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Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 8:20:56 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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I've been reading Screw the Roses, Send Me the Thorns and find myself getting progressively annoyed. While I do think there is some good advice in there, particularly in being cautious when looking for a partner, I find the overall touchy feely coddle the s-type attitude just rubs me the wrong way.

While yes it's good to be careful and not break your toys they tend to gloss over things that many of us enjoy safely and without permanent damage. For example, they dismiss total slavitude as the domain of women looking to avoid responsibility for their lives by giving total control to their D-type. In another area, corporal punishment there is little to nothing devoted to people like me who just want the snot beaten out of them and in fact find it quite cathartic. We choose instead to make sure to get to know the one who will beat us well before submitting to the beatings.

It (the book) frequently comes across as one-true-way. again annoying. It could have included more exceptions to the rules and by not doing so some of us may be left with the idea that we are doing it wrong or there is something wrong with us.

So what do those of you who have read this book think? Have any of you had the same response I have?

Zeph aka #7

< Message edited by zephyroftheNorth -- 9/4/2011 8:21:13 AM >

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 8:35:36 AM

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I read the book probably about ten years ago and just laughed. It reminded me of CastleRealm. I threw it away a few days later finding it completely useless to me.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 8:39:47 AM

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I read it when I first heard about D/s and it was good in that it showed me I wasn't the only one.

Apart from that, it's a bit "one true way" for me too. But to be fair, any book is going to mostly reflect the views of the author.

I'm one of those "freaky" slaves that enjoys a punishment dynamic and pain play just for the hell of it. Even on cm I get the "you're dealing with issues" or "an adult would just talk things out and move on" talks. I just shrug, say YKINMKBIOK and move on with my happy little life.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 8:40:25 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

I read the book probably about ten years ago and just laughed. It reminded me of CastleRealm. I threw it away a few days later finding it completely useless to me.

That's exactly it! After hearing how so many recommend it I was really disappointed. I think it's more helpful for those looking for a bit of kinky sex than those of us who are not quite so delicate and in need of protection.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 8:42:13 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

I'm one of those "freaky" slaves that enjoys a punishment dynamic and pain play just for the hell of it.

Which is basically ignored in favor of the funishment dynamic. I've rolled my eyes so much I'm afraid they will get stuck that way.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 8:59:35 AM

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I never read it, but I did quite like the title. I'm disappointed to learn that the title is wasted on a shitty book.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 9:01:21 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

quote:

I'm one of those "freaky" slaves that enjoys a punishment dynamic and pain play just for the hell of it.

Which is basically ignored in favor of the funishment dynamic. I've rolled my eyes so much I'm afraid they will get stuck that way.

Exactly!

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 9:13:11 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Epytropos

I never read it, but I did quite like the title. I'm disappointed to learn that the title is wasted on a shitty book.

Like I said in my OP it isn't completely without merit. The section on precautions when looking for a partner, especially looking online is good, it's the basically one true way, coddle your subbie parts that annoyed me.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 9:17:34 AM

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I dunno. I'm not much for caution. Bad decisions make for good stories. I mean you have to exercise basic awareness, but if anything I'd say the average person is way, way too cautious about internet interactions. I'll meet subs who come to bed with me on the first night without question, but I've had subs block me for mentioning sex in passing after 2 weeks of talking on here. It's not rational.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 9:23:31 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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REALLY bad decisions can also leave you dead. I do agree with you though and in fact have done exactly that with two men. I knew both really well and did check them out beforehand but I stayed with them right from the first trip to meet them.Had a great time too.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 9:57:48 AM

Mr4sg

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I love the book. It fixed my wobbly table perfectly.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:10:05 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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Hey THERE'S an idea. I hadn't even thought of it, I know just the table to use it on. Thanks!

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:10:25 AM

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I've read it and I recall, from the very beginning, the authors state that the book is written from their own point of view as a Male dominant, female submissive couple. They repeatedly state that their was isn't the only way. I found this book far more entertaining than Different Loving, which comes across as home counselling for white collar professionals who have discovered they like to have their asses whipped.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:14:39 AM

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I agree with SP about the first bit... but I did enjoy LD as well, for different reasons (and I am damned tired, so I may get back to ya on the why's of that..or not..probably, I'll forget by the time I wake up)

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:14:46 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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True but I take that as being from the point of view of male dom/female sub as opposed to female dom/male sub or female dom/female sub male dom/male sub. As I said, what I found annoying was this business of treating the sub like some fragile object that might break if not coddled.

ETA: their perspective is one thing, advising others not to do it is quite another. Also, dismissing what others might greatly enjoy also annoyed me, imo they should have encouraged exploring other things more.

< Message edited by zephyroftheNorth -- 9/4/2011 10:17:12 AM >

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:29:28 AM

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I read the book years ago, the same with Loving Dominant. While neither of them appealed to me ( I am a hard core, beat the fuck out of me unconscious, masochist ) I did find that they are good references for people new to the scene. They both give practical advice that a person/couple can then build upon. To be honest, when asked by new comers, I often refer them to those two books as a foundation on which to build, stressing that they should be used only as a foundation and not as the blocks themselves.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:43:03 AM

zephyroftheNorth

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Which is why I think there should be a broader spectrum of the kinky stuff in there. Imagine someone new to all this who happens to enjoy a good heavy beating to the point you do who reads Screw the Roses, sees that they discourage such stuff and thinks s/he is a freak for enjoying it. Similarly they describe total slavitude as the stuff of fantasies. How is that going to be helpful to the neophyte?

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 10:52:05 AM

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I bought the book gee almost 17 yrs ago...'94 or '95, I actually had a signed copy from Phil. He and Molly were at a club in Boston. My copy went with my first Dom so I have not seen a copy in many years. I recently was able to glance through a copy and yes I found it annoying. It wasn't annoying the first time I read it but the second revisit I sort of wondered how it even got any popularity.

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 11:03:09 AM

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I read the book about 10 years ago. My copy is ... somewhere around.

Right at the start of my bdsm life I thought I was a sub. I was sure I would hate pain.

Soooo, fast forward a decade and I'm a masochist slave. A couple of years ago I remember being told by a guy who was (briefly) a prospective Dom to read the book again and understand that there's no place for masochism AND slavery. I was either a masochistic bottom, or a slave.

Sighs...I'm so glad I didn't listen to him! And so is my sadistic Master

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RE: Screw the Roses.... - 9/4/2011 11:09:41 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

REALLY bad decisions can also leave you dead. I do agree with you though and in fact have done exactly that with two men. I knew both really well and did check them out beforehand but I stayed with them right from the first trip to meet them.Had a great time too.

I was more referring to a distinction between meeting in real life and trying to interact online - the distinction in how cautious people are between the two is baffling for me. It's like people are really convinced they can look me in the eye and tell whether or not I'm a psychopath in a few hours, but doing it from my writing is all but impossible. It just strikes me as something close to a phobia - if people were that fearful of others in day to day life they'd never leave the house. Why are internet people inherently more scary than regular people?

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