RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack....

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 1:30:43 PM

BamaD

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Yes but I was talking about someone who claimed that while accusations didn't make Martin a criminal they did make Zimmerman one. Remember also that the state has to prove it wasn't self defence not the other way around.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 5:55:49 PM

Nosathro

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From: Orange County, California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

Zimmerman never having been convicted of a crime is also not a criminal.

Neither is Martin, but alot of people think he is a criminal because of his school record. As to Zimmerman I keep wondering how much money is in the donations account.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 6:05:02 PM

Baroana

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Since Z was chasing M, I would think that even if M was in some way being aggressive, it was arguably in self defense against Z. So there.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 6:06:11 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

Zimmerman never having been convicted of a crime is also not a criminal.

Neither is Martin, but alot of people think he is a criminal because of his school record. As to Zimmerman I keep wondering how much money is in the donations account.

Note I said also who else do think I was talking about?????
Those you accuse of claiming Martin is guilty off something are mostly pointing out that this isn"t as cut and dried as you may wish to believe.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 7:37:33 PM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

Yes but I was talking about someone who claimed that while accusations didn't make Martin a criminal they did make Zimmerman one. Remember also that the state has to prove it wasn't self defence not the other way around.

Well we see what happens in court. However, I read more about Martin the punk and thug the Zimmerman, and the only complaint I hear about Zimmerman was the press referring him to be a White Hispanic. I learned something funny this weekend, a friend of mine who is involved in hiring of his company did tell me that on the race hiring stastics there is a Hispanic - White and Hispanic Non White. I asked about what that all means but even he didn't know, it was required by the Department of Labor.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 7:42:13 PM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
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From: Orange County, California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

If you have a valid reason, then it isn't paranoia.

Actually paranoia does not impaire intelligence, remember the movie "It's a Beautiful Mind" The man a paranoiad schoizd...yet he won a Nobel Peace Prize in Econimoics. Many person with a mental disorder function very will, that includes job, school, family, etc. The big question is what is the paranoia, and if the person will act on the deliusion, many learn to control it.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 7:42:31 PM

BamaD

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Again I will point out that this may well be a tragic convergence of two people each of whom thought he was defending himself.

< Message edited by BamaD -- 5/13/2012 7:45:33 PM >

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 7:54:06 PM

Baroana

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Zimmerman, armed with a gun, chased Martin while on the phone with the police. I think he's toast on the Self-D issue.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/13/2012 9:12:55 PM

DarqueMirror

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Baroana

Zimmerman, armed with a gun, chased Martin while on the phone with the police. I think he's toast on the Self-D issue.

You'd be both wrong and grossly misinformed. It happens when you pay attention to...one percent of the story and not the rest. When you catch up with the rest of us, you'll see he didn't chase Martin, but followed briefly, heading back this vehicle when directed. You'll also see that Martin attacked Zimmerman, not the other way around.

Let us know when you catch up.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 1:02:21 AM

Nosathro

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From: Orange County, California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror

quote:

ORIGINAL: Baroana

Zimmerman, armed with a gun, chased Martin while on the phone with the police. I think he's toast on the Self-D issue.

You'd be both wrong and grossly misinformed. It happens when you pay attention to...one percent of the story and not the rest. When you catch up with the rest of us, you'll see he didn't chase Martin, but followed briefly, heading back this vehicle when directed. You'll also see that Martin attacked Zimmerman, not the other way around.

Let us know when you catch up.

That maybe true, Martin used his fist Zimmerman used his gun. I read many years ago a Northeastern study 1995 on the subject of those defending themselves with a firearm, in some 48% of the cases, the so called attacker was unarmed. I am not aware any recent study but it would be interesting. It is my understanding Zimmerman wanted to become a police officer, if he ever does, he better get use to being punched, and the rules on the use of deadly force, i.e. shooting an armed anybody are alot more strictive.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 3:34:44 AM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror

quote:

ORIGINAL: Baroana

Zimmerman, armed with a gun, chased Martin while on the phone with the police. I think he's toast on the Self-D issue.

You'd be both wrong and grossly misinformed. It happens when you pay attention to...one percent of the story and not the rest. When you catch up with the rest of us, you'll see he didn't chase Martin, but followed briefly, heading back this vehicle when directed. You'll also see that Martin attacked Zimmerman, not the other way around.

Let us know when you catch up.

More bullshit, its clear in the transcript with the dispatcher that he left his van to follow the kid. How you come to the conclusion that thats heading "back" to the van beggars belief.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 8:41:48 AM

Raiikun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

More bullshit, its clear in the transcript with the dispatcher that he left his van to follow the kid.

He left the van *before* the dispatcher gave the suggestion that he didn't have to follow, and Zimmerman replied in the affirmative.

Then the investigator said in court that he knew of no evidence contradicting that Zimmerman was on his way back to it.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 8:57:57 AM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

More bullshit, its clear in the transcript with the dispatcher that he left his van to follow the kid.

He left the van *before* the dispatcher gave the suggestion that he didn't have to follow, and Zimmerman replied in the affirmative.

Then the investigator said in court that he knew of no evidence contradicting that Zimmerman was on his way back to it.

Just an aside....I thought you blocked me, or was that another lie.

He still left the van to follow the kid.....Any suggestion that wasnt the way it happened was nonsense.

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 9:09:20 AM

thompsonx

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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

I am sorry you did not understand my question.
Yes indeed go on.
So far from the list you posted you have only listed two things.
One of which you are wrong about.
The thing you are calling a sub-machine gun w/silencer does not exist. The sgw carr ar is an ar 15 look alike and according to the factory are not full auto. It fires a projectal that exceeds 1500 fps(the speed of sound at sea level).Only those projectals that travel slower than the speed of sound can be silenced...yes you can muffle the muzzel blast but you cannot muffle the shockwave of the supersonic projectal.

quote:

You are joking right?

Nope
Then you must have attended special school, or you been out in the sun too long. I miss that K submachine gun with the silencer....

quote:

By the way yes there are such things as sub-machine guns with silencers...I remember having one, a Swedish K submachine gun 9mm with silencer very effective..but I had to give it back to the Army.

Please go back and read what I said. I said the carr ar 15 was not a submachine gun.
A 9 mm has a muzzle velocity significantly below 1500fps so it may be easily silenced

quote:

then there is a sawed off shotgun, illegal I should know I arrested a guy with one, the charge stuck.

If they had a permit (as another poster has mentioned)it would not be illegal....I am going with no permit so now we have two from the list which were actually illegal.
Nope federal law, no permit ...the guy I busted got 5 years....appeal denied...Oh he told the judge the same thing you are trying to tell me.

quote:

Yes there are conversion kits that can be purchased to make a semi auto to a full auto, very illegal.

Those were not on the list.

The were conversitons

quote:

You know...I hate to say it but I am thinking of buying some firearms, my permit and CCW are still valid. Some of you are making me scared, I think that all I need to justify myself under this "Stand You Ground Law"

I see nothing adverse to anyone entitled to own a firearm from possessing as many as they choose. Would you hazard a guess as to the value of a ruger blackhawk 44. mag with a 6 digit serial number?
Or:
Perhaps an automag with all three barrels?
Or:
Perhaps a matched pair of mod 57 s&w with consecutive serial numbers.

I do believe that the roi on such an investment would pay better than any investment I have heard of.

Go sit in the shade

I do not mind a bit of snark if it is attached to some sort of rebuttle of something I have posted. You are normally rational and this is somewhat of a departure for you.
Would you like to try to respond to my questions or are we through here?

(in reply to Nosathro)

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RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 9:09:57 AM

Raiikun

Posts: 2650
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Funny thing happens with the Ignore function when you're not logged into the site...noone gets blocked. :p

And since there's not even been a first lie yet, any "another" lie is your imagination.

quote:

He still left the van to follow the kid.....Any suggestion that wasnt the way it happened was nonsense.

The fact that the person you responded to said he was on the way back to his vehicle kinda proves he wasn't suggesting he never left.

Kinda impossible to walk back to a vehicle that you never left, yes?

#logicFTW

(in reply to Politesub53)

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Post #: 475

RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 9:17:51 AM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

I am sorry you did not understand my question.
Yes indeed go on.
So far from the list you posted you have only listed two things.
One of which you are wrong about.
The thing you are calling a sub-machine gun w/silencer does not exist. The sgw carr ar is an ar 15 look alike and according to the factory are not full auto. It fires a projectal that exceeds 1500 fps(the speed of sound at sea level).Only those projectals that travel slower than the speed of sound can be silenced...yes you can muffle the muzzel blast but you cannot muffle the shockwave of the supersonic projectal.

quote:

You are joking right?

Nope
Then you must have attended special school, or you been out in the sun too long. I miss that K submachine gun with the silencer....

quote:

By the way yes there are such things as sub-machine guns with silencers...I remember having one, a Swedish K submachine gun 9mm with silencer very effective..but I had to give it back to the Army.

Please go back and read what I said. I said the carr ar 15 was not a submachine gun.
A 9 mm has a muzzle velocity significantly below 1500fps so it may be easily silenced

quote:

then there is a sawed off shotgun, illegal I should know I arrested a guy with one, the charge stuck.

If they had a permit (as another poster has mentioned)it would not be illegal....I am going with no permit so now we have two from the list which were actually illegal.
Nope federal law, no permit ...the guy I busted got 5 years....appeal denied...Oh he told the judge the same thing you are trying to tell me.

quote:

Yes there are conversion kits that can be purchased to make a semi auto to a full auto, very illegal.

Those were not on the list.

The were conversitons

quote:

You know...I hate to say it but I am thinking of buying some firearms, my permit and CCW are still valid. Some of you are making me scared, I think that all I need to justify myself under this "Stand You Ground Law"

I see nothing adverse to anyone entitled to own a firearm from possessing as many as they choose. Would you hazard a guess as to the value of a ruger blackhawk 44. mag with a 6 digit serial number?
Or:
Perhaps an automag with all three barrels?
Or:
Perhaps a matched pair of mod 57 s&w with consecutive serial numbers.

I do believe that the roi on such an investment would pay better than any investment I have heard of.

Go sit in the shade

I do not mind a bit of snark if it is attached to some sort of rebuttle of something I have posted. You are normally rational and this is somewhat of a departure for you.
Would you like to try to respond to my questions or are we through here?

Did I hear something....must be the Marines having artillery partice again

(in reply to thompsonx)

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Post #: 476

RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 9:26:32 AM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

I do not mind a bit of snark if it is attached to some sort of rebuttle of something I have posted. You are normally rational and this is somewhat of a departure for you.
Would you like to try to respond to my questions or are we through here?

Did I hear something....must be the Marines having artillery partice again

So you agree that on your list there are only two illegal items and that we have nothing further to discuss.
Thank you for your input.

(in reply to Nosathro)

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Post #: 477

RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 10:02:44 AM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

I do not mind a bit of snark if it is attached to some sort of rebuttle of something I have posted. You are normally rational and this is somewhat of a departure for you.
Would you like to try to respond to my questions or are we through here?

Did I hear something....must be the Marines having artillery partice again

So you agree that on your list there are only two illegal items and that we have nothing further to discuss.
Thank you for your input.

Never agreed to anything.....

(in reply to thompsonx)

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Post #: 478

RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 10:34:28 AM

Politesub53

Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Funny thing happens with the Ignore function when you're not logged into the site...noone gets blocked. :p

And since there's not even been a first lie yet, any "another" lie is your imagination.

quote:

He still left the van to follow the kid.....Any suggestion that wasnt the way it happened was nonsense.

The fact that the person you responded to said he was on the way back to his vehicle kinda proves he wasn't suggesting he never left.

Kinda impossible to walk back to a vehicle that you never left, yes?

#logicFTW

Bullshit about the ignore function. You may have read my post while you werent logged in, but you had to log in and unblock me to quote me.

Logic isnt your strong suit either. It has been proved Zimmerman left his van, it hasnt been proved he was heading back to it when attacked.

Can someone please repost this for me incase I am blocked again...

(in reply to Raiikun)

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Post #: 479

RE: "Stand Your Ground" law under attack.... - 5/14/2012 10:48:38 AM

Raiikun

Posts: 2650
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

You may have read my post while you werent logged in, but you had to log in and unblock me to quote me.

Which is exactly what I did.

quote:

Logic isnt your strong suit either. It has been proved Zimmerman left his van, it hasnt been proved he was heading back to it when attacked.

Personal attack aside, I didn't say it was proven. Zimmerman says he was, and there's no evidence to prove him wrong, and the 911 call makes it seem possible that he was, so until there's reason to believe otherwise, I think the possibility is strong that he was headed back.

I was just disputing your assertion that him "leaving the van" makes the conclusion that he was "headed back" something that "beggars belief."

(in reply to Politesub53)

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