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ORIGINAL: CountrySong

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ORIGINAL: DarkSteven
It is evident that man cannot have created the world, so that something greater than man did it.  The only question is whether that stronger entity is random or is capable of thought.
I choose to believe that it is in fact capable of thought.  Thus I choose to believe in a thinking creature capable of creating the world, and I choose to call it God.

Hum - last I checked, the prevailing theory for the creation of the world was that a series of stars and supernovas created the heavy elements needed to make our world and give us the eliments needed for life like - iron for our blood. Gravity, eventually lead to some of the mass of one of those explosions forming the sun and a disk of dust spinning around the sun. (we see similar things happening in nebulas) Withing that disk of dust, gravity and impacts formed the earth and by luck our planet was protected from a lot of damage by the larger gas giants in the outer solar system. (current estimates based on Kelper data indicate over 2 billion earth like planets in our galaxy alone)

Every time I hear that some god created us then I have to ask these questions:
1) If some supreme being created us then why did that being do such a piss poor job?
Many animals have capabilities well beyond humans in speed, senses, and strength! Humans are smart but we certainly are not that smart. Heck, we are not even the longest lived animal on the planet.
We also have very limited brains which certainly can not handle the vast amount of data currently availible. In fact, that is probably why we need the concept of a god it is simple and easy to understand. Most of us dropped out of school long before we could understand the mathematics needed to acurately describe nature as far as we currently understand it. (Plus, the need for some way of escaping the scariest fear for most humans - death with no afterlife.)
2) Why bother with the rest of the universe if we are so f***ing important? Heck, you don't really even need a galaxy to have humans. As small globular cluster would work fine!
3) Why wait billions of years to make humans?

God is a myth that we made up to comfort ourselves and explain things that we were and are too dumb/eneducated to understand, don't want to understand, and don't really need to understand for our species to procreate. Eventually, we will be replaced either by mechanical lifeforms (ala AI the movie), animals that humans altered (ala Planet Of The Apes), a genetically altered line of homosapien, or some nasty entity from outerspace (pick your movie or book)!

We were created by our sun, our planet, and millions of years of evolution.

If the sun and the earth are intelegent then I would love to speak to them and have a meaningful conversation that the rest of humanity could understand, listen to, and share in. If a god exists then let god appear so that humanity can chat and everyone could get on the same religious page.

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ORIGINAL: hussainishahid

It's comforting to think that there's something after this life.

Also, actively attending religious services introduces you to lots of generally nice, decent, forward-thinking people, and gives you an easier opportunity to donate money or time.  They can also provide you with valuable contacts for finding work.

And on a personal note, I myself do best when given clear, strict, guidelines on how to live, work, and behave.  Probably how I ended up here in the first place...

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ORIGINAL: LaTigresse
You've obviously attended different churches than I have. Everyone I've been to, the thinking has been alllllllllllllllllllllllllll backwards.

And they are only nice and decent when you conform to their rules.

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ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

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ORIGINAL: hussainishahid

It's comforting to think that there's something after this life.

Also, actively attending religious services introduces you to lots of generally nice, decent, forward-thinking people, and gives you an easier opportunity to donate money or time.  They can also provide you with valuable contacts for finding work.

And on a personal note, I myself do best when given clear, strict, guidelines on how to live, work, and behave.  Probably how I ended up here in the first place...

You've obviously attended different churches than I have. Everyone I've been to, the thinking has been alllllllllllllllllllllllllll backwards.

And they are only nice and decent when you conform to their rules.

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ORIGINAL: coyotesub315

I have a problem with the question posed by the OP.  It asks for proof for something that is a matter of faith.

The existence of God ( under any name you choose) is something that can not be proven, it is a matter of faith. Faith is for those things we choose to believe, or not believe, that there is no evidence for. Statements of other faithful do count as evidence. You can not prove an article of faith using the scientific method, when you ask if God exists you are asking someone's opinion of something that they will never be able to back up with facts.

That being said, yes, I believe in God. But I can not prove his or her existence  to you.

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
Moreover, if that is the case and 'god' exists what great power created 'god' It is turtles all the way down.

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ORIGINAL: hussainishahid

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
Moreover, if that is the case and 'god' exists what great power created 'god' It is turtles all the way down.

I think the general belief is, god came first, no one created god. 

It's my belief that god is beyond all understanding, so I really don't ask these questions :) By that same token, I also believe that no mortal person can understand the specific criteria that god uses to judge between good and bad.  We can make inferences based on revealed texts, and act accordingly, but we can't go passing judgement and playing god.

That said, coyote had it right, religion is about faith, and that's something people seem to either have or not have.  I don't think either way of life is good or evil, and I think that god judges based on actions more than simple thoughts.  If a person chooses to enjoin what is good and forbid what is evil, they are probably on the correct path.

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
The general belief still begs the question dramatically. If God does not need a first cause (creator), why does emergy/matter need one?

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ORIGINAL: hussainishahid

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
The general belief still begs the question dramatically. If God does not need a first cause (creator), why does emergy/matter need one?

Energy and matter aren't god.  God's special, really special.  There's never been anything else like god, and there never will be anything like god.  It's convenient to use he/she to personify god into something more understandable, but the reality (yes this is based off faith) is much different. 

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
You really do not see how you keep begging the question? If I named matter/energy 'really special' would that satifsy you. Of course, not. So saying God is 'really special' is a way of avoiding the question entirely. If god exists, and that exists requires a 'res' to create it, god equally so requires.

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38

Why do people assume that nonexistance is the normative state and that existance requires some typ of agency. Moreover, if that is the case and 'god' exists what great power created 'god' It is turtles all the way down.

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ORIGINAL: Yachtie

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38

Why do people assume that nonexistance is the normative state and that existance requires some typ of agency. Moreover, if that is the case and 'god' exists what great power created 'god' It is turtles all the way down.

Why turtles all the way down? The physical universe can be summed up via math, chemistry, physics, biology, etc. Most people understand God within the realm of Spirit. Spirit, by any understanding, is more akin to ~love than math, physics, chemistry, etc. I'll bet no one here would state categorically that love does not exist, yet one cannot quantify it via math, chemistry, physics, etc.

You ask this question -

The general belief still begs the question dramatically. If God does not need a first cause (creator), why does emergy/matter need one?

Ok, let's say energy/matter need no first cause. Does that answer the question of whether it was created? No. Now you could leap to Occam's Razor, but that is purely argumentative and of no real value as to what is or is not. Just because X is not required does not negate the existence of X. Now, which way is science pointing? Created, i.e big bang, or no beginning at all?

One point here, within context. Can science currently state without reservation that Y is, given the amount of (self?) correction it goes through on a daily basis?

edit: To really get into God's existence, is it of necessity to go to other evidence than that which science can provide?

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ORIGINAL: MSubEdinburgh29

No-one can prove there is a God, and no-one can prove there isn't a God.

The world and how it came to be - there is no logical theory that can explain it. It is beyond our comprehension, yet we have an unending desire to find answers for it all.

The only logical solution is to stop wasting any more time thinking about it.

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ORIGINAL: hussainishahid

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
You really do not see how you keep begging the question? If I named matter/energy 'really special' would that satifsy you. Of course, not. So saying God is 'really special' is a way of avoiding the question entirely. If god exists, and that exists requires a 'res' to create it, god equally so requires.

This is pretty much the part where faith comes in.  I accept that god is "really special" and "beyond understanding" because I prefer to.  It's a part of my faith, a very large part of my faith. 

I like my religion, and I like being religious. I grew up with it, and it's a part of me. 

People might think it's childish to believe in a "magic fairy in the sky", but I don't care.  I'll be childish.  In the end, all I'm missing out on is getting fucked up on weekends and screwing before I'm married.  And pork, but pork is actually quite unhealthy.