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Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 3:42:16 AM

Posts: 1005
Joined: 3/31/2004
From: Sacramento, California
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Okokok

This is an ongoing fierce debate in one of the yahoo groups I'm a member of, lol, so got kinda curious what folks thoughts were on this elsewhere (prolly why I did a small rant here the other day regarding folks lying about their past - I guess the rant stems from this heated discussion that's been surging non stop this last 2 weeks in that group)- so thought I'd post this here and see what the consensus was.

Escorts and BDSM, i.e.: Escorts going into the professional world of BDSM with no real experience or knowledge - good or bad? Should they or shouldn't they?

Needless to say I'm not talking about those that are actually both, but the ones that are *faking* it as they perceive the money to be in fetish or BDSM niches, rather than just being an escort.

The questions being batted around so far are of this nature:

• Are the ones faking it an issue, or not?
• Do you frown on that practice?
• If so, why? If not, why?
• Do you think it matters?
• Does it dilute BDSM in general?
• Is it insulting to those that live and love it in a genuine fashion and aren't pantomiming or going through the motions for a few bucks?
• How important really is it that someone is honest about their background and history and experience in a personal relationship?
• How important is it that someone is being honest about their history and background and experience when they are dispensing advice or saying I agree or I dont agree in spaces like Yahoo groups, mailing lists, and boards like this?
• Someone lies about their past - do you say something or leave it - knowing it's not honest and is very misleading?

Might have a few other questions to add in here, I'm not 100% sure where I stand really, part of me says it's bad, the other says, welllllllllll, not so sure. LOL

So what say you?

Just curious since it seems to be such a strong and opinionated divide on those things.

~ShadeDiva

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~ShadeDiva
My projects of love:
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RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 4:55:14 AM

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Joined: 5/6/2004
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I keep getting this picture of paying for a submissive to show up at my door, she arrives with a pair of Velcro cuffs and one of those thin a paper whips and there I stand with my full cat and a steel collar hehehehehehehe. Not likely but I am LMAO at the look on her face.

Playing at this without knowledge is purely foolish, an unskilled Dom could seriously hurt someone, not even knowing they could. There are just to many things that can go wrong in the wrong hands.

I do not think it affects us outside the fact that when someone gets hurt we all get blamed in one way or another.

as for the last three questions

very, very, and something should be said if it is that misleading.
Not debatable with me.

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 5:56:44 AM

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Joined: 1/1/2004
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Any idiot can top within reason. (Same goes for bottoming within reason.) You don't need an advanced degree to weild a riding crop.

If some prostitute finds her pay goes up if she dresses in leather, spanks her John, and tells him he is a pathetic worm; I would not want to get in the way of free enterprise.

_____________________________

When the Lady smiles i can't resist her call. As a matter of fact, i don't resist at all. Well that depends if it is a smile or a grimmace.

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 7:22:45 AM

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From: Scotland/Tennessee
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I'm going to drop my nickle in here. This has become an ongoing issue because it has become a problem for the very reason mentioned by MasterZues when he said "when someone gets hurt we all get blamed in one way or another."

quote:

• Are the ones faking it an issue, or not?

I believe it is an issue because we all end up dealing with it at some point. Dealing with their victims, or the bad results.

quote:

• Do you frown on that practice?

I do, because there is information available to everyone. Why "fake it" when the information is there? Why not just say "I'm new to the lifestyle" and come in the right way?

quote:

• Is it insulting to those that live and love it in a genuine fashion and aren't pantomiming or going through the motions for a few bucks?

The answer to that would be yes. Even when we consider those who are professional in the lifestyle (where monetary gain is a factor) there is that passion involved when she slides her stockings on...when she touches her tools. She knows what she's doing, and she loves what she's doing. It is absolutely part of who she is. It isn't a game, it is a factor in her reality, her fine tuning...her life balance. It is insulting on so many levels!

quote:

• How important really is it that someone is honest about their background and history and experience in a personal relationship?

This is at the top of the list of Most Important Things. Regardless of personal level of experience, beginner to advanced, there is going to be growth in the relationship, any relationship. Because each and every relationship is as unique as the individuals involved, and what they bring into it. So each individual involved is going to acclimate, change, grow, evolve within the relationship, according to that. Which is really exciting when one thinks about it. That honesty going in, is what allows us to do that growing to our greatest possible potential. There's no shame in not knowing something. The shame would be in not being willing to learn, or claiming to know something falsely and putting someone else at risk. Or even worse, and oh wouldn't it be so incredibly sad, to risk a rich and beautiful relationship by telling a lie?

quote:

• How important is it that someone is being honest about their history and background and experience when they are dispensing advice or saying I agree or I dont agree in spaces like Yahoo groups, mailing lists, and boards like this?
• Someone lies about their past - do you say something or leave it - knowing it's not honest and is very misleading?

This is another biggie. Because when we advise others we are also telling them that this is "tried and true". We speak with authority, therefore the person, or persons we are speaking to believe that the information is based on our personal experience. So how important is it that we be honest about our background experience when dispensing advice? Well gee...let me think...la la la...thinking...doing nails....thinking...um...it's critically important that we are honest! That is pretty much a no brainer there. But Shade, you're right in asking this question, because how often is advice given actually based on real experience?

I had a young woman email me the other day inviting me to a "Dominant" class. She said that if I took the class that it would help me to attract more subs. It helped her to attract a "whole bunch" of financial subs. And it was "real easy". She also complimented my profile picture, but gave me a few tips on that too.

I responded to this young woman and informed her that I was raised in the BDSM lifestyle and have been a Mistress for over 30 years. I believe I have a realistic handle on being a Dominant woman, and I've never really been much interested in "real easy" or people who are. I encouraged her to participate in the message forum, take advantage of the links available, and the information on the lifestyle, and wished her success in her life.

But this is just a mild example of what is out there right now. *sigh*

If someone lies about their past, to me, and I find out about it, I will say something about it, when I find out about it, to them. If it involves someone else, I will have that someone else present as well. Communication is something that I not only insist upon, but practice practice practice moment by moment. That is not to say I'm always right. I know I'm not. In fact I'll say I'm wrong at least once a day because I figure I will be, at least once. lol

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 3:46:56 PM

Posts: 247
Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

I live in Las Vegas and there are lot's of escorts out here, and very few Pro Dommes. I have noticed many escort services that advertise for Domination, whitch I believe is very missleading. I have also seen many clients that have called strippers with whips. There experiences weren't so good and it irritates me that they claim to be a Mistress when they aren't. Some people have never done anything as far as BDSM goes and want to see if they like it. I have heard many bad stories about people trying to do sessions when they have no clue as to what they are doing. Then the newbies never want to try again, because they dont want to go through the same ordeal. That pisses me off, and I dont think they should be missleading. I also dont think it's right for them to say they are a Mistress that has sex. It makes the real ProDommes look bad.

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www.Domina.ms/love

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 7:53:57 PM

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Joined: 3/31/2004
From: Sacramento, California
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I have to say that's a very interesting stance from someone that was a real life escort herself not so very long ago (like what about 2 months ago?) Marissa.

I'd agree with it, but I'm a tad surprised you would, to be honest.

~ShadeDiva

_____________________________

~ShadeDiva
My projects of love:
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HumanFauna
Kinked
DommeWorld

(in reply to GoddessMarissa)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/23/2004 10:14:45 PM

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From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

Did I ever say I was an escort? I dont think so, where are you getting your information from? If I was I would have no problem saying so, but I am not. I personally dont care for sex at all so being an escort wouldn't be of any interest to me. I love what I do and always have.

I just started to use the internet 2 months ago. I have always advertised locally prior to using the internet.

< Message edited by GoddessMarissa -- 5/23/2004 10:17:39 PM >

_____________________________

D/s makes the world go round~~
www.Domina.ms/love

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 3:29:03 AM

Posts: 1005
Joined: 3/31/2004
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

Well off your escort page.

Yanno the one you recently killed off.

Here let me get the link off google's cache:

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:EZU_HBWnK8sJ:www.usaadultdirectory.com/master/body/1713/feedback_fs.html+702-561-1212&hl=en

I first saw that particular page about 1 year ago, when it was still active - someone showing me another money dommes escort advertisments threw me the wrong link and I popped onto it, and was all dude that's not her, and she gave me the correct one.

However, my memory, especially for faces of women, and tattoos is quite exceptional (prolly cuz I study them as I specialize in drawing women, I seem to retain an unnatural photographic memory of sorts when it comes to women's faces and shapes, and as an artist that has drawn tattoos, and a tattoo affecendio, I remember tattoos).

At any rate that page was active a year ago and as recently as about 2 months ago, last date I happened to blink by it while looking up someone else, I really dug the tattoo, or what I could make of it, lol.

So yanno, you popped onto this site, with your original post which BTW was typical of a moneydomme *post*, and so as a result you caught my attention. I love this site in particular because I don't see a lot of that type in general on the boards, and was pleased to find a space on the net unburdened by that particular greedy mindset. So yeah when I see that mentality appear, I tend to notice. And the picture you included was quite familiar.

Sooooooooo I got curious, and did a google search on your phone number which also seemed very very familiar, and wahla, your first dominant page pops up on ms.domina.com, along with an escort page that I saw only recently but it was still active.

Now you say light domination there, so yanno, I know escorts can indeed be interested in BDSM for it's own sake and yanno to buffer their services, so no biggie really, for all I know that's the way it is, and I won't judge a woman for being an escort anymore than I would judge them for being a prostitute, that's their business, after all.

So yanno I know you've been on the web for at least a year and that page was active two months ago, soooooooo being bored and now fully curuous, in light of your first post, I just did some quick looking into your whois for your new domain name which you registered on May 2, 2004, at which point you killed the ms.domina.com page and set up on extrasuite.com with your domain name pointing to it. Nothing bad really, except for the fact of a few things:

You are lying about your history right here right now.

You are lying and putting down the exact same thing you have done or do.

You are lying about how long you've been on the web.

You are lying about your opinions of escorts that advertise domination.

Why, I don't know, and I kinda don't care. You could have just posted in this post that hey *I* do it, and I think it's fine, or I do it or have done it and I don't see the problem with it. Instead, you state you think it's *wrong*, and then deny your own history, when I expressed that I was surprised at your stance considering you were a real life escort. And I was surprised - I had expected you to be honest and come up with THEIR angle in a thought provoking way, or to shed a different perspective on it from that side, not bash yourself. The more likely reality is that goddessmarissa was created 2 months ago, not that you came online 2 months ago, especially considering the nature of your first post here. Though I will admit you learned DAMN quickly when the regulars here kinda ragged you for trolling.

And please don't deny it at this point, I mean have some dignity. The female in the pictures is the same lady as in the pictures on your website, and they are *verfied* pictures from that company, which means they screened the real life escorts to make sure they were using real pics, their money and crediblity depends on that, and besides the *tattoo* is the same. So is the phone number.

I would have had a ton more respect had you copped to your experience and background and history honestly - rather than just sitting here and lying about it. I wasn't judging you for your histroy, I was saying I was surprised that you agreed.

I don't think being an escort or even a prostitute is something to be ashamed of if you made that choice yourself and found nothing wrong with it - it's not a choice I'd make for myself, but I have no issue with others making that choice for themselves and their lives. But on that same token, I don't expect them to lie about it either.

I also don't recall seeing any advertisments in the Las Vegas listing that feature such ads over the years, as I do have family that lives there and in Reno, and I do travel there somewhat frequently, and do get curious what is going on in that corner of the BDSM world. But hey, I could have missed those.

Anyway, just because you yanked your pages doesn't mean they can't be dug up, or found. Why people feel a need to invent personas, historys and backgrounds is beyond me, I just don't get why it's difficult to just be honest and say who you are. It all comes out in the end, anyway.

I will say that I agree with Lady Beckett's post, in regards to posting with an authoritative voice, which you have done here. I must say it disturbs me on a few levels that if you'd lie about your entire background, well, it makes me wonder how honest you were in your posts, your advice, and the experiences you relayed here, and if any of them really happened at all. I confess I find it sad as I have really come to like this space and the minds that frequent it, and I do feel a tad protective of it, and I truly hope the moneydomme mentality does not gain a foothold here and make this space into one where the BDSM integrity of it on a whole is called into doubt.

~ShadeDiva

_____________________________

~ShadeDiva
My projects of love:
theFetishForums
HumanFauna
Kinked
DommeWorld

(in reply to GoddessMarissa)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 3:59:42 AM

Posts: 1005
Joined: 3/31/2004
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

Ooops. that's www.domina.ms (not ms.domina.com) and it appears that your domina.ms/love page is still alive, but the first one, domina.ms/dom1/mistress.html has been yanked, unless of course you view google's cache in which case it is still viewable:
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:Ov6PDyn5JwIJ:domina.ms/dom1/mistress.html+702-561-1212&hl=en

Just figured I'd clarify that.

I LOVE google! I honestly do.

~ShadeDiva

_____________________________

~ShadeDiva
My projects of love:
theFetishForums
HumanFauna
Kinked
DommeWorld

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 10:18:26 AM

Posts: 247
Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

Actualy that page you posted was up over a year ago, and I didn't have a computer then. I wanted to see what kind of responce I would get, and that was supposed to be under the massage section, but they didnt have one. If you look, you will see it was up for only 3 mo. No I have no reason to lie. I was never an escort or taken any money for sex. I am a massage therapist as well. I do sensual massage as well as Domination. I have no reason to lie about who I am or what I do. Believe what you like.

< Message edited by GoddessMarissa -- 5/24/2004 10:20:33 AM >

_____________________________

D/s makes the world go round~~
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(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 10:35:31 AM

Posts: 247
Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

If you could tell I have only been on the net for two months. I came in here thinking I could troll and found out very fast, this is not the place. Everything that I have written about is all from experience. Yes how could I learn that much in only two months, because it's been 7 years. If you really like to know I started with massage and domination when I was 18. Of course I started novice then and did more massage then Domination to ease my way in. I have grown tired of massage and sensual massage through the years, and have converted to strictly Domination. Like I said I have never really cared for sex so it would be of no interest to be an escort. I do like this place and I like to share my feelings on certain things so I'm not leaving.

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D/s makes the world go round~~
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(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 11:26:23 AM

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I've never found escorts to be sexually motivated, or being escorts strictly for the sex. Most escorts like the payoff, which I envision to be similar to most people's dislike for work. Most don't even like to work, and most don't work for the sheer pleasure of working... most do it for the profit, or wages/salary they receive for their efforts.

Inyouagain

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(in reply to GoddessMarissa)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 11:57:32 AM

Posts: 247
Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

You can also look me up at LasVegasCityLife, LasVegasWeekly, Mercury, NiftyNickle, and last years phonebook. There all local papers

_____________________________

D/s makes the world go round~~
www.Domina.ms/love

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 11:59:38 AM

Posts: 247
Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

Im under the massage section of the phonebook, all other papers are under massage or adult section.

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D/s makes the world go round~~
www.Domina.ms/love

(in reply to ShadeDiva)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 1:40:29 PM

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From: Washington
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quote:

and that was supposed to be under the massage section,

If you have never been an escort then why does your profile on the page ShadeDiva put up say the following:
"In addition to being a fun and beautiful escort I can also indulge your fantasies and fetishes up to light domination."

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"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

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(in reply to GoddessMarissa)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 1:47:41 PM

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Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

I gave them a short text that I wanted and they took it upon themselves to put escort. They told me they didn't have a catigory for massage at the time. I let them do it, but I didn't get the responses that I liked and pulled it. I was experiementing with the net to see if it was worth going any further.

_____________________________

D/s makes the world go round~~
www.Domina.ms/love

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 2:06:14 PM

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From: Washington
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Thank you for your reply GoddessMarissa. I see little difference in what you do for pay, escort service, prostitution, and massage services when more than just theraputic massage, but that is just MHO.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to GoddessMarissa)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 3:01:13 PM

Posts: 247
Joined: 4/10/2004
From: Las Vegas NV
Status: offline

It all does involve some form of a sexual act wheather it is intercourse or not.

_____________________________

D/s makes the world go round~~
www.Domina.ms/love

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 3:37:42 PM

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I prefer to be topped rather than dominated, and I find that escorts (and strippers) are more interested in topping than the professional dommes in my area. They seem to enjoy what they're doing to me, or they're very good actresses.

< Message edited by Shyguy21040 -- 5/24/2004 6:38:50 PM >

(in reply to GoddessMarissa)

RE: Escorts and BDSM - 5/24/2004 6:12:08 PM

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Joined: 4/26/2004
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quote:

Escorts and BDSM, i.e.: Escorts going into the professional world of BDSM with no real experience or knowledge - good or bad? Should they or shouldn't they?

Escorts work in the shadow world of the sex for money industry, so they are used to flying low and avoiding the radar. So let me give a hypothetical.

Prostitute A is contacted by John B for BDSM related activities.

John B offers to pay X amount of money, but asks Prostitute A if she has any limits.

Prostitute A has no idea what a limit is, and says no.

John B, unbeknownst to Prostitute A, is actually a serial killer.

Prostitute A ends up on the slab after being beaten to death by John B, who gets away because no appropriate safeguards were in place, no safe calls, no personal information from John B given to a friend, etc.

Doesnt sound safe, doesnt sound sane, although I suppose in a sense it is consensual.

I think it is a bad idea, but unfortunately the sex industry is what it is and some percentage of those who frequent it are John B's.

Sinergy

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David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

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(in reply to Shyguy21040)

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