RE: "Under My protection"

Join Our Community

Collarchat.com

Home Login Search

RE: "Under My protection"

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> RE: "Under My protection"

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 5 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/24/2006 9:42:17 PM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

I think that this is a great thing for other people to do. It makes it so much easier for me to weed out the idiots and drama queens.

They are sorta like tattoos, the more you see the less there is.

(in reply to emdoub)

Profile

Post #: 21

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/24/2006 9:48:06 PM

DiurnalVampire

Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

ADVICE:..........DO NOT go 'under consideration' or 'under the protection' of anyone. They are designed to stash you for booty calls and do not result in a relationship. Those terms are a scam as one sub told me years ago from the net. This is a net gimmick to get you out of circulation and reserve you for a fuck. NO MATTER what any of them say, run away from them.

While I might agree that under protection is a bunch of cybercrap, beng put under consideration doersnt necessariy have to be bull. My boy was under consideration for quite a while in his profile, while we were figuring out whatour relationship was going to be. The difference being, someone who is under consideration is taking themselves off the market. Someone under protection is not.

I never trust someone who is suposedly under the protection of a Dom/Domme. While they might hav a mentor or a confidant, if they feel they need protection then I worry about their abilities to stand up to my standards. If they cant make their own decisions without outside input, then I doubt they are going tobe able to deliver what I want. Besides, I dont want someone running back to a second dominant person to get opinions on my commands. But thats just me.

DV

_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Profile

Post #: 22

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/24/2006 9:59:42 PM

emdoub

Posts: 223
Joined: 10/22/2006
From: Minnenipples, Minnesnowta
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DiurnalVampire
I dont want someone running back to a second dominant person to get opinions on my commands. But thats just me.

I hate to disagree, but I must - no, it's not just you.

Midnight Writer

_____________________________

Benevolent Dictator of TIES - Tremendously Intense Erotic Situations. If you're local to Mpls-St.Paul, MN, you may want to check us out. The web site is at http://www.ties-bdsm.org and the Munches are monthly.

(in reply to DiurnalVampire)

Profile

Post #: 23

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 12:24:50 AM

Zensee

Posts: 1564
Joined: 9/4/2004
Status: offline

In general - consideration, cybering, mentoring, double-domming and protection - NOT the same thing. Lumping them together just causes confusion.

**************

Just because something doesn’t work for you doesn’t mean it doesn’t work.

Some submissives really do need protection, even if it is just as an asshole filter. Is such an arrangement open to abuse and misunderstanding? Certainly. But so is every other arrangement we discuss on these boards, up to and including marriage.

emdoub, your second argument is problematic - “...if the sub is not his property, he simply doesn't have any authority to say "you may not" or "you must" negotiate with a third party - myself. If she gives him that authority, why not just let her submit to him and be done with it?”

Using the term “property” is a straw-man argument, which amplifies your indignation without cause. Obviously there IS an authority granted and accepted here or the situation would not exist to confound you. That authority is clearly not for personal / intimate control or the submissive would not be available for even casual consideration by a new Dom. Right?

Some are clearly offended by protection arrangements. That's a common but not a universal opinion - and it is only an opinion, not some sort of fact. In this case, you could protest to the submissive, ignoring their expressed limit and probably disqualifying yourself. You could complain to the protector, demonstrating you neither respect nor understand the situation and probably disqualify yourself. Or you can say to yourself – I don’t like this – and move on.

Z. 0

_____________________________

"Before enlightenment, chop wood and carry water. After enlightenment, chop wood and carry water." (proverb)

(in reply to emdoub)

Profile

Post #: 24

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 1:22:35 AM

CrazyC

Posts: 949
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline

I have had a Dom tell me to put myself "under consideration" which actually insulted me. Luckly, he quickly corrected himself and reallized that i was not game for it. He actually realized that in my eyes he was teh one "under concideration" not me to him. Though this isn't completely true either, i left him thinking that way.

As for a Dom for protection....i can promice it is CRAP. i became over whelmed by the emails. Many where nice and encouraging and other just a hi, but there started to become way too many that became demanding and demeaning. i asked a Dom friend to go through the email with me since it was actually cause me to want to not persue this anymore if people thought it alright to act this way. As he went through them, i watched him find any reason possable to delete them from my email. "oh he is over bearing" or "he just looks like he isn't it for good reasons." The reasons piled. Then after going through too many emails, he offered to be my protector that if it ever becomes too much to tell the other Dom that i was already protected. i am a pretty simple person and can't lie to save my life, so the offer was denied since that would be lying. i later realized that it was all based on jealousy. i under no condition believe this type of thing could ever benefit for the sub, since motivation on the other party is huge....

ok i feel like i am babbling, must be lack of sleep. lol night.

(in reply to emdoub)

Profile

Post #: 25

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 3:07:43 AM

ChaOz

Posts: 98
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline

if it is a trusted friend with no possibility of more then its ok. I have noticed a few subs who could use it, who ended up trusting the wrong person or rushing in and getting into situations that were harmful to them and they regretted.

(in reply to CrazyC)

Profile

Post #: 26

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 6:29:02 AM

ExtremeOwnerIL

Posts: 197
Joined: 10/19/2006
Status: offline

A "fast reply" - I have seen the "protection" concept used well in real life/face to face leather as a "mentoring" relationship. A Top or bottom has a mentor who, as someone pointed out earlier, raises red flags and assists someone in learning the "ropes". Usually, in the case of a bottom, the mentor will serve as a screen/filter to help the bottom learn good protocol and what types of red flags are appropriate for a leather lifestyle. Once the bottom feels like he/she is ready, they step out "on their own" - the best part is having a mentor that you can come back to should you need some assistance.

I can't comment on cyber relationships, as I do not understand them. I would suppose that the concept of a "pen pal" mentor might be useful, but in terms of limiting interactions with others, I can't comment. It sounds silly.

Regards,
EO

(in reply to emdoub)

Profile

Post #: 27

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 7:13:48 AM

naughtygeisha

Posts: 32
Joined: 10/20/2006
Status: offline

When my first Master and i seperated because of job related move He asked me to take His friend and mentor on as my Guardian. He is a wonderful Man and a great friend to me. Although i am no longer under His Guardianship i still count on Him for advise from time to time.The only time i ever mentioned that i had a Guardian was when One was interested in meeting with me i advised Him of this,i sent the email to my Guardian advising Him of where and when the meeting was so that someOne would know where i was. It was just a precautionary thing but the Dom had enough respect for my wishes to oblige, i have never used the Guardian/Protector thing again i do advise any seekers for my time that i speak with Others in regards to what and who i am talking to. It is a safety issue more than anything.

_____________________________

Submission is the greatest gift there is , Why throw it away, cherish it and be cherished

(in reply to ExtremeOwnerIL)

Profile

Post #: 28

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 7:26:56 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

quote:

I think that this is a great thing for other people to do. It makes it so much easier for me to weed out the idiots and drama queens.

Yep, I can see how this would be a helpful weeding out tool.
Again, if someone can't deal with their own life, without "protection", why would anyone want to consider them for a relationship?

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to CrappyDom)

Profile

Post #: 29

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 8:31:26 AM

happypervert

Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline

quote:

ok i feel like i am babbling, must be lack of sleep.

That babbling made a lot of sense; keep it up! It sounded like you have first hand experience with what I suspected would happen -- that the protector will invent all sorts of reasons to weed out other doms who aren't just like him. It makes me think that anyone who believes he has the wisdom necessary to be a good protector has already proven that he doesn't.

_____________________________

"Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live." . . . Mark Twain

(in reply to CrazyC)

Profile

Post #: 30

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 8:40:33 AM

Aileen68

Posts: 6091
Joined: 8/2/2005
Status: offline

Who's going to protect me from my protector?
Seriously though...don't you need to make judgements on who you choose as a protector. If you're capable enough to do that then you're more than capable of weeding out potential partners. Use your own brain and instincts.

(in reply to emdoub)

Profile

Post #: 31

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 8:54:00 AM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: freyjasdottir

One of my best friends IRL is also on this site and I made a promise to him not to get involved with anyone without running it past him first. I have a history of making poor choices so while I am working to improve it and I'm also trying to get his opinion on what choices I do make as I know he has my best interests at heart. I understand some people go overboard with it but I don't see how in the long run its much different than having a friend do a once over for a new vanilla relationship. And yes, the gentleman I have been talking to knows of my promise to my friend and they have talked also.

I think that is just being wise and mature. Knowing yourself enough to try to protect yourself from a pattern of trouble. I think it is quite different then what cyber protection is, which to me is something much different.

I am certainly in the corner of if I was a dominant I would not go near a person like that. It is one thing to ask advice and bounce things off another person, it is another thing to basically give up your own choice and freedoms to another person's thoughts, opinions and motives.

Personally for me if a submissive needs that much protecting and cannot handle messages then the person should not be on a site like this and is probably not in any condition to be in a healthy relationship of any type.

Now I have seen real life protection type things and even had previous owners do something in that nature so in real life protection has some validity, but even in real life protection does not equal give up decisions and control.

(in reply to freyjasdottir)

Profile

Post #: 32

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 10:33:38 AM

leatherorlace

Posts: 215
Joined: 2/21/2005
Status: offline

I beg to differ, julie. I've personally met some of the women that were twisted by My old nemesis, jj. I met many more on-line, in groups where they were seeking healing and advise. Most stories were very similiar, he was a twisted control freak and his passing held no sorrow for Me.
Cyber-trash, cyber-poseurs, and the like can affect some girls, especially if they're entering a subbie-frenzy (Imperative stage in their reactions to the possibilities available to them now that they're free (or not) to accept their need.
It's an old subject and rehashing it will probably aid someone that's not seen the old debates so, I didn't mind finding it in My mailbox.
Gentry
Pope of Perversion
Doctor of Delicious Deviance

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I do not understand protection collars over the internet. You cannot harm a submissive over the internet via email, you cannot force her to do anything with you.

I would understand this at a play party of a dungeon in real life with a submissive that is owned by another dominant wanting a friend to watch out for her, or someone who wanted to go out to a club but did not feel comfortable without a protection collar. In these circumstances the submissive is face-to-face with a dominant, and the more aggressive sorts may back off if they believe a submissive is being escorted.

But over the internet it is just odd in my mind, but to each their own... I would not deal with it, and pass these sort of submissives by if I were a dominant... but that is just my opinion

As far as the daughter thing, if I had a minor daughter I would be very much impressed by a young man if he asked for permission to court/date her and not find it creepy at all... but I tend to think in an old fashioned way.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Profile

Post #: 33

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 10:49:26 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leatherorlace
I beg to differ, julie. I've personally met some of the women that were twisted by My old nemesis, jj. I met many more on-line, in groups where they were seeking healing and advise. Most stories were very similiar, he was a twisted control freak and his passing held no sorrow for Me.
Cyber-trash, cyber-poseurs, and the like can affect some girls, especially if they're entering a subbie-frenzy (Imperative stage in their reactions to the possibilities available to them now that they're free (or not) to accept their need.
It's an old subject and rehashing it will probably aid someone that's not seen the old debates so, I didn't mind finding it in My mailbox.
Gentry
Pope of Perversion
Doctor of Delicious Deviance

There's absolutely no doubt that most novices go completely insane when they first start out and allow themselves to lose all good sense and judgement.

I simply disagree that the way to handle this is to tell them it's ok and give them a "protector" as a way to deal.

I think the way to handle this is to tell them they are acting ridiculous and need to start acting like a responsible adult and take care of themselves.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to leatherorlace)

Profile

Post #: 34

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 11:25:10 AM

CrazyC

Posts: 949
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

There's absolutely no doubt that most novices go completely insane when they first start out and allow themselves to lose all good sense and judgement.

I simply disagree that the way to handle this is to tell them it's ok and give them a "protector" as a way to deal.

I think the way to handle this is to tell them they are acting ridiculous and need to start acting like a responsible adult and take care of themselves.

i completely agree LA. As a complete beginner, i had no idea of what i was stepping into. i wasn't prepared for any of it, and did get very overwhelmed.But at the same time, i wasn't ready to have someone else dictate who i was compatable with or not. no one knows that except me.

my advice to subs who think they need a protecter would be to do some self eval. as to why they feel they need one, especially over an internet. Are these reasons sound, or is there a diffrent way of dealing with it? If you always have someone taking care of you, how are you to learn valuable lessons that only come from taking responcibility for one's life? I know hurt/ broken hearts are awful, but i have learned that it only make one more beautiful from the lessons they learn.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Profile

Post #: 35

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 11:27:10 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

me--- drop by the house, sweetie.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Aileen68)

Profile

Post #: 36

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 11:59:07 AM

Elegant

Posts: 1024
Joined: 3/15/2005
Status: offline

SOMEONE TO WATCH OVER ME?

(note: In this commentary the terms slave/submissive/bottom are used interchangeably in most cases as are the terms Dominant/Top/Master and him/her. The comments here are opinions and not law)

So many people have misconstrued concepts of Protection Collars and Protectors. Definitions are varied and numerous.

~”This particular collar is worn by new submissive at various events to show that she is under the protection of a Dominant. All approaches to the submissive wearing this collar should be made through the Dominant whose protection she is under. This is a temporary collar that it is normally returned after the event has adjourned.” http://www.leathernroses.com/generalbdsm/thecollarlc.htm

~”[A protection collar] is given when an individual feels that he or she is in need of protection. Normally the slave/sub will choose a respected Dominant that they are familiar with and ask him or her to provide this service for them. The Dominant chosen will be the contact person for anyone interested in the slave/sub and is normally present at any meetings, or activities the slave/sub will be participating in, they may also be involved in any negotiations and or formal arrangements between the slave/sub and a Dominant.” http://luna.kinkygroups.com/leaders/Norische/collars.php

~ “Protection collars- these are what they sound like. A dominant has placed you under their protection. You are not committed to the dominant but you may play from time to time and they are often teaching you and guiding you. The dominant takes an active interest in finding and approving other dominants for you. You often see these more on female subs then men and in public lifestyle forums or clubs. Some Doms use this as a way of creating a small harem of novices and are really not protecting anything but their ability to get laid often.” http://www.maitresseregine.com/ask.html

Why would someone need a ‘protector’? Is a slave/submissive/bottom not able to make common sense decisions herself? Are slaves all foolish, weak and incapable of saying ‘no’? This is a stereotype and a bad one at that. Most slaves I know are capable human beings who can function on their own quite well. Slaves may prefer to be in the service of others but this does not mean they need a ‘protector’ if not in a relationship or if on their own for a specific occasion.

It often seems that Dominants/Tops (and even some slaves) think that a slave are lacking in the ability to make decisions and be responsible and accountable for their own actions. This is far from the truth in most cases. Unfortunately some Dominants use the concept of ‘Protection’ as a way of creating a family of slaves and submissives or as an outlet for their desire to control. This is often like asking the wolf to protect the sheep. Some Dominants even use the ‘protector’ label as an underhanded step towards ownership.

Also unfortunate is that some submissives also use ‘protection’ as a crutch. If someone is not capable of handling their own negotiations and conduct then perhaps they should not be in this life. If a submissive cannot trust herself to make decisions concerning who to play with then how will she be able to trust their own decision when it is time to decide on complete submission/slavery to one?

Sometimes ‘protection’ is mistaken for mentoring. Talking about the lifestyle, sharing experiences, encouraging patience, providing feedback and guidance and offering suggestions is mentoring. Taking this to a level of decision making for someone else under the guise of ‘protection’ and this is now a power-exchange and there is probably a hidden agenda.

If a submissive feel the need for protection while at a play party then this should be more along the duties of a private, unobtrusive bodyguard. The guard/protector is not there to tell the submissive how to act or what to do or where to go. The guard/protector does not need to approve of anyone the submissive is speaking with or wanting to play with. The guard/protector is not there to negotiate with potential play partners for the submissive. The guard/protector is there in case something happens and the submissive needs help. This type of protection can be a casual relationship with a trusted friend or knowledgeable community associate (dominant or submissive) and does not have to be the same person for every event and every occasion. The guard/protector does not need to be identified to others if this is what the submissive desires and the submissive does not need to wear a label announcing to the world that they have help if needed. These guard/protectors can often be called friends.

Regards In Leather,
Elegant
~Slave to Master Archer

Copyright July 2005

< Message edited by Elegant -- 10/25/2006 12:10:30 PM >

_____________________________

Elegant
~Slave To Master Archer

http://www.FantasiesInLeather.com

(in reply to mnottertail)

Profile

Post #: 37

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 12:00:47 PM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

select all.
control c is copy
control v is paste

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Elegant)

Profile

Post #: 38

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 12:24:45 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

Hello A/all,

I have been a person that several submissives have asked to function as an asshole filter for them.

Sure, I can be a protector. I feel, for myself, that if I feel that I cannot trust the one in my life to deal with other people, then perhaps we are not meant for each other. So it is not something I demand of those I am with.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to mnottertail)

Profile

Post #: 39

RE: "Under My protection" - 10/25/2006 12:26:26 PM

MsKatHouston

Posts: 1909
Joined: 6/7/2006
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline

quote:

I have been a person that several submissives have asked to function as an asshole filter for them.

How about dominants? Can you do that for me? It would save me a lot of time... ;)

_____________________________

-Kat

~If you can't be a good example, you'll just have to serve as a horrible warning~

(in reply to Sinergy)

Profile

Post #: 40