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RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 4:53:14 PM

Sub03

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It definetly can be difficult at times but it also can work. I have been in this situation for almost a year. Hasn't always been easy but I wouldnt trade it for anything. As long as everyone knows and there is no sneaking behind anyone's back and everyone understands and agrees then why not??

Though I know not everything is everyone it can work for those who do like it.

(in reply to thetammyjo)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 5:20:49 PM

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Sub 03,
Agree that as you state, "As long as everyone knows and there is no sneaking behind anyone's back and everyone understands and agrees"; it can work. How does your Dom feel about failing to fulfill you in some manner that caused you to seek that missing ingredient from a man soon to be your husband? The same question applies to your future husband. Is he comfortable with his inability to make you happy regarding your need to submit? Was there a time when one or the other wasn't comfortable?

Its a strong man, or in this case men, to deal with failure that he has to confront and be reminded of every day; assuming you'll be wearing a wedding ring and a collar, or some other visual confirmation of your relationship with your Dom. Most men would tend to avoid dealing with their shortcomings completely. They must both be very special.

Congratulations on evaluating yourself, determining what is important, and then going out and finding it.

Good Luck!

(in reply to Sub03)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 6:30:15 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

How does your Dom feel about failing to fulfill you in some manner that caused you to seek that missing ingredient from a man soon to be your husband? The same question applies to your future husband. Is he comfortable with his inability to make you happy regarding your need to submit?

Interesting questions Merc.... seems that you think if a person is accepting of a poly relationship that they somehow have to be failing the person(s) they are in the relationships with.

I have to wonder... what makes you think there is any failing in the first place?

Interesting question...

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 6:33:11 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

quote:

Her husband is hospitalized, does she come to a play party with you if it was scheduled and you really wanted to go?

Thats one of the reasons I couldnt be in a multiple relationship, who takes priority? Who gets part of you and which part? And if the situation were reversed, say I was the single one and my partner had other people he was committed too...would I be happy accepting a part of him? Would I be happy knowing I was second on the priority list? Like if I really needed him but he had to go on a barbeque with his wife and kids...ugh..fuck that *grin* Its just too confusing and entirely too ....split.

The way it works in our relationship, whoever has the greatest need in that moment, then it is his will that they would come first. Whether it is alandra, the little ones, parents, me, work...

I do not view it as getting part of him. I get all of him that he is able to give in that moment. But then again, I am part of the family so I would be at the family BBQ... eyes glazed over as I stare at the metal grill brush.... LOL

Knight's kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to slavejali)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 6:41:57 PM

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quote:

But then again, I am part of the family so I would be at the family BBQ... eyes glazed over as I stare at the metal grill brush.... LOL

I see your situation differently than the one I spoke of. Like you and your role has been accepted within the family. Even though I still think I couldnt do that, I can understand how some people could.

(The "split" thing for me would come when everyone is not involved.)

(in reply to kyraofMists)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 6:51:30 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali
I see your situation differently than the one I spoke of. Like you and your role has been accepted within the family. Even though I still think I couldnt do that, I can understand how some people could.

(The "split" thing for me would come when everyone is not involved.)

I understand and I would not have entered this relationship if there was not full disclosure to all parties involved. The three of us are loyal to our relationship together, so we work together to make the relationship strong. Sometimes that means alandra needs more, sometimes I need more or he needs more... Most times it is just the three of us loving each other for who we are.

kyra

**edited to add that involved for me means everyone has knowledge of the relationship. My Lord and alandra have an intimate physical relationship as well as friendship with denika and her husband, but I am only friends with them. So I am not part of the physical intimacy, but I have knowledge of it.

< Message edited by kyraofMists -- 3/20/2006 6:59:56 PM >

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to slavejali)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 6:53:05 PM

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Knight

quote:

seems that you think if a person is accepting of a poly relationship that they somehow have to be failing the person(s) they are in the relationships with.

No, I didn't equate this with Poly. I didn't see a Poly lifestyle entering into the equation. I was addressing the issue of someone needing a Dom to fill some needs while a husband filled others. As it was expressed, one couldn't do what another could. When you can't do something isn't that defining failure? Use another word if you'd like, but the ability to accept that on a daily basis is beyond my ability as man and as a Dom; my failing if you will. This isn't about Poly. It's about a relationship that may include more than one person, but what happens occurs one person at a time. I'm trying to understand how the person who stays at home deals with it, as well as the person on active duty deals with the thoughts of other man.

I don't think this is a situation where people are just in it for the 'sensation'. The dynamic of Dom/sub and Husband/wife is on a different emotional, mental, and spiritual level. It's my desire to understand how these are or can be compartmentalized and work that generates the questions. And again, correct me if I'm incorrect in the assumption that as part of a Poly Family the rings and/or collars are commitments to the 'Family'. The situation we are discussing here is, in effect, two separate and distinct lives.

(in reply to KnightofMists)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:14:28 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

No, I didn't equate this with Poly. I didn't see a Poly lifestyle entering into the equation. I was addressing the issue of someone needing a Dom to fill some needs while a husband filled others. As it was expressed, one couldn't do what another could. When you can't do something isn't that defining failure? Use another word if you'd like, but the ability to accept that on a daily basis is beyond my ability as man and as a Dom; my failing if you will. This isn't about Poly. It's about a relationship that may include more than one person, but what happens occurs one person at a time. I'm trying to understand how the person who stays at home deals with it, as well as the person on active duty deals with the thoughts of other man.

I don't think this is a situation where people are just in it for the 'sensation'. The dynamic of Dom/sub and Husband/wife is on a different emotional, mental, and spiritual level. It's my desire to understand how these are or can be compartmentalized and work that generates the questions. And again, correct me if I'm incorrect in the assumption that as part of a Poly Family the rings and/or collars are commitments to the 'Family'. The situation we are discussing here is, in effect, two separate and distinct lives.

No Poly Lifestyle in the Equation lol

ok - Person A has a intimate relationship with Person B And Person C mmmmmmmmmm

Poly... equates to multiple..

in this situation .. multiple intimate relationships... that all are aware of! So I can't see how.. This isn't a Poly situation! Just becasue the relationships dynamics don't meet your simple ideal of Poly doesn't mean a that there is any failure going on... or that it isn't poly.

A situations that you label Person B and C as failing person A. mmmmmmm like I said... I find it interesting how you equate a poly situation to mean there is failure!.

This post of yours is way below what I would of expected from you.... but it does answer some questions for me!

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:16:56 PM

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OK, it seems to be everyones belief that it's all up to who all is involved. I personally.. do not believe in being married to one.. collared to another. I do not believe in open marriages to the point that either can go and play with who ever they want. I do not how ever have a problem with play mates are brought in on a MUTUAL playtime. But not as a live in, nor going over there when ever they want.

To this one, collar, rings, however one shows ownership.... shouldn't be taken so lightly. I do not believe in open marriages to the point that one spouse allows another to stray outside a marriage to see so call full fillment either. And if on that off chance that a spouse allows this... chance are very strong, they're stepping out as well. Which usually leads to disaster sooner or later. Sometimes sooner, sometimes later.

Now as I stated, others will not agree with me on this.... oh well as I do not agree with theirs either. And I sure as hell do not believe in.. What ever Master wants..... Master gets. I do not knock the way others choose to live their lives. It's their bed, let them lay in it and clean up the mess. I personally, prefer my own bed, my own mess.

_____________________________

Wisdom is knowing what to do next, Skill is knowing how to do it, and Virtue is doing it.

(in reply to upherass)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:24:21 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

**edited to add that involved for me means everyone has knowledge of the relationship. My Lord and alandra have an intimate physical relationship as well as friendship with denika and her husband, but I am only friends with them. So I am not part of the physical intimacy, but I have knowledge of it.

yes kyra... and apparently to some... denika's husband and I are failing denika.

Fact is... we all have different needs/wants... it's a success when relationship find ways to meet the needs/wants of their partners... be it directly or indirectly.

Of course,

Jali... there is some that option of multiple partners is never an option in fullfilling those needs... Sometimes people will make compromises or will scarifice certain needs/wants and maintain monogamy relationship. Only a fool would thing that is a failure... I see it as a strength! Not everyone is poly not everyone is Monogamist... Go with want works and brings happiness... Go with your strengths and have Successes NOT failures. There is nothing wrong that you couldn't or wouldn't be in a poly relationship... I think it's great that you know what works for you... I think that is success!

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to kyraofMists)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:35:42 PM

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Interesting, your reply was exact as expected - defensive, even if no offensive was intended. You brought the idea of any poly situation indicating failure. I don't know why you would equate one with the other. A symptom of doubt? Our poly friends are anything but failing, they complement each other perfectly, but then they don't have doubt.

Focus on the issue, if you can't do something - you fail. If I didn't fulfill beth in a way important to her - I'd be a failure. My attempt at success may include bringing in another party, but as a man, I'd feel failure. As a Dom in the situation unable to fulfill the emotional needs on a submissive or a person I refer to as my slave, I'd feel the same way - a failure. I'd love to hear from a confident person who is in that situation who can correct that false(?) understanding.

And really, was commenting about meeting "expectations" germane to the subject?

How many mmmmmmmmmm's will this generate? Okay - NOT 'germane' either! Instead - lol.

(in reply to KnightofMists)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:35:53 PM

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Just wanted to add my perspective, that in such a situation, it is not a given that there need be any poly.
It is highly likely that people would assume that such a Master would be having sex with the married sub, but I don't rule out the possibility that a Master, perhaps in the manner of a therapist, could give someone a collar, and whatever else they neeeded outside of their marriage, without it moving into the realm of 'amory'.

Other than allowing for that possibility, I'll just echo the general 'it could work, depending on the people and the situation' sentiment.

(in reply to KnightofMists)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:37:03 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: upherass
So then, do you think if one or both partners are committed to others by marriage that they can FULLY commit to a lifestyle collar, and the responsibility it entails?

I don't think so, but I have never been in that position, nor would I be.

To me it would be like asking if a sub can also have children.

My Boston partners wife is a submissive to a dom. I know that neither her husband nor her dom feel that they are somehow missing out or that she isn't "fully committed."

Being poly myself and having been part of relationships that involve married partners, I know that it's possible for the people who choose to do it.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to upherass)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:38:54 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jennalynn
Judgement of others is often frowned upon here on the boards, keep an open mind and many things may be learned

Actually judgement is highly encouraged (at least, I really encourage it).

Expecting others to share judgements or making universal statements however, not so much.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to jennalynn)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:42:49 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
When you can't do something isn't that defining failure?

No. My nephews didn't know how to tie their shoes at one point, that doesn't mean they failed at it. I can't fall in love with you, that doesn't mean I've failed in loving.

That's a very weird definition- you must feel like you fail a LOT.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:44:55 PM

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I get what Merc is saying re the failure thing.

It would be like say I had a partner, who was just totally vanilla, perhaps even so vanilla that they became submissive to me in a general relationship dymanic. Now here I am a slave/submissive starting to get frustrated just because the partner I have isnt able to live up to my own desires that are raging around inside of me. In every other way, that partner could be amazing...but he is failing me in the area of being able to dominate me.

In that scenario, its not an attack against the person, its just an awareness of the situation...but it is a failure, nonetheless. And that failure could make that partner really feel bad about themselves knowing they cant fulfill my desires or be all I need.

(in reply to Alumbrado)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:49:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali
In that scenario, its not an attack against the person, its just an awareness of the situation...but it is a failure, nonetheless. And that failure could make that partner really feel bad about themselves knowing they cant fulfill my desires or be all I need.

I think there's a difference between "failure" and "failure to meet someone's needs."

And yes, for a lesbian, Merc would completely fail to meet her sexual needs directly. That doesn't mean he's a failure or has committed a failure.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to slavejali)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:55:13 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
When you can't do something isn't that defining failure?

No. My nephews didn't know how to tie their shoes at one point, that doesn't mean they failed at it. I can't fall in love with you, that doesn't mean I've failed in loving.

That's a very weird definition- you must feel like you fail a LOT.

Shoe tying like golf is a skill and yes, until he was able to do it he 'failed' at doing it.

And yes, I fail often, but not where it's critical or important, and not more often than I succeed.

I wont agree with the falling in love example because we haven't met. So, in that case, we didn't try. Don't try - can't fail. Not trying is worse than failing. Failure should be as welcome as success because you achieved 'try'. With that logic - I never 'fail'.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:56:33 PM

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I think we are being a little pedantic. In either case, the partner who is not fulfilling the others needs is really going to have to process some strong thoughts and feelings to have that relationship continue on healthily for all concerned. There are some issues here that are gonna have to be faced, rather in your face ones that effect personal well-being.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: Collars when married to others - 3/20/2006 7:59:42 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali
I think we are being a little pedantic. In either case, the partner who is not fulfilling the others needs is really going to have to process some strong thoughts and feelings to have that relationship continue on healthily for all concerned. There are some issues here that are gonna have to be faced, rather in your face ones that effect personal well-being.

I suppose some people might. For my Boston partner and his wife it was far more like a happy thrilling revelation and relief. More like "Yay we REALLY get to do what we want and be completely happy AND together! Cake and eating!"

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to slavejali)

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