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Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 8:10:58 AM

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I was thinking today that a lot of people get the impression that because DCS and I are so casual and comfortable with switching between eachother, that a lot of people form the misperception that we aren’t “serious” or “deep” with our dynamic.

It’s an understandable misperception and I don’t know that I can really say/type anything to be persuasive enough to the contrary. I know it’s condescending to say “If you’re a switch, you get it” but I know even some switches get this misperception and plenty of non-switches don’t. It’s more of “If you get it, you get it” type of thing.

With DCS and I, the priority is on BEING TOGETHER. And by “being” I mean that in the most basic literal as well as the highest vibratory spiritual way. Whatever we happen to BE is secondary to that. Whatever the energy/emotions/moods are flowing, we simply flow with them.

The energy is still intense, and we are devoted to eachother. When I am his mistress, he is my boy- as much as any non-switching relationship would be. And the same is true when I wear his collar.

We are utterly devoted to eachother. How we happen to express that devotion is an expression of the moment. In the way that a couple can be deeply connected and intimate by sharing the Sunday paper in their PJs on the couch just as much as they can with cuffs and knives and masks and tears.

I never thought I’d be very comfortable calling myself “a dominant.” But then I never thought I’d be very comfortable calling myself a “woman” and dressing in women’s pretty clothes either. But now I feel more MYSELF than ever before. If people make the misperception that I am confused or less “serious” because who I am is expressed differently from the traditional ways…I can only hope they learn to feel the energy, not rely on their former standards.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 8:19:19 AM

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Amen Lucky~!! as usual well expressed and good thought to put out there...
One Dom, who has been in the scene for 30 yrs, told me..."hey, get off the fence~~! Your one or the other.....or your just F'in confused~!"
Wow...that put me on the defense
immediately~!
Lil

_____________________________

“The only thing I regret about my past is the length of it. If I had to live my life again I'd make all the same mistakes - only sooner.”
santiz Tallulah Bankhead quotes , 1903-1968)

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 8:29:47 AM

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Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

Greetings..~smiles~

Okay this girls perception of this may be wrong to any others but as have read your posts over the last couple of years..you've pretty much been the gamit. In the same breath you call yourself a slave..you call yourself a Dominant, and a switch, and no clue what else.

Does not think that anyone would have a issue about your seriousness of the dynamic if you'd just be a switch ..but it seems when ever the mood strikes you or it's somewhat relavent to a post you make to a thread..your that flavor of the day. This does see as not serious and playing at this for sexual turn-ons rather than living it as a way of life.

Does believe persons have both traits within them and they come out for different reasons. This makes switching possible..but it doesn't make it seem anymore serious or committed beyond the commital needed for sexual/fantasy fullfillments within a human relationship. It has nothing to do with how serious you or anyone else is about the other as just a partner in life because that can exist quite well without any BDSM, Gor or other.

Probably not going to win any boobie prizes today for this but this is how it comes across to this girl. Not saying any of it's wrong but rather would be better to call it what it is.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 8:57:56 AM

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As far as I'm concerned it has nothing to do with seriousness, but knowing "Who" you are..........and sometimes that does change.....we evolve, we come to terms with tendencies we may have suppressed, we may not be the same person today with the same needs as we had last year. I respect and admire anyone who does the "check in" to see where their at, in BDSM, and all aspects of life. Knowing one self, learning along the way,...and offering it to another, .....is what we all seek. The other side of our coin. Lillith

_____________________________

“The only thing I regret about my past is the length of it. If I had to live my life again I'd make all the same mistakes - only sooner.”
santiz Tallulah Bankhead quotes , 1903-1968)

(in reply to starshineowned)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 9:40:56 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned
Does believe persons have both traits within them and they come out for different reasons. This makes switching possible..but it doesn't make it seem anymore serious or committed beyond the commital needed for sexual/fantasy fullfillments within a human relationship. It has nothing to do with how serious you or anyone else is about the other as just a partner in life because that can exist quite well without any BDSM, Gor or other.

Probably not going to win any boobie prizes today for this but this is how it comes across to this girl. Not saying any of it's wrong but rather would be better to call it what it is.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

Starshine, your feelings are exactly why I began thinking and typing up that post.

I AM a slave, I AM a dominant, I AM a switch, I AM a bottom, I AM a top, I AM service oriented, I AM a lover.

I think most of the problems arise by people thinking these cannot co-exist within the same person, or cannot co-exist without losing "something" from them.

Similarly to the way people cannot understanding have a relationship with more than one person at the same time without thinking you must be "losing" some intensity or love or something.

And you are right, I do post from all of those perspectives, based on whatever that post strikes within me. Again, I just go with where the energy takes me.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to starshineowned)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 10:26:39 AM

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*sigh* as if how 'deep' you are into the lifestyle or roles and any such is any of their damn business.

You are deep into each other! Sounds like you and DCS are 'into' each other in a deep and sincere way. That you approach each other as true and complete people that transcend any roles.

Good on you, and tell anyone that has a problem with it to pound salt!

fergus

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 11:59:21 AM

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From: Texas
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Greetings..~smiles~

Yes perhaps..but your being those things when the mood strikes you is not the same equilvelent as someone that lives true to one trait as far as life style. It's not living a lifeway, choice, style, whatever..it's simply utilizing different traits to get your kicks for that particular time, and then it's presto chango to something else. This is and will always be perceived as "playing" at this and there isn't any seriousness really to it beyond just general safety. The rest or where any seriousness might arise is just in the personal human relationship, which again can and does exist well without alternative choices incorported into it daily. Having a Dominant or submissive trait is not the samething in this girls eyes as being a Dominant/submissive in the context that is used here for lifestyle choice. It certainly isn't living as a Master, Mistress or slave in any fashion that you could truely call yourself one of those without adding on that you "pretend or play" being those when the mood of your trait strikes you or your persuaded to bring a specific trait out. If it isn't a constant..then see's it as nothing more than roleplaying ..just together rather than apart physically.

In another look: You are not a Dominant in this lifestyle..you simply act on your dominant trait in order to become a Mistress or Top to fullfill a session/s of play. You are not a submissive in this lifestyle..you simply act on your submissive trait in order to become a bottom or a submissive(noun type) or a slave to fullfill a session/a of play.

Again thats fine if thats your thing but this girl doesn't take this sort of behavior as living a lifeway, choice, style, but just play in the scope of sexual/fantasy fullfillment only.

Yes does understand by context of the legal system We are all considered playing..however, if you look at the use of a dog or car..legally you own them..but park that car wrong on a hill and it's liable to roll down or back and get smashed up..leaving you with no car. Beat that dog and have someone get wind of it and see if the spca isn't banging on your door, or that dog just decides to up and run off. It doesn't much care about that collar or license saying it's a legally owned property. Take the time to make sure that car is park correctly or the bond with you and the dog is done right, and most likely both are going to stay and perform exactly how you wanted..legal or not.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

< Message edited by starshineowned -- 11/17/2006 12:21:50 PM >

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 12:28:36 PM

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Well said Lucky, it's very much about relating to your partner and learning to live and love and grow together.

(in reply to fergus)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 1:00:41 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned
Yes perhaps..but your being those things when the mood strikes you is not the same equilvelent as someone that lives true to one trait as far as life style.

I live true to the thing that matters most- my self.

It's not a trait, it's an identity. My being A slave isn't "submissive traits" it's an orientation.

It's not just a mood- it's energy, it's emotion, it's flow of life. Trust me, when I wear his collar, I don't get to say "Hey I'm not in the mood to do that so now I'm your dominant!" That would be very wrong and very much against who we are.

Trust me, WE don't decide who is who at any point...I WISH!!!

The energy decides- we follow the energy.

quote:

Having a Dominant or submissive trait is not the samething in this girls eyes as being a Dominant/submissive in the context that is used here for lifestyle choice.

I agree. Again, it's not a trait. If you read all my prior posts you will see I've said for YEARS that this isn't a trait- it's an orientation.

quote:

In another look: You are not a Dominant in this lifestyle..you simply act on your dominant trait in order to become a Mistress or Top to fullfill a session/s of play. You are not a submissive in this lifestyle..you simply act on your submissive trait in order to become a bottom or a submissive(noun type) or a slave to fullfill a session/a of play.

I understand that's how many people see and perceive it to be. But that would be just like saying a slave isn't a slave if she's allowed on the furniture. Just because we don't express who we are in the traditional ways, doesn't mean we aren't those orientations.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to starshineowned)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 1:59:26 PM

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From: Texas
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Greetings..~smiles~

Not here to defend nor any of the such. You put yourself out here in a somewhat attempt to define, understand, convince, manner, and you got back from this girl exactly how feels about what you do. No more thinks of you as any of those "orientations" in any manner other than you act and pretend to be them when it suits yours or your partners fancy. This type of behavior falls exactly into the switch category and it's there for a reason because it denotes the depth/reasoning for calling oneself either or (as in Dom today sub tomorrow) ..same goes with Top/bottom. These aren't considered a lifestyle, way of life, or choice of life. They are merely fun additions/play sessions/fantasy and kink fullfillment that add to a persons life for spice. If you've any understanding at all of what it is really like to live 24/7 as a Owner or a ownee..then you'll know LA this is not a game and it damn sure is not a choice that comes easy, and would not even begin to put a switch into the same level because to this girl it's just flat out demeaning. Doesn't have a real clue as to wether being a slave is a orientation or some other word out there yet undiscovered but does know that Not living this way as close to possible as what we know past slavery to be..leaves this girl empty, and lifeless. Can't explain it, and not going to try. Can this girl function without being a slave? Can exist yes..this is where being a doormat and robot comes in. People in this girls eyes have that all ass backwards when they are referring to a slave.

Not much different to this girl than a guy thats portrayed as a Dominant figurehead around his family or in his work but sneaks off on the weekends to submit to some pro domme as her whipping boy to get off, and relieve stress.

This is what see's, and how separates things. Won't apologize for it nor is this girl condemning anyone for living or calling themselves something.

If your happy, and feel your being true to yourself..then cudo's.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 2:37:02 PM

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From: Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

The energy decides- we follow the energy.

This sentence right here is why some people will never 'get it', LA. (And just opens another can of worms - what happens when the energy of both parties is in conflict.. and how is that different than vanilla energy conflicts, a valid question to be sure.)

The very idea of that there can be any sort of relationship flux is why switches are the unwanted step-children of BDSM. People leave vanilla behind because there are no boundaries or borders within the relationship dynamic and they find D/s because of the very demarcation that switches erase. Switches aren't real because to admit they are means that you have to admit that the boundaries are invisible and set internally (which is tantamount to a sin for a Gorean what with natural order and all), you have to admit there are no lines other than those you draw yourself, you have to admit to stereotypical box thinking, you have to admit that there is no One True Way, you have to admit to possibilities of something which falls outside your own knowledge and internal perceptions, something which actually attacks your holy beliefs and sacred pronouncements.

Might as well beat your head against the wall for all the good it's going to do trying to convince anyone who's not willing to hear it that such is as valid within BDSM and D/s as any other choice but then you knew that and posted anyway. ::chuckles::

What is wrong with you, LA?

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 3:06:04 PM

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As far as I am concerned people should live their lives the way it makes them happiest as long as it is CONSENSUAL. If other people do not agree, the hell with those other people! If people were less concerned about "roles" and "lifestyles" and more concerned with the handling of their own personal business I truly believe we'd have less problems in this world.

Don't worry about what your neighbor is doing, worry about what is going on in your own backyard. That is something that my Father used to say and I believe it. People who down switches for not being *real or true* are full of shit and should mind their own business. Who here holds a Master or Mistress license? Who here can call the police and say "Hey my slave took off, can you get a guy with a shotgun and a couple of tracker dogs to chase her down?" and have the police actually do it?

People who down switches really need to look at themselves before they point fingers. Master/Mistress/slave/sub/switch are roles that we each decide to play/live and just because one person decides that they are one of those roles does not mean they should judge other people for how they live. Yes being a Mistress is very much who I am as a Dominant female but that does not mean I should look down at someone who switches because of their life choice.

To often on this forum I've heard people go on and on about "true, real" etc. Instead of pointing fingers these people should examine their own lives, I guarantee you there are somethings that aren't perfect in their supposedly perfect world. Who are they to judge what other people do? They are nobody, except people with too much time on their hands. Being a switch is just as valid as being a Dom/me or sub/slave. Variety is the spice of life as they say.

~Lashra

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to BitaTruble)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 4:01:47 PM

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I heard a good quote this past weekend: People are great at what they do when they do it for their own approval. I think I heard it watching CSI.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
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Ms Relationship Books
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BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 4:12:22 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

I heard a good quote this past weekend: People are great at what they do when they do it for their own approval. I think I heard it watching CSI.

Master Fire

Great quote Master Fire, and CSI rocks <girl imagines Grissom as her Dom, mmmmm>

_____________________________

"Beauty is in the eye of the key holder" - my Master <g>

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 4:15:23 PM

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From: Texas
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quote:

People who down switches really need to look at themselves before they point fingers. Master/Mistress/slave/sub/switch are roles that we each decide to play/live and just because one person decides that they are one of those roles does not mean they should judge other people for how they live. Yes being a Mistress is very much who I am as a Dominant female but that does not mean I should look down at someone who switches because of their life choice.

If you really read what this girl was saying..then you'd know this statement of yours Ma'am is just inflammatory at best. No where in there did this girl say that she looked down on switches or did not think people should do or call themselves what they wish if they are happy and feel they are doing what they must. Did however, define the base differences between play for fullfillment of sexual/fantasy/kinks versus needing to live a certain way All the time in order to feel like is living period. People need to get out of their heads to that "sexual" doesn't require the act of penetration/intercourse but often is just that "high" that is looked for.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to Lashra)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 5:29:09 PM

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From: Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned

Greetings..~smiles~

No more thinks of you as any of those "orientations" in any manner other than you act and pretend to be them when it suits yours or your partners fancy. This type of behavior falls exactly into the switch category and it's there for a reason because it denotes the depth/reasoning for calling oneself either or (as in Dom today sub tomorrow) ..same goes with Top/bottom. These aren't considered a lifestyle, way of life, or choice of life. They are merely fun additions/play sessions/fantasy and kink fullfillment that add to a persons life for spice. If you've any understanding at all of what it is really like to live 24/7 as a Owner or a ownee..then you'll know LA this is not a game and it damn sure is not a choice that comes easy, and would not even begin to put a switch into the same level because to this girl it's just flat out demeaning. Doesn't have a real clue as to wether being a slave is a orientation or some other word out there yet undiscovered but does know that Not living this way as close to possible as what we know past slavery to be..leaves this girl empty, and lifeless. Can't explain it, and not going to try. Can this girl function without being a slave? Can exist yes..this is where being a doormat and robot comes in. People in this girls eyes have that all ass backwards when they are referring to a slave.

Not much different to this girl than a guy thats portrayed as a Dominant figurehead around his family or in his work but sneaks off on the weekends to submit to some pro domme as her whipping boy to get off, and relieve stress.

This is what see's, and how separates things. Won't apologize for it nor is this girl condemning anyone for living or calling themselves something.

If your happy, and feel your being true to yourself..then cudo's.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

::bold mine::

Perhaps your particular mode of communication causes others to misread your intent. That is the fault of the writer, not the reader. To me, your words speak your vision quite well and how you view the way others live. Their ways are not your ways, so their way is not the true way. It is less than yours. It is not the same level as yours. They are actors and pretenders. They don't understand. Others play games, you live a serious life.

You make the claim that you do not put down switches.. but your entire post reeks of it. Lip service is cheap and easy to give, but doing so in a post which quite clearly belies your tolerance of any but your own chosen path isn't fooling anyone but yourself. You don't have to be tolerant, but why make the claim you are when clearly you are not?

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to starshineowned)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 6:14:43 PM

nikaa

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Joined: 10/13/2004
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starshineowned,

I find your posts and comments insulting, close minded and extremely judgemental.

I am a slave. I am a dominant. I am a switch. I am a lover. I am a mother. I am a friend. I am all these things.I have been all these things under one roof, within devoted 24/7 relationships. Although unlike LA I am not these things to the same person.

To deny that I am any of these things is to deny who I am and that is something I refuse to do.

I ask you this how is not living true to your nature, to yourself not a life choice? Perhaps not YOUR choice but it is a life choice none the less.

I know for myself. I do not morph into a dominant or a slave when it is conveint I am those things ALL the time.

I also know that I don't PRETEND to be a slave or a dominant. I AM both. Though I will admit circumstance and energy will often dictate which is shown at any given time.

It has NOTHING to do with "play,sexual/fantasy/kinks ". It has to do with knowing myself and being true to myself. It has to do with not denying MY nature.

To say I should do so would be like those in the vanilla world saying you should deny YOUR slave nature because it not normal in their eyes.

I will admit one thing I don't classify most switches I know with those like yourself. I would not want to demean THEM in such a manner.

Edited to add: You don't have to like my life choices. You don't even have to be comfortable with my life choices. In the end only I have to.

< Message edited by nikaa -- 11/17/2006 7:01:33 PM >

_____________________________

Blessed Be,

Phoenix's Nika

The Cherokee legacy is that we are a people who face adversity, survive, adapt, prosper and excel.

Wakan Tankan Nici Un

(in reply to starshineowned)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 7:49:04 PM

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I read what you stated and I stand by my post. It wasnt flammatory or directly aimed at you, if I had meant it directly at you , I would surely have put your name in it. It was my thoughts and opinions to which I am fully entitled too. If however you don't like my words you are more then welcome to place me on your block list that is indeed what it is for.

Have a nice day,
~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to starshineowned)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 9:44:13 PM

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

Greetings..~smiles~

Like said..didn't expect to win any boobie prizes here. Does think this girls line of thinking is just fine. It neither puts down those that play or pretend..it merely states that this is what it is. That does not make it wrong nor bad except apparently in the nay sayers such as here view. If thats how you live and do things then can't you be proud and happy about doing that? Sorry but no way anyone ever will convince this girl that the same dedication nor devotion nor commitment nor understanding of what a person who lives true to one way All the time and deals day in and day out with that versus someone that doesn't. It's a difference of living a certain way of life versus using parts of this lifestyle to enhance a otherwise nilla life. Finds you alls posts just as close minded, opinionated and anything else slinged at this girl for her view of and how she defines and breaksdown things. So guess were even. In the end neither of us cares one iota what the other thinks because it doesn't affect our lives. You won't change this girls view, and doesn't care if changes anyone else. Simply stated an opinion of what feels. End of story from this girl. :) (To the general mass's)

Rather sky dive and put this girls life in the hands of a person thats a instructor and does it everyday versus a person that had a few lessons and occassionally does it for fun but feels that qualifys them to call themselves a instructor.

Well Wishes

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

< Message edited by starshineowned -- 11/17/2006 9:46:31 PM >

(in reply to Lashra)

RE: Seriousness in Switching - 11/17/2006 10:43:35 PM

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Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned

Finds you alls posts just as close minded, opinionated and anything else slinged at this girl for her view of and how she defines and breaksdown things. So guess were even.

OK, cool. My only beef with your post was that you claimed you are tolerant when you are not. Here you admit to your intolerance so it's all good.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to starshineowned)

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