RE: Resentment while obeying

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akbarbarian -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/26/2007 10:47:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willowspirit Four pages of posts... whew! Lots of good stuff too. Just a thought. If You truly wish to become her "Master" You need to come to the realization that it means You Own ALL of her. her body, her heart, her thoughts, her health, her emotions, her spirit, her words, and her resentment. If You OWN it you are responsible for it. Her job is to surrender it up to You, to be open, to state it as clearly as she can. She also has the duty to work with You on it, as You need her to. It's not some sort of linear development either. -- IE. bottom to submissive to slave. -- Not all who bottom are submissive. Some of the best slaves are "contractually" submitting in a relationship but are quite Dominant outside of it. Some deep submissives can't make good slaves because they can't state their needs clearly, or find a confidence in who they are, or find any real joy in service, but are psychologically resigned to obey anyway -- and not happily. Some just want to be "sex slaves". Same sort of thing with Dominants. Some may be quite domineering, yet get nothing but resentment. Some may not have the inter-personal skills to "master" anyone. Some Dominants may be so lacking confidence, that they find no joy in taking charge and being responsible for another human being. That's just a few examples. Sorry, I can't make it any easier for You. Keep at it. Like others have said elsewhere .... It's a journey, not a destination. All the bottom/sub/slave has to do is show up? It takes two to tango. Masters aren't magic. Your post was nice enough, and well intended I'm sure, but I honestly wonder how many people on this site actually have a BDSM life outside of these message boards. Oh wait, no I don't.

akbarbarian -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/26/2007 10:51:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: puella I have read a couple of the first few replies to your query, and having no previous encounter with you on the forums will offer you this to mull over (given I did not read the entire 4 pages of replies, it may have already come up, but oh well). At what point did you forget that your submissive/slave/whatever title you need to supply for your relationship partner, is a person? I have encountered in previous relationships and in many discussions here on the forums this most fundamental forgetfulness over and over. A woman can be profoundly submissive, can desire to please you and serve you and still not find every little (or big) thing you require or desire of her to be completely blissful, joy inspiring or even at all pleasant. You are harping on the fact that she was resentful. How about looking at the fact that though, for what ever reason, she found it distasteful or personally unpleasant, she complied with your wishes and submitted. Sometimes, we human submissive types do things we do not like or want to do for our dominants and sometimes, that bald submission is in and of itself is all we can manage that is pleasing...just submission, just compliance... Sometimes, we human submissive types, absolutely detest, do not understand, and dread some of the things our dominants ask of us. Sometimes, we even fail to comply with demands and wishes placed upon us by our dominants. That does not make our submission less real, less worthwhile or less committed. It just goes to show you that you are working with an actual person in this relationship, not an automated sex doll that only has one programmed response... a mechanical smile and a "Yes, Master!" Remember that she is a person and be proud of the fact that even though she obviously, and for what ever reason or myriad of reasons which can range from the simple to the long-standing and complex, she obeyed your orders...it may not have been as effortless and graceful as you would have liked, but she obeyed you. Your (and I would argue any) submissive, from time to time may not, and I would also argue, can not possibly love every little thing you command and desire of her. Though she may love serving and pleasing you, she may actually quite adamantly dislike some of the things you ask/require her to submit to. If you really want to get to the root of the resentment...talk to her and be prepared to put in a bit of work (and in my opinion, work you as a dominant should fundamentally love) getting to better know your submissive, what makes her tick, and what it is that is making her not tick quite so loudly as she obeys you despite her own displeasure. Remember, being a dominant is far more intricate than barking out orders and having your life greatly eased by the labors of another who is devoted to you....that would just make you a lazy bastard...well perhaps a lucky lazy bastard. Being a dominant means you actively (not passively) take control of the situation and the woman you have chosen to be in and be with. If you can not handle that, you will probably find it more rewarding to pay some chick for easy pleasure without complication or lack of customer satisfaction. Take some time to think about this. Jen Someone with some experience! I can really tell you are no paper tiger. The submissive personality you describe shines through, and comes to life for me when I read it. Your insight as to what goes in is really good stuff, and throught provoking. If you like writing, I'd consider publishing someday. No I'm not kidding. Even if it doesn't solve all of my problems yet, the clearer I see things the closer I am to the right choices in the future whatever they might be.

akbarbarian -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/26/2007 10:52:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: foreverminx From your previous posts and this one included when you mention her going off to mud baths and being gone for 5 days... it seems like she would rather be with her family and friends than being a slave to you. She doesn't contact for hours, she is resentful of orders you give you... you are clearing landmines before dominating.... it seems like there is a bigger question you need to be asking her............. does she really want to be your slave? This has indeed been a source of confusion for me, and I have directly asked her questions like this.

akbarbarian -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/26/2007 10:57:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SlaveSoul greetings all, mia apologises if this has been said before, but when mia and her Master were just starting the relationship (we both come from a BDSM background) mia was very very frequently resentful of commands, even though to be commanded, and enslaved, and "put beneath the whip" was mia's fondest wish, and most aching need. The only thing that fixed this issue for mia was time. A slave needs quite a lot of time to trust her Master (she is giving over her entire life, that is quite a risk for anyone to take). Slaves also need time to trust themselves (my desire is finally out in the open, can i do it? do i have the courage, and strength to follow my dreams???) and the dynamic of the relationship before they can let go, and just be what they are. Might mia suggest, instead of pushing her to be a certain way and trying to mould her at this early stage, maybe "stand back" and just watch her, sit and talk with her about her goals, her wishes for her slavery, and how she sees herself; get to know what you have at your feet; mia knows that if people do that with her, her slave responses come naturally, she bonds very easily. mia hopes she hasn't offended, or displeased with her reply. girl wishes well, mia{L} Property of Logos. Sometimes talking about her fantasy is much more productive than talking about the real, immediate situations. It has helped in the past, and I hope it continues to work as well. Once the fantasy is examined, it's easy to compare the ideal fantasy to the reality and see what's "not quite right". That's often the cause of a serious problem.

akbarbarian -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/26/2007 11:00:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit quote: ORIGINAL: slaveofKaos I was trying to protect myself from things I was afarid of instead of trusting in Master to decide what was right for me. Huh... I would actually call that the right thing and not the wrong thing in this case You might ask her yourself instead of speaking for her. All this lecturing, from various people that I don't listen to my slave, and guess what? She speaks up and still you don't listen.

akbarbarian -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/26/2007 11:03:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance Either way, you are rather like a Timex. I find it amazing you will take such a kicking and keep on ticking. Kudos for that. I do get somethat ticked off now and then, but noone's perfect I suppose. Thanks [:D]

AquaticSub -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 3:37:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: akbarbarian quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit quote: ORIGINAL: slaveofKaos I was trying to protect myself from things I was afarid of instead of trusting in Master to decide what was right for me. Huh... I would actually call that the right thing and not the wrong thing in this case You might ask her yourself instead of speaking for her. All this lecturing, from various people that I don't listen to my slave, and guess what? She speaks up and still you don't listen. She speaks up and says... what? That, very convientently for you, the problem has been decided to be all her fault. I think it's utterly amazing that in a relationship so riddled with communication issues that it boils down to her trying to top from the bottom. You ask for advice and than seem to ignore every piece of it. What are you doing to fix this because, quite frankly, I don't buy the topping from the bottom line. In everything I've seen you post, it's been "all her fault, none of mine". I hope, for the sake of Jodi, that you realize you are going to have work your little tail off as well to fix this. D/s relationships aren't any easier than vanilla ones. Hell, they may be harder. But hey, nobody said being a master would be easy.

willowspirit -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 10:23:28 AM)
Both roles require heavy thinking, communication skills, committment, and WORK. quote: ORIGINAL: akbarbarian quote: ORIGINAL: willowspirit ...... If You truly wish to become her "Master" You need to come to the realization that it means You Own ALL of her. her body, her heart, her thoughts, her health, her emotions, her spirit, her words, and her resentment. If You OWN it you are responsible for it. Her job is to surrender it up to You, to be open, to state it as clearly as she can. She also has the duty to work with You on it, as You need her to. It's not some sort of linear development either. -- IE. bottom to submissive to slave. -- Not all who bottom are submissive. Some of the best slaves are "contractually" submitting in a relationship but are quite Dominant outside of it. Some deep submissives can't make good slaves because they can't state their needs clearly, or find a confidence in who they are, or find any real joy in service, but are psychologically resigned to obey anyway -- and not happily. Some just want to be "sex slaves". Same sort of thing with Dominants. Some may be quite domineering, yet get nothing but resentment. Some may not have the inter-personal skills to "master" anyone. Some Dominants may be so lacking confidence, that they find no joy in taking charge and being responsible for another human being. That's just a few examples. Sorry, I can't make it any easier for You. Keep at it. Like others have said elsewhere .... It's a journey, not a destination. All the bottom/sub/slave has to do is show up? It takes two to tango. Masters aren't magic. Your post was nice enough, and well intended I'm sure, but I honestly wonder how many people on this site actually have a BDSM life outside of these message boards. Oh wait, no I don't. After playtime negotiations, bottoms just show up... yes, pretty much that's it! A submissive submits -- "submissive" is a personality trait, btw. But a slave ---- that's what I highlighted above in the dark pink. a slave IS work. absolutely. and that's what I wrote -- I'm sorry you missed it. Masters can seem magical ... sometimes. Take the time to grow into your role. Ownership alone doesn't make you her "Master". Her commitment doesn't make you a Master. Master is about "master-ING" her, like earning a Masters Degree at a university. Both take time, study, work, trial and error, participating in a program, talking with others -- Lots of others! No one is born with a Masters degree, though some are born naturally dominant -- and some aren't. Question ? Is there a M.A.s.T. chapter near you? (Masters And slaves Together). We find it to be a wonderful resource, and the discussion topics deal with issues very much like yours. The 2007 Great Lakes Region Master and slave personally facilitate the group. There are many MANY types and variations of people who are in the BDSM lifestyle. That's my partial listing above was all about. That, and to help give you some more categories to use for insights. Y/you T/two may or may not individually be one of those I listed... but the point I also wished to make is that IT'S OKAY . Be true to who and what you are. Discover what that really truly is. and reality and fantasy don't always mix well. But it's okay. Regarding your parting comment... Are you asking me if I actually have a BDSM life outside of these boards? Yes, in fact I do. Emphasis on the "s" part of the "D/s", and I am working hard at preparing myself for the honor of being SomeOne's slave. No matter how deeply submissive in personality I am, I still need to learn about myself. I need to learn how to NOT hold back and hide areas of myself that I am shy or worried about. I need to develop skills that will give me confidence in my ability to serve... and much more. Be careful judging people. I've given you and yours benefit of the doubt, and honestly tried to help. Others have too, even if their help was in the form of jest. -- which, you've taken pretty well, it seems.

iammachine -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 1:51:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: akbarbarian quote: ORIGINAL: willowspirit Four pages of posts... whew! Lots of good stuff too. Just a thought. If You truly wish to become her "Master" You need to come to the realization that it means You Own ALL of her. her body, her heart, her thoughts, her health, her emotions, her spirit, her words, and her resentment. If You OWN it you are responsible for it. Her job is to surrender it up to You, to be open, to state it as clearly as she can. She also has the duty to work with You on it, as You need her to. It's not some sort of linear development either. -- IE. bottom to submissive to slave. -- Not all who bottom are submissive. Some of the best slaves are "contractually" submitting in a relationship but are quite Dominant outside of it. Some deep submissives can't make good slaves because they can't state their needs clearly, or find a confidence in who they are, or find any real joy in service, but are psychologically resigned to obey anyway -- and not happily. Some just want to be "sex slaves". Same sort of thing with Dominants. Some may be quite domineering, yet get nothing but resentment. Some may not have the inter-personal skills to "master" anyone. Some Dominants may be so lacking confidence, that they find no joy in taking charge and being responsible for another human being. That's just a few examples. Sorry, I can't make it any easier for You. Keep at it. Like others have said elsewhere .... It's a journey, not a destination. All the bottom/sub/slave has to do is show up? It takes two to tango. Masters aren't magic. Your post was nice enough, and well intended I'm sure, but I honestly wonder how many people on this site actually have a BDSM life outside of these message boards. Oh wait, no I don't. I don't know how you came to that conclusion from willowspirit's post. Nothing in her post states that a slave is strictly passive (see "She also has the duty to work with You on it, as You need her to. "), just that as a "master", final responsibility and guidance is in your hands. You are the pervasive guiding force to your submissive, you have more to consider than solely your wants and what benefits you alone. Being the owner of a slave, their needs are your ultimate responsibility. Again, that doesn't mean they have a carte blanche and are absolved of all responsibility, but again ultimately, their well being and the shape of their involvement in your dynamic is your call, and hopefully those judgements have not been made in a vacuum. I find it interesting, that you come here and appear to ask for advice, but seem to pay very little attention to much if any of it. If you only want to listen to perspectives that validate the model of what you want to hear, why bother asking? You most certainly don't have to agree with everyone or anyone, and feel free to take any words with a grain of salt, but come on, man, you're drowning in it! "Your post was nice enough, and well intended I'm sure..." but my eyes are glazed over, my mind is apparently closed and I really don't give a damn because I've already made my decisions - whether they be sound or not - and you are not validating them for me! The world is not the "yes man" that you seek. I'm sorry for my little bit of creative writing there, and if I sound a bit harsh, but that's the perception that I'm getting. "...I honestly wonder how many people on this site actually have a BDSM life outside of these message boards." Critisizing (hell, outright insulting) the same people that have offered you their insight also makes any show of "gratitude" (previous actual quoted portion) ring... terribly hollow. As for RL experience, some do, some don't, I can't speak for anyone but myself, and I don't have an inclination to toot my own horn. Ultimately it matters little since that statement was clearly just a stab. I did notice in another post somewhere that you have named off a laundry list of events, classes, munches and this n thats that you have attended, as if they were badges. That's all fine and good, but says precious little about your actual ability, credibility or lack thereof - simply that you have attended these things. Communities like that are somewhat good for insulating themselves against predators, so provided you haven't been ousted from those groups that does say something nominally positive (though they aren't fool proof, so it's nothing definitive) - however a laundry list does not a character reference make. You don't gain respect by promoting and marketing your accomplishments, you gain credibility by behaving in a way that inspires it. Anyway, that's just my .02 from the peanut gallery. I otherwise have very little to say that hasn't probably already been said.

celticlord2112 -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 2:55:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: akbarbarian All the bottom/sub/slave has to do is show up? It takes two to tango. Masters aren't magic. Your post was nice enough, and well intended I'm sure, but I honestly wonder how many people on this site actually have a BDSM life outside of these message boards. Oh wait, no I don't. Brie or camembert--which would you prefer?

MadRabbit -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 3:37:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AquaticSub quote: ORIGINAL: akbarbarian quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit quote: ORIGINAL: slaveofKaos I was trying to protect myself from things I was afarid of instead of trusting in Master to decide what was right for me. Huh... I would actually call that the right thing and not the wrong thing in this case You might ask her yourself instead of speaking for her. All this lecturing, from various people that I don't listen to my slave, and guess what? She speaks up and still you don't listen. She speaks up and says... what? That, very convientently for you, the problem has been decided to be all her fault. I think it's utterly amazing that in a relationship so riddled with communication issues that it boils down to her trying to top from the bottom. You ask for advice and than seem to ignore every piece of it. What are you doing to fix this because, quite frankly, I don't buy the topping from the bottom line. In everything I've seen you post, it's been "all her fault, none of mine". I hope, for the sake of Jodi, that you realize you are going to have work your little tail off as well to fix this. D/s relationships aren't any easier than vanilla ones. Hell, they may be harder. But hey, nobody said being a master would be easy. I look forward to reading his next post when he's single entitled "Why cant I find one trully submissive slave who will actually listen to me?" Edited to Add : Since you have already stated in the past that you dont think in terms of right or wrong (or perhaps care about them at all), then that tends to present a serious flaw in the idea of "trusting my Master to do whats right for me". What if I rephrased it as ...."The problem is I need to stop being afraid and instead, trust in my Master who doesnt care about right and wrong to do whats right for me".

AquaticSub -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 5:17:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit What if I rephrased it as ...."The problem is I need to stop being afraid and instead, trust in my Master who doesnt care about right and wrong to do whats right for me". That would be a problem. The reason I can trust Valyraen so much is that he has a moral compass. He knows right from wrong and we have had long discussions regarding our own morals and personal codes of ethics so I know I can count on him. Honestly, AK, if your slave doesn't trust you to do what's right and wrong for her you should look in a mirror first. What have you done to earn her trust? How have you shown her that you care for her and make the best choices for the both of you, not just yourself?

feastie -> RE: Resentment while obeying (8/27/2007 8:57:18 PM)
Fast reply: Of COURSE it's all her fault. Any and all problems are her fault. He is completely blameless. [:'(]

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