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When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 4:56:57 PM

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I am trying to formulate this question in such a way as to make it clear that this is not something I am currently pondering about my own power exchange relationship. I have lived through some experiences and speak with women on a regular basis that try to decide when it is time to call it quits in an abusive relationship (especially hard seems to be when the woman believes and holds to marriage vows). For some it looked as simple as irreconcilable differences, for others it was the first time a fist was raised. Others still it took nearly losing their lives. For some, they didn't make it out alive.

So when is enough enough? Is it more difficult to see things getting out of control in a power exchange dynamic? If you are willing to share, what did it take for you or someone you knew, both vanilla and D/s to finally sever an abusive relationship?

lovingpet

RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 5:29:23 PM

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I have had my share of emotionally abusive relationships, which can't kill you but can kill your soul. It was hard for me to quit them. I'll simply talk about the last and the worst of them. I kept going back, thinking it would change. It didn't. Mind you this was my first D/s relationship as well, so that made it even more confusing. He cheated on me, started off lying to me about it, then he started leaving evidence around. Her panties on the floor, the duct tape and other things on the bed. Things I had bought him hidden and that is just what I can really talk about. The things he said, the things he did... its still confusing to me to this day as what exactly this relationship was, it was a D/s relationship but in some aspects I feel it went over the line both physically and emotionally, It was defintly an emotionally abusive relationship and sometimes I think it was a physically abusive one but then I have my doubts, questioning the whole D/s thing.

Enough was enough, when I was at his house cleaning and found a reciept for jewelry, diamonds no less dated the day before valentines day. I wasn't with him on vday, I found this the day before I was leaving, questioned him, and he replied what does it matter? That was enough for me.

(in reply to lovingpet)

RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 7:05:08 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

So when is enough enough? Is it more difficult to see things getting out of control in a power exchange dynamic? If you are willing to share, what did it take for you or someone you knew, both vanilla and D/s to finally sever an abusive relationship?

lovingpet

In a vanilla relationship I was in, this was the situation. He didn't exactly smack me around or anything, but there were incidents here or there that were explained away like .. he didn't mean it, we were joking around, it was an accident, etc. Then once I was at his place and he punched me in the arm and when I was upset enough to leave, he tackled me and was trying to take my clothes off and laughing about it, while I was screaming at him to stop. I got away from him and left and sent a very large scary friend to go pick up my things, but it was just the thing that pushed me over the edge, I guess..

It was a terrible, emotionally and sometimes physically unhealthy relationship in so many ways. I still have trouble talking about that, because in retrospect it's so much easier to see how harmful that situation was for me, and I still question why I did not dump his ass sooner, but there ya go..

--cs

*edited to add: oh look, and on that note I just became "curious" ... ironic! :-)

< Message edited by CookieSlave -- 10/1/2008 7:20:21 PM >

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 10:19:39 PM

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quote:

I have had my share of emotionally abusive relationships, which can't kill you but can kill your soul.

For me, it can literally kill me. I have manic-depression, and being emotionally abused - which has happened in the past - left me in a severe depressive episode, leading to a (nearly successful) suicide attempt.

So much for that stupid freaking "sticks and stones" saying.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 10:27:05 PM

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i will admit that for mine i had to be told that i was released. as dumb as that sounds, i had given my word, that reflects my honor. now i am not saying i didnt go out and do something that i knew would force that release, but i did.

when i watched my being sucked dry, when the choas of the house was pulling base elements of my personality out that i depised. the competition. the punishments. not really physical abuse, per se, but just an unhealthy environment. but when i saw elements of myself that i detested in others, well i knew it was time to go.

now i allowed this. i blame no one but myself, but putting myself in this situation. i do take responsibility for my actions. as such i was the only who could pull myself out of it. i guess when the reality of a situation smacks you in the head, you can change it, or wallow.

the choice is yours.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 10:47:57 PM

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Okay, here is the Cliff Notes version of my personal experiences.

Well, for me personally, it was taking a step back and saying to myself "is this what I want my kids to think is normal?" Mind you, this was a "vanilla" marriage, although we tried to add some of the kink and there was always some of the power exchange present but we weren't privy to the BDSM jargon, but by the time that I discovered what really pushed my shiny buttons, and that I wanted to share this with x, the wall that divided us was so high there was no way the trust was going to be rebuilt to allow such a deep and profound (in my eyes anyways) connection.

There was a period early in the marriage that was very physically abusive. He was the typical "abuser": isolating me from friends, family, any type of support. Being told that I wasn't worth a damn as a lover, parent, that I had no choice but to stay who would want me, etc. I was the typical "victim" and I bought into his crap, I was scared to leave since I went straight from my father's house to my husband's house. We were a textbook case, complete with the predictible cycle of honeymoon period, stressors, more stressors, explosive episode, ya'll get the drift. After many broken dishes and broken spirits, not to mention the bruises and emotional humiliation and verbal attacks that left much deeper wounds, and two jail stays for the x, lots of counseling stopped the physical abuse. A few very good years go by, and the violence creeped back in, only the real damage was with the words and actions, not the fists this time around. I found my voice with the help of the friends and loved ones that I refused to allow any type of disconnect from. After being told after one volatile evening of verbal warfare to "get your shit get your son and get out of my house" I said "okay, I'm out". I haven't looked back.

< Message edited by monywildcat -- 10/1/2008 10:50:08 PM >

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/1/2008 10:53:15 PM

hlen5

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A woman I know had a shitty, abusive marriage for 27 years. One of her (unstated) reasons for staying was she couldn't see herself without a man. Her sons were raised to treat her with disrespect, she had been laid off from her job and her mother died of cancer. She left 2 months after her mom died. Her explanation of leaving was, "I didn't have any farther to fall".

< Message edited by hlen5 -- 10/1/2008 10:54:20 PM >

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/2/2008 12:42:51 AM

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Enough is enough when you feel unsafe, unloved, or unable to trust your partner. Sometimes these things can be worked out, but more often than not they can't. Sometimes its best to just cut your losses and leave, take some time to heal, and start over with someone new.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/2/2008 7:04:15 AM

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year 2 of vanilla marriage ...when he held a knife to our child threatening to harm him if I did not agree to his terms

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/2/2008 8:03:05 AM

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Like many I've had my fair share of abusive relationships. In many cases many people are quite surprised when they find out because I always tried to keep it hidden from view and go about my life as if nothing was wrong when in fact that wasn't the case. My previous marriage though was by far the worst and I did try to honor my wedding vows long after I feel I should have gotten rid of her. The first time I was ready to call it quits I listened to a good mutual friend that had worked at battered womens shelters before and convince me to give her another chance and convinced her to enter an anger management program. That was just barely after the 1 year anniversary. Fast forward about another year and after another massive blow up I tell her it's over and I listen to the lovely submissive that had entered our life and didn't want to see our marriage end like that. Unfortunately she hadn't seen all of what I'd endured to that point and this trip included me going to the ER and being put on crutches and my knee in an brace as I had had my right knee hyper-extended when it was kicked backward by wife. So I gave it another chance... Fast forward yet again about 6 months this time and I find myself trying to stem the blood flowing from my nose as the cops are finally called and she's escorted out of the house and taken to jail.

The marriage ended after 3.5 years when it was all final and done. In the end she had the domestic violence and assault & battery charges reduced to disturbing the peace as she used our lifestyle to justify her actions. Nevermind the fact that she was the *cough* "submissive" *cough* in the relationship and I was the one that was spending the next 9 months with the chiropractor correcting the whiplash in my neck.

So how much is enough.. Obviously I feel I gave it my best shot to make it improve and work before calling it quits on my marriage vows. For me that was a very hard decision as I did not want to follow in my mother's footsteps and go from marriage to marriage. For me the line was when the blood was drawn and law enforcement were involved.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/2/2008 4:43:35 PM

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Thanks to each who have responded. I know this is difficult to talk about. I welcome and appreciate any further responses.

lovingpet

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/2/2008 5:38:34 PM

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I asked the same question when i was married - when is the time to get out? The breakpoint for me was when he told me that he was leaving when our youngest turned 18. She was 8, i was 40, and i couldn't see spending 10 more years with him, knowing that he was going to leave. I figured that i would be better off being single at 40 than at 50 - and i was right!

The funny thing was when he asked me if i would get married again - and got his feelings hurt when i told him not only no - but hell no!!!!!!!

I think for me, as with a lot of women, that we stay a lot longer than we should because that is the way we have been wired - the nurturers, the caretakers, the smoothing over the ruffled feathers. We have never been told that it is ok to quit while we were ahead, and while it is good for us. And it takes some of us a long time to catch on.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/3/2008 8:05:09 AM

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The line drawn will be different for each one. I stayed in an abusive relationship for 15 years. I believed in my marriage vows.

I filed for divorce but continued to live in the same home. I had one daughter and five stepchildren, all grown by this point, and I prayed for guidance on whether I should go through with the divorce or not. Within an hour my husband came home after drinking (though I didn't realize it at first) and graphically showed me how he planned on murdering me - first stabbing my chest but since that wouldn't be enough blood to satisfy him he would slit my throat but not deep enough to kill me. Then he would force me to take pills (which he had done once before) so it would look like self mutilation before a suicide. That was my answer - I went upstairs in tears and snuck out the back of the house.

People that knew my husband had encouraged me for years to leave him. I had to know my children were doing ok. We ran a business together; I was President, he was the equipment designer. To leave I had to give up all property, my business, and literally left for Europe with about a dozen boxes and two suitcases of personal belongings. I lost all financial security but for the first time in years had a real peace. I had been afraid of walking out of one nightmare into a situation that might be even worse, and I think a lot of abused spouses go through that same thought process.

I found the lifestyle after I left, and saw that I had basically been a slave but with no appreciation. Now I CHOOSE to be a slave, and found a Master who shows His appreciation of everything I do and often thanks me. When I first read about the lifestyle I just marveled at the ideas of the deep trust and communication, and until I got the chance to live it really had no idea of how fullfilled a person could be within a D/s relationship. This isn't to say that all relationships work well in the community, or that no one abuses their position - and I would certainly want a person to get out of a bad situation like that. However, when the dynamic works well it is just plain wonderful.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/3/2008 6:35:52 PM

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Again, thank you all for so the kind and personal responses. If there are any others who wish to contribute, then by all means I would love to hear from you.

lovingpet

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/4/2008 7:01:14 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12
I think for me, as with a lot of women, that we stay a lot longer than we should because that is the way we have been wired - the nurturers, the caretakers, the smoothing over the ruffled feathers. We have never been told that it is ok to quit while we were ahead, and while it is good for us. And it takes some of us a long time to catch on.

I stayed in an emotionally abusive marriage for 23 years. The turning point came when he came in for lunch one day and I came into the kitchen after being on the computer...he said "is that all you've got to do?" in his usual put-down voice, like the things I enjoyed doing didn't matter....I just lost it and told him I'd had enough and was going to leave...he was shocked and tried to tell me that he loved me....he'd never ever said it before, or it was so long ago that I could not remember.

I'd never lived alone before, and I was leaving my daughter behind...she chose to stay with him because she loved the farm and she was old enough to make that choice. I moved 20km away but could still see her whenever I wished, as long as I didn't go into "his house"

It's taken me the last 6 years to rebuild my self esteem and to realise that my submissive side is not a curse but a blessing....Sir tells me every day that I am loved and appreciated

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/4/2008 7:25:32 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NovelApproach

Enough is enough when you feel unsafe, unloved, or unable to trust your partner. Sometimes these things can be worked out, but more often than not they can't. Sometimes its best to just cut your losses and leave, take some time to heal, and start over with someone new.

Well stated. And exactly what I did. Haven't looked back or regretted that decision once.

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Love is giving him the power to destroy you, but trusting him not to.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/5/2008 7:07:04 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

So when is enough enough?

For me I stayed much longer then I should have. He always told me he would find me and kill me if I ever left him, and I believed him, which is one of the few reasons I stayed. What made me finally leave was when he almost killed me anyway.

He came home around midnight and pounced on me while I was sleeping going on about how I was cheating on him. (He always accused me of cheating when he would come home after being with another woman)

For the next 8 hours he proceeded to beat me into unconsciousness several times, kicking me in the ribs to revive me (broke 2 of my ribs) He held me face up under the faucet so that he could drown me. After body slamming me throughout the house he threw me into the kitchen table and the table and me fell to the ground in a heap. But that wasnt the end of it. He decided the table leg would make a good stick and thought my face and head needed some adjustment. He ruptured both of my eardrums, my cheek and jaw line on the left side were so battered and swollen I wasnt able to eat solid food for a few weeks and needed to use a straw.

By 6 or so in the morning he decided he had damaged me enough (one of my eyes was swollen shut and I was battered, bruised and bleeding) he decided it was time to fuck me. Over and over again.

By 8 am he finally fell asleep on the couch. It took me another hour to tiptoe out the front door and down the stairs. I was SO afraid he was going to wake up and find me trying to leave that I 'almost' didnt leave. Once out the downstairs door I ran to my car and drove off.

I didnt know what to do or where to go. I ended up driving to my Gramma's house (Bless her heart) and it just happened that my mom was there as well. My mom took me ot the ER. They thought I had just come in from a car accident, that's how fucked up I looked. Obviously cops were called when they were told I was beaten.

Damn...Im writing a novel, My apologies. I rarely talk about this so when I do I just keep going....

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/5/2008 7:23:35 AM

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do you ever get over it?......the loss , the betrayal, the awful words and lost years. the feelings that you were to blame somehow. how do you keep it from affecting anything you might do in the future......i too found the courage to get out when i discovered the life.....sighs just wants to forget now, wishes the inside bruises would go away.... i am trying to deal with it day to day, one step at a time and looking forward. that is the best you can do.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/5/2008 8:06:05 AM

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I spent 10 years after the end of my marriage hiding at work and at home. It took 3 years of therapy and a great therapist for me to be willing to start living again. In the midst of that therapy i discovered my submission and my Sir and i haven't looked back since.

As i was serving my Sir his coffee this morning, he looked at me and told me what a beautiful woman i was, and how proud of me he was. He also said anyone who didn't see that was stupid - and my ex was a stupid man. You can imagine how good that made me feel!

I honestly hadn't ever expected to find a man that i could love and who would love me back - i was willing to settle for "friends with benefits" - and i got that and so much more. If you are in a untenatable position, don't stay for the wrong reasons. It is so possible to find love and acceptance again.

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RE: When Enough is Enough - 10/5/2008 8:52:42 AM

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I don't look at it as lost years. I look back and see how I have become stronger and I know I will never allow myself to be in that type of situation again. My ordeal happened quite a few years ago, whereas it sounds as though you went through yours recently.

Don't get me wrong; It wasn't easy finding myself again. It didn't help that even after I had him arrested and an order of protection he still came after me...a few more times. I literally lived in fear day in and day out. I started sleeping with a knife under the couch cushion (I was too afraid to sleep in my bed anymore) . The last time he broke in I actually had my hand on the knife but he was able to wrestle it away from me. What saved me that night was by chance. A fire truck was going by and one of the firefighters saw him climbing through my window- They stopped, called the police and were there within 5 minutes. That 5 minutes felt like a lifetime. He cut me, punched the crap out of me and was choking me when the police busted in.

In the next year I moved 6 times to make sure he wouldnt find me. Years later I am still here. -smiles-

As I said in my earlier post, I very rarely speak about this but it doesn't haunt me anymore. I no longer wake up in a cold sweat when I hear the least little noise. I no longer sleep with all the lights on. I no longer live in fear.

One of the lasting effects it had on me has to do with water. When he held me under the faucet, his hands around my throat, watching as he was drowning me--water running into my mouth and up my nose-- That is something I still have a problem with. I will freak if someone dunks me under water or even playfully gets my face close to a pool of water.

I didn't go the therapy route, I just tried to live.

Guess what? It worked.

You'll get through it as well.

That damn saying really is true. What doesn't kill you will make you stronger.

laura

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