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RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 11:41:30 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer
Just wondering what is the idea behind the feeling of offense you would feel if I were to address you as "Good evening slave" (as a title form)with a repectfull nod passing in the dungeon? To me acknowledging the possition with respect, reguardless of what the possition might be is a acknowledgement of truth and in no way means "I'm better than you" or "I out rank you", it simply means I recognize you as a slave, girl, boy, chosen pronoun, and honor your choice.

and I am being honestly curious as to the why you would find it offensive?

I'm not Magiks, but if her experience in the scene is in any way like mine, she has probably been exposed to plenty of drooling creepazoids too. A few encounters like that are generally sufficient to make a woman wince to be addressed by any kind of D/s title from a stranger, because it's quite often associated with seriously creepy, icky looks or behavior.

A polite acknowledgement of D/s role from someone like yourself would not necessarily be automatically offensive, but you'd have to get the role right. It is not good form to call a Daddy's boi a slave girl, or a slave a submissive, or vice versa. And since you need to find out what they identify as anyhow, how much more trouble is it to find out what they consider a polite form of address?

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 11:44:45 AM

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Archer,

I'm going to guess that some people would object to such an address because they see the title as more of a name. Thus the reason some folks have said "I am my master's slave, but I am not a slave to you. Call me <insert name here>." It's a personal thing.

zuma

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 11:45:11 AM

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oh certainly if it is someone I know very slightly I would default to their name in most cases, boy/ girl/ slave are a framiliar form of address, someone I have known for a while and was on freindly terms with. (would have to be since to know which identity they choose would be required) I used slave as an example only.

Shortening of the idea for fit seems to have left my idea expressed with too little detail, My bad.

(in reply to AquaticSub)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 11:47:07 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
Can I have her when you are done with her?

I WILL SELL YOU KAJIRA 4 50 GOLD PEECES. AND LET U TICKLE HER. AFTER I HAVE COLLARD HER. BUT U MUST SUBMITE 2 ME AND LET ME WATCH U 2 HOT SLAVE GIRLS GETTING IT ON. UR MASTER IS VERY XCITED NOW AND AM PLAYING WITH "LITTLE MASTER". I MEEN MY GREATER ROD OF LORDLY MIGHT. UR MASTER CANNOT TYPE ANY MORE NOW. NEED BOTH HANDS.

(in reply to AquaticSub)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 11:56:43 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zumala

Archer,

I'm going to guess that some people would object to such an address because they see the title as more of a name. Thus the reason some folks have said "I am my master's slave, but I am not a slave to you. Call me <insert name here>." It's a personal thing.

zuma

But that is part of what I am discussing here, I recognize them as "A" slave, boi /boy, girl, insert chosen pronoun here,...the fact of the matter is they are what they are.
The problem comes in not with a person recognizing and honoring their identity but in the idea that far to many Dominants forget that they have protocol requirements on their behaviour as well.

If they say "Good morning Sir" I would reply with Good morning (insert appropriate ponoun).

That recognition of each person's identity has no effect at all on the power arrangement between them.

(in reply to zumala)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:03:17 PM

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Of course now to confuse the issue even further, LOL
There are slaves out there who I call Ma'am and Sir as a matter of respect for their seniority.

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:05:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

MajiksSlave,

Just wondering what is the idea behind the feeling of offense you would feel if I were to address you as "Good evening slave" (as a title form)with a repectfull nod passing in the dungeon? To me acknowledging the possition with respect, reguardless of what the possition might be is a acknowledgement of truth and in no way means "I'm better than you" or "I out rank you", it simply means I recognize you as a slave, girl, boy, chosen pronoun, and honor your choice.

and I am being honestly curious as to the why you would find it offensive?

Bear with me Im guna quote Dale carnagie here
"a persons name is very importent to a then as it is the only thing in this entire world they own only souley as their own"

My name is part of my identety and I find it no more respectfull to be called the generic name of slave then I would if someone on the street called girl or "Hey you" It was how I was braught up. At the dinner table my mom used to yell at us if we called her she while talking abuot her while she was sitting right there she would say "Excuse me SHE has a name" I guess because it is dehumaniseing and it isnt for someone that isnt my Master or a friend to dehumanise me in that manner. Im overly sensative I know it, though if Sir you called me slave as you said respectfully I wouldnt say anyhitng about it though I may introduse myself and ask you kindly to use my name. I do hope that makes sence

Magik's slave

< Message edited by MagiksSlave -- 11/20/2006 12:06:34 PM >

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:10:31 PM

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Makes perfect sense and is an easily defendable opinion with thought and effort put into it.

I can assure you that we are not nearly as far apart on the ideas as it seems, and I have asked for clarification mostly as a matter of exploring the ideas.

I would only hope that since the rule is that "you do not use pronouns when they are present" that you would never use "Good evening Sir" and would afford me the same as expected protocol and use my name. Which would be the clue that I would be looking for.

< Message edited by Archer -- 11/20/2006 12:13:59 PM >

(in reply to MagiksSlave)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:13:10 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

Makes perfect sense and is an easily defendable opinion with thought and effort put into it.

I can assure you that we are not nearly as far apart on the ideas as it seems, and I have asked for clarification mostly as a matter of exploring the ideas.

((curtsies and offers a smile showing off her dimples))

Thank you Sir... I hope I explained it well.

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:14:44 PM

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Magiks brought up a very good point. In part it is also the generic interaction I object to when some random yahoo calls me Mistress. I am NOT "A Mistress", I am a real human being with a name and a personality. I do not enjoy interacting with people who treat me like a cardboard cutout from a fetish magazine and who have no interest in looking farther than the tits and the whip. I would rather be treated like a real person than to feel objectified by people who seem to want to interact with a role, not a human being.

Archer, you don't strike me at all as the type of person who would be sleazy or crude, but unfortunately you're following a lot of acts that are. Most guys who would address a woman as either "slave" or "Mistress" are doing so in a way that is downright icky, for reasons that have more to do with getting their dicks hard than with any concern for manners or protocol. So it's quite likely that your courtesy in this regard would be easy to misinterpret.

(in reply to MagiksSlave)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:15:51 PM

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sorry made that look like you missed a point, for those reading along my last was edited after MajiksSlave's reply.

We now return you to the regularly scheduled programming, *grin*

(in reply to MagiksSlave)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:19:23 PM

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Actually Najakcharmer, we have met a few times so you know me a bit better than you may recall at the moment.

We met at Lion's Pride Weekends 2004 and 2005 If I recall as well as quite possibly a few other places, LOL. We both were in Master Z's Rough Body Play class.

(in reply to Najakcharmer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:25:58 PM

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Cool beans. I emailed you once about a custom leather armor piece but I think it got lost in the shuffle.

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 12:41:46 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer
That recognition of each person's identity has no effect at all on the power arrangement between them.

I would have to say that this depends very much on the individuals in question and how they personally feel and react to being called slave or Master or Mistress or boi by each specific person. So you may not be affecting the actual power arrangement, or initiating an actual D/s exchange of power, but it may be percieved that you are attempting to do so. And that perception itself can become its own reality, either in a positive way or a negative way.

I don't personally feel that my role in the bedroom or the dungeon with my consenting partners a) can be neatly pigeonholed or accurately described by any one-word title, and b) is automatically the business of strangers or casual acquaintances. I'm really not quite sure how to boil down "savage, feral alpha feline, gender-switching at random from Daddy Sir gay male top to femdom" into a single word that anyone could use to address me in passing.

But that's just me; other people's identification may be a lot less complicated.

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 1:11:38 PM

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Fast Reply:

Ok, before I say anything, just so you know my perspective, I really get off on formality and protocol. In fact when people are too laxy-daisy, it kinda makes me sad in a way.

Maybe situations like this could take a lesson from martial arts. Martial Arts Masters and students could be seen as having the dominant and submissive roles that are within D/s relationships, with all the formalities that some people get into.

There are martial arts masters who have students. Each student is loyal, respectful and submissive to their Master. The Master takes on the dominant role for the students. A Master would teach their students to be very respectful of other Masters, no matter what style of martial arts they practice (kinda like how we all practice D/s different ways). The student of a particular Master would be very polite and even formal to another Master that is not their own. The student acting this way would be a reflection on their own Master and their training. If someone who was not their Master asked for a cup of tea, the student would be honored to serve him and would do so respectfully and submissively, happy for being given the opportunity to serve. However, a Master who is not their own would never (if they had any credibility as a Master) put themselves in a position whereby they were acting as the students Master. Examples: Asking for a cup of tea is harmless, telling anothers Masters student what they should and shouldn't be doing is incorrect protocol and disrespectful.

I pretty much see it like Archer, to recognise someones role and call them by it, is a respectful act in itself. Its not downgrading anyone or anything in my mind, heck if someone called me slave I would get the biggest smile on my face, simply because I'm proud to be one, I've got nothing to defend.

_____________________________

Freedom in Bondage

Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

(in reply to Najakcharmer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 1:26:53 PM

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Dear SirGordonslil, Ladies and Gentlemen;

In my mind's eyes, so many of us (in general terms) come from different reference points as far a social and civil (vanilla) etiquette and or good manners. Being from the 1950's, it is easier for me than for those born in the late 70's and 80's. Everybody was a ma'am or sir, even the boy bagging the groceries, janitor and domestic workers. It just was. In the South (USA), it was even more used and still practiced, even to this day.

Those with military experiences have also found it through practice, easier to roll 'ma'am and sir' of their tongues.

That said, in my mind's eyes; I address others, Masters, Mistresses, SIRS, Ma'ams, slaves, submissives boy/boi, girls/gyrls, lads and lassies, pups/dawgs and all the flavors in between, with kindness and respect.
When I greet; "Hello slave!" I do so, as they are slave, a title they earned and worthy of respect, honor and status. But, I do not expect them to obey me as they would their owner. In person, it works so much easier than in text form indeed. The tone, the facial and the spirit of the words, express the tone of respect or not.

Slaves of mine will be instructed to address all dominants by their respective titles--earned or not. In my mind's eyes I see, the slave is my representative and a reflection of me. Being respectful, at times to a fault, I have yet seen complaints by any and or all, that have been afforded respect.

True, indeed in our hearts, spirit and souls, our mind's eyes know which individuals do indeed deserve and or have earned respect but, that is for 'us' to know. But, to inspire respect from others, it must be shown. Indeed, it is a form of diplomacy as well as making a more profound statement about "us" and or "me" in giving respect, deserved or not. It is a statement of respecting myself first. Having self respect, I then have an excess as to freely offer others. Perhaps in feeling respected, they can use that feeling to elevate themselves and give more freely respect to others.

In seeing 'respect' as a power, that indeed is conditional; it is a person that has a wealth of respect for self and others, can empower those who have none.

Respect though, is not to be confused with obedience. Respect compliments obedience. Obedience is selective, in this lifestyle.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to SirGordonslil)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 1:55:58 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

oh certainly if it is someone I know very slightly I would default to their name in most cases, boy/ girl/ slave are a framiliar form of address, someone I have known for a while and was on freindly terms with. (would have to be since to know which identity they choose would be required) I used slave as an example only.

Shortening of the idea for fit seems to have left my idea expressed with too little detail, My bad.

Even in friendly terms it simply doesn't make sense to me because I prefer to be addressed by a name, such as Aqua or a nickname. I don't mind, in fact I enjoy it, when my dominant calls me his little sub, but for another to refer to me as "submissive" or "slave" seems to confer a sense of ownership to me. You could always call me "Subbie A".

Is it just me or does that sound like a bad rap name?

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to Archer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 2:01:22 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

oh certainly if it is someone I know very slightly I would default to their name in most cases, boy/ girl/ slave are a framiliar form of address, someone I have known for a while and was on freindly terms with. (would have to be since to know which identity they choose would be required) I used slave as an example only.

Shortening of the idea for fit seems to have left my idea expressed with too little detail, My bad.

Even in friendly terms it simply doesn't make sense to me because I prefer to be addressed by a name, such as Aqua or a nickname. I don't mind, in fact I enjoy it, when my dominant calls me his little sub, but for another to refer to me as "submissive" or "slave" seems to confer a sense of ownership to me. You could always call me "Subbie A".

Is it just me or does that sound like a bad rap name?

Oh i love when Master calls me his little bratling but its a term of endearment not a term of conveniance!! Theres a difference

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

(in reply to AquaticSub)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 2:05:35 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Najakcharmer

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub
Can I have her when you are done with her?

I WILL SELL YOU KAJIRA 4 50 GOLD PEECES. AND LET U TICKLE HER. AFTER I HAVE COLLARD HER. BUT U MUST SUBMITE 2 ME AND LET ME WATCH U 2 HOT SLAVE GIRLS GETTING IT ON. UR MASTER IS VERY XCITED NOW AND AM PLAYING WITH "LITTLE MASTER". I MEEN MY GREATER ROD OF LORDLY MIGHT. UR MASTER CANNOT TYPE ANY MORE NOW. NEED BOTH HANDS.

I don't have to play with Little Mast- I mean your greater Rod of Lordly Might? But I get to tickle her right?

By the way... be careful not to stain your moniter. I am not scrubbing that stuff off...

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to Najakcharmer)

RE: belong to One not all - 11/20/2006 2:07:51 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

Even in friendly terms it simply doesn't make sense to me because I prefer to be addressed by a name, such as Aqua or a nickname. I don't mind, in fact I enjoy it, when my dominant calls me his little sub, but for another to refer to me as "submissive" or "slave" seems to confer a sense of ownership to me. You could always call me "Subbie A".

Is it just me or does that sound like a bad rap name?

Oh i love when Master calls me his little bratling but its a term of endearment not a term of conveniance!! Theres a difference

Magik's slave

Once I couldn't pick a beer and since he has better taste in beer then me (and knows what I like pretty well) I asked him to pick one for me. He tried to make me choose myself, as I have trouble on deciding things and he wants to correct that, but I explained I wasn't being indecisive, I just wanted to try something new and I wanted to defer to his knowledge. He grinned at me and said "All right, my little sub.". I glowed.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to MagiksSlave)

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