is, is a very negative one. To me it means they get off on hurting you emotionally. Their release is at the expense of your spirit. I'd rather be beat daily till I bled than to be crushed emotionally by someone. Mental sadism and I are not, and will not be friends. I get no enjoyment, and very insecure of my ability to trust him from that point forward as I do not feel he has my best interest at heart. To me it was as if I felt like a lab rat that was being killed slowly with the worst form of torture.
Suzanne

(in reply to raiken)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:41:30 PM   
onestandingstill


Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SexyRed

quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead

quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

I have sadistic fantasies that emotionally involve deprivation of sex, food, and pleasure from things I am looking forward to that I've been promised I can have that are suddenly taken away from me. I also have a deep appreciation for humilation, and have never found it unappealing. Physically, my sadistic fantasies involve whipping to the point of bleeding - but I have no experience with any real sadists or sadistic activity, so there might be more added as time goes on, for me, in that area.

In all of my sadistic fantasies, the Master or Dominant is fairly gentle with me, except he just won't give in when it comes to these specific things he is doing to me. He is otherwise affectionate, and I do feel valued by him. If I didn't - I doubt I could or would want to do any of this. 


I've come across a few who like really harsh treatment. They can be fun, but my ability to trust them has always been questionable. I can't quite wriggle into them with my empathy, before I feel my mind going in directions I'd really rather not allow.

I'd rather look at Auschwitz from the outside.

Smiles, and fires up "The Horst Wessel song."


How incredibly distasteful and insensitive to even mention the word Auschwitz.

For goodness sake how incredibly distasteful to comment on their comment in such a whining way. They were stating it was a bad place they did not want to enter into, not it was a cool place or something. Get over your self riotous attitude please!

(in reply to SexyRed)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:42:39 PM   
raiken


Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
Status: offline 		Many folks have this view, that is why it is often difficult to find those that can share about their experiences.  In my opinion only, society puts labels on behaviors and tendencies. Such as in this area, and then annnouces to the public, that this is to be thought of as monstrous, mentally disabling, and cruel.  However, there is a sweetly bittersweet area that calls to my depths...it is for me, a challenge, of the ritualistic dance between logic and rational assumption, temporal emotions and true grit, as applies in my case. *smile The unspoken dare inside myself that says...okay...give me all ya got! *grin i will accept it, take it, and raise you double! LOL!  Lets play...weg.

< Message edited by raiken -- 9/1/2006 12:43:51 PM >

(in reply to onestandingstill)
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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:52:45 PM   
Mavis


Posts: 828
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline 		raiken, that's why i asked.. my reaction to the term has always been that it's a negative.  Seeing juliets appreciation for it clarifies it for me a bit.  i can understand her interest  (not like she needed me to, but hey)   although i couldn't dabble at that level, i can see how it's a positive experience for some.

i think i'll forever be at the "ahha!  got ya!"  mindfuck level.  i've found my niche. lol

(in reply to raiken)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:58:10 PM   
raiken


Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
Status: offline 		LOL Mavis, thats what im talkin bout...finding that elusive niche...priceless!

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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 12:59:31 PM   
Homestead


Posts: 1005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: raiken

Many folks have this view, that is why it is often difficult to find those that can share about their experiences.  In my opinion only, society puts labels on behaviors and tendencies. Such as in this area, and then annnouces to the public, that this is to be thought of as monstrous, mentally disabling, and cruel.  However, there is a sweetly bittersweet area that calls to my depths...it is for me, a challenge, of the ritualistic dance between logic and rational assumption, temporal emotions and true grit, as applies in my case. *smile The unspoken dare inside myself that says...okay...give me all ya got! *grin i will accept it, take it, and raise you double! LOL!  Lets play...weg.


If taken in the correct spirit, it challenges one. Especially when the cruel thing that is said is SO true. It's a denial breaker, a harsh mirror of the soul.

Look at it this way. What is more caring, to ignore things that may impair an individual, or be cruel enough to bring them up for consideration?

For instance, if someone tries to troll me for a compliment by saying the tired, standard old "does this make my ass look big?"

I may just retort with, "YES, lay off the twinkies!"

< Message edited by Homestead -- 9/1/2006 1:02:53 PM >

(in reply to raiken)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 1:06:05 PM   
raiken


Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
Status: offline 		LOL Homestead...i have learned my lessons. Some in the hardest of ways i might add, due to my being stubborn to concede at times, but yet, learned them well.  i never express all those vulnerable thoughts outloud, unless i know for sure, that i am prepared, and that it is what i desire to enter  into.  In other words, i am a firm believer in being careful of what i wish for.  There is much to be said for having one around who is not intimidated in the slightest to call me on my shit. *grin

(in reply to Homestead)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 1:14:10 PM   
Homestead


Posts: 1005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: raiken

LOL Homestead...i have learned my lessons. Some in the hardest of ways i might add, due to my being stubborn to concede at times, but yet, learned them well.  i never express all those vulnerable thoughts outloud, unless i know for sure, that i am prepared, and that it is what i desire to enter  into.  In other words, i am a firm believer in being careful of what i wish for.  There is much to be said for having one around who is not intimidated in the slightest to call me on my shit. *grin


I get called on mine too-it's all good.

(in reply to raiken)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 1:17:49 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: onestandingstill
Wow, for me my perspective of what a mental sadist is, is a very negative one. To me it means they get off on hurting you emotionally.

Pretty much.  Physical sadists means they get off on hurting you physically.  Both types are viewed as pretty negative by the majority of people.

quote:

Their release is at the expense of your spirit. I'd rather be beat daily till I bled than to be crushed emotionally by someone. Mental sadism and I are not, and will not be friends. I get no enjoyment, and very insecure of my ability to trust him from that point forward as I do not feel he has my best interest at heart. To me it was as if I felt like a lab rat that was being killed slowly with the worst form of torture.
Suzanne

It's good that you know this about yourself.  The same way that some people can't be beaten on a particular part of their body because it would be too harmful to them and unable to hearl from, some people can't be forced to endure certain mental beatings.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to onestandingstill)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 2:01:16 PM   
raiken


Posts: 868
Joined: 10/18/2005
Status: offline 		[quote]ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

It's good that you know this about yourself.  The same way that some people can't be beaten on a particular part of their body because it would be too harmful to them and unable to hearl from, some people can't be forced to endure certain mental beatings.
[/quote]
 
i agree, it all circles back to being able to realize our limits, and capabilities, and mesh them nicely with what we believe we desire and need for fulfillment.
 
Let my try to explain this thought....here goes...lol....
 
There are those negative brow beatings, that comprise the human nature of destructive and often thought of as cruel criticisms, and the expression of such, from others that either care, and are not good at saying what they mean, or others who really don't care and totally mean what they are saying.  As in how some folks just blurt out whatever hurtful (whether truth or not) words, and then leave it to the other person to sort it out.  These type of folks don't care in the slightest,  if the other person is left hurting, or learns or gains anything out of it.
 
i believe that when this occurs among individuals, then those individuals happen to enter into this lifestyle, the negative connotations of such miscommunications and misunderstandings are carried over. i believe that perhaps somehow this carry over in assumption, gets applyied and/or associated in the same negative light, with the unique purpose and exchange of sadism/masochism used as a medium of connection, fulfillment and expression in this particular venue.
 
Hope this made sense. *grin 

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 4:42:42 PM   
julietsierra


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Joined: 9/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NastyDaddy

An emotional masochist perceives a deep inner "need" to receive emotional sadism.... as they squirm and quiver in dire anticipation of the forthcoming negative deluge at the mercy of the emotionally sadistic dominant... the emotionally sadistic dominant simply says "no" and proceeds to watch a football game instead... 


I don't know that I perceive a deep "need" to receive emotional sadism. Personally, I'd rather NOT go through all that. It's a HELL of a lot of work. And like someone trapped in the desert, it isn't the desert that's oh so wonderful...it's that glass of water at the end.

On the other hand, in my little world, he gets to be exactly who he is. I LIKE him for who he is. I LOVE him for who he is. But I don't get to pick and choose the pieces of him he gets to be around me. He is who he is and that's that. He is an emotional sadist, and while I'm a masochist, I can tell you, I can manage the pain of getting beat MUCH more than I can the emotional pain.

But since I like and love the entire man - even that nasty side of him that likes to see me all mixed up and frightened and wondering what the hell I'm doing - I take all of him...and have learned to appreciate him in his entirety. It's not toleration. It's acceptance. And the added benefit is that I get to learn a hell of a lot about me. I get to become a better person out of it all.

Going back to that trust thing, I'd say that there are a number of things I don't trust about him. I simply look at the man - what he says and what he does and make a decision. Is the whole of who he is and who I am when I am with him better than that one niggling part that wonders what the hell is happening?  I look at what he does and make a decision: Am I in a healthy place in my mind - mild panic notwithstanding. My criteria for that decision is "Am I losing who I am - the person inside that I've always been with or without him?" If the answer ever turns out to be "yes." I'm gone.

So far though, the answer is no. I look at my panic...take it out and kind of turn it around in my hands to see what I am really looking at. Since this is something I'm feeling, WHY am I feeling this way? What is it in me that is happening? What is the bigger lesson to be learned from this? Sometimes my panic can be attributable to things happening in my life: onset of colds, pms, a fight with my ex (and when that happens, EVERYONE is a bad guy to me), and things like that. Sometimes my panic is attributable to things other people have done to me that look very similar to what's happening but have no bearing on the present. And sometimes, panic is just me exploring a new idea.

I only had one time where the panic was attributable to something he's done...and he sure did it. Before then, I'd have been right with you all lauding the benefits and necessity of trust. After that, I learned that he is who he is...and that when I place all my trust in him - and then he changes to fit what I say I need - that's not trust.

That's clout. And I don't want clout. I just want him to be exactly who he is - with no allowances made for me. And for me to be exactly who I am - with no allowances made for him...And then, for me to choose to take exactly who I am and submit to exactly who he is. And I really don't see that as trust in him. I see that as trust in me and my judgment about how I am feeling and my intentions for myself and for our relationship.

He says no and goes to watch television. I say ok and sit down to do the same. It's not an angst-filled situation. It's just a situation where he's said "no."

And no, he's not the product of abusive and/or neglectful parents.

He's just an emotional sadist. If that is difficult to deal with, think of him as a psychological researcher. He likes to put people in different situations and see how they fare. Actually, think of me as one too. I like to see how I'll handle something I never thought I'd ever be able to handle. And when I do handle these things, he's pleased with me and I'm proud of myself.

juliet

(in reply to NastyDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/1/2006 4:47:32 PM   
julietsierra


Posts: 1841
Joined: 9/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

But I think one's true character can shine and be revealed even in the quiet, normal, happy moments just as much. 


See, in my experience, the quiet, normal, happy moments are lovely...but they are no test of character. In fact, unless someone has been tested by something a lot more intense than quiet, normal, happy times, they have absolutely no idea of their capabilities and the person they are inside.

Nearly 19 years ago, I was quiet, normal and happy. Then, I was handed the personification of my prejudice and told to go home and take care of her, love her, fight for her. I never knew before then, how prejudiced I was or that it was even possible to change that prejudice. I never knew how hard I could fight, how much I could care or how deeply I could love. I didn't CHOOSE this part of my life, but it's here. And now... I think THIS is normal, quiet and happy - but if I'd never been tested by something far more than normal, happy times, I can pretty much guarantee, I'd be completely different from what I am now. I'd never ever have realized the strength of my character.

I like me now much better than I EVER liked me before.

juliet

< Message edited by julietsierra -- 9/1/2006 4:56:55 PM >

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Sadistic tastes - 9/2/2006 12:20:24 AM   
NastyDaddy


Posts: 957
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline 		Perhaps it's me, but it seemed like your post opened saying you are not an emotional masochist, yet closed with expressed pride of being one.

Are you fucking with my head? I'm still digesting the you are you because he is he... but if you lose you, you're gone? How can he make you be what you are not, with a hinge-point limit of being gone should you lose you?

I'd venture you would be already gone if you did not like your pain, whether physical or emotional... unless staying is your pain.

_____________________________

"You may be right, I may be crazy... but I may just be the lunatic you're looking for!"

(in reply to julietsierra)
Profile   Post #: 60
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