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ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I've often heard/read, in relation to BDSM and other things related to sexual desires, people stating that they didn't chose a certain path -- being dominant, submissive, switch, vanilla, sado, maso, poly, gay, straight, bi, trans, etc.-- but that it chose them.

Now I'm willing to accept that we might not necessarily chose our desires, but I do think that we are making an active choice when we seek out the relationships that we do.

I actually have a hard time accepting that an able mind and bodied mature individual living in the Western World feels they aren't actively chosing their sexual, gender or kink orientation.

But if I'm starting this thread, it is to hear your ideas and thoughts on the subject.

- LA

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ORIGINAL: texangael
However, there is an important distinction between orientation (desire) and behavior (action):  while we cannot choose our desires, we always choose our actions. 

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ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

Take homosexuality as an example: during the Greek civilisation homosexuality was on an equal footing and was widespread; in western society when homosexuality was illegal it was perhaps not so widespread; today - as homsexuality has become accepted - it seems to be more widespread.

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ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

Take homosexuality as an example: during the Greek civilisation homosexuality was on an equal footing and was widespread;

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in western society when homosexuality was illegal it was perhaps not so widespread;

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today - as homsexuality has  become accepted

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- it seems to be more widespread.

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And then there is the evidence that during protracted wars where men do not have access to women - men (who otherwise would consider themselves to be straight) have indulged in sexual activities with men. So there is a case there to suggest that homosexuality could indeed be a choice depending upon the prevailing attitude of the day. And not having the urge to have sex with men could quite easily be a result of the ideas of the day - humans adapt to their environment in all sorts of ways so why would sexuality be any different?

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The idea that we have a choice in all areas of our lives apart from our sexuality seems contrary to me.

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It's comforting because we can hold on to the idea of an enduring self (thereby affording personal stability) while allowing ourselves the luxury of believing we can change our situation in order to achieve.

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Great discussion topic by the way - shame we lack sufficient knowledge of the human mind to enable us to draw a conclusion.

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ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I've often heard/read, in relation to BDSM and other things related to sexual desires, people stating that they didn't chose a certain path -- being dominant, submissive, switch, vanilla, sado, maso, poly, gay, straight, bi, trans, etc.-- but that it chose them.

Now I'm willing to accept that we might not necessarily chose our desires, but I do think that we are making an active choice when we seek out the relationships that we do.

I actually have a hard time accepting that an able mind and bodied mature individual living in the Western World feels they aren't actively chosing their sexual, gender or kink orientation.

But if I'm starting this thread, it is to hear your ideas and thoughts on the subject.

- LA

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ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

But you might try to not take the position that people who see through the stupidity lack the reading comprehension to understand you, or that you have suffered any kind of reasonable discrimination remotely close to any marginalized group. Only the similarly deluded will agree with you.

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ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

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ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

But you might try to not take the position that people who see through the stupidity lack the reading comprehension to understand you, or that you have suffered any kind of reasonable discrimination remotely close to any marginalized group. Only the similarly deluded will agree with you.

I don't know whether or not you saw this, but Stella did re-read the OP, after which she retracted her first post.

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ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

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ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

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ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

But you might try to not take the position that people who see through the stupidity lack the reading comprehension to understand you, or that you have suffered any kind of reasonable discrimination remotely close to any marginalized group. Only the similarly deluded will agree with you.

I don't know whether or not you saw this, but Stella did re-read the OP, after which she retracted her first post.

I did see it and I dont' retract my opinion of LA's insulting or ignorance regarding people who disagree with her or the concept that she put forth.

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ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

while it's possible that there may be less open practice of homosexuality in repressive societies, does that really have any bearing on the prevalence of the actual orientation?

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I didn't choose to be dominant or bisexual, or to express my primary mental gender in collusion with the physical gender that I was born with -- but I -did- choose how I would behave and interact in different situations. I have chosen whether to be active or passive in my behavior, to be open or circumspect, to participate or not. While I -am- what I -am-, I have, indubitably, chosen how I would be -perceived- and how I would interact and encourage others' interaction with me. For example, I will happily admit that I worked hard practicing to be ambisexterous and open-minded.

While it seems completely logical to me that people are inherently born and trained before they can rationalize to be canalized to certain attitudes and behaviors, I also think that we have a choice, as functioning human beings, to determine whether acting in given ways will further the goals that we've set for ourselves.

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I think that LA's first post could possibly have been better worded (maybe with more of an emphasis on the distinction between desires and actions?). I don't think for a minute, however, that she was being deliberately insulting.

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The thread really brought home to me that not everyone is flexible, and that a lack of flexibility isn't the same as prejudice or closed-mindedness; it's just wiring.

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ORIGINAL: domiguy

Why would anyone want to be gay?

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ORIGINAL: domiguy

I have a hard time believing a lot of this that I am reading....You think you have a choice in the way you conduct your life? You might have the possibility to make some small changes but much of who and what you are is determined right there in the womb.

If you have suffered some sort of abuse or severe trauma then these events could alter your perceptions of yourself as well as how you perceive the outside world.

Why would anyone want to be gay? There is a thread where Uganda has criminalized homosexuality. No problem. Everyone will simply stop being gay. Right?

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It does not mean that you are anymore "openminded" if you are bisexual. it simply is what it is. If you are bisexual and so openminded than why don't you simply "choose" to enjoy broccoli or raw oysters?

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ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

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I think that LA's first post could possibly have been better worded (maybe with more of an emphasis on the distinction between desires and actions?). I don't think for a minute, however, that she was being deliberately insulting.

The bottom line is that some people have a predefined notion of me and will always be hostile to anything I write. That is when I invoke the ignore button. Doesn't do much good when you quote them though! ;-)

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ORIGINAL: Rochsub2009
Moreover, saying "cat fight" just isn't funny anymore.  You're forcing me to come up with new comedic material. 

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For instance having your cock sucked is always useful