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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:16:53 PM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ElanSubdued
I have faith that adults will behave like adults.

Elan, I'm going to remember you said these words, on this thread, until the day I die.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:20:57 PM

DMFParadox

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Reacting to nick's post -

I've seen this before. Usually the cure is twofold: a)get the person an approximation of what they're asking for, and b)force them to confront someone who is acting in a similar enough way for them to get the hint.

If you rub their face in the poop on the floor before taking them for a walk, they'll just find worse places to shit on.

Not that I'm volunteering for a damn thing, I'm just saying.

< Message edited by DMFParadox -- 10/26/2010 7:22:50 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:22:18 PM

DMFParadox

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: ElanSubdued
I have faith that adults will behave like adults.

Elan, I'm going to remember you said these words, on this thread, until the day I die.

That was pretty much my reaction. But it would seem a bit trite from me, given the context.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:27:02 PM

DMFParadox

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Also, Pro Dommes should have a decent knowledge of the various things a sub might ask for, and there are workshops for that.

Apologies for my part in derailing the topic.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:31:20 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Some of you missed the reasoning here, and tried to argue that you appreciate solid, nice guys more than guys who play games. I was not advocating against being nice. I was advocating against being predictable.

Again, it boils down to what I define as integrity - honesty, clear communication, self-knowledge and personal transparency. That does at times equate with predictable, in the sense that I need to trust that my partners will do what they say they will do, and that they are presenting an honest face to me with no hidden agendas or meanings or desires that they are not communicating.

If you mean predictable in the sense of non adventurous, boring, limited in your tastes and outlook on life, a guy like that probably isn't going to be the best match for me. But in the sense of open, honest, transparent, reliable, not likely to surprise me in a bad way or cause me unexpected drama, that's generally a good thing, even if it means he also isn't going to surprise me too often with good stuff either. IMO, you can't really do poly any other way but with reliability, honesty, transparency and clear communication. Fuck that shit up, and your chances of making poly D/s work in the long term are pretty freaking poor.

quote:

What's key is that women, even dommes, know this. They hate 'doormats', usually. But they're inconsistent with their signals. Act like a doormat, but don't be one. And if you act like one, you are one.

Very few dommes want a partner who is a general purpose doormat to everyone or to life itself. He's not likely to be good for much. But what I love about my primary is that he is a strong and competent adult who willingly submits to me and lives to make me happy. He is my knight, my samurai, my obedient liege. To me he is a doormat, but he's *my* doormat. Not anyone else's, unless I tell him to be. I cannot fathom wanting to be in any other kind of relationship, because - duuuh - I'm a dominant, and I am wired to be intensely attracted to submissives. Not to other dominants, though I can appreciate them as friends and brothers. And especially not to game players who have an ultimately selfish agenda. A man must be submissive, and selectively so to me, or the chemistry's all wrong.

I know what gets my pussy wet and my nipples hard. It's a hot man who is willing to be *my* doormat, but who is complete enough in himself not to *have* to be anyone's doormat. When it's a choice, and when that choice is about me and my dominant energy, there is no greater turnon.

A guy who sucks up to random women and acts like a general use doormat in the hopes of getting laid, kinda pitiful. A guy who plays asshole head games with women in the hopes of getting laid, also pitiful. Do you see the common factor here?

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:41:22 PM

DMFParadox

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>>A guy who plays asshole head games with women in the hopes of getting laid, also pitiful. Do you see the common factor here?

Start a different thread and I'll address this if I see it.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:41:45 PM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyNTrainer
Again, it boils down to what I define as integrity - honesty, clear communication, self-knowledge and personal transparency. That does at times equate with predictable, in the sense that I need to trust that my partners will do what they say they will do, and that they are presenting an honest face to me with no hidden agendas or meanings or desires that they are not communicating.

I hear that when engaging in play that's especially the case. I've heard Dommes say that a good sub play-partner is one who'll let him/herself be open, authentically vulnerable . . . that kind of thing. I often think, 'oh, whoa - could I handle that?' It's an unusual sort of challenge, perhaps especially for a bloke.

< Message edited by PeonForHer -- 10/26/2010 7:43:13 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:42:05 PM

naughtynick81

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ElanSubdued

I really don't think being nice gives you a much better chance either. When looking for dommes/tops there is too much expected out of you if you have a penis.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 7:49:42 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Start a different thread and I'll address this if I see it.

Feel free, if you wish. Honestly, given that I replied at considerable length to your discussion of evolutionary biology and human reproductive strategies, and the conversational gambit was dropped for whatever reason, I'm not really inclined to go out of my way to pick it up again.

Life happens, and no one is obliged to take time to respond to any stranger on the Internet if they're disinclined or too busy with more productive things. This is a long thread, and I'm sure replies tend to get lost or go unread simply for that reason. So no big deal really, but I've already had my say on the topic; address it or not as you feel inspired, here or in a new thread if you prefer.

< Message edited by LadyNTrainer -- 10/26/2010 7:52:34 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:14:34 PM

ElanSubdued

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Nick,

quote:

I really don't think being nice gives you a much better chance either. When looking for dommes/tops there is too much expected out of you if you have a penis.

Consider the following. If you're getting the results you desire, don't change what you're doing. However, if you're not happy with the results you're achieving, doing more of what you're doing now won't change anything. To get different results, you must change what you're doing. Here's something else to ponder. When a woman treats you poorly, what is your reaction? Giving dominant women the stick perpetuates the behaviour your don't like. I have quite a few friends who are dominant women and none of them treat me with the "penis hate" you describe. Try showing empathy and courtesy and you'll get a different response. If your only experience with dominant women is online, I suggest you go to a much and meet people face-to-face. The online and face-to-face world are completely different.

E.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:16:26 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: naughtynick81
I really don't think being nice gives you a much better chance either. When looking for dommes/tops there is too much expected out of you if you have a penis.

Is being an asshole getting you any better results? Let us know how many dommes you attract with all that.

I expect my submissive to be smart, geeky, and to share some of my vanilla interests. In turn, I expect to be supportive of his interests and to be as intellectually challenging and stimulating to him as he is to me.

I expect my submissive to be generous of spirit and to want to give and to make me happy according to his ability. I expect to be generous and giving to him as well. Specifically I am quite likely to spend a ridiculous amount of money on clothes and jewelry for him, because I like making my property attractive, and giving can't be a totally one way street in any relationship. It's ok if he's broke in terms of money, as long as he is still generous and giving *according to his ability*. It's the feeling, not the material goods, that count.

I expect my submissive to be mature, emotionally stable and rational, sound of mind, self-aware and honest, with good clear communication skills and a willingness to be personally transparent. I offer the same to my partners in a relationship. Poly D/s relationships don't really work so well in my experience if everyone, including the dominant, does not practice these skills assiduously.

I expect my submissive to take care of his physical and emotional health and to generally work on making healthier choices in his life. I hold myself to the same standard.

I expect my submissive to treat me with the fundamental respect due to another adult human being and a friend, regardless of our respective D/s roles, and I offer him the same.

In my experience, that is indeed "too much" for a lot of folks who are looking for shallow and instant porn movie style gratification, but it's pretty much a sensible required minimum for a successful human relationship. And D/s relationships are definitely human relationships, regardless of how kinky they are. Being kinky doesn't keep you from being human, or having human needs, and I think that's a mistake a lot of people make when they try to entirely substitute D/s dynamics for sensible human relationship dynamics.

< Message edited by LadyNTrainer -- 10/26/2010 8:17:22 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:20:16 PM

DMFParadox

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyNTrainer
and the conversational gambit was dropped for whatever reason,

A direct request from a moderator.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyNTrainer
I'm not really inclined to go out of my way to pick it up again.

Nor I. You may make your claims about what does and does not constitute asshole behavior unchallenged, at this point, unless you really want an answer. In which case I'll oblige. Since you just want to vent, I'm ok with that. There's no point in going further.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:22:38 PM

ElanSubdued

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quote:

Lockit: Well I burned my bra and I am not and never have been a feminist! I don't care what they cost... I am not buying many of them or wearing them! I'm a hippie! Free flowing, love machine. hehe

SorceressJ: *agrees with Lockit, is also a hippie!*
I burn bras because I have a passionate hatred of all underwires. Women need healing space and space to be righteous after a thousand generations of being non-consensually trod underfoot, but radical feminism is IMHO no more correct than it's polar opposite. It's all about balance. Wait, did we just hijack this thread? :-)

VaguelyCurious: I have left the house without some form of bra on exactly ONCE in the last eight years (accidentally) and it was AGONY. NEVER AGAIN.

Lockit: Well... lol... I cup my boobies... one of my favorite things to do... and run up the stairs giggling. I am aware I could lose my domina status for this... but like I said, it is one of my favorite things and you all know I am always lol'ing, so I might as well admit, I sometimes giggle too. :-)

SorceressJ: See? That's why Lockit is made of *WIN*, and has what it takes to be the best kind of Domme: because she is human enough to admit that she runs up the stairs giggling with her boobs in her hands. (The mental picture is outstanding, btw.. :-)

WyldHrt: I cannot go braless. Never mind the stairs.... if I had to run, I would wind up with 2 black eyes! :-) :-) :-)

Lockit: Ummm, Wld one... whats that black stuff around your eyes? :-)

WyldHrt: That pic was taken after the last time I tried to go braless! :-)

VaguelyCurious: Let's face it, boobs > nicky's diatribes...

Ah... bouncing, cupped gambits... with or without bras. This thread is improving immensely. Yes, I know... if I were a smoother, aloof bad boy, I'd write "FUCKING HOT TITS!", but there are too many people here who know this isn't my style. In this instance, authenticity trumps technique. :-)

Elan.

< Message edited by ElanSubdued -- 10/26/2010 8:23:45 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:24:53 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
A direct request from a moderator.

I read the moderator comments as applying to discussing moderated happenings on another site, not a request to table a discussion of primate evolutionary biology and how it related to modern reproductive strategies.

I was engaging in factual rebuttal on that specific topic, complete with references to published works. I am unclear as to why you would choose to refer to that as venting. Unless that's an example of one of your social gambits?

To be clear, I would define being intentionally deceptive or presenting yourself in a misleading way in order to obtain sex under what are essentially false pretenses as asshole behavior.

< Message edited by LadyNTrainer -- 10/26/2010 8:28:29 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:25:53 PM

ElanSubdued

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Peon,

quote:

Elan, I'm going to remember you said these words, on this thread, until the day I die.

Take me to dinner and I'll come to your funeral. :-)

Elan.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:36:32 PM

DMFParadox

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VideoAdminTheta

let's try to keep it close to the topic.

This seems pretty clear to me.

The topic is what it takes to be a Pro Domme. And though Theta mentioned that topics do wander, my wanderings tend to practically take over the thread. Especially on this subject. And that would not be trying to keep it close to the topic; that would be the opposite of trying to keep it close to the topic. Or the inverse. Perhaps the obverse, even.

Really, I have a list of ways in which your clear-cut, black and white version of right and wrong can be not only falsely applied, but harmful. I'm not going to argue the point here. Start a new thread, or speak into the void, because I've already reacted too much to you in this one.

Peace out.

Edit: in reaction to LadyNTrainer. Damn, things are moving fast around here.

< Message edited by DMFParadox -- 10/26/2010 8:37:26 PM >

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:40:26 PM

Nineveh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyNTrainer

quote:

What's key is that women, even dommes, know this. They hate 'doormats', usually. But they're inconsistent with their signals. Act like a doormat, but don't be one. And if you act like one, you are one.

Very few dommes want a partner who is a general purpose doormat to everyone or to life itself. He's not likely to be good for much. But what I love about my primary is that he is a strong and competent adult who willingly submits to me and lives to make me happy. He is my knight, my samurai, my obedient liege. To me he is a doormat, but he's *my* doormat. Not anyone else's, unless I tell him to be. I cannot fathom wanting to be in any other kind of relationship, because - duuuh - I'm a dominant, and I am wired to be intensely attracted to submissives. Not to other dominants, though I can appreciate them as friends and brothers. And especially not to game players who have an ultimately selfish agenda. A man must be submissive, and selectively so to me, or the chemistry's all wrong.

I know what gets my pussy wet and my nipples hard. It's a hot man who is willing to be *my* doormat, but who is complete enough in himself not to *have* to be anyone's doormat. When it's a choice, and when that choice is about me and my dominant energy, there is no greater turnon.

A guy who sucks up to random women and acts like a general use doormat in the hopes of getting laid, kinda pitiful. A guy who plays asshole head games with women in the hopes of getting laid, also pitiful. Do you see the common factor here?

I don't know if this is common across all Dominants but I know it is a preference you and I share. I don't want a sub who is going to do as she is told by anyone and everyone. I want a sub who is going to do as I tell her and be quite assertive with anyone else and not let them push her around.

a weak person is not a turn on, a strong person who is weak for me is.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:44:43 PM

ElanSubdued

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GreedyTop,

quote:

RedMagic1:
I enjoy paying, even if she makes more money than I do. But, I'll say this, if she doesn't pay for something, I'll lose interest really fast. I don't do greedy.

GreedyTop:
haz a sad ;)

Meant to reply to this earlier. 'Tis okay. I'll happily soothe your "greed".

(Ha! Now all my friends will accuse me of being coquettish. Such are the perils of being a man-slut online. :-)

Elan.

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 8:56:15 PM

naughtynick81

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Elan, thanks for the advice and all. You do mean very well. But I just don't feel a need to give any domme respect unless they are not such things I mention or if they choose to befriend me. But even if one does befriend me, I wouldn't take up the offer if she is the types of things I talk about on this thread....which may likely be the case. And I hope she doesn't expect me to kiss her ass. My bitterness actually amuses me rather than being bitter in an angry way. It's self entertainment for me. But hey, women are shameless hypocrites when it comes to bitterness so I don't feel that I am doing a crime. Anyway, I know there are some awesome women in this scene and then there are others that don't deserve any good will.

Ladytrainer

Firstly, you have to make sure that you offer these same qualities yourself. Secondly, it may be hard to find a man with all them qualities in one. Thirdly, when dommes or women in general look for certain qualities; take intelligence for example, they can go over the top with it and expect this super duper intelligent guy that stands out from most while the women who demand this are not offering such intelligence themselves.

Not that I am accusing you of any of this

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RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 9:00:07 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
The topic is what it takes to be a Pro Domme. And though Theta mentioned that topics do wander, my wanderings tend to practically take over the thread. Especially on this subject. And that would not be trying to keep it close to the topic; that would be the opposite of trying to keep it close to the topic. Or the inverse. Perhaps the obverse, even.

Male versus female reproductive strategies are actually pretty applicable to the pro domme topic, IMO; the discussion at hand certainly covers the economy of mate choices, including who actually pays for it. It's a dry, scientific and possibly boring-to-most way of going about discussing it, but it's relevant and applicable. Moderator input, please?

quote:

Really, I have a list of ways in which your clear-cut, black and white version of right and wrong can be not only falsely applied, but harmful.

I notice that you assign my input the value of "clear-cut, black and white version of right and wrong" while failing to see your own rather sweeping claims about the nature of gender relations in quite the same light.

quote:

I'm not going to argue the point here. Start a new thread, or speak into the void, because I've already reacted too much to you in this one.

Looks like you already are, doesn't it?

Drop it if you really don't feel up to a factual rebuttal with academic references. Or reply here, assuming the moderator agrees that the economics of male-female exchanges and competing reproductive success strategies is directly relevant to the topic, albeit in a more intellectual than interestingly kinky manner. Or start a new thread with your reply. Doesn't matter particularly to me.

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