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"Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 4:28:23 AM

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OK, about time for this week's sap question from me.

That word "Ma'am" doesn't work for American women, does it? Especially not in the southern states, from what I can make out. I like "Madam" - but in the UK it seems most women (vanilla or otherwise) can't stand it. Too many memories of frosty shop assistants. We all know that "mistress" has the more common connotation of "an adulterous woman; a woman who has an ongoing extramarital sexual relationship with a man" (WordWeb) It works for lots of Dommes, from what I can see, but it doesn't work as well as, maybe "My Lady" does for me.

These words mean different things in different cultures, even though those cultures may have a common language. So which words press the right buttons? Which, if heard (or if you say, to the right person) really send a thrill through the body? It would be interesting to canvass opinions here at Cme - populated as it is so clearly is by people from all over the world.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 4:39:01 AM

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Dear Peon.. I dont know where you got the idea that Ma'am doesnt work well for southern ladies.. We get Ma'am everywhere we go.. its a courtesy title for all females from eight to eighty here.. You go the grocery store and the checker says.." did you find everything you were looking for today Ma'am.?". you go to a resturant .. "would you like more water Ma'am?"... your standing in line at a movie theater..." pardon me Ma'am" when someone brushes past you trying to get to the door...I am personally rather fond of it as a title of respect but perhaps I am conditioned to it.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 4:39:08 AM

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Ma'am, Miz, MizV or MizVixen all work for me. I like My Lady as well as Domina.

I don't allow anyone to call me Mistress unless I am their Mistress. That term implies ownership to me.

Here in the states at least Sir and Ma'am are time honored terms that it's hard to go wrong with, unless a person says specifically they don't like it.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 4:48:28 AM

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My preferences run to Ma'am or M'Lady. Miss Sue is fine also. I agree with MizSexyVixen that Mistress is acceptable only from a boy/girl that is owned.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 4:58:53 AM

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i like names, names have impact to me, not titles. the only time i refer to someone in such a way is if their name is not known to me, and even then i'm more likely to simply gesture to them so they're aware of who i am addressing and beginning my conversation with something that doesn't include an unnecessary name or a title like 'excuse me' or just saying 'hello'. otherwise, i use what seems to be the safest word, 'miss'. if people have something they prefer to go by, i might alter my habits, but it's a hit and miss case by case basis of how i interact with people. i try to exercise common courtesy, but only when the courtesy is 'common', and the request is not discourteous to me, for example, i pretty much refuse to refer to anyone as goddess, simply because it's asinine and makes me feel like an idiot to say.

to me, saying mistress michelle every time i speak to a person seems just as stupid as saying manager bob or waitress susan or lawyer kinley everytime i address those people. it feels like forced broken english, and like i said, names have impact to me, not titles. saying things like 'yes mistress alice ma'am' just sounds so phony and insincere to me.

< Message edited by hopelesslyInvo -- 10/9/2008 5:13:02 AM >

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:08:34 AM

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Ma'am works for me... I prefer it, but only in the right context (i.e., when someone is in that kind of relationship with me).

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:14:12 AM

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I prefer Madame, with the French emphasis on the second syllable. But I enjoy various honorifics. I'd like to hear them in languages foreign to me, too - Japanese, Korean,... And Ma'am is very pleasing, if the intention is to address me as a lady (rather than to signify that they think I'm an old lady) or to address me as dominant in status.

"Who am I?"
"You are my death, Madame."
"Perfect."
- from Orphee, by Jean Cocteau

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:24:40 AM

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I'm very Southern (USA Southern) so Ma'am works for me. I know some consider it to be something that you only say to old ladies, but I disagree. It's old world curtsy and I always like that. But then, I like a man who opens my doors and walks on the 'street' side of me down the sidewalk.

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It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed,
the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning,
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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:27:57 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsStarlett

I'm very Southern (USA Southern) so Ma'am works for me. I know some consider it to be something that you only say to old ladies, but I disagree. It's old world curtsy and I always like that. But then, I like a man who opens my doors and walks on the 'street' side of me down the sidewalk.

Me, too.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:27:57 AM

Chi

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Ma’am…a politeness, a courtesy, a social grace extended. But there are many females that don’t want anything at all to do with common courtesy or social sophistications of any kind.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:42:26 AM

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Sylverdawn, MizSexyVixen, MsStarlett, Madame Marque: sorry, I should have said "That word "Ma'am" doesn't work for American Dommes, does it?"

I'd begun to think this not just because another American lady here on CM had said told me it rubbed her up the wrong way - but also precisely because "Sir" and "Ma'am" are still so much more common in a vanilla setting in the USA than they are in the UK. (Also, somewhat relatedly: I remember a young American woman arguing with a man (politely, I thought) about a reserved seat on the train recently and addressing him as "Sir" - at which he became very irate. The poor woman was utterly perplexed. )

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:47:56 AM

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HI,

Yes. I like names too. Mistress [X] would be - hmm. A bit of a mouthful for me too. Well, I would if told to, but it would take a bit of getting used to. Sometimes I like the thought of simply Her surname, plus some prefix. I don't know . . .

"Manager Bob" - that makes me titter. Wouldn't mind betting that's demanded in some workplaces

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:49:10 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chi

Ma’am…a politeness, a courtesy, a social grace extended. But there are many females that don’t want anything at all to do with common courtesy or social sophistications of any kind.

Well, FYI, for some females, their experience has taught them that these manners come with a small price tag attached. If I correctly detect a condescending air to your remarks, I would just point out that trivializing the motives of others doesn't make their motives less valid.

I do rather wish they'd stop dissuading males from practicing these manners. If any male thinks that being courteous or gentlemanly obligates a female to anything more than common human acknowledgement, he's no gentleman, and I do not care for what he expects, so these sorts don't ruin my appreciation for someone who behaves well because that's just the way he or she is.

(in reply to Chi)

RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:50:59 AM

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As with all things, when spoken, it depends on the inflection. It could sound respectful or spiteful.

In net correspondence with Dom/mes - it's all in what S/he prefers. I swear that some people get persnickity about it just to make a sub's life difficult.

_____________________________

It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.
It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed,
the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning,
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.

(in reply to PeonForHer)

RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:52:08 AM

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HI,

Special note on "Goddess". Yes, I could do that, and it would feel right for me - but it would need a pretty special occasion.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:54:32 AM

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I do have to ask... why did you decide after experience with one American that all of us don't care for it...

a few have actually said they do, including me.. an American more or less...

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Sylverdawn, MizSexyVixen, MsStarlett, Madame Marque: sorry, I should have said "That word "Ma'am" doesn't work for American Dommes, does it?"

I'd begun to think this not just because another American lady here on CM had said told me it rubbed her up the wrong way - but also precisely because "Sir" and "Ma'am" are still so much more common in a vanilla setting in the USA than they are in the UK. (Also, somewhat relatedly: I remember a young American woman arguing with a man (politely, I thought) about a reserved seat on the train recently and addressing him as "Sir" - at which he became very irate. The poor woman was utterly perplexed. )

_____________________________

You're crazy bitch
But you f*ck so good, I'm on top of it
When I dream, I'm doing you all night
Scratches all down my back to keep me right on

(in reply to PeonForHer)

RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 5:57:18 AM

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Goddess is not even on my list. Princess is for the young ums. Ma'am is the way I was raised and so were my kids.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 6:01:45 AM

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Not that I am a mistress, but having worked customer service in the northern US, east coast and now in the upper South -- I would say that I use "ma'am" for every adult lady, "miss" for every one under age, and "sir" for every man.

I have never gotten a complaint.

When I worked in a hotel, we had to call everyone by their last name. "Mrs. soandso" "Mr. soandso" and the complaints I got were always from the men, that they sounded too much like their father.

When I make phone calls now, I always call for "Mr. xxx" or "Mrs/Ms xxx". People usually appreciate the respect, and I've never had anyone upset.

Granted, this is not in a BDSM context at all-- just regular life in the upper south.

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 6:04:02 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Yes. I like names too. Mistress [X] would be - hmm. A bit of a mouthful for me too. Well, I would if told to, but it would take a bit of getting used to. Sometimes I like the thought of simply Her surname, plus some prefix. I don't know . . .

"Manager Bob" - that makes me titter. Wouldn't mind betting that's demanded in some workplaces

likewise, i possibly would too, but it would take plenty of getting used to.

i would have no issue at all in referring to someone as my ________ or being _________, but to directly address them as such seems so... strange.

for example, saying 'this is my manager bob', 'this is my lawyer kinley', or 'this is my mistress michelle' sounds perfectly intelligent and sensible, but to say 'hello mistress michelle ma'am', 'good day manager bob sir', or 'how's that case coming lawyer kinley' just seems totally amiss to me.

judge judy works for some reason though.

< Message edited by hopelesslyInvo -- 10/9/2008 6:15:59 AM >

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RE: "Ma'am" - 10/9/2008 6:12:55 AM

TermsConditions

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Others experiences may have embued the word with negative connotation. Words are powerful things. I would not knowingly use a word that made another feel uncomfortable, slighted o otherwise "less than."

In the South yes Ma'am and no Ma'am are indoctrinated early, early. The same way you know you are in trouble if mama calls you by all three names, you know to use Ma'am (and Sir).

Only on one occasion did a young lady take offence at my calling her Ma'am, asking if I was calling her a prostitute (?). Of course I blurted "No Ma'am!" No second date; no suprise.

And on one other occasion two young ladies displayed obvious displeasure when I held the door open for them. I didn't even blanche; they were "not from around here." Bless their hearts.

Two out of what must be ten thousand such interactions of deference and politeness on my part and only two ill responses. I would not change if I could. Unless She told me to, of course.

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