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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:22:20 PM

vincentML

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quote:

It`ll take some time and a trial before it`s official.....

The Supremes have already turned away the ACLU suit on the issue. Google ACLU NSA

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:26:01 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

giving aid and comfort

Honest question: What aid and comfort do you see him giving and to whom?

quote:

plus violating his security oath.

I'm sure that's criminal, but I'm less certain that it rises to treason.

Considering that the NSA program was designed to seek out any foreign operators who might be planning an attack on Americans at home and considering that for the most part these operators have been in recent history associated with the Islamist Fundamentalist groups it seems pretty clear who is receiving aid and comfort from the disclosure of the program.

Violation of the security oath unlikely rises to treason.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:26:29 PM

Yachtie

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FR

Majority Views NSA Phone Tracking as Acceptable Anti-terror Tactic

A majority of Americans – 56% – say the National Security Agency’s (NSA) program tracking the telephone records of millions of Americans is an acceptable way for the government to investigate terrorism, though a substantial minority – 41% – say it is unacceptable. And while the public is more evenly divided over the government’s monitoring of email and other online activities to prevent possible terrorism, these views are largely unchanged since 2002, shortly after the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

How far America has fallen.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:28:35 PM

tazzygirl

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How far? Since 2002?

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:28:57 PM

kdsub

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I get that he did not reveal this information to purposely aid the enemy...however Vince is right when he says he knew he could be prosecuted for committing a traitorous act and thus fled, of all places, to China...and is now in hiding again seeking asylum in Iceland, by some reports.

I believe he is a naive troubled man who is looking for notoriety. He has poor judgment, most likely why he is not working for the CIA anymore, and is just screaming...look at me. But of course just my opinion.

What can't be denied is he betrayed his country and perhaps put our love ones at risk. Our government is hindered in its response because explanations WOULD aid the enemy. The details of the operation may be forced into the public ending its usefulness and perhaps one of the only ways we have to fight terrorism within our borders. All because this little man wants attention.

Whistle blowing is important and needs to be protected...as long as there is something to blow the whistle about...and so far at least there was no reason.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 6/10/2013 4:31:14 PM >

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:29:47 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

How far? Since 2002?

Not even a stumble since 2002

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:30:35 PM

tazzygirl

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Thats sorta what I got from his link too.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:31:40 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I get that he did not reveal this information to purposely aid the enemy...however Vince is right when he says he knew he could be prosecuted for committing a traitorous act and thus fled, of all places, to China...and is now in hiding again seeking asylum in Iceland, by some reports.

I believe he is a naive troubled man who is looking for notoriety. He has poor judgment, most likely why he is not working for the CIA anymore, and is just screaming...look at me. But of course just my opinion.

What can't be denied is he betrayed his country and perhaps put our love ones at risk. Our government is hindered in its response because explanations WOULD aid the enemy. The details of the operation may be forced into the public ending its usefulness and perhaps one of the only ways we have to fight terrorism within our borders. All because this little man wants attention.

Butch

Well said, Butch. Glad to see you are back from the hospital

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:32:14 PM

tazzygirl

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quote:

What can't be denied is he betrayed his country and perhaps put our love ones at risk

Wait... again... how did he betray his country? This system was already known about.

What betrayal?

What information did he give except that the system exists and how it gathers information? Did he give actual information? Did he do it to help another country?

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:33:11 PM

Yachtie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I get that he did not reveal this information to purposely aid the enemy...however Vince is right when he says he knew he could be prosecuted for committing a traitorous act and thus fled, of all places, to China...and is now in hiding again seeking asylum in Iceland, by some reports.

Unsubstantiated, but I would not put it past government -

A US editor has alleged he overheard security officials saying that the NSA leaker and the Guardian columnist who broke his story should be “disappeared.” Leaker Edward Snowden said that American spies often prefer silencing targets over due process

I'd say he left for fear of the government, and not the prosecutorial kind.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:35:13 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

What can't be denied is he betrayed his country and perhaps put our love ones at risk

Wait... again... how did he betray his country? This system was already known about.

What betrayal?

What information did he give except that the system exists and how it gathers information? Did he give actual information? Did he do it to help another country?

Then the reverse question begs to be answered. Why is the nutter such a hero to the personal liberty crowd?

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:36:50 PM

kdsub

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quote:

except that the system exists and how it gathers information?

What else need be given?

Butch

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:37:13 PM

Yachtie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Then the reverse question begs to be answered. Why is the nutter such a hero to the personal liberty crowd?

One must understand liberty to comprehend that. Your question proves you are not one.

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“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:41:51 PM

Owner59

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

It`ll take some time and a trial before it`s official.....

The Supremes have already turned away the ACLU suit on the issue. Google ACLU NSA

Believe me...this guy is going to jail....

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:42:06 PM

tazzygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

What can't be denied is he betrayed his country and perhaps put our love ones at risk

Wait... again... how did he betray his country? This system was already known about.

What betrayal?

What information did he give except that the system exists and how it gathers information? Did he give actual information? Did he do it to help another country?

Then the reverse question begs to be answered. Why is the nutter such a hero to the personal liberty crowd?

No clue. I dont think he is a hero or a traitor.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:45:14 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

It`ll take some time and a trial before it`s official.....

The Supremes have already turned away the ACLU suit on the issue. Google ACLU NSA

Believe me...this guy is going to jail....

Oh sorry. I misread your comment. I thought you were referring to the legitimacy of the NSA phone program. I agree this guy will be in jail unless someone has already hidden him well.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:49:53 PM

Owner59

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If this interview is any indication of who this guy really is.....he`s cooked.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/11/edward-snowden-what-we-know-nsa

Just as a staring point, folks with clearance that high don`t get a free pass to leak intel (to our enemies).....Ya just don`t.......Unless it`s Soylent Green is people, or something that outrageous, you go to jail.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:51:55 PM

kdsub

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quote:

unless someone has already hidden him well.

Maybe it is his new friends and protectors the Chinese Unit 61398 along with The Ministry of State Security...we know all the freedom they guarantee to the people of China...because we know he could not get a fair trial in our police state.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 6/10/2013 4:53:17 PM >

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I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Post #: 78

RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 4:52:00 PM

tazzygirl

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Im not saying he wont go to jail. I just dont see him being charged as a traitor. Again, what intel did he leak? Wasnt this program already known about?

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: NSA leaker comes forward - 6/10/2013 5:11:36 PM

JeffBC

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie
Majority Views NSA Phone Tracking as Acceptable Anti-terror Tactic

A majority of Americans – 56% – say the National Security Agency’s (NSA) program tracking the telephone records of millions of Americans is an acceptable way for the government to investigate terrorism, though a substantial minority – 41% – say it is unacceptable. And while the public is more evenly divided over the government’s monitoring of email and other online activities to prevent possible terrorism, these views are largely unchanged since 2002, shortly after the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

How far America has fallen.

I disagree. That question, as it stands, is misleading. And that is exactly why it was even asked that way. How do you think it'd look if we asked the real question? Honestly, had someone asked me this question and I didn't know what else I know I'd be much more on the fence about it. But when you add in not just email but EVERYTHING that goes online and is not encrypted along with geotracking your location and taping your phone calls things begin to look a bit different.

I don't think Americans have fallen so much as they are being duped. IF you were to ask them whether it's OK for the government to know every single thing there is to know about every single American in near-real time (and perhaps helped by explaining the ramifications of that) they would see it differently. That's what I try to do.

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