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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 10:05:29 PM

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I have come to the realization that sometimes the sub "thinks" he/she wishes to be controlled, to be trained, to be mentored and directed, but in reality they as mentioned before, they have a preconceived notion as to what THEY think this entails. So instead of embracing what is being requested of them, they choose to attempt to manipulate or dictate what THEY want the request to be, which is not what the Dom is commanding of them.
I too experienced this once with a sub, had tasks established with rewards and punishments, but even after punishments were invoked, the sub continued to dispute, argue and create excuses as to why the tasks could not be completed in the time frame or manner expected. I eventually dismissed her and told her to seek out a DADDY figure, she obviously needed that kind of attention.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/26/2012 10:11:47 PM

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Perhaps.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/27/2012 2:07:51 AM

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As HisPet21 stated, I have done funishments, but that's all good-natured. When my Master laughs and smiles at my playful attempts, I smile and laugh with Him.

Otherwise, I don't see a point in pushing a Master that I respect. I have, however, headbutted and eventually come out on top with a few fakes. They try so hard, but the instant a slave puts her hoof down, they run from the horns. Y'know what they say about messing with bulls, and I'm a proud Taurus. Respect is key in a relationship. If it's not there from the start, expect to get gored with defiance.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/27/2012 2:27:58 AM

LillyoftheVally

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quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx

She -asked- for these things. She stated she was sick of arriving late for work, she was sick of not having time to do the things she wanted to do. She is the one that asked for the guidelines, I just gave her guidelines to adhere to.

But, I was under the impression that the job of the dominant was to guide the sub, and to teach them to manage themselves, IF that sub were incapable or UNwilling to do so themselves.

I am talking about a 30 year old woman that couldn't find time to clean her house or walk her dog because she was too busy playing Diner Dash on her computer.

I made more than reasonable and ample effort to include the things she -wanted- to do, with the things she -needed- to do to maintain her life. Like, work, clean house, cook meals, pay bills, not over spend...

Sorry, I expected her to be a grown up.

Sorry, I am talking from my own experience which does not match up to that. I was in a relationship for a while and then one day woke up to find a list of 'rules' I was expected to adhere to. They didn't actually have a chance to give them to me. I saw them, calmly packed up my stuff and went home. Totally diffierent situation of course, but my initial comment was based on that.

The only thing I would disagree with in what you posted was the idea that it is the dominants responsibility to sort out an incapable human being, though it is nice if a dominant wants to do that I don't think they should feel they have to.

Sorry for the misunderstanding there

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/27/2012 5:28:46 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx
But, I was under the impression that the job of the dominant was to guide the sub, and to teach them to manage themselves, IF that sub were incapable or UNwilling to do so themselves.

Perhaps that's the job of your kind of dominant (and to an extent, I feel a responsibility to guide subs) but there are all kinds of dominant and dominance, and all kinds of sub and submission.

quote:

Sorry, I expected her to be a grown up.

You know, personally, I think you're 100% entitled to that expectation (I expect it too, as it happens), but some subs are looking for a dominant that will be a grown up for them - Which is fair enough, there are lots of doms out there who would dig that kind of relationship - it just isn't my cup of tea, or yours, I suspect.

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Remember.... There's always somewhere on the planet where it's jackass o'clock.

(in reply to xXLithiumXx)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/27/2012 6:16:47 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml

quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx
But, I was under the impression that the job of the dominant was to guide the sub, and to teach them to manage themselves, IF that sub were incapable or UNwilling to do so themselves.

Perhaps that's the job of your kind of dominant (and to an extent, I feel a responsibility to guide subs) but there are all kinds of dominant and dominance, and all kinds of sub and submission.

quote:

Sorry, I expected her to be a grown up.

You know, personally, I think you're 100% entitled to that expectation (I expect it too, as it happens), but some subs are looking for a dominant that will be a grown up for them - Which is fair enough, there are lots of doms out there who would dig that kind of relationship - it just isn't my cup of tea, or yours, I suspect.

I went into it thinking I had a completely different animal on my hands. She seemed confident, well read, calm, domestic, all of the things that would make training really easy. What an idiot I was. Lol.

She was only like that in -my- environment. It was a ploy to impress me, and when I figured that out, I buckled down a bit harder; I felt that if she were capable of those behaviors at any given point, to the point that she could pick and choose when she exhibited them, then she could do it all the time.

Turns out it was just a fun game for her, and that was all she wanted. Well, not all, she wanted someone to live life for her so she could sit around and look at the tv all day. It used to kill me that she was so big on that show Me or the Dog? And I had to use those same tactics on her, only in human form, to get a reply.

I think we all come to this with fantasies and expectations; fantasies can be let down, expectations can not. They can be compromised, and a reasonable conclusion met, but in all honesty, the end goal is that both people should be happy. Yes, there is a certain level of testing on, I think, both parts to find that happy place. And someone else, I don't know who right off, I just remember reading it here, said that it's not a D/s thing, its not a male/female thing, it's a human thing.

We live in a world where we are expected to put everything in a two week relationship, and that is just not realistic. People need to take the time to feel each other out, and after what seems like a lifetime of two week all or nothing relationships, you get a lil pissy, and you want to push the other person; I mean, fuck, if you are gonna leave, go on and leave now. Better to do it when I give less of a fuck about you than when I have invested all kinds of emotions and time in you, yanno?

That makes many of us come across as bitter and resentful, when in reality we are scared and sick of being hurt.

Fact is, that may be what the OP is dealing with here. Or, it could be that his style of dominance isn't working with her style of submission. It could also be that he isn't being consistent, or any of the hundred other things that have been listed on this thread, but what both people have to ask themselves is, "is this worth it? Do I want and need this person in my life enough that I will work past this?"

Chances are? It's another two week, microwave, roller-coaster of love, and they will be dividing property before they ever get married.

And no, fixing people isn't what I want to do. It just won't work. I know this because I know myself and I know I am far to fractured a human to fix anyone.

I get burned out after having invested that much in some one, to get no return, or to have my emotions used as a weapon against me.

In my case, she knew I was a switch, and she played on that. She would cry at me about myself as if I had no idea who I was. "well, my domme doesn't..." What ever..yes she does too, quit making shit up.

In the end, I don't want to be a grown up for anyone, some days, not even myself. So...yeah...not my thing...and it had to end.

But- I do not think it is unreasonable to have a set of rules that are adhered to, even if it is just bedroom play. I feel like this just kind of lets everyone know where they stand and what to expect, so that there can be no bitching about what wasn't known later.

I don't think it is my particular style of dominance, in fact, that experience taught me that if a sub approaches me and says they want to live in 24/7 and so on and so forth, what they really mean is they want to be naked 24/7 and they want to have sex 24/7, and they want a fantasy life. And that is just not practical.

So, since then, I haven't taken another sub, and I just kind of stopped looking for a dominant.

Why should I? Someone else has it all figured out already, and I like a good mystery.

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Ideas don't stay in some minds very long because they don't like solitary confinement

You have to believe in yourself. -Tsun Tzu-

Resident Malkavian.

(in reply to crazyml)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/27/2012 6:21:11 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

quote:

ORIGINAL: xXLithiumXx

She -asked- for these things. She stated she was sick of arriving late for work, she was sick of not having time to do the things she wanted to do. She is the one that asked for the guidelines, I just gave her guidelines to adhere to.

But, I was under the impression that the job of the dominant was to guide the sub, and to teach them to manage themselves, IF that sub were incapable or UNwilling to do so themselves.

I am talking about a 30 year old woman that couldn't find time to clean her house or walk her dog because she was too busy playing Diner Dash on her computer.

I made more than reasonable and ample effort to include the things she -wanted- to do, with the things she -needed- to do to maintain her life. Like, work, clean house, cook meals, pay bills, not over spend...

Sorry, I expected her to be a grown up.

Sorry, I am talking from my own experience which does not match up to that. I was in a relationship for a while and then one day woke up to find a list of 'rules' I was expected to adhere to. They didn't actually have a chance to give them to me. I saw them, calmly packed up my stuff and went home. Totally diffierent situation of course, but my initial comment was based on that.

The only thing I would disagree with in what you posted was the idea that it is the dominants responsibility to sort out an incapable human being, though it is nice if a dominant wants to do that I don't think they should feel they have to.

Sorry for the misunderstanding there

Not an issue.

Maybe I should have been more precise in what I was saying.

I feel like if the sub comes to you and expresses that there are areas of life that they have no control over, or are struggling with, then if you, as a person can, then you should, as a compassionate human, guide them.

It's not something all dominants do. But, it is something I felt I had to do. Much of it, in hind site, was more about showing her how to manage time to get the things she wanted.

In your case, I wouldn't have blamed you for leaving. I mean, you wake up to a list with no discussion, no negotiation, just boom, there's your list, get on it.

No. I can't disagree.

In my case, we spent almost a month talking about the problems she was having, and she continually expressed that she could not get a handle on them.

But, I am of the opinion that you shouldn't ask for something if you don't know what you want. She didn't.

_____________________________

If Barbie is so popular, why do you have to buy her friends?

Ideas don't stay in some minds very long because they don't like solitary confinement

You have to believe in yourself. -Tsun Tzu-

Resident Malkavian.

(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/27/2012 9:50:10 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SomeCdnGuy

quote:

Sorry, but part of my get off thing on service, is knowing my partner appreciates my work, and if he doesnt say good job or even look at what ive done... i wont be putting in the effort
So its not really so much service then is it? Its sort of like the teacher's pet sucking up to get praised.

I too think there's a big difference between submissive people who who serve for the sake of service and those who serve for external reward, to be "paid" for their service in some form with secondary things. They're very different creatures.

In response to the opening post:

I'm one of those who sees absolutely no need to test or push to find out things. I'd rather ask, and, even if I barely know the person, believe them, give them the benefit of the doubt. I've never felt duped by showing such respect--or at least not for long, as I have few illusions. And if they are deserving of respect, the payoff of this approach is potentially enormous. I've also found that just interacting naturally with a dominant, showing him what I really am, tells me all I need to know--and very quickly, usually. The great majority are more than happy to to leave my presence as quickly as possible, once they see what I'm really about. Dominants DQ'ing themselves in response to me is most helpful--it means I am spared having to tell them no, which I abhor. I never wanted to win the Miss Slave Universe pageant, I just wanted to find a single dominant person who understood what I was and knew what do with it. :-)

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 6:16:02 AM

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~FR.

What I find interesting is that we all speak of how no two relationships are ever the same. Yet I have noticed a lot of interesting comments.

quote:

I find it immature and something that usually newbies or SAMs do, neither of which I am.

Of which I am neither. Yet, I do test, and I an open and up front about that.

quote:

I test those who think they want to serve me in subtle ways. I expect that they are doing the same to me--TO SEE WHAT I WILL DO. I also expect to be questioned if I've made some kind of oddball request that is just not a good idea. Questioned properly, not told off.

I see myself along those same lines. This is what I hear from Awareness, LadyHib, DominantHunger and a few others.

quote:

My interpretation of "testing", and I think DarkSteven's also (?) is open defiance, that PROVE to me that you're a domly dom.

Something I did only with one man. What was his reaction? He laughed. I mean a heart felt, deep belly laugh. And then simply, and quickly, brought me to heel. No yelling, no demands, no threats, no "My way or the highway". A few hard truths showed me the pull on that leash I desperately was seeking. Yes, every once in a while, I need to feel that tug. I wont speak for other subs, I dont know them. I am strictly strictly speaking for myself.

quote:

but I am not going to change my self or my style to match someone who is either dead wrong, or just plain not interested in being submissive.

Nor would I expect a dominant to do so. However, I would like to point out that because someone is no longer interested in being the submissive you may want them to be (universal you) doesnt mean they arent submissive.

quote:

I think a lot of dominance is based on temporary authority and temporary authority makes absolutely no sense to a submissive.

Oh how true that is for me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

quote:

ORIGINAL: SomeCdnGuy

quote:

If you arent bothering to make sure the work i do for you is done right and to the way you prefer why go out of my way to make sure its done in the way you prefer?
Because that's what your supposed to do. Why would I want to waste my time with somebody who couldn't be trusted to do things the way I want them done? If I have to check every job to make sure it is done right, then really, what's the point?

No kidding, that whole "trust" thing works both ways. I EXPECT that things are done right, once I see that the task is understood.

Again, I am not addressing particular posters, just the thoughts expressed as I read through the thread.

Trust does work both ways. I have yet to meet a dominant who trusts me immediately. Why would he expect me to trust him right off the bat? I dont expect every job to be scrutinized. That would tend to piss me off. However, an occasional check would show me he cares enough to acknowledge the many tasks he sets out for me to do. Its like the white glove test in the military. What if I didnt do it to his expectations? How would I know if he doesnt, occasionally check up behind me?

Another thought, which is very true for me... and only me as I cannot speak for anyone else... a lot of praise rings false, so heaping it on does nothing for me, simply makes me question more. For myself, a little goes a long, long way. I didnt expect praise when I swept the floors. But I glowed when he came home and noticed the walls and ceilings were clean after I scrubbed them that day. If he had said nothing, that would have made me believe that no matter how much or how little I did, it wouldnt matter. My pride in being his slave was not in the mundane things I did day to day, I did them because he asked. It was in the things I did that he never asked me to do. Of course I ran the rick of his displeasure as well, and felt the sting of that a few times for over stepping myself.

I guess what I am trying to say is that, from time to time, I need to feel the snap of the leash. Either in pleasure or displeasure. I know my place, I also know I need to feel my place. If suddenly I am feeling my place has no meaning, or it starts to feel shaky, then I will test. I do not blame the dominant for these feelings. They are my own faults. But they are owned, and expressed.

It could be that we are all speaking of testing in different ways. My testing is the desire to feel that yank on the leash that he holds. The thought of it slipping out of his grip, either from complacency, from lack of desire to hold it any longer, from neglect... are all scary prospects.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 1/28/2012 6:19:49 AM >

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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to LillyBoPeep)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 7:39:27 AM

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Speaking from my experience only...Yes i've tested OP. That's just being smart and savvy. This "testing" as it's being called was only initially, however after a certain point, if there is still a need to "test" i don't belong there. I am not talking about willful and/or blatant disobedience, that is something totally different.

After a certain point, if I were to feel that he is not paying attention, there aren't enough rules, isn't strict enough, is too strict or whatever the issue, and it cannot be resolved with communication, as should be in any healthy D/s relationship, then I don't belong there. After all, after a certain point if good communication isn't established with said "Domly" one, and the the need to "test," is still present, then there are bigger issues, and I probably shouldn't be there to begin with. I don't necessarily think that he isn't "Domly" just that he isn't the right "Domly" one for me.

Just my opinion, and we all have one. It is what is between two (or however many), no one else can define that, and what is established between them (this should go without saying though, but I said it anyway).

~Edited not in reply to tazzygirl, this was a reply in general. Sorry i hit the wrong thingy..eeek~

< Message edited by slavehearttt -- 1/28/2012 7:42:09 AM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 8:00:57 AM

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Welcome to the forums!

Since there is no true Fast Reply feature, some posters will add "FR" to the beginning of their post to show that it was not directed to anyone in particular. I appreciate when people do this, as the default makes it appear that you are replying to the last poster, which can cause confusion when lots of people are posting.

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 8:07:29 AM

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Great first post. Welcome to the forums!

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to slavehearttt)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 8:08:03 AM

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Joined: 8/8/2010
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quote:

I too think there's a big difference between submissive people who who serve for the sake of service and those who serve for external reward, to be "paid" for their service in some form with secondary things. They're very different creatures.

I was trying to explain my former "service sub" relationship to a mostly vanilla friend (who is not a member so I can quote her) and she said:

quote:

Sounds like a good way to con someone into doing your laundry, lol

I gave her a few links:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service-oriented_%28sexuality%29
http://www.submissiveguide.com/2011/01/some-thoughts-on-domestic-service/

To which she replied:

quote:

Again, sounds like a great way to con someone into doing your chores.

/shrugs/

(in reply to aromanholiday)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 8:13:10 AM

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kalikshama, and tazzygirl

thank you for the info and the welcome *smile* (repeating FR, FR -so i don't get forum "jumped" LOL)

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quote:

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RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/28/2012 11:17:09 AM

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Yes, all the time, I just consider it part of finding out where the line is, 'cause they can't see that the line is still there unless they try to cross it.

(in reply to SomeCdnGuy)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/30/2012 3:26:02 PM

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OP here. Gotta say, I am loving the discussion.

(in reply to xXLithiumXx)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/30/2012 5:43:15 PM

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I tried getting funishments from my first Dom, but he knew I like impact play so my actual punishment wasn't what I wanted. I learned very quickly that it wasn't worth it. I also tend to act out if Im being ignored. Im a work in progress and still growing as a sub. I love the Master I have now and wouldn't misbehave on purpose.

(in reply to littlewonder)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/30/2012 11:20:04 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Yep. In my first D/s relationship, she decided she wanted out. So she challenged me repeatedly, over all kinds of stuff. I'm not sure why she wanted me to end it instead of her, but things fizzled shortly.

Perhaps as she was a submissive she felt it was not her place to end it so she made you end it.

(in reply to DarkSteven)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 1/31/2012 7:51:56 AM

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More likely he didn't inspire her to submit. Just because I'm submissive doesn't mean I'm submissive to everyone. And I don't submit in a vacuum.

If I don't feel dominant energy coming from a guy, I wouldn't do anything he asked.

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(in reply to TheKingofHell)

RE: Being tested as a Dom - 2/2/2012 6:09:06 PM

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I can idenitify with you here. I feel that in the beginning it is normal to test limits to a point. I don't mean to fight everything or be a disrespectful brat. But most subs do test a Dom at the start. How else do you know the limits and if he is serious? This is newer to me. I have had a few short lived relationships. And most have proven not to have what it takes. Maybe for someone else, but not for me. I've talked to someone off and on for several years. And I believe one of the reasons we end up talking again is because he is consistent and does not allow me to top from the bottom. I still have a long way to go. But I have gotten much better at following directions and not pushing as much. It's not always easy for me. Although I crave this more than anything, I am also strong willed and used to doing what I want. And it's especially hard if I feel he is being unfair. And of course at times I do feel that way. So how do you get past that? I'm getting better at it, but still have difficulty with it at times. I am supposed to exercise for 30 minutes everyday before I'm allowed to get online. I can sometimes go days without a problem. But then one day I'm just having a bad day, or I'm tired, etc and I just don't want to exericise that day. I don't "have" to exercise. But I'm not allowed to get online if I don't. On those days I feel he's being unfair and will try to prove my case. He sees it as arguing. I see it as explaining why I need a break. Any suggestions or ideas from either subs or Masters?

(in reply to myotherself)

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