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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/21/2007 5:07:04 PM   
Mercnbeth


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quote:

There are events that are pivotal in history, Merc. It is impossible to stop the tide and the Gods themselves are as subject to the tides of history as ordinary men. The old testament was eventually done away with by Jesus and surpassed by the new testament. Those ancient examples of ruthlessness were at that time invalidated. We have outgrown them - or at least some of us have.

Rule,
You'll have me believing that you have been chatting with my beth - that was her answer! Were it only that more were like you and her!

Take care!

Sorry for the religious based thread hijack! 
 It's time to start the weekend!

(in reply to Rule)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/21/2007 5:12:38 PM   
Bobkgin


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From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

The old testament was eventually done away with by Jesus and surpassed by the new testament.



Which was completely replaced by Paul, who is the author of what passes for "christianity" today.

But I suggest that is another topic and not germane to the one in hand.

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to Rule)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/21/2007 5:21:30 PM   
BoiJen


Posts: 2608
Joined: 3/7/2007
Status: offline 		Ummm...the old testament still exists in just about every bible out there today...it's not done away with perse...people just forget that there's two different sides to the Christian God. The vengeful angry God and the forgiving God. What people also forget mainly because it was rewritten is that Jesus never said he was "the" son of God but a son of God. Just like everybody else.

(in reply to Bobkgin)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/21/2007 5:26:19 PM   
Bobkgin


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From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

Ummm...the old testament still exists in just about every bible out there today...it's not done away with perse...people just forget that there's two different sides to the Christian God. The vengeful angry God and the forgiving God. What people also forget mainly because it was rewritten is that Jesus never said he was "the" son of God but a son of God. Just like everybody else.


Actually, there are two different christianized versions of the OT (Catholics include a few more books than the Protestants), as well as the original books used by Judaism which includes their commentaries (Christians threw those out entirely).

Again, thank Paul for totally obfuscating the connection between Jesus and Judaism.

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to BoiJen)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/21/2007 5:29:04 PM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bobkgin
Which was completely replaced by Paul, who is the author of what passes for "christianity" today.
Quite. In fact I originally had written "by Jesus and Paul" and upon reconsideration, before posting, to keep my statement more simple, decided to remove the reference to Paul.

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/22/2007 12:48:13 PM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

Yet in God's own words - it's not only appropriate but serves as a valuable lesson.


One imagines he might be in a better position to safely rig the outcome, though...

quote:


In that light, as "abusive" as others may think your Master, he's not required of you a similar sacrifice.


Apart from the abortion.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/22/2007 12:54:50 PM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

The vengeful angry God and the forgiving God.


No. Just dealing with different stages in the education of his people.

That, and the difference between dealing with his people and those that are an obstacle to them.

quote:


What people also forget mainly because it was rewritten is that Jesus never said he was "the" son of God but a son of God. Just like everybody else.


"[...] Before Abraham, I am [...]", etc.

Biblical Hebrew does not have a past, present and future tense. It has perfective and imperfective aspects, as well as e.g. the continuous aspect. Thus, this statement parallels God's statement of identity when approaching Moses: "ehyeh asher ehyeh", colloquially "I am that I am", more like "I was, am and will be what I was, am and will be" or "My identity is that I exist" (with no reference to a beginning or ending of this state of being).

But this is really getting off-topic.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/22/2007 12:59:48 PM   
subtee


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quote:

Again, thank Paul for totally obfuscating the connection between Jesus and Judaism.


To this I say, "amen!"...I mean, I agree...

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 9:57:20 PM   
Bobkgin


Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		This will be opening up a new sub-topic for this thread: Molding.

Molding goes under many names: Growth, Learning, Stretching the Limits, Behaviour Modification, Personality Modification.

The no limit slave, having given up her rights to control herself, gives her power to her master to adjust whatever aspects he feels are required.

It might be as benign as stopping the slave from smoking, or requiring her to adjust her weight to a more healthy level.

It can be a lot more.


_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 10:03:07 PM   
RRafe


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Status: offline 		This makes more sense. I have know Gorean masters who have taken on morbidly obese subs-and brought them down with diet restrictions. They simply denied them acess to a food compulsion-rationed them to healthy levels.

I still think the term molding is too general.

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I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 10:10:58 PM   
Bobkgin


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From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RRafe

This makes more sense. I have know Gorean masters who have taken on morbidly obese subs-and brought them down with diet restrictions. They simply denied them acess to a food compulsion-rationed them to healthy levels.

I still think the term molding is too general.


Intentionally so.

"Molding" has no moral value assigned to it: it can be benign or malicious.

"Molding" is merely a tool a master can use with those who give authority for such activities. Whether it is used for good or ill depends upon the morality and ethics of the master, and what the slave will accept.

But as you can see from the list of synonyms I provided, "molding" goes under many names and some of them do have a positive moral value (despite the subjectivity involved in defining the terms more precisely).

I prefer "molding" because the moral ambiguity of the tool is more obvious.

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to RRafe)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 10:14:28 PM   
RRafe


Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline 		I guess I am just not into the whole control thing bob.

Enjoy your conversations with those who are..........I'm going to stop getting involved in things I have no use for.

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I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 11:20:34 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		What's not to like about control?

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to RRafe)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 11:22:07 PM   
RRafe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

What's not to like about control?


Too much like work.

_____________________________

I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 11:39:24 PM   
chellekitty


Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
Status: offline 		i want to get into casting bronze molds.....

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/25/2007 11:50:01 PM   
RRafe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

i want to get into casting bronze molds.....


Sand, or investment?

_____________________________

I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/26/2007 5:50:40 AM   
Bobkgin


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From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

What's not to like about control?


Indeed.

Is that not one of the essential ingredients in making a d/m: the desire to control (some aspect of) another individual?

And it starts with (some degree of) self-control.

Control is power, and it is hard to have a power exchange unless control is included.

< Message edited by Bobkgin -- 9/26/2007 5:54:23 AM >

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 677
RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/26/2007 6:11:50 AM   
AquaticSub


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Joined: 12/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bobkgin

This will be opening up a new sub-topic for this thread: Molding.

Molding goes under many names: Growth, Learning, Stretching the Limits, Behaviour Modification, Personality Modification.

The no limit slave, having given up her rights to control herself, gives her power to her master to adjust whatever aspects he feels are required.

It might be as benign as stopping the slave from smoking, or requiring her to adjust her weight to a more healthy level.

It can be a lot more.



I really don't think molding has to do with limits. It has to do with what the two people are interested in. If you gave Valyraen any no limits slave he wouldn't be interested in molding her. If she didn't already interest him, he wouldn't have anything to do with her.

He is very interested in growing and changing with his partner, but not in molding her into someone else. This doesn't make him less of a master and it doesn't make someone who is into molding less of a master. It just means that, like Goreans and non-Goreans, they aren't suited for each other.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/26/2007 6:14:14 AM   
chellekitty


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RRafe

quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

i want to get into casting bronze molds.....


Sand, or investment?


sand


_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to RRafe)
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RE: No Limits: How far would you go? - 9/26/2007 6:54:12 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline 		Last time I checked I wasn't made out of clay.

Molding limits growth, you push back here and pinch a bit off of there. Many who believe in molding say things like "mold me to be all I can be". Well if you are molding and trying to get the person to "fit", it seems to me that in itself is limiting. I prefer my growth to be unlimited. Granted, there are some who can only assume control when they take it, and some who can only be controlled when it is taken from them. In my mind that smacks more of coercion, not dominance and submission which to me, come from a place of inspiration. The growth that results from the latter is more of a blossoming than a controlled (limiting) molding and polishing.

< Message edited by mistoferin -- 9/26/2007 7:02:21 AM >

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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