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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 2:48:08 PM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
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There you go misinterpreting the law again.

George admitted to a homicide, not a murder. Wee bit of a legal difference.

(in reply to mnottertail)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 2:51:24 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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No, not misinterpreting the law. I am stating fact. You are misinterpreting the law in that she held out. You are all over the place, are we going with evidence or law or rhetoric. Keep it on the same plane, because you are talking way under my intellect here.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/25/2013 2:53:09 PM >


_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Raiikun)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 2:58:46 PM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
No, it is not a fact that George admitted to murder. There are more elements to murder than simply killing someone. That is a fact.

George never admitted that the killing evinced ill will, hatred, or spite, therefore by law, George did not admit to murder.

For that matter, it is a fact that George did not stalk Trayvon, per Florida law. Stalking in Florida requires multiple instances, for example...one instance of trying to help police locate someone does not fit the Florida definition of stalking.

This is just a false equivalency you've created, since the facts are universally not on your side.

(in reply to mnottertail)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 2:58:55 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline
Some imaginary law schools teach things differently.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

There you go misinterpreting the law again.

George admitted to a homicide, not a murder. Wee bit of a legal difference.



_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to Raiikun)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 3:02:43 PM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Some imaginary law schools teach things differently.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

There you go misinterpreting the law again.

George admitted to a homicide, not a murder. Wee bit of a legal difference.




For some time I've wondered if he believes even a fraction of the stuff he fabricates, or if he's just trolling. I'm leaning toward "troll", because surely everyone understands the basic difference between justifiable homicide and murder, and why claiming the former is not admission of the latter.


(in reply to Powergamz1)
Profile   Post #: 2665
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 3:07:23 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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What's the old joke about Winston Churchill? 'We've already established what you are, now we are merely haggling over the price?'
http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/300099-churchill-madam-would-you-sleep-with-me-for-five-million


We've already established the occupation, and are merely wondering about the motives.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun


quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Some imaginary law schools teach things differently.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

There you go misinterpreting the law again.

George admitted to a homicide, not a murder. Wee bit of a legal difference.




For some time I've wondered if he believes even a fraction of the stuff he fabricates, or if he's just trolling. I'm leaning toward "troll", because surely everyone understands the basic difference between justifiable homicide and murder, and why claiming the former is not admission of the latter.





_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to Raiikun)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 3:24:24 PM   
mnottertail


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We've established at the outset what you are, and believe me, we are laughing at you.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Powergamz1)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 3:59:22 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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Who is 'we'? StormFront? The other phony legal experts on the internet? Laugh away.


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

We've established at the outset what you are, and believe me, we are laughing at you.



_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 2668
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 6:16:21 PM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
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Ya know, I just wanna say that this whole unmoderated thing has been a fascinating social exercise. It's wild watching people's true colors come out.
Kinda a micro version of Lord Of The Flies.
Some folk have stayed civilized, stated their cases and defended it as best they can while remaining polite and decent. Others have resorted almost immediately to personal attacks and degenerated from there.
People whom I've had some respect/liking for have dwindled in my eyes. While others whom I didn't think much of have raised themselves by their demeanor.
And this really has zip to do with what side of the argument the person is on. Instead, it has everything to do with how they've conducted themselves during these discussions.

Cuz ya know, just cuz you can get away with saying damn near anything don't mean ya gotta.

So thanks to all who have participated, pro/con, good/bad, attacking/ well mannered.

It's been an eye opening experience.


ETA-And thanks to the mods and powers that be for allowing it to happen. You folks rock.

< Message edited by Kana -- 7/25/2013 6:17:09 PM >


_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 7:45:47 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

Ya know, I just wanna say that this whole unmoderated thing has been a fascinating social exercise. It's wild watching people's true colors come out... And thanks to the mods and powers that be for allowing it to happen.

I really enjoyed it too. I can't say that it opened my eyes to anything I didn't already know, but it's been a lot more honest and fun than the pretentious crap that trying to eviscerate someone while avoiding moderation produces. And I'll second your thanks to the PTB. If contentious topics routinely had an unmoderated thread paralleling the moderated one, I bet the action would all be on the former.

K.

(in reply to Kana)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 7:51:51 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline
quote:

Some folk have stayed civilized, stated their cases and defended it as best they can while remaining polite and decent. Others have resorted almost immediately to personal attacks and degenerated from there.
People whom I've had some respect/liking for have dwindled in my eyes. While others whom I didn't think much of have raised themselves by their demeanor.
And this really has zip to do with what side of the argument the person is on. Instead, it has everything to do with how they've conducted themselves during these discussions.

Cuz ya know, just cuz you can get away with saying damn near anything don't mean ya gotta.

So thanks to all who have participated, pro/con, good/bad, attacking/ well mannered.

It's been an eye opening experience.


ETA-And thanks to the mods and powers that be for allowing it to happen. You folks rock.



I agree, but most people have remained fairly "true to type".
Those I lost respect for, I didn't have much respect for to begin with.
lol
I have gained a lot of respect for several people.
People always show you "who" they are, if you look/listen long enough.
Peace

< Message edited by Marini -- 7/25/2013 7:57:40 PM >


_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to Kana)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 8:24:07 PM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
Others have resorted almost immediately to personal attacks and degenerated from there.

It takes 2 to tango.. no one needs to engage the attackers.. They are looking for a reaction, to suck you into that, to yank yer chain.. but you have the choice in how you react.. I refuse to engage anyone that attempts that with me.. I am not someone's online punching bag.. I do enjoy discussing various topics with other people that are civil.. But thats me..

And as evidenced by this thread, some people do enjoy the bloody online boxing match, even if their reputation suffers.. I have never seen someone change their viewpoint tho, when they are personally attacked.. attacks tend to entrench a persons views.. So why do that? You have a much better chance of getting your point across and getting some amount of agreement if you are calm and have a logical & supported opinion..

_____________________________

As Anderson Cooper said “If he (Trump) took a dump on his desk, you would defend it”

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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 8:32:30 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
How many locked Zimmerman threads were there before this?

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 2673
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 8:43:09 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline
FR

I ran across this again. I thought it would be nice here. Well no I did not because I am not nice, I am not polite and I really don't give fuck what anyone says or thinks about me because I am a Man. I am not a highschool kid with peer pressure nor seeking public office in this fucking cesspool of a country. You can call me a racist or any other goddamn thing you want because sticks and stone will be met with fucking lead bullets and/or buckshot. You can call me politicallly incorrect but if you want to bend over for these motherfuckers you go right ahead, you got that right. But remember, someday when they come for your goodies, your pleas of "I was always with you people and I LOVE YOU" is not going to mean a fucking thing to them. They want your money. Granted, they are not worse than bankers or the government but here it is :

-------
"My name was Antonio West. I was the 13-month old child who was shot in the face at point blank range by two black teens, who were attempting to rob my mother, who was also shot.

I think my murder and my mommy’s wounding made the news for maybe a day, and then disappeared.

A Grand Jury of my mommy's peers from Brunswick, Georgia ruled the black teens who murdered me will not face the death penalty. Too bad it was me who got the death sentence from my killers instead, because Mommy didn’t have the money they demanded.

See, my family made the mistake of being white in a 73% non-white neighborhood, but my murder wasn’t ruled a ‘hate crime’.

Oh, and President Obama didn’t take a single moment to acknowledge my murder. He couldn’t have any children who could possibly look like me - so why should he care?

I’m one of the youngest murder victims in our great Nation's history, but the media didn’t care to cover the story of my being killed in cold blood.

There isn’t a white equivalent of Al Sharpton, because if there was he would be branded a ‘racist’. So no one’s rushing to Brunswick, Georgia to demonstrate and demand ‘justice’ for me. There’s no ‘White Panther’ party, either, to put a bounty on the lives of the two black teens who murdered me.

I have no voice, I have no representation, and unlike those who shot me in the face while I sat innocently in my stroller I no longer have my life.

Isn’t this a great country?

So while you’re out seeking ‘justice for Trayvon’, please remember to seek ‘justice’ for me. Tell your friends about me, tell you families, get tee-shirts with my face on them, and make the world pay attention, just like you did for Trayvon.

I won’t hold my breath.

I don’t have to anymore. "
-----

Indeed, where is the public outrage ? I'll tell you where, buried in the hearts (not minds of course) of the little sheeple who are victims of indoctrination of White guilt. That is why this fucking thread even exists, isn't it now ?

The motherfucker who killed that baby did it FOR MONEY. Zimmerman did not. Where is your outrage ? I'll tell you where, it has been buried by a lifetime of brainwashing to make you guilty for all you have earned and all you have no matter what the source, just because someone else doesn't have it. That is where. Down in your fucking asshole.

With your common sense.

Where also is the outrage about that Woman, also in Florida who fired warning shots into the air to scare her abusive ex out of HER house ? (she had a restraining order as well) You SHOULD be right there if your White guilt runs true I would think. She is Black and doing twenty years for NOT killing someone. She should have killed the abusing motherfucker and then said "He lunged at me" when the cops got there. Where is your outrage over that injustice ? MINE IS. I think she needs a new trial or something, this is fucking wrong. And she is Black but I am a racist. I am not the one who needs to rethink shit.

People are sickening to me, really. I long for the day they tell me I only have a short time to live, because I will be taking names. ALOT of names. Equal opportunity destroyer.

T^T^T

< Message edited by Termyn8or -- 7/25/2013 8:58:06 PM >

(in reply to tj444)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/25/2013 8:51:16 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
I still receive security updates from my old neighborhood. There has been a rash of burglaries there. Today I received an email from the association, and in it was the picture of a black kid who was a "person of interest" in solving the crimes. It occurred to me that I would not try to follow and confront such a person. It also occurred to me that if I saw a suspect, I'd be on high alert and my sense of danger would be heightened, and Zimmerman probably felt the same way.

This is why Zimmerman did not approach Martin in a friendly manner. He did not have a depraved heart, but his perceptions were colored by the past and the rash of crimes in his neighborhood. That, plus the firearm, proved a deadly combination.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 7/25/2013 8:57:27 PM >

(in reply to VideoAdminAlpha)
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RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/26/2013 12:41:12 AM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline



Things that make you go 'Hmmmm'.

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to Powergamz1)
Profile   Post #: 2676
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/26/2013 12:56:01 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

A Grand Jury of my mommy's peers from Brunswick, Georgia ruled the black teens who murdered me will not face the death penalty. Too bad it was me who got the death sentence from my killers instead, because Mommy didn’t have the money they demanded.


This is what bothers me about that blurb. Legally, per Georgia law, they cant face the death penalty because of their age. There was no need to "rule". That law is already in place.

quote:

Where also is the outrage about that Woman, also in Florida who fired warning shots into the air to scare her abusive ex out of HER house ?


That has also been discussed. She left the house to get the gun, as I understand it, which negates her feeling of imminent death. She didnt take her way out.

quote:

She is Black and doing twenty years for NOT killing someone. She should have killed the abusing motherfucker and then said "He lunged at me" when the cops got there. Where is your outrage over that injustice ? MINE IS. I think she needs a new trial or something, this is fucking wrong. And she is Black but I am a racist. I am not the one who needs to rethink shit.


I agree with you here. However, she was honest, and got fucked in the end.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 2677
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/26/2013 3:05:24 AM   
lilcracker


Posts: 243
Joined: 4/14/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

FR

I ran across this again. I thought it would be nice here. Well no I did not because I am not nice, I am not polite and I really don't give fuck what anyone says or thinks about me because I am a Man. I am not a highschool kid with peer pressure nor seeking public office in this fucking cesspool of a country. You can call me a racist or any other goddamn thing you want because sticks and stone will be met with fucking lead bullets and/or buckshot. You can call me politicallly incorrect but if you want to bend over for these motherfuckers you go right ahead, you got that right. But remember, someday when they come for your goodies, your pleas of "I was always with you people and I LOVE YOU" is not going to mean a fucking thing to them. They want your money. Granted, they are not worse than bankers or the government but here it is :

-------
"My name was Antonio West. I was the 13-month old child who was shot in the face at point blank range by two black teens, who were attempting to rob my mother, who was also shot.

I think my murder and my mommy’s wounding made the news for maybe a day, and then disappeared.

A Grand Jury of my mommy's peers from Brunswick, Georgia ruled the black teens who murdered me will not face the death penalty. Too bad it was me who got the death sentence from my killers instead, because Mommy didn’t have the money they demanded.

See, my family made the mistake of being white in a 73% non-white neighborhood, but my murder wasn’t ruled a ‘hate crime’.

Oh, and President Obama didn’t take a single moment to acknowledge my murder. He couldn’t have any children who could possibly look like me - so why should he care?

I’m one of the youngest murder victims in our great Nation's history, but the media didn’t care to cover the story of my being killed in cold blood.

There isn’t a white equivalent of Al Sharpton, because if there was he would be branded a ‘racist’. So no one’s rushing to Brunswick, Georgia to demonstrate and demand ‘justice’ for me. There’s no ‘White Panther’ party, either, to put a bounty on the lives of the two black teens who murdered me.

I have no voice, I have no representation, and unlike those who shot me in the face while I sat innocently in my stroller I no longer have my life.

Isn’t this a great country?

So while you’re out seeking ‘justice for Trayvon’, please remember to seek ‘justice’ for me. Tell your friends about me, tell you families, get tee-shirts with my face on them, and make the world pay attention, just like you did for Trayvon.

I won’t hold my breath.

I don’t have to anymore. "
-----

Indeed, where is the public outrage ? I'll tell you where, buried in the hearts (not minds of course) of the little sheeple who are victims of indoctrination of White guilt. That is why this fucking thread even exists, isn't it now ?

The motherfucker who killed that baby did it FOR MONEY. Zimmerman did not. Where is your outrage ? I'll tell you where, it has been buried by a lifetime of brainwashing to make you guilty for all you have earned and all you have no matter what the source, just because someone else doesn't have it. That is where. Down in your fucking asshole.

With your common sense.

Where also is the outrage about that Woman, also in Florida who fired warning shots into the air to scare her abusive ex out of HER house ? (she had a restraining order as well) You SHOULD be right there if your White guilt runs true I would think. She is Black and doing twenty years for NOT killing someone. She should have killed the abusing motherfucker and then said "He lunged at me" when the cops got there. Where is your outrage over that injustice ? MINE IS. I think she needs a new trial or something, this is fucking wrong. And she is Black but I am a racist. I am not the one who needs to rethink shit.

People are sickening to me, really. I long for the day they tell me I only have a short time to live, because I will be taking names. ALOT of names. Equal opportunity destroyer.

T^T^T
http://politicalblindspot.org/new-evidence-suggests-the-black-teens-accused-of-shooting-white-baby-were-not-involved/

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 2678
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/26/2013 7:04:41 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Who is 'we'? StormFront? The other phony legal experts on the internet? Laugh away.


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

We've established at the outset what you are, and believe me, we are laughing at you.




I dont know, you are the stormfront guy, sort of a stormfront felcher would be fairly accurate, really.


_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Powergamz1)
Profile   Post #: 2679
RE: UNMODERATED ZIMMERMAN - 7/26/2013 7:26:22 AM   
Marc2b


Posts: 6660
Joined: 8/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

I had the occassion to look into allegations of discrimination in the legal system, and generally I support fixing bias when possible.


Well that's good to know.

quote:

But I also think that the largest cause leading to bias is the actions of blacks themeselves. We do not have criminal bias against koreans, or filipinos, or latvians, or colombians or....


How do you know this. Most of the studies I have seen or heard about show that any non-white is more likely to be discriminated against.

quote:

To what extent do you suppose that judges, juries, cops and prosecuters get jaded? Time after time they are arresting black thugs, time after time sending them to jail. If that were case for any minority I think it would lead to bias in the court system.


Judges have no right to be jaded. If they are not capable of judging each case on its own merits and without bias, then they should not be in their posistion.

quote:

Europe has a similar problem - not with blacks - but with gypsies. Persecuted, and biased against. Not black.


There are those who would disagree with you. This shouldn't be surprising since American racism is a direct descendant of European racism.

quote:

Where is the million man march not for non-violent protest - but for a rejection of crime? For a rejection of gangsa culture, of rap?
Where's the million man march for education and staying in school and not having sex.


They're out there.

quote:

There was an interesting study that said - if a black man got his high school diploma, got married, and didnt have a child out of wedlock then the rate of poverty for those individuals was 6.7%. Lower than the general white population, in fact.


The fact that an education and some stability in one's life lessens (but by no means eliminates) the chances of living in poverty is not surprising... but what does that have to do with minorities being discriminated against or followed and shot for walking down the street.

quote:

So sure - racism bites. And we should fix injustice where we can. But turning a blind eye to such a simple prescription to reducing black poverty is counterproductive.


Of course reducing poverty would help but only to a limited extent. Much of that poverty is due to racism and reducing poverty will not end the racism of prosecutors, judges and jurors. Racism is something that can only be fixed within each individual's conscious.

quote:

And the actions of sharpton, jackson, the NAACP appauls me when they don't demand action within their communities along these lines.


The fact that some self appointed "leaders" of the black community are deficient in constructive criticism does not mean that such does not happen. I direct you back to the second link in this post.



_____________________________

Do you know what the most awesome thing about being an Atheist is? You're not required to hate anybody!

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 2680
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