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RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 5:37:43 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin
why have a gun and the problems they cause.


We're like 26 pages into this now and lots of folks have given their reasons. You just don't like them. You just don't understand them. Think maybe it might just be that you're just not gonna "get it"?

< Message edited by mistoferin -- 11/14/2008 5:38:06 AM >


_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 501
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 5:54:21 AM   
twistedreality


Posts: 64
Joined: 5/22/2008
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I agree, that in a perfect world, there would be no need for "weapons". But, in that same world, firearms would not be weapons. The reality is, there are those who seek your demise. If you choose not to be able to protect yourself or loved ones, that is your choice. But, why should my choice have to be the same as yours? When you find the way to enforce brotherly love, I'll be right there with you.

Your implication is that no one uses an automobile as a device of malice. That simply is not true. You are also implying that the majority of firearms are tools of malice. That maybe true in some parts of the world, but I do not believe that is true in the civilzed world.

Your argument re: the automobile's intent is flawed. Under the reasoning of your argument, knives should be outlawed. The majority of owners of knives, firearms and automobiles use them without malice. The problem is not with the device, the problem is with people. Treating the symptoms wont cure the cancer.

(in reply to celticlord2112)
Profile   Post #: 502
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 5:57:20 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: twistedreality
The reality is, there are those who seek your demise.


Oh stop it with your paranoid fantasies! You mean to tell me you think that there could be unscrupulous people out there who would actually seek out to harm others?????? Get a grip!!!!

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to twistedreality)
Profile   Post #: 503
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:00:15 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

quote:

ORIGINAL: CraZYWiLLiE

Thousands die in automobile crashes each year. Ban em.
.

2nd ammendment... Well regulate militia... free state..shall not be infringed...

Without the 2nd , there is no constitution, what you think holds it all together...words...NO guns, and those that have them.

Ask those who had their guns taken from them if they feel safe and secure.



An automobile as a weapon, it can be used as such, as automobiles are dangerous, or can be dangerous in the wrong hands, but automobiles have a good use, that of transportation, that is it's purpose. An automobile for killing, that is a misuse of purpose, not the reason for making them and using them, so banning automobiles because they can kill is much the same as banning anything pointy or sharp, because of the possibilities of misuse or accident. Given that level of paranoia, after the pointy, sharp things have been eradicated , the hitting things will be next and there follows every other tool we use until we are left with our own tooth and claw, until that is banned.

It is misguided to assume because an accident can kill as a by product of proper use , it should be taken away.

Guns on the other hand have but one use, killing. Hunting for game is fine if you need to hunt to live, but other than that, why have a gun and the problems they cause.


I think to realise that what I see as this philia that is gun love in the US is more disturbing because we in the UK cannot legally carry anything which can be deemed as offensive for the protection of ourselves. The law is, if we are attacked, we must call a policeman, something which is fine for olden times when we had bobbies and peelers, the hue and cry method then worked. So, we cannot carry in public what is deemed to be an offensive weapon, even for protection, if we use 'something' to defend ourselves, then it is highly possible we will be prosecuted for it, as everything that can be used in defence, can be used for attack and in the eyes of our controllers, we are all potential assailants.

It is no joke that much of our youth carry knives and knife crime is a problem, and I do understand those that say they carry for defence, as here, weapon owning is a respect thing with the young, a knife being a thing to respect in the hands of a known head case, defence against head cases I can understand, but there are better ways than knives, martial arts training is very effective.

The rest of us, well, most just keep clear of known trouble spots and use feeling as to ascertain whether a place we are going to is safe to go to, get the gut feeling and change the plan. Avoidance of difficulty by being aware.



Is this why your against guns? Because we can carry them and you can't?  Sorry, but that's as lame as the ones who claim you shouldn't own a gun because your really don't "need" it.  Maybe you should turn your energy to fixing the problems where you live. When you have no more violence in your own area, then you can start worrying about others.

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 504
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:01:31 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: twistedreality
The reality is, there are those who seek your demise.


Oh stop it with your paranoid fantasies! You mean to tell me you think that there could be unscrupulous people out there who would actually seek out to harm others?????? Get a grip!!!!


Just because your paranoid, doesn't mean they are not out to get ya.......bwaaahaaahaaa

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 505
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:04:52 AM   
MissouMama


Posts: 2
Joined: 1/25/2007
Status: offline
Really want to save lives?   More people are killed every year by either cigarettes or kitchen knives.

That should be your target......

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 506
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:10:03 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
.

< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 11/14/2008 6:51:15 AM >

(in reply to MissouMama)
Profile   Post #: 507
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:10:30 AM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: twistedreality

I agree, that in a perfect world, there would be no need for "weapons". But, in that same world, firearms would not be weapons. The reality is, there are those who seek your demise. If you choose not to be able to protect yourself or loved ones, that is your choice. But, why should my choice have to be the same as yours? When you find the way to enforce brotherly love, I'll be right there with you.

Your implication is that no one uses an automobile as a device of malice. That simply is not true. You are also implying that the majority of firearms are tools of malice. That maybe true in some parts of the world, but I do not believe that is true in the civilzed world.

Your argument re: the automobile's intent is flawed. Under the reasoning of your argument, knives should be outlawed. The majority of owners of knives, firearms and automobiles use them without malice. The problem is not with the device, the problem is with people. Treating the symptoms wont cure the cancer.


Exactly !

Guns are just pieces of useless metal and chemical without a user, they are without harm if just left alone decaying away, but it is the user that is the problem and the mentality of the user.

My mentality is I don't want a gun, but if I am forced to have a gun for whatever reasons, civil defence or whatever, it will be put away, out of harms way, forgotten about and I will depend on my wits in day to day life. The carrying of a weapon could even be so to dull the wits by the knowledge that armed with lethal force, there is no danger.

I have carried weapons for personal protection, because of a fear of danger behind every corner. I don't carry weapons now, because I just use my wits, I keep out of trouble and if unsuspected trouble happens, then I use whatever to get out of trouble, if that means I cow tail to an assailants wishes, then fine, as the important thing is to stay safe and alive or as I have found in some situations, if you meet aggression with non aggression, it foxes the assailant, they expect trouble, but they don't get it, talk them out of their actions, it has worked.

Despite my peace seeking ideals, I am not without skill in weapons, for I can use other things. I am accurate with a catapult and ball bearing ammo, I can lob a half pound rock with accuracy over a hundred meters with an ancient sling, terminal velocity of a half pound rock has just got to be devastating.


< Message edited by Aneirin -- 11/14/2008 6:15:39 AM >


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to twistedreality)
Profile   Post #: 508
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:14:49 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissouMama

Really want to save lives?   More people are killed every year by either cigarettes or kitchen knives.

That should be your target......


That should be my target as opposed to what?  Did I imply I was against guns somewhere in this thread?

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to MissouMama)
Profile   Post #: 509
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:39:26 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
Aneirin, I just don't get ya. Guns are bad and evil because they hurt people....and you don't need one because you have your wits.....and if your wits don't work you can kill 'em with your slingshot???????



_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 510
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:45:58 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

Aneirin, I just don't get ya. Guns are bad and evil because they hurt people....and you don't need one because you have your wits.....and if your wits don't work you can kill 'em with your slingshot???????


Just ignore the guy.  Read his posts and it is clear he hasn't read anything anyone else has written, has given it no thought, no consideration.  He is here to shout to the world what a sensitive new age man he is.  The whole thing is a line of bullshit.  He is the anti-gun equivalent of our side's group that own guns to compensate for their insecurities.  

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 511
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:47:06 AM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
If it came to a worse than worse situation and all avenues had passed by or been unsuccessful,  I can defend myself, but given that we are not allowed to have weapons, I can make them and use them. I n defence, I mean defence of my home and family, guns arent the only option, bullets run out, rocks don't, guns make noise, slings don't.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 512
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:47:40 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Just out of curiosity...

What do you folks feel the "a well-regulated militia" part of the 2nd means? What regulation does this call for or imply?


Thanks for clearly eleminating yourself from any intelligent discussion of the constitution.  March off to a dictionary and learn what "regulated" means at the time. 

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 513
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:48:42 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
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Actualy you can kill a person with a slingshot. Are hunters supposed to throw rocks at bear and moose.

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 514
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:51:11 AM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
What's wrong with new age, surely it has got to be better than  neanderthal, I believe in the progression of humanity, not the regression.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 515
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:54:00 AM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

Actualy you can kill a person with a slingshot. Are hunters supposed to throw rocks at bear and moose.


Why not, hunters of the past used weapons such as these. Take the Native American sling for example, a formiddable weapon in skilled hands.


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 516
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:54:31 AM   
scarlethiney


Posts: 492
Joined: 8/22/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joenextdoor

I do not sit in my house "waiting "for the door frame to crunch.  I was simply saying I would rather have a chance to defend myself than be defenseless.  Again, you are welcome to never have a gun on your home, and i won't ridicule you for your choice, and I ask that you not ridicule anyone else for wanting to have a gun in their home. As for a reality, if all the guns in the world disappeared overnight, I can assure you, crime would not


Isn't that point of all of these threads Joenextdoor?? Agree to disagree? Just because some of us disagree with you or choose to not want guns around us doesn't mean we should have to put up with your spewing disdain.

Arm yourself to the teeth.  There is unfortunately nothing I can do about it legally. I don't have to like it or agree with you and it doesn't matter in the least what my motivation is.  My experience has coloured my perception about guns. I will never forget how loud the gun was three feet away from me, the smell,. the blood.

I reasonably protect myself, my home is safe, I am careful walking to my car in the evening after work. I don't put myself in situations where my safety will be compromised.  I don't feel the need to "arm" myself with a weapon because I witnessed a violent crime. It is for this very reason that I don't choose to own a gun. I don't live in fear and refuse to let anyone make me feel as though I need to.

(Thanks Kitten for saying what I wanted to.)

scarlet


_____________________________

"The words 'I am...' are potent words; be careful what you hitch them to. The thing you're claiming has a way of reaching back and claiming you." - A.L. Kitselman.


see my profile masterkspet

(in reply to Joenextdoor)
Profile   Post #: 517
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 6:58:26 AM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: scarlethiney

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joenextdoor

I do not sit in my house "waiting "for the door frame to crunch.  I was simply saying I would rather have a chance to defend myself than be defenseless.  Again, you are welcome to never have a gun on your home, and i won't ridicule you for your choice, and I ask that you not ridicule anyone else for wanting to have a gun in their home. As for a reality, if all the guns in the world disappeared overnight, I can assure you, crime would not


Isn't that point of all of these threads Joenextdoor?? Agree to disagree? Just because some of us disagree with you or choose to not want guns around us doesn't mean we should have to put up with your spewing disdain.

Arm yourself to the teeth.  There is unfortunately nothing I can do about it legally. I don't have to like it or agree with you and it doesn't matter in the least what my motivation is.  My experience has coloured my perception about guns. I will never forget how loud the gun was three feet away from me, the smell,. the blood.

I reasonably protect myself, my home is safe, I am careful walking to my car in the evening after work. I don't put myself in situations where my safety will be compromised.  I don't feel the need to "arm" myself with a weapon because I witnessed a violent crime. It is for this very reason that I don't choose to own a gun. I don't live in fear and refuse to let anyone make me feel as though I need to.

(Thanks Kitten for saying what I wanted to.)

scarlet



There is no substitute for experience and once you have been there, everything changes.


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to scarlethiney)
Profile   Post #: 518
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 7:03:08 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar
Are hunters supposed to throw rocks at bear and moose.


Wanna go bear hunting ray? I'll let you go first. I'll watch from the car.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 519
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/14/2008 7:03:55 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
I will bring the popcorn.....

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 520
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