quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave
Thank you Sir this was much better said then i could have aspecially since Im rather tired of Daddysprop but I wont get into that...

that truth is everone is so carefull what they say to her as to not upset her or make her think her ideas are wrong yet she seems to think only how she sees things are right ok Im done ranting because Im beeing unseemly now too

Magik's slave

quote:

Thank you Sir this was much better said then i could have aspecially since Im rather tired of Daddysprop but I wont get into that...

that truth is everone is so carefull what they say to her as to not upset her or make her think her ideas are wrong yet she seems to think only how she sees things are right ok Im done ranting because Im beeing unseemly now too

Magik's slave

quote:

ORIGINAL: ImpGrrl

quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave
Thank you Sir this was much better said then i could have aspecially since Im rather tired of Daddysprop but I wont get into that...

that truth is everone is so carefull what they say to her as to not upset her or make her think her ideas are wrong yet she seems to think only how she sees things are right ok Im done ranting because Im beeing unseemly now too

Magik's slave

What??

It's about the fact that her world is her world - and that none of us can tell her that she's wrong.  Any more than she could tell you that you're wrong.

I think she's been more than tolerant of others questioning her, and she's explained herself calmly and without resorting to the sort of thing you write here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956

Here we go again, it seems.  daddy'sprop247, there is a saying that appears over and over on chat boards, and you appear to need to hear it again:

You have the right to your opinions.  You do not have the right to your facts.
 
WTF????   She does not have the right to her facts?  LOL   What the heck does that mean?


I respect your opinion, and I know bandit does too.  But in fact you are not a slave simply because you declare you are one. 

Another WTF???   Who is a slave E?  Is Magik a slave?  Is prop a slave?  Is owned a slave?  Is your slave a slave?  Who determines who's a slave?  You...with your facts?  Seems slave has a wide range of meaning these days and i'm not sure who really has the right to say who is and who isn't.

I understand entirely the concept of "owned property".  Indeed, I have owned a slave who, had she been asked to discuss her enslavement, would have said much of what you have said in this thread, although frankly I hope that she would have done so more demurely, and would not have continued to argue when her behavior became unseemly. 

i don't see prop as arguing.  She is merely stating what is involved in her partnership.  And for some reason, people keep taking exception to that.  Hmmm....let's see.  Why would that be?

I also understand that ownedgirlie is correct in speaking of the powerful feelings that create a Master-slave bond in a place where actual enslavement is illegal.  But in fact you are not legally cognizable owned property outside of your and your Master's dynamic.   When you say: 

quote:

i do not remain with my Master simply because i "choose" not to leave. i remain with him because he does not wish me to have the right or freedom to leave him of my own free will, therefore he takes measures to make leaving him an impossibility

you are simply wrong.  You choose to remain with him every moment you remain with him.  This is not opinion.

Woohoo....this is not opinion!  Yet what you say if fact?  Gotta love the irony.

Perhaps you need a reality check, daddy'sprop?  Might I suggest the following:  Go to the nearest Maryland State Police station tomorrow.  Walk in and say exactly the following to the desk officer on duty:

"Sir, I am a slave who has ventured out from my Master's home with the idea that I wanted to end my enslavement by coming to the police.  But I have decided that I was wrong in doing so, and as I am absolutely his owned property, I must go back.  I recognize that he owns me and may do what he wishes to me, and I know you will support that arrangement.

Please drive me to [give him your Master's name and address] where I will return to my enslavement, which will entail my being beaten mercilessly for my transgression, possibly starved, abused sexually and otherwise, perhaps being sold to others for their sexual and/or sadistic enjoyment, and -- if He chooses -- my death.  Thank you sir."

Let us know how it goes, OK?

Well, let any slave (or sub) go to their nearest PD and tell them she was beaten last night, chained, tied to a cross, made to beg, led around like a dog....or any other countless things subs do in their relationships, and let me know how that goes.  i would really be interested.

E.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

Im not intolerent at all, I just get short of breath with Daddysprop, and maybe she doesnt do it to anyone els but she has emplied more then ones the I wasnt a slave because I didnt do things as she does!

And no Im not enviouse, I would not servive the kind of reationship she is in plain and simple. But that doesnt make her a better slave then me and thats all I am saying.

Magik's slave

quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

Im not intolerent at all, I just get short of breath with Daddysprop, and maybe she doesnt do it to anyone els but she has emplied more then ones the I wasnt a slave because I didnt do things as she does!

And no Im not enviouse, I would not servive the kind of reationship she is in plain and simple. But that doesnt make her a better slave then me and thats all I am saying.

Magik's slave

quote:

ORIGINAL: adaddysgirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

Im not intolerent at all, I just get short of breath with Daddysprop, and maybe she doesnt do it to anyone els but she has emplied more then ones the I wasnt a slave because I didnt do things as she does!

And no Im not enviouse, I would not servive the kind of reationship she is in plain and simple. But that doesnt make her a better slave then me and thats all I am saying.

Magik's slave

MS,
 
i honestly don't think prop is trying to say that she is a better slave than you.  i think what she says is that within the meaning of being a slave to her, she sees that as doing certain things.  But look at mostly everyone else here who is a slave......most do not go to such extremes.  So who is really 'wrong'?  i don't think anyone is saying what you (or others) do here is right or wrong...just different.  Try not to think that prop is talking to you....but to the thread in general.  That might help.
 
DG

quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

Im not intolerent at all, I just get short of breath with Daddysprop, and maybe she doesnt do it to anyone els but she has emplied more then ones the I wasnt a slave because I didnt do things as she does!

And no Im not enviouse, I would not servive the kind of reationship she is in plain and simple. But that doesnt make her a better slave then me and thats all I am saying.

Magik's slave

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas

As I said, we've debated this to death over the years, and you and I may just end up needing to agree to respectfully disagree with each other, which is more than fine.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia
I totally agree, can we agree that there is a difference between a submissive and a slave?
Also, there are levels of submission also.
Great thread.

LOL what on earth does that have to do with this subject?

And slaves usually are at a different level of submission.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirDominic
cjenny, to answer your question, no Dom or Master worth a damn would ever whip their sub/slave in anger.

Umm false. Just plain false.

Heck, playing in anger is something I really dig into- both as a mistress and a slave.

quote:

ORIGINAL: daddysprop247

quote:

ORIGINAL: edana

By Leonidas, logged in as his slave, again.

quote:

For those "Masters" who believe they have total and complete to do with their slaves as they will - that is hogwash, too. These people have lost all sense of reality, as far as I am concerned. Master/slave relationships are about play; sometimes very heavy play, but play none the less. If anyone has ANY doubt, just ask any legally qualified person. Real slavery is a crime.

It is so funny.  We had this debate over a decade ago on the old ASB, and I guess it still goes on, or people who weren't party to those debates just keep stirring the same damn pot.  Some people don't play at this.  There are people who have completely surrendered their autonomy in return for their owner accepting responsibility for their well-being and the outcomes in their lives.  We call them slaves.  No, they have not lost all sense of reality, they just live a reality that you do not.  Legality has nothing to do with consensual (though absolutely real) enslavement.  Legality only comes into play if someone decides that they don't want to be a slave anymore. 

You don't have to like it.  You don't have to do it.  If play is the alpha and omega for you, keep right on playing.  Just try to muster up maybe just a little bit of respect for those for whom it isn't, if you can.

Be well.

thank you edana, you took the words right out of my mouth.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirDominic
LA, your comment surprised me, as it has been my experience that you understand what is and is not ethical behavior. Are you really suggesting that you don't have an issue with someone so angry they are not in control of themselves, and taking it out on their sub? You are okay with that?

With respect, Sir Dominic

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia
LOL just as I said there is a difference between a submissive and a slave.
And slaves usually are at a different level of submission.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirDominic
LA, your comment surprised me, as it has been my experience that you understand what is and is not ethical behavior. Are you really suggesting that you don't have an issue with someone so angry they are not in control of themselves, and taking it out on their sub? You are okay with that?

With respect, Sir Dominic

Ahh there's quite a large difference between "Playing in anger" and "playing and not in control of yourself"  Your original statement said only "playing in anger."  It's completely possible to play in anger and have it be a very healthy, controlled, and positive experience all around.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

Why would you not give aftercare after physical punishment?  You still have the same dangers of a sub/slave going into shock etc as you would in a scene.  Only makes sense that a Dominate would want to make sure he/she is alright afterward.  Maybe not a snuggle fest as you put it, but still aftercare.  Just a thought.

If you would read the other posts on this topic you will read that aftercare on the part of the dom is not always required, let alone desired by the participants.

Making sure everyone is ok is everyone's responsibility at all times.  If a sub has particular needs above and beyond that- they need to communicate them beforehand. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: daddysprop247

quote:

ORIGINAL: bandit25

Yeah, that is the one right no one ever gives up...the right to walk away.

that is actually a VERY false, although common, assumption. when i became a slave it was made crystal clear to me that i was giving up ALL rights, including the right to leave of my own free will.

also, simplyangelic mentioned that everyone has a "flight or fight" instinct, that will prevent them from accepting being beaten to the point of serious injury, even death. this too is simply not true. i have no such instinct, i have come across a fair number of others who have no such instinct. if you fully understand and accept that you are indeed property, and that your very life even is in the hands of Another, then it is not outside the realm of feasibility for you to accept injury, disfigurement, even death at your Owner's hands, without even a whisper of a fight.

quote:

ORIGINAL: simplyangelic1


Aftercare doesn't always mean going "there there baby, are you ok?  How are you doing?  You are such a good girl etc.  It means monitoring the condition and making sure all is well.  It might include the huggy kissy stuff but doesn't have to.  I know a number of slaves who want to be left alone after a scene but you can bet there Masters aren't off doing whatever.  They are near by watching.