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RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:39:38 AM   
CutieMouse


Posts: 81
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterA56

Thank you for the introspective and thoughtful response, SNSBBW.  However, what I am stating with my brief introductory message - "establish control immediately" - is to establish control of the communications between the sub/slave and Myself.  I would never expect immediate trust from a potential sub/slave.  I DO, however, expect immediate RESPECT. That is a basic tennant of the Dom/sub as you should well know.


I skimmed your ad, and *to me* it read as if you wished to establish complete control of the submissive, period. I did not see anything in your ad explaining you simply wish to be the person in charge of the direction conversations might take. I'd suggest clarifying that, as it reads a bit "uber-dom" - ish... which a lot of submissives (like me) equate with "fake" dominants.

As to respect, it is a two way street. If you wish a submissive to respect you, you should show him/her equal respect... I have no insight to your method of communicating, but is it possible those with whom you chat don't feel respected, and are thus withdawing from the conversation?

quote:


When I communicate with a potential sub/slave I ask them to express all of their needs, wishes and desires.  I am completely open to whatever they feel is important to share.  I explain that it is important for an exchange of expectations to determine if there is compatibility and a connection.  I also explain that this is a process and takes time to arrive at a pont in time when SURRENDER actually takes place.


It is also possible that you are requesting them to "express all of their needs, wishes and desires" too soon... I'm sorry, but those are rather private and personal things to me, and I don't discuss them lightly - which means you have to be in the "has serious potential" pile before I'll even consider such a discussion, and asking too soon will result in my bumping you to the "just looking for masturbatory fodder" pile.

quote:


My approach is from a point of caring, safety, strength and control, which a potential sub/slave would recognize as desirable in a Master, IF they are SERIOUS about being collared and/or owned.


One would think... however, you are also dealing with a written medium, which makes it difficult to read tone and intent. It's easy to be missunderstood. It's also easy to get so frustrated that you delete the entire flipping profile (as I did with mine), and decide to fly under the radar...

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:40:42 AM   
MasterA56


Posts: 30
Joined: 10/11/2007
Status: offline 		You are entitled to your own opinion.  I imagine you would disagree that the earth is round or that the sun sets in the west.

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:41:47 AM   
TotalState


Posts: 278
Joined: 9/3/2007
Status: offline 		You should be asking for politeness, not respect.  Respect is earned, and never given.

Perhaps you put some different meaning into respect than most.  Perhaps you should elaborate on this when you demand 'respect' outright.  Otherwise, you'll get confusion, like in this thread.


_____________________________

Spanking with a smile, living with feeling.

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:44:15 AM   
MissIsis


Posts: 473
Joined: 1/1/2005
Status: offline 		I have always thought it unfair for Dominants, or submissives to call someone a fake just because the person realizes there is something that isn't right for them. 

Just because they flee or disappear after one's contact with them,  doesn't, in my opinion mean they are fake.  It might not even be that they have cold feet.  It could simply mean that they realized the Dominant they were corresponding with, wasn't for them.  Personally, at least a note is nice, but I have known people who in an effort to avoid drama, have just disappeared.  In some instances, they didn't want to be pressured, possibly more than they had already been pressured.  Perhaps there was something during the course of the conversation that alarmed them in some way.  Maybe the Dominant was too forceful in wanting to meet the submissive, when the submissive clearly wasn't ready. 

The nice thing about online, is it gives some people a little extra feeling of security while they get to know people.  And very often, there are some, who do not contribute to making the person they are corresponding with, comfortable enough to promote honesty. 

Better they disappear online than before the investment of real-time, money, & more of one's heart.  



(in reply to TwistedLady)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:44:18 AM   
MasterA56


Posts: 30
Joined: 10/11/2007
Status: offline 		Thank you for the insights.

As to your suggestion: I'd suggest clarifying that, as it reads a bit "uber-dom" - ish... which a lot of submissives (like me) equate with "fake" dominants.  <<< Exactly what would you suggest as an improvement to make me appear less "fake"? 

(in reply to CutieMouse)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:47:05 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterA56

You are entitled to your own opinion.  I imagine you would disagree that the earth is round or that the sun sets in the west.


Then you imagine wrong. I would agree the earth is round and the sun setting in the west, well ill go with you on that too as i really haven't a clue.
 
The truth is i object to your universal truths that have very little truth in them except for you. If you want my respect then earn it. If you want to control communications with me then earn the rights to that too.
Don't tell me in your first breath that i will respect you and you will control communication because that is the quickest way for me to feel no respect for you at all and to not want to communicater at all.

_____________________________

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If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:49:13 AM   
MasterA56


Posts: 30
Joined: 10/11/2007
Status: offline 		Well, this is a "win-win", I don't want your respect!  How cool is that?  LOL!

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:52:13 AM   
sweetNsmartBBW


Posts: 167
Joined: 5/16/2007
Status: offline 		Hello again...

I think that, until a recent post, it seemed that You were saying that Dom/me's deserved respect based solely on their role; may not be what You meant- but certainly came across that way.

I try to treat everyone respectfully- just the way I was raised.  I don't base it on things like gender, age, orientation, or role.  However,  just because I am respectful- it does not mean that I respect an individual.  I can be very courteous to someone without them having my respect.     I disagree that actual respect is a given; it is indeed earned in my world.  Certainly makes it more valuable in my eyes as well.

Communication is a two way street- and yes, I understand Your desire to be in control of it- but again, until there is a reason for a submissive to hand over that control (even in communication)- it's quite possible that it is Your demeanor and posturing that is scaring away the very people You are accusing of being fakes.   Do I desire to be collared?  You betcha!  Does that mean that I'm letting someobdy I don't know take over from the very beginning?  Dictating terms of communication and such?  Nope, it certainly does not.  I need to get to know a person before we even start to venture there.  Until then, He and I are merely acquaintances... 

"My approach is from a point of caring, safety, strength and control, which a potential sub/slave would recognize as desirable in a Master, IF they are SERIOUS about being collared and/or owned."

And, while ~I~ would agree with the above statement- from a personal point of view- I gotta say, I know it's MY point of view.  There are LOTS of folks for whom those things would have little or no bearing on a collar.   Just because somebody wants something else does not make them any less real or serious about this than I am, or You are.  It simply makes them different- and that's what makes the world go 'round.






_____________________________

There are two kinds of strengths: the strength to lead, and the strength to follow; the strength to control, and the strength to yield. There are two kinds of power: the power to strip away another's soul bare, and the power to stand naked. Yaldah Tova

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 10:52:51 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterA56

Well, this is a "win-win", I don't want your respect!  How cool is that?  LOL!


You may not want mine but, you are DEMANDING any sub / slaves who contacts you / you contact in regards to a relationship.
All i am trying to say to you is that i think and hell if i'm wrong i'll apologise, that you will find very few subs / slaves who will feel you DESERVE instant respect.

< Message edited by missturbation -- 10/15/2007 10:54:04 AM >

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:04:06 AM   
givemyall


Posts: 620
Joined: 12/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterA56
I imagine you would disagree that the earth is round or that the sun sets in the west.


So by your response you say that if someone doesn't agree with you, then they are nothing but argumentative, I see now why people are disappearing on you - personally I think that if someone is willing to listen to other peoples views and discuss them in an adult manner, then that deserves alot more respect than the label you have bestowed upon yourself

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:04:13 AM   
jezzabelle


Posts: 391
Joined: 2/5/2005
From: Southeastern, MA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterA56

TRUST is earned.

RESPECT is a given...always...universally...for everyone!!

This is why the world is so full of hatred and anger.  Because NO ONE has RESPECT for anyone. 

Everyone has RESPECT for an elderly person walking down the street, whether they know them or not.  A person doesn't stop an elderly person on the street and say, "You must EARN my respect!" 

I respect any potential sub/slave that I initiate contact with or has initiated contact with me.  This is part of the GOLDEN RULE!



Trust is earned, yes.  It is built over time and grows.  Respect, just like trust, is earned.  How can you respect a person you don't know and know absolutely nothing about?  I'm sorry, but I don't respect an elderly person just because they are old.  They are no different than any other person walking down the street, other than they've been on this planet longer than I have.  For all I know, they could be some dispicable low life.  Once I get to know a person, then they begin to earn my respect, assuming they've proven they are deserving of it.

Now, common courtesy should always be given immediately.  Be polite and treat others as you'd like to be treated. 

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:06:30 AM   
Maya2001


Posts: 1656
Joined: 8/22/2007
From: Woodstock ONT,CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

My approach is from a point of caring, safety, strength and control, which a potential sub/slave would recognize as desirable in a Master, IF they are SERIOUS about being collared and/or owned.



there is one important missing detail,  it is called establishing trust

I would be an absolute  fool to trust anyone based on their say so,  that they are caring, safe and in control,

That is something they have to prove to me  first before I am will to submit to them, and that is done by starting an online friendship first, and as a friend I am an equal, I am not obligated at that point to act as the submissive this allows me equal footing to ask questions  inorder to know the person better and determine if our views and interests are compatable, I want to know what the doms experiences are, by questioning them repeatly in different areas i can determine if they are changing answers or not being quite truthful.

So I am not surprised that you are scaring off so many subs , I would not call them wannabes but smart safety minded subs instead  who recognize the dangerous position they could potentially be placed in by accepting you on the terms you are insisting on

And  even though I had some experience I still would not be foolish or stupid enough to agree to accept a dom on terms that you are insisting on,  and as others mentioned a dom does not demand respect they earn it.  Have you heard of the terms safe, sane and consensual  nothing you have said suggests you subscribe to these ideals.


< Message edited by Maya2001 -- 10/15/2007 11:14:16 AM >

_____________________________

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(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:08:44 AM   
MasterA56


Posts: 30
Joined: 10/11/2007
Status: offline 		Thank you, all, for your opinions and advice.  This has been extremely educational and eye-opening.  I am always impressed and amazed by the diversity of thought among individuals on even such a seemingly innocuous topic.

While there may be a difference of opinion on some aspects of the "wanna-be" discussion, one thing seems absolutely certain:

MasterA56 is a brute and a bully. 

Duly noted.

(in reply to sweetNsmartBBW)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:20:30 AM   
kittyinpink


Posts: 83
Joined: 10/7/2007
Status: offline 		I'm new to bdsm but not new to meeting people from the net.  I've met about 7 people from various sites and all have been great, sometimes even life changing experiences. 

There was only one time I backed out of a meeting.  The reason was that he called last minute changing our meeting place from a restaurant near a friend and where I knew the staff, to a place I had never heard of in a part of town I'd never been.  The other reason is that he lied about his age saying he was at least 10 years younger than he really was... which is funny because I like older men so I would of been more turned on if he had just told the truth... but I digress =P

His reaction was irrate phone calls along the line of "You big fake!   You're just like all these other girls online!  Go date your stupid college boys!" and other offensive things.

I'm not saying people aren't fakes, but everybody has their reasons. 


_____________________________

He knew he should leave
That this could only turn cold
She was a bad bad girl
So he told her so

http://youralice.livejournal.com/

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:21:22 AM   
sweetNsmartBBW


Posts: 167
Joined: 5/16/2007
Status: offline 		You came here trying to find out why something was happening, why You were getting the responses You were getting.  Why submissives were disappearing on You; and to see if Others had similar experiences. 

For me, if I asked such a question- and got these kind of responses- don't know that I'd be saying I was a brute and bully.  But, I'd certainly wonder why I was perceived as being such.  And, I'd have to wonder if that's what the people that kept disappearing on me thought, too.  Then, I'd have to figure out what to do about it...if, anything.

I certainly understand feeling defensive; but there's no reason for it really.  The opinions of strangers should not matter all that much; however, that's not to say we can't learn from them.  My mother used to say that if the rest of the world had a problem with something I was saying or doing- it was likely ~my~ problem, and not that of the rest of the world.  When 99% of Your contacts are ditching You, instead of calling them fakes,  it's likely time to reevaluate Your strategies and figure out why.   



_____________________________

There are two kinds of strengths: the strength to lead, and the strength to follow; the strength to control, and the strength to yield. There are two kinds of power: the power to strip away another's soul bare, and the power to stand naked. Yaldah Tova

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:28:25 AM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterA56

MasterA56 is a brute and a bully. 

Duly noted.


Not at all.
You might be a bit overbearing for someone who is new to the lifestyle, but I dont think you come across as brutish or bullying.
You do have to keep in mind those who you are contacting.  If they are disappearing often, maybe you should stop chatting up the newbies and see if you can find someone with a bit more experience. Newcomers are flighty, as a rule, on both sides of the whip and across gender lines. It sounds to me like those are the type you are finding, and they are up and disappearing on you alot.
Those who never write back dont count as disappearing. I dont count them at least. You are running into the same problem we all have, and all stil will on occasion.  You just notice it more beacuse youve made fewer contacts.
Give it time and se if it continues on, maybe readjusting who you talk to is better than readjusting what you say to them.

DV




_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:30:17 AM   
jewells13


Posts: 6
Joined: 9/29/2007
Status: offline 		I'm sure to some I fall into the catagory of what you perceive to be fakes also. I'm a very strong, independent woman, and that comes through in all initial contact with me. As others have said, parts of a personality is often lost in on-line communication, so I'm sure I even appear tougher than I am. Doesn't mean I'm not submissive, simply that I don't know enough about the person I am communicating enough to feel even a little submissive towards them. I've also chosen to de-activate my profile. Quite simply, because I'm tired of sifting through the emails that I find an insult. I think I give a lot of latitude in initial contacts as far as language (or rather intent) is concerned. I realize it can't be easy for the Dom's on this(or any of the other) sites to make contact, but I just reached the point of preferring to not deal with it any longer. I'll continue to read the forums, and the profiles of others, and initiate contact on my own. Does it make me a wannabee? No, not hardly. It does make me a submissive who takes the power exchange within a relationship seriously, and one who understands that mutual respect and trust is something that grows as two get to know one another, not something that is given randomly to all who engage in conversation with each other. I'm also more comfortable knowing the person I am engaged with understands and feels the same way. If we end up on the same page, then I know he'll treasure my submission as much as I treasure his Dominance over me.
I realize none of this answers the basic question you posted, but wanted to give you some insight for some of the behavior you described as being different than your perception.

(in reply to missturbation)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:33:16 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		LOL, him being gay, I don't think you are gonna convince him that the boys go thru what you girls do, not quite at least.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to jewells13)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:34:32 AM   
Bearlee


Posts: 2311
Joined: 10/25/2004
From: South Central CO
Status: offline 		Well, Sir...I feel your pain.  You joined us some four days ago, I'm not sure what you expected to find online.  It's really a lot better than...say...meeting someone in a bar.  At least we all come here for 'something' about BDSM, huh? 
 
Still...there are something like ten times the men on these sites as women; so perhaps it is harder for a guy.  Having said that...as a female, I can tell you that at the very least I find less than one in ten guys looking for anything other than kinky sex.  It's the territory... the nature of the beast.
 
You and only you can affect how this affects you.  Ron has a good point... just keep on trucking along.  I figure it's a numbers game.  I've got to wade through a lot of frogs to find one worth kissing.  Yanno?  Even then...who knows if he'll be a 'prince'.  LOL
 
BTW...I also just checked out your profile.  Personally, I've often found that when someone leads with so little...there is often very little to offer anyway.  I wonder what it is you are saying in your notes?  Surely you aren't demanding submission by mail.......are ya?
 
b

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(in reply to MasterA56)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Wannabe subs/slaves pretending to want a Master - 10/15/2007 11:36:02 AM   
Estring


Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		The op's profile picture just screams "respect".

_____________________________

Boycott Whales!

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 60
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