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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:34:15 AM

marieToo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty

quote:

ORIGINAL: Calandra

You may be correct, however our civil liberties are there to assure that we get to make those choices for ourselves, not have someone arbitrarily out us...

Our civil liberties are to protect us from an overreaching government, not the acts of individuals.

Taggard:

While you are correct on a technecality (the definition of civil liberties). I think the point is that something like this could be pursued in a 'civil' action. ie....Slander/Libel....Both are valid reasons to sue a person in a civil case. Although there are certain criteria that do or do not make it a viable cause of action, it is still a danger that the one posting opens themselves up to.

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:34:52 AM

ExistentialSteel

Posts: 676
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Calandra

ES, there's pics of me all over the internet... I had someone a while back try to get me flustered by "impersonating me". It was really weird to see that most of my friends knew almost immediately that it wasn't me... but a lot of people who only knew me in passing really believed it was me...

you know, if you hear something second hand it's gotta be fact.... ~grinz~

I've heard women on here say more than once that someone was using their pics as you say happened to you. I mean this is such a real possibility that it makes the whole thing so dangerous. Don't you guys realize how many imposters are out there?

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:37:50 AM

TNstepsout

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Nope, it's not ethical. The issue of personal responsibility is an entirely different matter. Yes, people should be careful and not put personal information on the web, and if it gets leaked, and they get outed over it, they have to take responsibility for what happened. BUT it doesn't mean it wasn't wrong to take the information and OUT someone. It's not illegal, but it's still wrong. It's ethically and morally wrong to out someone without their permission. In fact, it's unethical to repost any personal information or personal correspondence with anyone on any other website without permission.

It's not really that complicated.

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Post #: 43

RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:38:41 AM

Calandra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ExistentialSteel
Don't you guys realize how many imposters are out there?

Yeah, but the minute you ask someone to use a microphone, or webcam or telephone, your a shallow asshole who only thinks of sex... you perve!!!!!

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:40:14 AM

NINASHARP

Posts: 295
Joined: 4/23/2006
From: NJ/NYC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Calandra

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelface183
ooooh I think I know whom you are referring to and I do not like what she has done either....those men may have been "rude" to her (completely subjective) but that does not give her the right to post the emails that they sent her nor their email/im address and photos! In my opinion, she is by far ruder than any of the men who "disparraged" her.

Yanno what I noticed? some of the emails this person took offense to were very very polite, they just didn't match what she was looking for, so "deserved" to be treated badly... I think if I'd seen the posts here I'd have been offended and spoken my mind, but the fact that it was conducted off-site makes it worse...

sheesh, my 10 yr old niece visits that site... if I piss this chick off and my pic gets posted, no big deal because I'm already totally out... but the potential for those who aren't out could be devastating.

I think if I came across someone exposing others from here or anywhere, I'd let those being exposed, know what was happening if I could. They could report the person doing this to the mods of the boards. JMO.

Nina

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:43:42 AM

TallDarkAndWitty

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quote:

ORIGINAL: becca333
Why is it terrible if a government commits a particular act, but fine if the same thing is done by an individual? I object to anyone, government OR individual, abusing my rights.

It has to do with the concept of The Social Contract as invisioned by John Locke (amongst others) during The Enlightenment (a period of time in which some aastinishing advancements were made in the areas of polotics, economics, math, philosophy and other arts and sciences...it occurred roughly around the time of the American Revolution). Rights, you see, are not given to us by any person or government. Rather, we have them simply though our own humanity (or some think they are given to us by God). The Social Contract is formed so that men can apply the power of the group toward the protection of those rights (through laws and civil procedures).

However, The Enlightenment thinkers also saw the problem with giving power to a group of people. Mobs tend to be unruly, and even the best laid plans can go wrong when the power of the mob takes over. Our civil liberties are an enumeration of rights that even the mob (or government) can not step on (without due process).

People during The Enligentenment were much more concerned with the power of the mob than they were of the power of any individual, so the protections they built into their systems of governance had to do with protection of people from the government themselves, and not from other people. They figured that the states and localities would figure all the people vs. people stuff out.

Unfortunately, most people have no idea that any of this happened or why our government is stuctured the way it is, so they think that the First Ammendment protects you from being kicked out of a resturant for wearing a t-shirt with a profanity on it, or that it protects the Dixie Chicks from being booed and boycotted for saying something offensive to a certain group of people.

Taggard

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Post #: 46

RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:43:51 AM

Calandra

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I already made a list, contacted everyone with the website info last night so people can be informed about their personal information...

I even contacted the ones who weren't "outed" by picture or email, simply so they would know what they were being accused of.

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:44:23 AM

marieToo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

Now, imagine me butchering domesticated pets as a religious sarcrifice, and researching my interest in sacrifices to ward off evil spirits.

Same thing as you did, except I deleted excerpts. You sick, sick, person. I like it!

Yours,

benji

copy cat!

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Post #: 48

RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:46:07 AM

spankmepink11

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I believe outing anyone, in the form of sending out their information...pictures...membership on alternative sites...etc...is highly unethical. A female acquaintance of mine, with whom i shared some very private opinions with...and a few photos, (bondage type...no nudity), shared those opinions...AND photos with some guy who had done a yahoo search for local people with particular interests. I'm not sure if she was using me to gain credability or what, but after she shared what she and a "girlfriend" (me apparently) discussed over dinner....and the pictures....the man told her he knew me. Next thing i knew...i got an email from him out of the blue saying..."Did you REALLY do (blank....)? I was very angry ...and responded accordingly.
The question is...if i "out" her as being....unsafe...and unable to maintain discretion or confidences,(which i told her is exactly what i would do) am i being unethical? Hmmm

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:46:46 AM

gooddogbenji

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Joined: 11/15/2005
From: Toronto
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quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

Now, imagine me butchering domesticated pets as a religious sarcrifice, and researching my interest in sacrifices to ward off evil spirits.

Same thing as you did, except I deleted excerpts. You sick, sick, person. I like it!

Yours,

benji

copy cat!

Leave the cats out of this. They did nothing to you, and they don't ward off any spirits anyway.

Yours,

benji

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:47:03 AM

zumala

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Joined: 6/16/2005
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First post made strictly from the OP...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Calandra

I wanted to ask for everyone's opinion... Do you think it is ethical to post email addresses, pictures, instant messenger ID's, and/or private correspondence to a popular vanilla website where "anyone" could run across it?

I realize that even here "anyone" could run across it, but they'd have to have a reason for coming here first (curiosity, kinky needs of their own, checking up on a spouse if there's already suspicion)... On a vanilla website a person could easily find these posts, maybe recognize a picture, and then boom, that person is outed.

Please explain why you answer the way that you do...

Of course it's not ethical. It's not ethical to post anyone's information (but your own) ANYWHERE. If it's personal information and it's not your own, you had better NOT post it anywhere at all. Simple as that. It's a privacy issue.

zuma

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:50:51 AM

marieToo

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Just on a side note to all of those who feel ok with it because they are already outted....

Outted already or not, would you want your personal email correspondence to be broadcast over the internet?

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Post #: 52

RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:51:11 AM

Calandra

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I believe that someone who cannot be trusted to keep confidences, and who is guilty of outing people herself SHOULD be reported to local lifestyle leaders. Imagine this girl going into a dungeon local to her and then outing people because she didn't like a scene they were doing????

I've already made the community where she lives aware of her activities. If she truly is the person in the picture on her profile, she may discover that she isn't welcome at some of her local events anymore... the needs of the many, do sometimes outweigh the needs of the few...

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:53:19 AM

TallDarkAndWitty

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From: Rochester, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bignipples2share
Just why would the gay community be angry about those who choose not to be out of the closet, is it for their own personal gain?

Of course it is for their own personal gain. No one does anything that is not for their own personal gain.

However, in this particular case, the idea is that as more and more people are identified as homosexual, the more people will have to accept homosexuality. When Rosie O'Donnel or Ellen Degeneres came out, it was seen as huge moments for the lesbian community, as these were household names with huge followings. There were many in the gay and lesbian community that were angry it took so long for both of those women to come out, as it was obvious to anyone with half a brain that they were both queer. Much of the same thing is said of Tom Cruise and Richard Gere...though you never really know until they actually do come out.

Again, I would never out anyone, but subcultures do benefit from people being open about their lifestyle, and they benefit greatly with the outing of partcularly public people.

Taggard

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:54:26 AM

LaTigresse

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using the fast reply feature here....

Obviously we are all in agreement that to post someones private information, photo's, words, etc is unethical and morally wrong. However, I have learned the hard way that it is not illegal. At least not in the sense we are discussing. I have a profile on another site, it has existed for quite a number of years and had several photos, none of which were in the least distasteful or even gave away my identity as I was unsure wether I wanted the world to know about my sexual tendencies and I did have children living at home when it was created.
Several months ago a friend of mine emailed me in a teasing fashion asking when I got ten years younger. After a couple more emails back and forth I found out that someone had copied my profile, word for word, photo's AND even used the same profile name with one character difference on another site. Suffice to say I was livid. I instantly contacted the webmaster of the site with a long detailed letter, referencing my profile I had actually created on the first site etc. I was totally ignored. Finally I contacted again threatening legal action. WELL, I found out that unless I copywrited it and plastered a bunch of legal disclaimers on it, of course I didn't, anything of that nature that I put on this beloved internet is considered public domain. Soooo, legally I had no case whatsoever. While someone else "outing you", using your personal information for their own gain, or any other number of unethical tricks may be just, wrong, it is not illegal unless you have taken steps to legally "own" that information.

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:54:46 AM

angelface183

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quote:

I believe that someone who cannot be trusted to keep confidences, and who is guilty of outing people herself SHOULD be reported to local lifestyle leaders.

I aggree with you.

(I emailed you on the other side...)

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:56:01 AM

Calandra

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I'm out... I was in for eight years, and my brother of all people outed me in a fit of anger... I lost all my family for over a year... lost many so called friends that I've never gotten back... Thank goddess that I did have lifestyle friends to throw their arms around me and cry with me...

I'd NEVER EVER EVER out someone and put them through that... I do encourage those who seem to need this lifestyle on a larger scale to slowly out themselves... you know, let people kinda realize it over time from clues that were right in front of them? Tears come to my eyes even now when I think of the pain my outing caused not only me, but those I love...

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:56:22 AM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

Now, imagine me butchering domesticated pets as a religious sarcrifice, and researching my interest in sacrifices to ward off evil spirits.

Same thing as you did, except I deleted excerpts. You sick, sick, person. I like it!

Yours,

benji

copy cat!

Leave the cats out of this. They did nothing to you, and they don't ward off any spirits anyway.

Yours,

benji

ack!! I shoulda known you'd do this!

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Post #: 58

RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:57:00 AM

NINASHARP

Posts: 295
Joined: 4/23/2006
From: NJ/NYC
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExistentialSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Calandra

ES, there's pics of me all over the internet... I had someone a while back try to get me flustered by "impersonating me". It was really weird to see that most of my friends knew almost immediately that it wasn't me... but a lot of people who only knew me in passing really believed it was me...

you know, if you hear something second hand it's gotta be fact.... ~grinz~

I've heard women on here say more than once that someone was using their pics as you say happened to you. I mean this is such a real possibility that it makes the whole thing so dangerous. Don't you guys realize how many imposters are out there?

I had someone do this as well. They used my screen name and kept my picture as an entrance to their website. It really got under my skin, especially since I had taken a hiatis for a few years and my reputation of those who once served me, might have been on the line, depending on how this poser was handling her/himself. Actually that is what led me to CM, a Pro was using a similiar name and when a sub I knew, contacted her, she pretended to be me and acted as if she knew him in real. He then contacted me through another IM service that I rarely use, and said he enjoyed taling to me the other day, and I said "What?" I hadn't heard from him in a year! So he explained what had happened. I never could understand why people have to pretend to be someone else on the internet...Maybe just attention whores.

Nina

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RE: Outing Collarme members on vanilla websites...? - 6/3/2006 5:57:40 AM

angelface183

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Joined: 4/12/2006
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quote:

it is not illegal unless you have taken steps to legally "own" that information.

How does one go about "owning" their information?

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