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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:07:40 AM   
SweetCheri


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So you are unable to answer any of my questions. Very well, that is noted. I however can answer yours.

quote:

Can you name one place where that is where a woman "must" breastfeed?
Wherever she is when her child is hungry.
quote:

Or is it that she has chosen to do so?
As is her legal right.
quote:

So would you brush your hair in court?
Yes, why not?
quote:

Did you read the article?
Yes, but that is irrelevant, you asked general questions
quote:

Was she sitting at the plaintiff or defense table? Did she have an attorney?
Do you know what occurs in a US courtroom?
All completely irrelevant to the questions you asked or the questions I asked.

quote:

So when is a parent responsible for teaching the child about "social conventions?"
That process would start sometime after it is an infant.

Now, perhaps, though it is unlikely, you will now be so kind as to answer my question.
Why does breastfeeding upset you so much that you go on a three page rant against it?




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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:28:41 AM   
xxblushesxx


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I'll answer your question even though it was not directed to me. I don't believe she "ranted" against breast feeding per se, it was the venue in which this woman chose to do so. Having breast fed three children, I can tell you that a mother knows about when her child will be hungry, and it is possible to take steps to avoid breast feeding in improper places. (such as a court room) Some of those steps might involve, feeding the child a bit earlier (or later) than normal so that it is not hungry at the time you need to be in court, bringing along some milk that has been expressed and put into a bottle, or even finding someone to watch your little one, because honestly, babies do not belong in the court room. (and I LOVE babies)

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:40:42 AM   
SuzeQ


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A few serious points first. (Well, OK, they could only be considered anything but a joke in the context of this thread.)

What exactly is it about a PUBLIC courtroom that makes it more sacrosanct than a cathedral? Nothing.
If it is only the venue she is upset about, then why all the questions about other places; stores, bathrooms, etc.? Because the courtroom is only an excuse to complain about public breastfeeding.
Why can she not answer any of the questions put to her? Because doing so would expose the vacuousness of her position.

Why am I answering my own questions? Because the OP won't.
_____________________________________________
Now on to the main course...

A woman and a baby come into the doctor’s office. She was told to go into a room and wait for the doctor.
After arriving there, the doctor examined the baby and asked the woman: “Is he breast fed or on the bottle?

Breast fed” she replied.

Well, strip down to your waist,” the doctor ordered.

She did as she was asked. He pressed, kneaded and pinched both breasts for a while in a detailed examination. Motioning to her to get dressed said, “No wonder this baby is hungry. You don’t have any milk.

Of course not,” she said, “I’m his aunt. But I’m glad I came.


< Message edited by SuzeQ -- 11/15/2011 8:42:00 AM >

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:41:37 AM   
Hillwilliam


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I think the lady was caught between a rock and a hard place. Not everyone has the money to pay for a sitter or day care. the fact that her baby had an ear infection makes it even more difficult as some daycares basically say "Don't bring a sick baby in".

I would 100% rather see a woman discretely breastfeeding (as she was) than to hear a hungry baby with an earache. I don't care if it's a courtroom, restaurant, mall, faculty meeting or where.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:44:11 AM   
xxblushesxx


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But there are ways to mitigate that as I discussed above. And honestly, if your baby has an earache, don't take him/her out anywhere, he's already miserable enough as it is. Re-schedule.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:54:37 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

Yes, please let's look at the video. There is a two second shot of the woman feeding her child, no "re-enactment."


By re-enactment I meant that while she appeared to be breastfeeding, she was not in the court.

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Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:55:22 AM   
Iamsemisweet


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When you get a subpoena to go to court, you go.  I doubt a court is going to reschedule a trial in which the mother is a witness because her baby is sick.  Nor does the witness have any control over when her testimony is scheduled, or how long the proceeding goes.  You go, and deal with it as best you can, or you risk not going and getting found in contempt.  Rock and a hard place, indeed.
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

But there are ways to mitigate that as I discussed above. And honestly, if your baby has an earache, don't take him/her out anywhere, he's already miserable enough as it is. Re-schedule.


_____________________________

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The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 8:58:47 AM   
xxblushesxx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

When you get a subpoena to go to court, you go.  I doubt a court is going to reschedule a trial in which the mother is a witness because her baby is sick.  Nor does the witness have any control over when her testimony is scheduled, or how long the proceeding goes.  You go, and deal with it as best you can, or you risk not going and getting found in contempt.  Rock and a hard place, indeed.
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

But there are ways to mitigate that as I discussed above. And honestly, if your baby has an earache, don't take him/her out anywhere, he's already miserable enough as it is. Re-schedule.



There are ways around that as you know. I've seen people witness through cam and over the phone. I've seen witnesses reschedule, I've also seen people ask their friends, relatives and neighbors to please watch their baby for the day. There are churches that will watch your baby for you, and if she just HAD to bring the baby into court, she could have waited outside the courtroom until it was her turn to testify.

_____________________________

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A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com


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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 9:24:20 AM   
VirginPotty


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBBTBW

I have no problem with anyone breastfeeding their children in public. It is a normal, natural thing.


So is taking a dump but I wouldn't want to see that being done in public.  If you're breastfeeding use a pump, fill a bottle & take it w/you.  The baby's still getting its nutrients just thru a different nipple.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 9:28:48 AM   
MadAxeman


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Well, I for one am completely shocked and outraged.

How long have gay men been holding hands and women riding bicycles?

They should be taken to court.

Ban this filth NOW!

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 9:41:55 AM   
Lucylastic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBBTBW

I breastfed my daughter in the park, on the bus and in many public places. This was 26 years ago. I discretely covered her and myself up with a blanket and she ate to her hearts content. I have no problem with anyone breastfeeding their children in public. It is a normal, natural thing. Sure show a little decorum about yourself and put a lite blanket over you and your child but those of you that are offended...get over yourselves.

this
PLUS....



A SECTION OF ONTARIOS HUMAN RIGHTS CHARTER.
VIII. Services, Goods and Facilities
Section 1 of the Code prohibits discrimination in “services, goods and facilities” against women who are pregnant and breastfeeding. This includes educational institutions, hospitals and health services, insurance providers, public places like malls and parks, public transit, and stores and restaurants. This means that women who are pregnant, or who are accompanied by their babies to a restaurant or a theatre, cannot be denied service or access unless there is a bona fide reason for doing so. This also means that women have a right to nurse undisturbed, and cannot be prevented from breastfeeding a child in, for example, a public area or restaurant. They also cannot be asked to move to a more “discreet” area to breastfeed a child, or to “cover up”. Complaints from other persons will not justify interfering with a woman’s right to breastfeed.
Example: While a mother was waiting in a courtroom to contest a parking ticket, she began to nurse her infant son. The security guard asked her to leave the courtroom and nurse her son where she would not be seen. The Tribunal ruled that this was discriminatory.64
Education providers have the same type of obligation as employers to accommodate women who are pregnant or breastfeeding, including the obligation to cooperatively discuss options and create a supportive environment.
Example: An educational program requires all of its students to complete a co-op placement as a condition of graduation. These placements last several weeks, and are in locations across the province. A student who has a young baby who is still breastfeeding frequently asks to be accommodated in a placement within a reasonable commute of her home, so that she can go home in the evening to nurse her baby, and more easily transport the breastmilk she will be pumping during the day. The program explores accommodation options with her.
Service providers should take steps to design their services in a way that is inclusive of pregnant and breastfeeding women.
Example: The City of Toronto has approved a policy on Breastfeeding in Public that supports women who live, work in or visit Toronto to breastfeed anytime and anywhere in public spaces controlled by the City. The City also promotes positive attitudes towards breastfeeding through public events such as annual Breastfeeding Challenges.65
Access to services may be affected by negative attitudes and stereotypes. For example, lone mothers are heavily stigmatized, especially if they are young, racialized or Aboriginal, or in receipt of social assistance, and these women may find themselves subjected to unwarranted scrutiny, denied services, or subjected to harassment when seeking services.
Example: A young Aboriginal lone mother in receipt of social assistance is told by her caseworker that she “is just having babies to get benefits” and that she “should have her tubes tied”.



FOR FURTHER INFORMATION
For more information about the Ontario Human Rights Commission or this policy statement, please call 1-800-387-9080 (toll free) or in Toronto (416) 326-9511 (TTD (416) 314-4535), during regular office hours from Monday to Friday. You can also visit our Web site at www.ohrc.on.ca.

IM so very happy I live in ontario, where my rights to feed my child are covered , wherever I happen to be caught short. Despite being almost 50, Im glad the law is there to protect my daughters rights... against those who rant against it.

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\(•_•)
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(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 9:43:26 AM   
Iamsemisweet


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Of course.  She should move heaven and earth for the privilege of appearing in court as a witness and not offending the tender sensibilities of the judge and bailiff.  And really, who wouldn't jump at the chance to care for someone elses' baby with an ear infection? 
Since I am not offended by breast feeding, of all things, I will continue in my belief that the courts should accomodate the public, not the other way around.  But feel free to believe otherwise.  All I know is that if this happened in my county, I would happily join the throng objecting to how this woman was treated.
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

When you get a subpoena to go to court, you go.  I doubt a court is going to reschedule a trial in which the mother is a witness because her baby is sick.  Nor does the witness have any control over when her testimony is scheduled, or how long the proceeding goes.  You go, and deal with it as best you can, or you risk not going and getting found in contempt.  Rock and a hard place, indeed.
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

But there are ways to mitigate that as I discussed above. And honestly, if your baby has an earache, don't take him/her out anywhere, he's already miserable enough as it is. Re-schedule.



There are ways around that as you know. I've seen people witness through cam and over the phone. I've seen witnesses reschedule, I've also seen people ask their friends, relatives and neighbors to please watch their baby for the day. There are churches that will watch your baby for you, and if she just HAD to bring the baby into court, she could have waited outside the courtroom until it was her turn to testify.


_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 9:45:19 AM   
searching4mysir


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quote:

ORIGINAL: VirginPotty

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBBTBW

I have no problem with anyone breastfeeding their children in public. It is a normal, natural thing.


So is taking a dump but I wouldn't want to see that being done in public.  If you're breastfeeding use a pump, fill a bottle & take it w/you.  The baby's still getting its nutrients just thru a different nipple.



Defacating in public is a public health safety issue. There is no such public health safety issue with breastmilk. Additionally, not every woman can pump and using bottles can cause nipple confusion. They have to work harder to empty a breast than they do to empty a bottle. You cannot overfeed a breastfed baby, but you can a bottlefed one.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 11:01:52 AM   
agirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: VirginPotty

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBBTBW

I have no problem with anyone breastfeeding their children in public. It is a normal, natural thing.


So is taking a dump but I wouldn't want to see that being done in public.  If you're breastfeeding use a pump, fill a bottle & take it w/you.  The baby's still getting its nutrients just thru a different nipple.


Why on earth should anyone that is happily and successfully feeding their child, in the biologically correct manner, have to faff about with bottles and pumps to satisfy other people's ridiculous prudery?

Tip: The head is sat atop a marvelous thing called a neck.....which has the ability to turn the head and change the view. 

agirl






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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 11:12:12 AM   
agirl


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"Further, a U.S. Public Law[30] enacted in 1999, specifically provides that "a woman may breastfeed her child at ANY LOCATION in a Federal building or on Federal property, if the woman and her child are otherwise authorized to be present at the location."

Is a court not a Federal building?

agirl


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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 11:14:11 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

"Further, a U.S. Public Law[30] enacted in 1999, specifically provides that "a woman may breastfeed her child at ANY LOCATION in a Federal building or on Federal property, if the woman and her child are otherwise authorized to be present at the location."

Is a court not a Federal building?

agirl


I guess that would depend upon the jurisdiction of the court in question. It might be state, federally or locally owned but I still think the baliff shouldn't have been a prick about it regardless of jurisdiction.


_____________________________

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Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 11:25:00 AM   
Iamsemisweet


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Some courts are state, some are federal.  Family law court would be state.

Good for the Feds, though.
quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

"Further, a U.S. Public Law[30] enacted in 1999, specifically provides that "a woman may breastfeed her child at ANY LOCATION in a Federal building or on Federal property, if the woman and her child are otherwise authorized to be present at the location."

Is a court not a Federal building?

agirl



_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 11:35:21 AM   
GreedyTop


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quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: VirginPotty

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBBTBW

I have no problem with anyone breastfeeding their children in public. It is a normal, natural thing.


So is taking a dump but I wouldn't want to see that being done in public.  If you're breastfeeding use a pump, fill a bottle & take it w/you.  The baby's still getting its nutrients just thru a different nipple.


Why on earth should anyone that is happily and successfully feeding their child, in the biologically correct manner, have to faff about with bottles and pumps to satisfy other people's ridiculous prudery?

Tip: The head is sat atop a marvelous thing called a neck.....which has the ability to turn the head and change the view. 

agirl








love this!

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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 12:02:47 PM   
HeatherMcLeather


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In this debate the two sides can be easily distinguished. Those supporting a mother's right to breastfeed undisturbed have made sensible, reasoned posts. Those who oppose, on the other hand have made ridiculous, insulting, impassioned and to be honest, occasionally asinine (Hi VP) posts.

I wonder why that might be.

I agree 100% with IASS here, the court serves the people, not the other way around. It is a court of law for God's sake, a place where the public's business is carried out, not some sacred temple.

Also, for those demanding decorum and respect, please keep in mind that many churches have depictions of the Madonna nursing the baby Jesus. I figure if its OK in a church, its OK pretty much anywhere.


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RE: Breastfeeding In Court? - 11/15/2011 12:07:49 PM   
VirginPotty


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From: Virginville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: VirginPotty

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBBTBW

I have no problem with anyone breastfeeding their children in public. It is a normal, natural thing.


So is taking a dump but I wouldn't want to see that being done in public.  If you're breastfeeding use a pump, fill a bottle & take it w/you.  The baby's still getting its nutrients just thru a different nipple.


Why on earth should anyone that is happily and successfully feeding their child, in the biologically correct manner, have to faff about with bottles and pumps to satisfy other people's ridiculous prudery?

Tip: The head is sat atop a marvelous thing called a neck.....which has the ability to turn the head and change the view. 

agirl



Opinions are like assholes..............everyone has one.  Allow me mine w/o resorting to name calling (ridiculous prudery).

The head sitting atop of the neck thing you posted.......very true and one I use plenty of times.  However, my "faff about bottles" was merely a suggestion to combat the "ridiculous prudery".  Why is it "faff"?  Plenty of breast feeding women use bottles when out in public.

_____________________________

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