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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 7:57:30 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
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I dont care if they are close.  Folks is folks.

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:08:56 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ranja

contempt means more than just 'not like'...
so if a person states or admits that they have contempt for somebody it does seem to mean that they might have a bit of a fear or misunderstanding of this person or maybe suffer general arrogance indeed like you state.

i think most dominant men don't care much at all about submissive men or dominant women, as long as they keep their distance


"They keep their distance"?

What was it you were just saying about general arrogance?

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:10:02 AM   
Ishtarr


Posts: 1130
Joined: 4/30/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ranja

contempt means more than just 'not like'...
so if a person states or admits that they have contempt for somebody it does seem to mean that they might have a bit of a fear or misunderstanding of this person or maybe suffer general arrogance indeed like you state.

i think most dominant men don't care much at all about submissive men or dominant women, as long as they keep their distance


Most people have contempt for pedophiliacs, does that mean that they necessarily fear and misunderstand him?

It seems very likely that people are able to look down on people and disrespect them without there being fear involved.

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:14:09 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
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yes, folks is folks
and most people are fine with eachother and don't care too much wether they actually like the other person they sit next to or not
until something happens that draws out some extra emotion

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:19:19 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

The thing is, the Chinese did this to each other.  Recorded Chinese military history goes back 4000 years.  And it's bloody.


Oh I agree it's bloody all right. However, there are over 50 different ethnic groups living in China. They had no choice but to fight each other, as China has historically been a very insular county until quite recently (last few hundred years). It is also huge. Did you know it spans 5 different time zones?


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Profile   Post #: 145
RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:32:27 AM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ishtarr


Most people have contempt for pedophiliacs, does that mean that they necessarily fear and misunderstand him?



Pedopheliacs are causing pain and suffering to innocent people who are defenseless against them.  That's a whole different bird.

I find the responses in this thread interesting, although not surprising.

I used to feel quite a dislike for submissive men (no longer do) but never understood why.  I needed to understand why I experienced such negative feelings about a populace of people who had no effect on my life whatsoever, so I explored within.  I discovered that the idea of a submissive man went against my personal desires of what I wanted to see in a man.  It went against what I had grown up to believe was "right."  So the idea of a man submitting had more to do with a concept that challenged what I "knew" and desired, and the negativity was really about my own internal conflict, rather than what anyone out in the world was practicing.

It also had to do with my image of my mother and father.  My father was an enormously strong man - 6'1, Naval Officer who graduated from Annapolis and went on to become a Top Secret analyst for Federal offices in DC.  Other than knowing he conducted satellite reconnaissance of the Russians during the Cold War, we were not privy to what he did in his career. 

And yet, within the walls of our household, my mother ruled the roost.  As a youngster growing up in such an environment, it was confusing, and without the maturity to process the fact that humans are multifaceted and can even demonstrate natures which are converse to each other, I likely rejected the notion that this man who I looked up to so much would agree to being bossed around by my mother.  As a result, I felt contempt for my mother and humiliated for my father.

Pretty fucked up. 

So when I'd find men openly demonstrate their submissiveness to women, those negative feelings would come up, and I rejected them, thus feeling a dislike for submissive men, because they conjured up feelings in me that I didn't like or understand.  They threatened my idea of "the way it ought to be."

Again, it was an internal conflict regarding what I believed and desired to be "right."  How dare these men challenge that and disrupt my organized thinking of everyone belonging in their appropriate box?

I can now look back and see a man who provided for his family, who ensured his kids were raised according to his wife's values, which he admired, and who was strong enough and "man enough" to hold his head up and be the man he needed to be.  I find that admirable.

Since I spent a great many years stuck in a box of my own making, I've learned how liberating it is to just be true to myself, and to "let" people be and express who they are, provided they are not harming anyone.  It sure makes internal peace much easier to come by.  Contempt for another person for simply being?  It no longer fits in my world.  I'd rather be happy that in this day and age, people have a lot more freedom to be who they are.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.


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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:35:51 AM   
ranja


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Joined: 11/1/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ishtarr

Most people have contempt for pedophiliacs, does that mean that they necessarily fear and misunderstand him?

It seems very likely that people are able to look down on people and disrespect them without there being fear involved.


i suppose some people might have contempt for peadophiles and not be fearful of them and maybe also understand them...
i personally do not understand them at all and am fearful of them for the children... it would be bloody scary knowing one lived on my street.



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Profile   Post #: 147
RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:44:50 AM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
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A submissive man, who can step out of his role as macho bastard to devoted pain slut with a look, is one of the sexiest moments for me
When a man can divulge his desires with trust and hunger and lust. Im a very happy woman.
Those men who cannot  let me see inside their walls, their hearts, their souls,  their mind and submit to my passions,  are those I have no time for.
just my two cents




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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 9:05:09 AM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
My confusions rests with his statement that he can be both contemptuous and tolerant at the same time.


I have no confusion at all re that statement. As a submale I'm similar, in fact: if I once got a vibe of such contempt aimed at me, the perp would get his arse kicked verbally, physically, or both. But I'd still be tolerant of him. Perfectly straightforward!

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 9:33:53 AM   
NocturnalStalker


Posts: 3858
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AneNoz

quote:

Fifty goats? I think I could have that arranged.
An auction! NocturnalStalker, I have an offer of fifty goats, surely you are able to better this offer. Think of the joys she will bring, she is an accomplished dancer and trained in the arts of love. She will bear you many fine sons.

Be at peace
Aneka



I propose seventy-six goats and the IPod Touch.


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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 10:21:45 AM   
VaguelyCurious


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From: United Kingdom
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nm. too off topic.


< Message edited by VaguelyCurious -- 4/29/2011 11:09:03 AM >


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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 10:39:42 AM   
Zonie63


Posts: 2826
Joined: 4/25/2011
From: The Old Pueblo
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida


That's my story and I'm sticking to it.



My story is somewhat the opposite of that. The happiest couple I ever knew in my life was my paternal grandparents. My grandmother pretty much ruled the household while my grandfather puttered around in the garage or the basement. She pretty much made most of the decisions, while my grandfather would just kick back and tell old stories about his life. It wasn't always like that, though.

At one time, my grandfather ruled the house with an iron fist, but when their eldest child reached the eighth grade, my grandfather decided that nobody needed any more education than an 8th-grade education. That's all he had, so that should be good enough for everyone. That's when my grandmother put her foot down and started to take over the reins of control in the family. They were also staunchly religious. They never watched movies, no dancing was allowed, and you couldn't do much of anything on Sunday. Still, they seemed much closer and in love with each other more than my own parents, who got divorced when I was six.

My father never hit my mother, and in fact, none of the men in my family were ever abusive or wife-beaters. To me, the concept was totally alien. Even when I would see shows about it on TV or even hear real-life stories, I was very skeptical: "No way would a man ever hit a woman. No such person exists on this planet." It wasn't until I reached my college that I finally started to believe that such things really do happen.

I took more after my father than after my mother. My father was very logical and analytical, but my mother's primary complaint was that he was weak. That was part of the reason they got divorced, probably the main reason from her point of view. But my mother was not exactly a tower of strength either. In the years following the divorce, she was a basket case, always crying all the time, could never manage her finances, and was in no condition to be taking custody of my brother and me. Fortunately, her parents lived close-by, so my brother and I stayed with them a lot, but eventually, we had to go back to live with our father.

As I matured, I began to look and act more and more like my father, and (while I didn't realize why until years later) my mother started to resent me more because of it. It wasn't intentional; it was just an emotional reaction which my mother was famous for. But again, it wasn't until years later that I was able to understand this. While it was going on, I was horribly confused about a lot of things. It was the 1970s, so it was kind of weird back then. My mother also was a staunch supporter of women's lib and talked a lot about strong women, but she wasn't strong herself. Maybe my father was weak, but at least he took care of us, while my mother could not. My father and I used to watch Star Trek together, and I was just amazed at how much he knew. He knew about science, technology, engineering, math - the man was a genius.

Where it started to go downhill for my father and me was when he got remarried, and that's when his perceived "weakness" might have impacted on me more negatively. He was giving in and deferring to his new wife a bit too much for my taste. I was 16 at the time, but at least it gave me the incentive to move out, be self-sufficient, and more independent. I just wanted to get the hell out of there. My new step-mother also had three kids of her own, so I suddenly had three younger siblings. It wasn't exactly The Brady Bunch.

I was born into the world of Leave it to Beaver, but by the time I came of age, it was Dawn of the Dead.


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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 11:46:08 AM   
diablarosa


Posts: 63
Joined: 10/3/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

quote:

ORIGINAL: diablarosa
Not a useful ally to YOU, and those who think like you, I guess. btw, are you denying that submission--REAL submission, not being a needy and desperate little pervert or sissy panzy that gets bent out of shape when he doesn't get his way with his opedial fantasy--doesn't take strength?
 

Of course not to me.  Do you seriously think I care one whit if some desperate woman requires his weakness as a way to bolster her self-image?  Don't be ridiculous?  Trying to reframe that as strength is simply a self-deception.


Hmm, your reading comprehension leaves much to be desired, but i'm not fooled. Your smarter than this. Anyway, this idea that submission does not require a certain strength flies in the face of how a lot of people think about it and what many , myself included, know to be true. Your simply wrong on this subject. Sorry.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
If find that weak-willed women unable to tolerate the presence of a contrary opinion to their own often trot out this kind of nonsense.  My opinions may be anathema to you, but at some point you're going to have to grow up and be a big girl about it and realise that the world isn't built just to keep you and your self-image happy.


LOL Cognitive dissonance response numero dos. who said I can't tolerate a contrary opinion? your the one who seems to be having a problem with things, daddy. The rest of your reply is lazy and void of any effort in admitting your cognitive failure. Seriously. If you want to really have an intellectual debate on this, cool, but you're going to have to try harder than this "artful" dodging of yours.

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 6:05:55 PM   
Awareness


Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: diablarosa
quote:

Of course not to me.  Do you seriously think I care one whit if some desperate woman requires his weakness as a way to bolster her self-image?  Don't be ridiculous?  Trying to reframe that as strength is simply a self-deception.


Hmm, your reading comprehension leaves much to be desired, but i'm not fooled. Your smarter than this. Anyway, this idea that submission does not require a certain strength flies in the face of how a lot of people think about it and what many , myself included, know to be true. Your simply wrong on this subject. Sorry.
  You have no idea.  This is not about reading comprehension but insight.  While some people regard the Dom/female sub interaction and the Domme/male sub interaction as two sides of the same coin, I find them completely and utterly different.  Doms and Dommes are nothing like each other.  The dichotomy goes on under the very noses of people who think themselves educated, while they ignore the obvious that stares them in the face.

As the simplest example - Doms who construct elaborate titles for themselves are rightfully regarded with a good deal of scepticism, simply because such titles are vain attempts at self-glorification.  Yet Dommes engage in such narcissistic nonsense with consistency.  How many Dommes self-style themselves as Goddesses.  It's so astonishingly consistent it's cliche.  I remember when I first came here being phenomenally amused at the attempts Dommes made to try and bolster their self-image.  The stuff in their signature lines made me howl with laughter.  When a woman tries to advertise herself as a "big bad dominant" in her signature, what she's trying to say is:  "This is how I want you to perceive me.  Go on... believe me... believe me!  Please!"

It is patently obvious to me, that such are painfully limited in their thinking - which limits their perception and definitely demonstrates a lack of self-awareness.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
If find that weak-willed women unable to tolerate the presence of a contrary opinion to their own often trot out this kind of nonsense.  My opinions may be anathema to you, but at some point you're going to have to grow up and be a big girl about it and realise that the world isn't built just to keep you and your self-image happy.


quote:

LOL Cognitive dissonance response numero dos. who said I can't tolerate a contrary opinion? your the one who seems to be having a problem with things, daddy. The rest of your reply is lazy and void of any effort in admitting your cognitive failure. Seriously. If you want to really have an intellectual debate on this, cool, but you're going to have to try harder than this "artful" dodging of yours.
  Christ, and you wonder why I find it difficult to treat you lot seriously.  Honestly, you toss in standard cookie-cutter responses which are nothing more than little mantras you repeat to comfort yourselves, like a nursery rhyme sung by a child as it rocks itself to sleep.  You simply pick your favourite explanation, pronounce it, expect to be taken seriously then claim cognitive dissonance when I laugh at your feeble attempts at debate.

A debate would require you to think and reason and you've demonstrated precious little ability to do that.  A debate also requires terms of reference and some axioms and there is very little reason to believe we would agree on those axioms.  Now go look up the word 'axiom' before you reply, there's a good girl.


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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:06:27 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
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quote:

nm. too off topic.
They're auctioning a girl for goats and you are too off topic?? VC I simply MUST know what you were going to post!!

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RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:10:03 PM   
Hisprettybaby


Posts: 781
Joined: 4/13/2011
From: Bellingham, WA U.S.A.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer


quote:


Will he suddenly reveal that my maleness correctly expressed in it's proper and natural dominate form is somehow unnatural
I fear not.


The word is dominant , Arturas. Jesus wept.


I wondered when someone would tell him that. I didn't because in HIS eyes I'm an inferior woman.

~Hisprettybaby~

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Profile   Post #: 156
RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 8:17:54 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline
You know, I wouldn't have an issue with the Doms who say they have an issue with male subs if they didn't dress it up in their "natural order" drivel. I mean if you've got an irrational dislike of something, go for it, but spare us the pseudo-science for fuck's sake.

If you really honestly believe in some natural male domliness, well, what can I say, you're dumber than I am when I'm 20 pints into a 24.


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Profile   Post #: 157
RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 9:26:59 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline
quote:

i think most dominant men don't care much at all about submissive men or dominant women, as long as they keep their distance
Hey, I know I'm not "most dominant men" but I have a hard time imagining a more entertaining and enlightening evening than one spent over a glass or two of wine with our very own LadyPact.

That's her picture in the dictionary next to both the entries on "Smoking Hot" and "Wisdom" you know.


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Ha Ha...Charade you are!


Why do they leave out the letter b on "Garage Sale" signs?

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Profile   Post #: 158
RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 10:49:03 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

It is hard to look down on someone who is living a fulfilling life and is happy with a good partner. The odd ball who can't find his way, has strange desires, and no girlfriend -- he's lower on the totem pole.


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Profile   Post #: 159
RE: Do you have contempt for submissive males? - 4/29/2011 11:22:36 PM   
diablarosa


Posts: 63
Joined: 10/3/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
This is not about reading comprehension but insight. 


oh is that what you're calling it? I was thinking more along the lines of transference with a sprinkle of confirmation bias. But ok, "insight".

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
While some people regard the Dom/female sub interaction and the Domme/male sub interaction as two sides of the same coin, I find them completely and utterly different.  Doms and Dommes are nothing like each other.  The dichotomy goes on under the very noses of people who think themselves educated, while they ignore the obvious that stares them in the face.


WOW. you are like, totally blowing me away so far. No shit Sherlock; doms and dommes aren't like each other, because they're opposite sexes, jackass. So where someone like you will prattle on about the good of the differences in male and female (when it fits your sexist world view), now you want them to be the same if we have to see girls as dominant. Well, I've got news for you: we are not the same. Men and women are physically and mentally different. deal.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
As the simplest example - Doms who construct elaborate titles for themselves are rightfully regarded with a good deal of scepticism, simply because such titles are vain attempts at self-glorification.  Yet Dommes engage in such narcissistic nonsense with consistency. 


You sound like a whiney, weak little child. And you think of yourself as a searingly intelligent misogynist! Psh! You don't deserve to wear the badge; you do such men all a disservice. Still waiting for the intellectual and insightful macguffin in this plot here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
How many Dommes self-style themselves as Goddesses.  It's so astonishingly consistent it's cliche. 

Guys like "Lord" a lot, but never mind that. What's wrong with "goddess"? Do you think it's because it's insinuating the ability to teleport to mount olympus or talk to unicorns? Nope. it's because they are using the term grammatically correctly, believe it or not.

god·dess   
[god-is]
–noun
1.a female god or deity. X
2.a woman of extraordinary beauty and charm.
3.a greatly admired or adored woman.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
I remember when I first came here being phenomenally amused at the attempts Dommes made to try and bolster their self-image.  The stuff in their signature lines made me howl with laughter. 


oh yeah, because we all know men aren't guilty of that, either. Tell you what, while you're howling with laughter, let me piss a "polite and less offensive" sig line to all the delicate and misogynist hicks out there down your throat so you can choke on it. i won't even demand tribute after.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
It is patently obvious to me, that such are painfully limited in their thinking - which limits their perception and definitely demonstrates a lack of self-awareness.


It's patently obvious that you're a moron who is obviously limited in his thinking. You look at profiles online and judge all dominant women by them. And YOU'RE talking about limits of perception and awareness? Dude, get off the internet and get out more. Seriously.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
A debate would require you to think and reason and you've demonstrated precious little ability to do that. 


I think I demonstrated that problem lies with you and on multiple counts.

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