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RE: Benghazi - 8/2/2013 1:43:10 PM

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There were planes in the middle east. They could have gotten there some way or another. Not in any useful timefram, and would have done nothing useful, except burn gas, while saving zero lives.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/2/2013 1:47:04 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Benghazi - 8/2/2013 1:50:48 PM

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Joined: 1/4/2004
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Wrong again.

As I've shown in multiple posts, with multiple examples. Even ferrying from aviano, the planes arrive more than an hour before woods or daugherty are killed. And possibly in time to save the ambassador.

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Benghazi - 8/2/2013 1:57:02 PM

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Joined: 11/3/2004
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You have not shown those planes, nor those planes in avenno, nor their ready times for armament, fuel and people. You have never been right. The sonic boom from your imaginary planes would not have saved lives.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Benghazi - 8/2/2013 2:22:14 PM

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Just pointing out that recent blather has been to ignore the fact that it pretty much is *proved* that planes are in range and could have gotten there.

When facts don't support you - change the subject.

I long back disproved all your claims about F-16's. They could not have ferried to Sigonella and armed because Sigonella does not have any fighter squadrons to arm them from.

They were not in range for a direct flight and launching a tanker would have added 2 to 3 hours minimum to the prep time for the mission plus the actual refueling time over the Med.

Even if we did launch them and get them there they would have been able to do nothing except indiscriminately bomb a town we considered friendly. The mortar attack that killed the two security contractors that were the only ones that died after this crazy half assed plan could have gotten a plane on station was from an unseen position and only 3 rounds were fired. There is nothing an F-16 in the dark could have done to prevent that.

(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Benghazi - 8/2/2013 2:25:55 PM

Posts: 4105
Joined: 10/26/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim
Four Americans were murdered in Benghazi, ...

As compared to the 241 Americans who died in the Beirut bombing in 1983. Under Reagan's watch. As he sold arms to the Ayatollah and chemical weapons to Saddam and imported cocaine from S American drug lords. And as Bush I, along with the US-funded Saudi Wahabi nutcases, enabled and empowered the Taliban.

Your point?

< Message edited by Edwynn -- 8/2/2013 2:37:14 PM >

(in reply to RacerJim)

RE: Benghazi - 8/2/2013 4:39:55 PM

Posts: 882
Joined: 10/15/2005
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quote:

You are on a fucksite, sport. If you don't like swearing, don't say stupid shit on a forum where people swear

the ONLY person I see swearing here is YOU, no one else, JUST YOU!

occassionally some one else will get frusterated and cuss, but you seem to have to do it in EVERY SINGLE POST...

it doesn't make you look smart or mature, it just makes it so civilized people feel you aren't worth listening to!

I thought it was COOL to cuss when I was like 13 and that persisted threw my teenage years, then I GREW UP!

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 7:02:03 AM

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

quote:

You are on a fucksite, sport. If you don't like swearing, don't say stupid shit on a forum where people swear

the ONLY person I see swearing here is YOU, no one else, JUST YOU!

occassionally some one else will get frusterated and cuss, but you seem to have to do it in EVERY SINGLE POST...

it doesn't make you look smart or mature, it just makes it so civilized people feel you aren't worth listening to!

I thought it was COOL to cuss when I was like 13 and that persisted threw my teenage years, then I GREW UP!

I don't give a box of invisible fucks what you think, and you do not speak for more than yourself, there are plenty ok with my lingo, and those who aren't, maybe they want to leave the fucksite and get civilized, although I would think they would want to have intellect that transcends the third grade.

You were looking for the word through there, but now that you have grown up, you can grab up your own third grade primer on spelling and words.

It is a matter of velleity to me, and I use swear words because it would take a raft of King James Scholars and every edition of the OED for some of the less fortunate to translate what I say into a comprehensible third grade level that many here precariously possess.

Again, I don't give the glimmer of a good goddamn fuck what your cretinous opinion is.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/3/2013 7:03:04 AM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to BitYakin)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 7:18:56 AM

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Joined: 1/22/2012
Status: offline

I believe in Obama. I voted for him and I trust him.

He was put in a horrible position, and I think he has did a fine job. Perfect no? Without terrible tragedies? no. Mistakes? yes.

I have faith in him to do the right things.

< Message edited by chatterbox24 -- 8/3/2013 7:19:22 AM >

_____________________________

I am like a box of chocolates, you never know what variety you are going to get on any given day.

My crazy smells like jasmine, cloves and cat nip.

(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 7:26:33 AM

Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

quote:

You are on a fucksite, sport. If you don't like swearing, don't say stupid shit on a forum where people swear

the ONLY person I see swearing here is YOU, no one else, JUST YOU!

occassionally some one else will get frusterated and cuss, but you seem to have to do it in EVERY SINGLE POST...

it doesn't make you look smart or mature, it just makes it so civilized people feel you aren't worth listening to!

I thought it was COOL to cuss when I was like 13 and that persisted threw my teenage years, then I GREW UP!

It is a matter of velleity to me

I most heartily agree, though I suspect you see your usage as more of an alternative choice than what I see as mere weakness, being useless and of no real value.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 7:32:54 AM

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

quote:

You are on a fucksite, sport. If you don't like swearing, don't say stupid shit on a forum where people swear

the ONLY person I see swearing here is YOU, no one else, JUST YOU!

occassionally some one else will get frusterated and cuss, but you seem to have to do it in EVERY SINGLE POST...

it doesn't make you look smart or mature, it just makes it so civilized people feel you aren't worth listening to!

I thought it was COOL to cuss when I was like 13 and that persisted threw my teenage years, then I GREW UP!

It is a matter of velleity to me

I most heartily agree, though I suspect you see your usage as more of an alternative choice than what I see as mere weakness, being useless and of no real value.

I see these unfounded chicken little threads as weakness and being useless and of no value. I throw no pearls before swine. There is no commerce in writing astounding prose to Ghana profiles or 'conservative-independent' thread blather.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Yachtie)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 8:59:59 AM

Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

I see these unfounded chicken little threads as weakness and being useless and of no value. I throw no pearls before swine. There is no commerce in writing astounding prose to Ghana profiles or 'conservative-independent' thread blather.

Yet, you participate so readily.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 9:01:52 AM

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

And why not? I own the place I work, I have free time, and I love to laugh at twatwaffles, especially the ones not tightly wrapped, I love seeing them come unraveled.

It is way better than planning out how I am gonna mow the lawn this afternoon.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Yachtie)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 9:11:13 AM

Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

I own the place I work, I have free time

Business that good, huh?

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 9:29:22 AM

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

It is good enough I can afford internet and a lawnmower and 97 acres and 4 cars and.........

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Yachtie)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 9:32:39 AM

Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

It is good enough I can afford internet and a lawnmower and 97 acres and 4 cars and.........

Then, having so much free time, you must be a capitalist pig, living off the labor of others.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 9:36:38 AM

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

You fucking Sie A. But not their labor, rather their weakness and indolence.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/3/2013 9:39:07 AM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Yachtie)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 10:18:21 PM

Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Just pointing out that recent blather has been to ignore the fact that it pretty much is *proved* that planes are in range and could have gotten there.

When facts don't support you - change the subject.

I long back disproved all your claims about F-16's. They could not have ferried to Sigonella and armed because Sigonella does not have any fighter squadrons to arm them from.

They were not in range for a direct flight and launching a tanker would have added 2 to 3 hours minimum to the prep time for the mission plus the actual refueling time over the Med.

Even if we did launch them and get them there they would have been able to do nothing except indiscriminately bomb a town we considered friendly. The mortar attack that killed the two security contractors that were the only ones that died after this crazy half assed plan could have gotten a plane on station was from an unseen position and only 3 rounds were fired. There is nothing an F-16 in the dark could have done to prevent that.

LOL: no quotes no facts just your words.

Fact: Sigonella is a logistics hub.
Fact: Ace F-16 pilot said the ferry option was perfectly viable - and mundane. And said they could have rearmed and refueled the planes.
Fact: Combat range of an f16 with external tanks is more than adequate. But even if not you could ferry.
Fact: The mortar position was NOT unknown but laser illuminated.
Fact: That version of the f-16 is night mission compatible. As evidenced by a). The specs (provided) and b). The fact that they use them for night missions all the time.

You repeat all these falsehoods - but not a single bit of evidence to back you up. Your words are dross.

This is why you are factless ken. Your oft repeated assertions are nothing.

< Message edited by Phydeaux -- 8/3/2013 10:20:35 PM >

(in reply to DomKen)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 11:43:08 PM

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

And yet he has been empowered to control the direction and de facto topic of the thread, Phydeaux.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Phydeaux)

RE: Benghazi - 8/3/2013 11:48:31 PM

Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline

We lost a heli in Libya, I want to be repaid by the fuckin libyans. Or they can fuck off for all I care.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

RE: Benghazi - 8/4/2013 2:46:47 AM

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Just pointing out that recent blather has been to ignore the fact that it pretty much is *proved* that planes are in range and could have gotten there.

When facts don't support you - change the subject.

I long back disproved all your claims about F-16's. They could not have ferried to Sigonella and armed because Sigonella does not have any fighter squadrons to arm them from.

They were not in range for a direct flight and launching a tanker would have added 2 to 3 hours minimum to the prep time for the mission plus the actual refueling time over the Med.

Even if we did launch them and get them there they would have been able to do nothing except indiscriminately bomb a town we considered friendly. The mortar attack that killed the two security contractors that were the only ones that died after this crazy half assed plan could have gotten a plane on station was from an unseen position and only 3 rounds were fired. There is nothing an F-16 in the dark could have done to prevent that.

LOL: no quotes no facts just your words.

Fact: Sigonella is a logistics hub.
Fact: Ace F-16 pilot said the ferry option was perfectly viable - and mundane. And said they could have rearmed and refueled the planes.
Fact: Combat range of an f16 with external tanks is more than adequate. But even if not you could ferry.
Fact: The mortar position was NOT unknown but laser illuminated.
Fact: That version of the f-16 is night mission compatible. As evidenced by a). The specs (provided) and b). The fact that they use them for night missions all the time.

You repeat all these falsehoods - but not a single bit of evidence to back you up. Your words are dross.

This is why you are factless ken. Your oft repeated assertions are nothing.

I already disproved all this nonsense except the claim about the mortar. You got anything on that one?

BTW why would your supposed expert say the only option was a ferry to Sigonella if the planes had the range otherwise? Because they don't and your own source confirms that. Also why would they have been designating a target with no air assets overhead? That would be the waste of a guy who could be doing something else.

Now lets consider you fantasy
Aviano recalls a couple of air crews and pilots,fuels up a couple of F-16's and loads them with drop tanks, develops this plan and briefs the pilots.
That's a minimum of an hour and more likely longer.
F-16's fly to Sigonella
more than an hour
F-16's land at Sigonella, air crews unfamiliar with F-16's remove drops tanks, refuel the planes and load ordinance.
probably an hour and a half to 2 hours
F-16's fly to Benghazi
another hour

So if everything goes just exactly right we have a couple of F-16's over Benghazi about 5 hours after we decide to send them. So too early to hit the mortar position, even if we did know it was there, and without the fuel to loiter to wait for something we didn't know was coming. So still nothing useful the F-16's could have done.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 8/4/2013 2:59:10 AM >

(in reply to Phydeaux)

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