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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:17:53 AM   
Driver1961


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He dips His lid to all;

Excellent thread to all, and yes we also should be mindful of the less enlightened that can take OUR WORDS as GOSPEL! (Gee if I believed and tried everything I see on this site and others- I could find myself in lots of trouble!)

Lots of other considerations to take into acount I'm not going to cover them all for two reasons space and I don't want folks who read this little post thinking they can go right out and start punching and kicking safely based on this little post. Many large events have presentations on this practice and going to one will certainly teach more than what I can write here. (Thankfully many have not forgotten this on this thread)

Of course we all have different experiences and expectations and I for one would like to say that I find this 'Thug play' totally repugnant however do not condemn another's right to consentual play of this or any other nature.  One does however need to 'protect themselves legally from consequences' (I presume)  perhaps someone could enlighten me on how to do this?

I question whether the OP's Dom in question was probing a reaction rather than 'stating an intention'- something that in no way discredits the Dom?

Warm regards to all, and ease off on the testosterone FARAMIR!  We aren't all in a wrestling ring- it's a discussion forum man.


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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:20:23 AM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Domspaintoy
Yes i see a punch as a violent act but again i have no personal experience of  punch being given in the erotic sense so thats why i asked initially.


Then what I am about to say will likely further confuse you. I don't necessarily engage in this form of play to get any erotic benefit from it. Sometimes it is simply a raw and brutal contest of strategies, endurance and strength. I partake in it for many of the same reasons a runner goes running, or a football player plays football or a weight lifter lifts weight. It's not about getting my pussy wet, sometimes it's about a means of exercise, sometimes it's about a relief of stress, sometimes it's about a release, but most times it's a test of my own will, my own strength and my own endurance. Nothing erotic about it.

If you watch a boxing match on tv, do you see the participants as violent abusers? Or do you think that maybe it's the mismatch of sexes in a relationship that lead you to see it as abusive violence?

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~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:23:16 AM   
Archer


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The legal question differs state to state, however if presented as a "sports injury" most medical personel will ask fewer questions and the likelyhood of trouble is reduced (so long as the injuries are consistant with the sport form you based the play on.) Ounce of prevention.

Cure would be not much different than any other is it BDSM or is it abuse case, have a lawyer, be prepared to deal with the results of wwhat you choose to do.


Edited for spelling


< Message edited by Archer -- 7/4/2007 8:24:30 AM >

(in reply to Driver1961)
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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:24:14 AM   
callofzion


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This topic seems to have stirred up a great deal of controversy. I suggest that we resolve it by punching each other in the stomach. I'll take Faramir first, then move on to the rest of you. Please form an orderly line, no pushing, no shoving, though smashing each other in the face will be an acceptable form of line jumping.

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:24:52 AM   
Domspaintoy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

quote:

ORIGINAL: Domspaintoy
if i read many different views for punching then it may be that i may alter my view because i will have been educated by those that know, (i doubt it because its an act of violence to me).


Personally, your original post, the wording of the questions and the comment above in parenthesis shows that your mind appears to be closed to the possibility of accepting this type of play for others.

I see a huge inconsistency in the type of thinking that I have seen from many people (not just you) regarding this type of play.  It is okay for a man to use a toy that is essentially an instrument of torture (flogger, whip, cat o' nine tails, cane, etc.) to beat a woman until she is bruised or bloody but if he uses his fists then it is abuse and violent. 

For me, this type of play it is highly erotic and primal.

Knight's Kyra


I can see where you may think this but you have to understand the only time ive ever experienced punching has been in violence so i do find it hard to equate punching to something erotic.

so on that note im going to ask another question, and please remember i have already stated i have nothing to gauge this on other than what i class as a punch ...

W/we are discussing punching in the erotic/scening sense, are We saying the hand is in the closed fist and is full force type of punching? thats the only way i can describe it, but im open to the perception that the word punching may actually be misleading???

dpt

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:29:01 AM   
Archer


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Covered the "full force" thing earlier, but maybe you missed it in the fray.

Non resistance punching and kicking does not nessisarily mean swing away at full speed and follow through, I mean we don't swing away hard as we can with a bullwhip, or flogger why would it be assumed that we would do so with a fist or foot?????????

You have so much more control over a fist or a foot than you do over any toy that is not in fact an extenssion of your body.

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:39:13 AM   
kyraofMists


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Domspaintoy
W/we are discussing punching in the erotic/scening sense, are We saying the hand is in the closed fist and is full force type of punching? thats the only way i can describe it, but im open to the perception that the word punching may actually be misleading???


To punch is to strike with a closed fist.  To kick is to strike with the foot.  Neither indicates the force that is used with the hand or foot. 

Just like with any other toy the top will vary the force of the strike to create the sensation that he wants.  The sensation can be something like a massage, very rhythmic and monotonous.  Or it can be a much harder strike that expells the breath from my body....  or it can be something rather annoying and spur me to turn around and strike back....  It is a sensation that can be varied and it is flesh to flesh which is very intimate.

He does not hit to harm me, he hits to create the sensation and reaction that he wants.  A brawl is not what occurs.  He is generally very controlled and precise during this type of play, though it may appear to those watching that it is not.

Knight's Kyra

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(in reply to Domspaintoy)
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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:41:24 AM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Domspaintoy
W/we are discussing punching in the erotic/scening sense, are We saying the hand is in the closed fist and is full force type of punching? thats the only way i can describe it, but im open to the perception that the word punching may actually be misleading???


In the erotic sense there are different ways that I engage in this type of activity and they are much "milder" than playing in the non-erotic sense of this form of play.

Sometimes it is a simple resistance/force play scene where there is a fight that culminates in some form of sexual activity.

I also love punching in erotic scenes where I am bound or kneeling on a bench and the punching is very localized and combined with massage or other sexually erotic activities. Punches to that sweet spot where ass cheek meets thigh are heavenly.

On the far end of the spectrum is the non erotic play. For me that is a no holds barred, I am out to win...or at least not get beaten scenario. It would look exactly like what you see happen in the ring.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to Domspaintoy)
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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:41:35 AM   
Driver1961


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ARCHER- granted on the 'sparring aspect' something that is built upon with experience by those that have real interest in what they are doing- not like the many trollers here that look, read and then go about implementing badly.


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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:52:23 AM   
Domspaintoy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: callofzion

This topic seems to have stirred up a great deal of controversy. I suggest that we resolve it by punching each other in the stomach. I'll take Faramir first, then move on to the rest of you. Please form an orderly line, no pushing, no shoving, though smashing each other in the face will be an acceptable form of line jumping.


OK if i just watch to get E/everyones reactions??

*grin*

dpt.

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 8:53:10 AM   
SweetAndInnocent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Areflectionofyou

This is called Thug play in the scene . I don't even like watching it, but to each their own.
quote:



I've never heard it referred to as thug play.  In fact, all presentations that I have seen on it call it rough body play.  Somehow, I think the "thug" reference is meant to make it seem "wrong".

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen68

A while ago I was punched unintentionally, not in my stomach, but higher up... right between my breasts.  Not super hard, but hard enough to knock the wind out of me for about 30 seconds.  When I was finally able to breath again I began to cry.  Not from pain but from the unexpected shock of what had just happened.  He felt awful because it was an accident and afterwards I was somewhat confused because I realized that it turned me on.  So this is something I would consider.  It has the potential of being a turn on for me.


I really enjoy rough body play, but have usually limited it to the shoulders, legs, butt, etc. Just a possible warning on this one Aileen.  During a recent conversation with Jay Wiseman, he mentioned that this is one of the "undefendable" things in court.  Not that there is anything wrong with punching, his comment was specifically for punching in the chest.

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 9:18:34 AM   
Wildfleurs


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FR...

We don't do punching or kicking play, but I am familiar with the concept.  It doesn't strike me as any more unsafe than any of the other activities done.  I don't think its abusive or anything like that... if anything it strikes me as having a strong potential to be dorky (it strikes me as also having the potential to be interesting to watch at least).

C~


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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 9:22:13 AM   
BOUNTYHUNTER


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NO punchimg unless you call a ringing face slap a punch...bounty

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 10:17:27 AM   
Alumbrado


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quote:

I have more than enough not to automaticaly write such off as an urban legend just because it fits some spurious agrument where someone is trying too hard to prove a point.


I guess the folks at Snopes aren't  fortunate enough to have risen to your level of expertise then...

http://www.snopes.com/horrors/freakish/houdini.asp


And before the same tired old 'you can't consent to an assault, so BDSM is illegal where I live' mantra repeats itself, will some other 'expert' please explain why these people aren't in jail:

http://www.dogbrothersvideo.com/promo01.wmv


Put me down on the side of consenting adults having the right to do a lot of things that I may or may not approve of or enjoy, and in hearty agreement with those who see the hypocrisy rampant .




< Message edited by Alumbrado -- 7/4/2007 10:31:36 AM >

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 10:35:09 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


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I saw lots of kicking and punching play at Leather Retreat- both males and females as tops and bottoms.  It was really HAWT. 

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"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 10:43:48 AM   
jaunty1


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Melissa and I engage in this quite often; though not as a form of play. There are times that she is so wound up from work that she needs a good outlet to release the tension; a good sparring match does that for her.
 
I don't baby or coddle her during these sessions; I punch,  I kick, I backhand...she punches, she kicks, she uses every tool available in her training to take me down; just as I do the same. More often than not, we come away brusied and bloody, but feeling 100% better.
 
Is it safe? Define safe. Neither of us have ever been hospitalized; nor have we ever required a trip to the hospital. We have never had the MP's called on us for domestic violence; her parents have seen her bruised and battered; they have never questioned whether it's abuse or not. Heck, her father is the one who taught her originally to fight like a man.
 
People physically fight all the time; men and women; we don't ever question whether they are abusing each other. Or whether a little fist fight on the street is dangerous.
 
What happens behind closed doors is no different; we just do it for different reasons.
 
Live well
 
Alex

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 10:57:29 AM   
daddysprop247


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punching....a subject which i've often wished to discuss here but wasn't sure of the reception it would get. as others have more than adequately explained, many engage in punching during the course of a scene, as a form of play or even as a form of physical therapy of sorts. my Master punches me (in the stomach and anywhere else except my head, a current limit he's placed on himself), kicks me, etc...when i refer to being beaten, i am most often referring to these sorts of activities. we are not big BDSM people, we don't have a toy bag or a dungeon, we don't engage in scening, etc. when he beats me it's never about mutual pleasure or fulfillment. it's either a matter of punishment...i've slipped up and now i'm paying the piper. or a matter of him needing the physical release, after a stressful day or period in his life, beating me to ease the tension and bring him back down to a place of calm and peace. either way i understand it and appreciate it.

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 11:09:44 AM   
TemptingNviceSub


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While I would not mind a bit of a grapple now and then, especially if extremely frustrated! Being punched would not be on my list of desirables..But I can imagine viewing such would be highly interesting..with that being said however..anyone who would punch me in the stomach would also need to be very much into vomit play as well!....Tempting

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 11:14:25 AM   
Faramir


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quote:

ORIGINAL: callofzion

This topic seems to have stirred up a great deal of controversy. I suggest that we resolve it by punching each other in the stomach. I'll take Faramir first, then move on to the rest of you. Please form an orderly line, no pushing, no shoving, though smashing each other in the face will be an acceptable form of line jumping.




_____________________________

True masters, true subs and slaves, X many years in the lifestyle, Old Guard this and High Protocol that--it's like a convention of D&D nerds were allowed to have sex once, and they decided to make a religion out of it.

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RE: Punching your sub/slave? - 7/4/2007 11:20:06 AM   
givemyall


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(fast reply)

I guess it's each to their own, we all have like and dislikes..... personally I would have to warn any Dom that was considering punching me, that even though its ok, I have an allergic reaction to it which causes my teeth to clench down at a later date, this can happen at anytime and normally at an inappropraite moment

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