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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 1:40:10 AM   
FirmhandKY


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Fast Reply:

Ladies, excuse the interruption.

Ya know ... every single group and gender of people get "lumped in" and "generalized about".  That's human nature and a useful trait.  Taken too far, and yes, it's prejudice.

I find it kinda humorous, all the bile and bellowing about "poor pitiful put upon me" from anyone, when they see only the most negative interpretation in any comment about their "special group", yet make the exact same (or worse) assumptions and comments back.

I think there is a word for that, and it starts with an "h" and has a "y" in it somewhere.  Not to mention, that such people's actions give truth to the very words and thoughts that they are putatively attacking.

Now, some direct thoughts about our "friendly, down to earth submissive male":

1. Haven't seen a friendly word or thought in the entire thread expressed by sissify.
2. He joins 8/30/06 and complains in his journal on 9/01/06 "no luck so far".
3. Journal entry a week later: "Hatred is not a family value."  But it seems to be one he values, nonetheless.
4.  The only place that the word "Service" can be found, is at the bottom of the page, where it's used as part of the link to CM's "Terms of Service".
5.  What he does post, however, about what he seeks is: 

I feel its rather rude and lacking in ettiquite to post what I like here but I will say..it does involve crossdressing, feminization, corsetry, rubber, and obedience training. This is what drives me. It makes me feel good.

Pretty clear to me.  It's all about him.

If he were a femsub, I'd never have given him a second look.

To mis-quote the Bard:  "The fault, dear sissify, is not in our dommes, but in ourselves"   

FHky



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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 1:45:28 AM   
FirmhandKY


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SubNY278

While I'm not necessarily defending all that sissytoserve has written, I can attest to his frustration as a fellow male sub.  I think for many subs like me, it's gotten to the point where you've done everything you possibly could.  You take the time to write to each Domme you are interested in with a specific, detailed letter written in response to Her profile.  If you have the opportunity to meet in real-life you always show up, ready and on time.  You don't flake out and don't demand sex or just use Dommes to have something to jerk off to when you're bored.  You have a sincere desire to serve, and the thought of serving is a turn-on for you.  You try all that, and fail, and many times, don't even receive a response from many of the Dommes you write to, even if you write a mature, well-written letter, not pushy, not demanding, not coming out with a laundry list of things the sub enjoys or asking for sex, not copy and pasting the same exact letter over and over again, etc., but a letter that specifically addresses the profile of the Domme being written to.  All that, and nothing to show for it.  So yes, it is frustrating. 


No offense ... but how is that experience any different in substance from what a "sincere" dom, or a "real" femsub has to go through?

None that I can see.

It's frustrating for everyone.  Sure, there are a lucky few who "hit it lucky" immediately, but I think the majority of people of whatever category you want to mention have generally the same problems.

FHky


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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 2:46:20 AM   
MaamJay


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I almost shudder to enter this very heated thread ... but strictly from My personal experience:

My ex-husband is a cross dresser. Before we met, he only wore ladies shoes ... quite obsessively at times eg he would put them on in the car for just a 5 minute drive to the shops, then change into "boy shoes" to go shopping, then change again when he got back to the car. I thought that was because he had always had to do this secretly. Initially I was interested in this behaviour, fostered and encouraged him wearing his shoes openly at home, bought him his first pair of stockings etc. However I didn't realise that this would only make him more obsessed, I had thought that with him now having more freedom to indulge his desire, things would balance out a bit. It didn't. I realise now I didn't truly understand a fetish.

Over time W/we moved into bdsm and he begged Me to take him as My sub and train him. However that proved to be impossible as ... as other posters have suggested MIGHT be the case ... for him, it's all about the fetish and not about the service.  It took U/us a long time to realise that this was just not something he could change, and so have severed those ties, though he is still living in the house (and still clomping around in his heels!).  In addition, I have met several other CDs, and most have openly admitted they are fetishists not subs. There is one I know who is more sub than CD ... but he's taken!

So what of the future? well, I am looking for a sub first and foremost. If I happen to find one here in Australia that IS a sub but happens to enjoy cross-dressing play, then I certainly wouldn't count him out. But it wouldn't be what I was primarily searching for and it doesn't rate very highly in My list of preferences. I am in need of a good allrounder, someone who gets a buzz out of service (whether it's washing My laundry or licking Me!), who relishes for Me to give him a good spanking or flogging, who enjoys helping Me to host play parties in the Dungeon etc.  And before I get labelled a female supremacist, and accused of it being "all about Me" I will add that I am also 24/7 sub/slave to Master. i love serving Him, whether it's getting His breakfast or massaging His back ... I am not looking for anything from a sub to Me that i do not give myself to Master. I am also a caring and loving Domme ... I will cherish the right sub, he would be loved and cared for, just as Master loves and cares for me. And then I get criticised sometimes for being "too kind, not cruel enough!"  Go figure!

Mistress Jay aka violet[A]

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 2:56:02 AM   
mam


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"putting down my cheesecake and stuffing myself back into my corset"...... none of us are perfect, we all have flaws, we search for the one who will accept us in spite of them. And dare I say love and cherish also............"now pass me that Hagen Daz!"

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 3:08:53 AM   
MisPandora


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It's interesting that you had that experience.  I had a similar journey with a gentleman who, between the two of us, it took almost a year to figure out that it wasn't just my mood or his mood or whatever, it was that he wanted what he wanted when he wanted it.  I was the means to the end, and he "tolerated" being obedient and being of service when it was convenient for him.  It didn't make him a bad person.  Actually, we had far more refreshing interactions when, after I'd had enough and called him out on the carpet, we'd discussed his kink as two people who had no interest in one another. It didn't work for me because I wanted someone who was inspired to be pleasing to me, not someone who needed me as the 'holder of the whip', so to speak.  In the end, we worked together to find him someone who truly fetishized/enjoyed dressing men up and humiliating them, and he's STILL to this day seeing her. 

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"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 6:03:25 AM   
MsKatHouston


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oh my, such anger first thing in the morning...guess I should have waited to read this one until after my first cup of coffee.  I need a cheesecake now too.

It amazes me that people will bitch about not finding their perfect match here on CM and wonder at why.  It must, of course be us terrible fem dommy type creatures.  Couldn't possible be anything regarding attitude, clearly hateful forum posts and one's own issues and insecurities. 

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 6:35:33 AM   
MzTlaz


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Personally, I prefer the Alpha-type male.  I have many friends who are crossdressers and occasionally I might play with them but it's not what I look for in a partner.  And that's just my personal preference which I do believe as a human being I have a right to...even if I am a FemDom. 

I'm not a female supremacist, have been told I'm way too considerate of my submissives by many and yet I too have met crossdressers who say they want to serve but really just want to pose around!  I can think of one who at a very formal D/s dinner at which he was a server and as such wore the 'uniform' of the night and had a strict code of behaviour threw it all out of the window to grab the spotlight.  I don't know why it is this way....but my experience is that probably about 70% of the sissy submissives I've met do tend to be too interested in 'being a sissy' to make a good submissive.   That's my experience.  I guess if other FemDoms put in their percentage we could maybe get an idea of how prevalent this is.....or isn't!

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 7:13:13 AM   
LadyEllen


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Thank goodness I'm TS, so cant possibly be one of these "selfish domme xxxxxx" or one of those angry crossdressers. I knew there had to be something of advantage to all this.....

Speaking from the neutral sidelines people, and having met dozens of TVs, CDs or whatever they want to be called, I would say its
50% clothes/makeup/shoes and "whoo! look at me!" - totally unsuitable in case you wondered
25% "I am now someone else completely, and so I can indulge whatever it is I find shameful as a man" (I DONT THINK MUCH OF WOMEN AS WOMEN DO THESE DISGUSTING THINGS - IN MY MIND AT LEAST) - equally totally unsuitable
15% "I totally love, adore and worship women so much that I want to emulate them to feel close to them" (I LOVE WOMEN, BUT ONLY AS MUCH AS I LOVE MYSELF) - reasonably suitable candidates
10% "I feel a need to love, adore and worship women that I want to emulate them to feel close to them, and I also want to love, adore and worship them whilst emulating them" (I LOVE WOMEN MUCH MORE THAN I LOVE MYSELF) - well qualified candidates

Personally I dont like males dressing as women, even though the males who do it tend to be the nicest guys around, (unless they are having a bad day). Still, its important to set rules and boundaries;

1) no borrowing my stuff
2) never, ever look better than me
3) dont walk like John Wayne after a hundred miles in the saddle - its funny only the first time
4) for goodness sake, lift those feet and use a little poise if you're going to wear heels; click not clop!
5) if out in public, pretend youre Albanian and unable to speak - dont even hmmmm to anyone, and especially dont do that horrendous falsetto that you think is such a good female voice but which sounds like a badly tuned church organ
6) if I say you look awful, you look awful. If I say you look really awful, you look better than me. Either way, you'd best change
7) dress appropriately - here's a clue; if I'm wearing jeans and a jumper 'cause its minus ten outside, then its probably not appropriate to wear that backless cocktail dress.

Why these rules? Well, because its all about me of course......

E



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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 7:46:36 AM   
MisPandora


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

5) if out in public, pretend youre Albanian and unable to speak - dont even hmmmm to anyone, and especially dont do that horrendous falsetto that you think is such a good female voice but which sounds like a badly tuned church organ

Ellen......bless you for this.  I spit my morning coffee all on my monitor!  Hahahahahaha.

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Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 9:15:35 AM   
LadyEllen


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MisP - my pleasure! Having trained my voice I know the pitfalls! Its also funny to me that TV/CD guys - even the ones who fall into my "top 25%" and wish to praise by emulation, obviously dont listen to women that much. Sure, its about pitch, but there's a lot more to it than that and even women with deeper voices are never mistaken for men on the phone.

If any guys are interested in how to develop a female voice, mail me direct and I will send you some links. Its about resonance, choice of vocabulary, getting out of that monotone and very importantly, something you must do at the end of every sentence thats exactly the opposite of what men do.

E


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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 9:55:17 AM   
MsKatHouston


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Lady Ellen, I don't wish to hijack this thread but I bet a lot of Dommes and subs would find that topic useful and interesting.  If you are so inclined, I'd love for you to start another topic on it or if you want to email me directly, I'd be interested in learning more about it. :) ty

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 11:33:57 AM   
LotusSong


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Am I the only one that doesn't really see the connection between D/sBDSM and cross dressing?  I never have.
D=Dominance
S=Submission
B=Bondage
D=Discipline
S=Sadism
M=Masochism
 
Nope.. I don't see "cross dressing" in that Alphabet soup.   This is why I'm so surprised to see them wanting to become involved in it.  A masochistic/dominant or submissive.. I can see.  There is an interest in the activities. But to get upset because we might not wish to relate to the cross-dressing behavior because we enjoy mind control, flogging, needle play or whatever.. is misplaced.  Do you feel the same way about Male Dominants?  There are some that play with CD's also.. but the CD has to have an interest in what the DOM/ME likes also.
 
I think you are genuflecting in the Synagogue.. Right church- wrong pew?
 
Have you tried groups like Tri-S?  (I believe that is how it's spelled)
 
You know what I'M tired of? The "If you are a Domme you have to like EVERYTHING!"  I think most of us have opened out minds to cross-dressers and just not found it to our liking is all.
 
The one transvestite I LOVE is Eddie Izzard.  He's one dapper dresser, but just acts like a regular guy.  THAT'S what is appealing to me.  He's not TRYING to feign a woman's persona. 
 
 

< Message edited by LotusSong -- 9/18/2006 11:37:20 AM >


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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 12:47:32 PM   
Phoenixandnika


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Let me start out by saying I enjoying a man who cross dresses in his service to me. I don't personally see it as a "fetish" for most though I am sure it is for some.
 
For many cross dressing is a way of expressing their feminine side and at times it is very much about domination and control. I know many men who enjoy being "forced" to crossdress either privately or publicly. However I ask this if crossdressing is something that they agree to do with a dom/me are they truly being forced?
 
I also know many who crossdress because they do see themselves as women they are not trying to be women in their minds they are women.Some crossdress part time or all the time simply because due to their current situations they can not go through with gender reassignment surgery.
 
I have an issue with someone saying things like this :D=Dominance S=Submission B=Bondage D=Discipline S=Sadism M=Masochism

Nope.. I don't see "cross dressing" in that Alphabet soup.

 
So what you don't see "cross dressing" in that Alphabet soup. What right do you or anyone else have to say they do not belong in this lifestyle? Perhaps it is no for you. Perhaps you don't understand crossdressers in general or how they fit into this lifestyle, but that frankly that is on you not on them.
 
I for one am glad there is a large number of crossdressing submissives within this forum and within lifesyle groups that I am part of.
 
 


< Message edited by Phoenixandnika -- 9/18/2006 12:48:17 PM >


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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 1:35:19 PM   
LotusSong


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Ever read the book "The Emancipated Cross Dresser"?  That was written by the husband of a Domme friend of mine.  He came out to my group. a number of years ago. (Het. Domme/male sub group I started)   He's usually the key-note speaker at the functions across the country... (Lacey Leigh) http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_b/002-0260290-8392803?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=the+emancipated+crossdresser&Go.x=14&Go.y=8
 
 After awhile he realized that he really wasn't in to D/s BDSM.  He just wanted a place to dress.  I encouraged him to start his own group.  He actually rented a house in which cross dressers could meet and dress and discuss things. That fell flat.  The CD's just didn't have the initiative to go and help each other.  It was so much easier to latch on to another group... and then cry bigotry.  He went on to become the head of Tri-S and even HE got fed up with them.  I connected him with a hairdresser and nail Tec for his first manicure.  He has since found his comfort zone and enjoying his cross dressing. 

There is a book by Samantha Adams "Through the Jungle http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0595310028/qid=1109962165/sr=1-3/ref=sr_1_3/104-1457744-7974339?v=glance&s=books".
 
This is about a transgendered lady AND her transgendered husband..  The "Tom" in her book- her mentor- is my brother.

So don't give me the "you don't understand" bit.. OK?  I DO understand.. and it's just not my thing! I've tried to help.. I've included them.. been there.. done that..OK??  Got my little Girl Scout badge and everything. I even helped an elderly cross dresser across the street.

I personally do NOT see cross dressing as a fetish nor part of the lifestyle UNLESS the Cross dresser enjoys the rest of it.  There are masochistic cross dressers out there. There are Dom cross dressers out there.. THAT's what I mean. To bitch that "I went to the dungeon and no one wanted to look at me" just makes me shake my head and throw my hands in the air.  What's next?  I went to a KKK meeting and they didn't want to sing the Negro spirituals I brought with me?  WELL!  (Head-toss, hair-flip.. stomping out of the room, DOOR SLAM!)
 
I say what I say about things like I do because I HAVE encountered situations and experiences.  And some things just don’t appeal to me.  And I just bless them and let them go on their merry way.
 
If one’s happiness is based on another person’s acceptance .. then they will never be happy.  It’s got to come from within.



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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/18/2006 1:37:13 PM   
tasha_tart


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Lady Ellen
 
Excellent post.
 
Tasha
 
ps  I'd be interested in the link to the voice resources.  Perhaps as another poster suggested, it could be put out for general comsumption.

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/19/2006 12:31:12 AM   
firefey


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lotussong, i have to agree with everything you said.  except for that part about cross-dressing no being a fetish.  it is.  by deffinition.  there's no getting around it.  and i honestly think it's the fetish that differenciates the submissive who also like cross-dressing from the cross-dresser who sees submission as a way to have a place and an audience.

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RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/19/2006 2:44:04 AM   
LadyEllen


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I'm going to post this because there seems to be the same confusion here as one finds in general life, about the whole phenomenon of crossdressing/ transvestism / transgender / transsexual. Apologies if I'm preaching to the perverted, and apologies if I'm simplifying things and not including everything, but I think its important.

First, its vital to understand terms. Sex is a biological term, usually understood to be male or female. Sex is determined by the arrangement of chromosomes in the foetus; XX (female), XY (male) and XXY and other such combinations for intersex people who share some characteristics of both female and male. The arrangement of chromosomes in the foetus either makes or does not make that foetus susceptible to changes brought about by hormones in utero. The default for all foeti is female, and it is only because a male XY foetus is susceptible to the action of testosterone that the foetus develops male genitalia; if testosterone is not present then even an XY foetus will be born with female organs. If the action of testosterone is inhibited, as in the case of XXY intersex foeti then the result can be ambivalent sexual development. The latest research into transsexuality (gender identity disorder) is indicating something of the latter case in at least the brain development of what are otherwise normal male sexed or female sexed foeti; a hormonal imbalance causing the brain of the foetus to be at variance with the chromosomally determined body sex - and explaining the hows and whys of a TS person feeling they are of one sex, whilst their body is of the other.

Gender - this is not the same as sex. Gender is a socially determined function. In the majority of cases, sex and gender are the same; one is female and one feels female. From gender, gender identity and gender roles are discussed, rather than sexual identity and sexual role, which are clearly more biological than social in nature.

Many people believe that cross gender behaviours are one long spectrum, ranging from the guy who masturbates wearing frilly knickers at one end, through to transsexuals living 24/7 in an adopted sex at the other. This is not the case, though it is understandable in that many transsexuals in their confusion and desperation will seek out crossdressers of all kinds with whom they can explore themselves in comparative safety, and will later emerge from that group in order to transition properly. The impression therefore to outsiders is that a transsexual is simply a transvestite who wants a lifetime buzz from crossdressing. However, the nature and motivations of part time crossdressers and transsexuals are very different.

The nature of transvestites (used as an umbrella term for part time crossdressers of all types) is very different to those of transsexuals (again used as a broad term for full time crossdressers of all types). A transvestite suffers no confusion between mind and body, and crossdresses for a variety of motives ranging from simple fetishistic pleasure, exhibitionism, stress release, inhibition release and likely many others besides. Throughout the whole episode, they remain men (and it is mostly associated with men since female crossdressers are largely invisible in our society), and enjoy a male reaction to their crossdressing. Because these episodes are often short and very occasional, they will also tend to go to excessive lengths to indulge the most feminine appearance possible, by way of clothing, make up and accessories; in the main, it is about how the crossdressing affects them, and in typically male manner, more equals a better experience. The vast majority will never venture from their own house or some other safe refuge, and the vast majority will reject any form of treatment which might affect their male sexuality or body appearance. It is one of the tests used by one specialist, to sort transvestites from transsexuals, that he gives a prescription for female hormones and testosterone suppressants; from his experience, he knows that transvestites will soon give up on these treatments when their erection fails them and they develop breast tissue, because to a classic transvestite these two occurrences are nightmarish. That some transvestities use such treatments and then use viagra to regain their potency has confused this test, though blood analyses will show whether this is the case. All in all, a transvestite is a normal man who engages in crossdressing for psycho-sexual reasons.

Transsexuals on the other hand, long thought by the medical community to be psychologically ill people, seem by the latest research to be suffering from a medical condition arising from hormonal imbalance in utero. Their bodies are sexually normal and functional, but their brains appear to be constructed as per the opposite sex to their body; since the mind arises and functions within the structure of the brain, they tend as people to be alike with the sex of their brain rather than that of their body. They generally struggle through life, some becoming aware of the disjoint early, some much later. Most try to conform to the gender which society says they are by virtue of their body sex, and many will go to excessive lengths to try to prove to themselves and others that they are "normal"; many will have married and had children, chosen careers specifically and engaged in outside activities to prove themselves. There is an urban legend which says that the highest number of transsexuals per capita who were members of the British Army, are ex SAS members. Sooner or later however, the disjoint which caused them trouble throughout life will eventually emerge - often via a total breakdown as the psychological stress of trying to live as someone else overcomes their resolve to do so. Suicide is the leading cause of death amongst transsexuals - not only because of this stress, but also because in seeking treatment they usually lose jobs, homes, partners, contact with children, families, friends and everything else, as well as receiving daily harassment, abuse, violence and even death threats from strangers and even those formerly considered to be friends and family. It should be clear enough simply from that last statement, that the motive and nature of full time transition to the other sex is not one taken lightly, and not an easy thing to do - it is done because it is the only thing that can be done and the one thing that must be done. It is not in the nature of the matter for it to be something that one wakes up one morning and decides to do. It is a totally life shattering event based on genuine need - not psycho-sexual desire. Following satisfactory evaluation the transsexual will embark on treatment to alter their body to fit their mind - a painful, expensive and difficult process which requires a great deal of conviction in overcoming the many obstacles put in the way by the medical community as a means of sorting the boys from the girls (in the case of MtF) - the idea being that only those for whom this is a need will continue. Hormonal treatments will alter the body permanently before surgery is even contemplated; whilst the transvestite will abhor such changes, the transsexual will welcome them or be dispassionate about them. Under such treatments, the transsexual loses her penis long before a scalpel is used. Of course, for the transition it also becomes necessary for the transsexual to adopt the clothing of the adopted sex. Here is where the difference between transvestite and transsexual crossdressing is most plainly seen; whilst the transvestite seeks an episodic "thrill" and will go to excessive lengths to maximise the way the clothes make them feel, the transsexual will dress normally for a woman of her age and adapt this to her environment. For the transsexual, it is not about the clothes or how they make her feel, it is about blending in as best she can in the new identity. A transvesite will be disappointed if he is not noticed, whilst a transsexual will be disappointed if she is noticed!

As short hand;
Transvestic crossdressing is an act of doing
Transsexual crossdressing is an act of being

As to the place of each over generalised group in bdsm, then I do not really see how they can be excluded. It is simply not possible to nail down exactly who can belong and what activities belong, unless we are to reduce the whole thing to one aspect of it which excludes all else and which thereby excludes the vast majority of people.

Transvestites belong, inasmuch as they get and give something in bdsm; who is to say that the change of identity wrought by crossdressing is any different to the change in identity wrought by wearing leather/PVC/rubber etc and which many in bdsm undertake in order to play a role? Not everyone has to like it, and no one is expected to like it, but looking at it disapassionately from the outside its the very same thing. I dont like some people's means of changing identity, so do they ergo not belong too?

Transsexuals belong, inasmuch as they remain sexual beings and remain people; who is to say that any form of condition precludes someone from involvement? Should amputees be excluded because some people find their appearance distasteful? Not everyone has to like it and no one is expecting everyone to like it, but looking at it dispassionately from the outside, it seems odd that one type of "weirdo" might be excluded whilst almost any other variety of "weirdo" is welcome. I dont like certain other types of people, does this mean they shouldnt belong?

E

(in reply to firefey)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/19/2006 3:03:39 AM   
iwearpanties


Posts: 509
Joined: 7/21/2005
Status: offline
hello all ive read the entire thread all the way thur.   so many points were made here and too see both sides of the coin . im  along time panty wearing male and has worn other Feamle  clothes but i dont have the want to be a female nor seek too have a sex change  .. i also started wearing on my ownat very young age i was 7 or 8  no one pushed  me  or forecd too wear panties  my crossdressing grew form there . but i think the wasnt said here is if you see Dom / mme  site many show a cd / panty boy getting whiped n spanked and other things  also at Adult book stores you find simular type Magazines there ..so just maybe putting two and two together  most cds or panty boys have this picture in there minds when they think of Mistresss or Dom/mmes . with out even fully knowing or meeting that potetual other person they seek too play and enjoy spical times with ..i realize you will flame me and things but there are some great posting here on both sides  .....

(in reply to firefey)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/19/2006 3:05:50 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline
For those who want information on voice training; if you Google "developing a female voice" (with the quote marks), you will find loads of links to sites with information; far too many to list here!

The basics though, if you are too lazy to go look!;

Pitch; pitch needs to be raised only slightly. Most of the male voice sound comes from resonation in the chest.
Resonance; this can be a tricky one and requires practice. If you speak with your male voice and put your hand on your chest you will notice that much of the sound comes from there. What you must learn to do is to raise the point of resonance from the chest into the head (it actually doesnt go that far, but thats where to aim for). This will remove much of the bass from the voice. The next step is to learn how to maintain volume without chest resonance, but again this is practice, trial and error. Singing is useful for changing the resonance - pick a fairly slow song (songs from musicals work well) sung by a woman; dont do it falsetto as this will make for a bad habit. Sing the song, and raise the point of resonance as you do so - eventually you should be able to sing like a woman, and learn how to project your female voice in speech too.
Vocabulary; some words are often used by women, and rarely by men - and vice versa. For instance wonderful, lovely and so on are more female words, whereas great is more a male word. Women tend to use words creatively, and will use more words and be more expressive than men.
Monotone; men tend to speak in a single tone throughout, the only variation being when they raise a question. Women tend to "sing" when they speak, using the tone of their voice to flavour what they are saying, moving up and down through a few notes as they speak. This is definitely, like the item below, a gender difference in that it is is perceived that a man's words are more weighty because he speaks them in a more serious, definite way as statements of fact by comparison to a woman.
End of the sentence; crucial! If you listen to men and women speaking you will notice something about the end of each statement they make. Men tend to go down in pitch at the end of the sentence, usually on the last word - again, this tends in our culture to denote something serious which must be taken as fact. Women tend to go up in pitch for their last word in each statement, which tends to denote in our culture something which is not so serious - more of a hypothetical or a question than a statement.

The interesting thing is, that it is often these simple and unnoticed elements of male/female speech which determine what we hear, (regardless of what is said), and which so often leads to misunderstandings between the sexes! Its also interesting that these same differences arise in text on this website so often - men making declarative statements which are then objected to, women saying the same thing but in a way which indicates less than a declarative statement!

Hope this helps

E

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Do Mistresses like Cross-Dressers ? - 9/19/2006 3:31:06 AM   
MaamJay


Posts: 2101
Joined: 9/2/2005
Status: offline
Lady Ellen may I congratulate You on two excellent posts! While I already knew the info re TVs and TSs from My studies of Human Biology (and My dealings over the years with both groups of people), You stated the facts so wonderfully concisely and clearly.  As You also did with the essential differences between male and female voices ... and I know, as I am also a choir Mistress *wicked grin* that the singing thing definitely works! Interestingly, while ex-hubby of whom I wrote (and ty Pandora for Your response), has no interest in crossing over to be a woman, and hasn't yet gone to the wig etc stage so he can appear in general public cross-dressed, he insists on sitting in the soprano section of My choir and singing without the bass resonance! He gets very pissed off when I occasionally move him over to the altos when I specifically want an all-female ethereal soprano sound for a particular song ... but then, he gets pissed off whenever he gets any kind of directive, from Me or anyone else for that matter! Such is the nature of the beast! I'm encouraging him to look for a woman who just loves a cross-dresser and who might be able to tolerate his "look at Me"-ism ... no luck yet!

It IS pleasing that after all the hostilities, some really valuable information has come out in this thread!

Mistress Jay aka violet[A]

_____________________________

Life is a song ... and I love singing it! (By me!)

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 80
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