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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 3:51:16 PM   
CruelDesires


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quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

 , by stunning beautiful elder sister,


I would have to say that I consider you beautiful. I am sure that others would agree.

And no... I am not flirting with you... much..

C-D

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 3:59:38 PM   
Aileen1968


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From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

So what’s your damage? … and what has it done for you?
 
There is always the assumption that we BDSMers must have something wrong with us to be this way … and I tend to agree … I still think some people are just plain kinky – I know I am! .. I also know that nature made me kinky, but my damage made me a slave.
 


I can honestly say that I had no "damage" done to me to account for how I am today or what turns me on.  I had no sexual, physical or mental abuse growing up.  I actually liked my parents and sisters (although they are control freaks...oh hell maybe they damaged me and set me on my path to submissiveness with their overwhelming type A personalities).  I don't view my preferences and fetishes as sick.  they are just a part of me and always have been.  I've had submissive fantasies as far back as I can remember.  I have no damage to embrace.  I only embrace all the things that make me content and happy. 

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 4:01:46 PM   
leadership527


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quote:

ORIGINAL=Mercnbeth
I don't agree with the premise...

I don't know about everyone else and I'm fascinated to see how this thread develops.  But I can definitely assert that I had a great family, a great childhood, and to the best of my knowledge, there is no "damage" above and beyond the various bits of teasing and whatnot that all children go through.  I Master my wife because we happened to find out about such things fooling around in Second Life (an online environment) and... well... it ended up fitting our personalities. Now it's in our living room and we smile a lot so we keep doing it.  There's nothing more mysterious than that. 

I thought I'd read somewhere (but cannot recall the reference) that various sexual surveys have found no real correlation between childhood abuse and BDSM.  Am I hallucinating that?

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I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 4:11:59 PM   
SlaveSubtoserve


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i had a particular early childhood hospital episode which can mirror much of my particular BDSM fetishes....

Re that study, that is what is often heard, but i think because many genuinely repress such early year episodes so not remembering for a survey means they just don't remember it happening...

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 4:21:16 PM   
CallaFirestormBW


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Am I damaged? I'm betting some folks would think so. The truth is, though, I am pretty much not damaged. I am just plain twisted, and I'm pretty sure that I was born that way.

I was raised in a dysfunctional family by today's standards. When I was growing up, though, it wasn't called dysfunctional -- it was called "strict". My dad worked hard, my mom kept busy and took outstanding care of us. She was a phenomenal cook (and mildly schizophrenic, a condition that she refused to treat and passed on to my brother). My twin brother died at birth. My younger brother was mentally ill because my mom's generation didn't believe in psychiatry or psychology, so her own illness was untreated. I worked my ass off from the time I was 3 years old and my mom sat me on a stool to dry dishes because "everyone who eats and is old enough to talk back is old enough to start pulling their weight!" (that's as far back as I can remember, though I remember my brother, as soon as he could walk, being told to pick up his toys and put them in the toybox). My mom was discerning, and things had to be done a certain way. I was (and am) a messy, chaotic person, and never did grasp the ideosyncracies of "if I do this mom's way, I won't have to do it over and I won't get a beating." I did it my way, did it -again- her way (bitching under my breath the whole time), and took the beating. I was born with a congenital immune disorder, but my mom and dad didn't believe in running to doctors for "every little sniffle", so I learned to push myself until it was obvious that I couldn't go any more, or until one of the teachers or the school nurse -made- my parents take me home. Once I started loving school, sometimes I'd even -hide- being sick so that I could stay for some favorite part (usually English, which was in the afternoon). I even remember being sent home from the end-of-the-year summer picnic in 4th grade... I'd had "spots" for 3 days or so, but covered them up with my mom's makeup, long sleeves, and tights (girls didn't wear pants to school back then, except for snow-pants in the winter) so I could finish the year -- but I got sweaty at the picnic and rubbed the makeup off, and the teacher sent me to the nurse, who declared that I had the measles and was burning up with a fever and packed me in ice until my mom could come get me.

When I was growing up, I thought that this was -normal-. Everyone I knew had one parent who was a flake, one who was driven, siblings who were a pain in the ass, got their asses whipped and their stuff taken away when they screwed up, and started working from about the time they could walk. I grew up in small town America, in the Great Lakes region of Upstate NY. Everyone knew everyone in our little town, and pretty much everyone who was worth hanging around with according to our mutual parents worked hard, played hard, and occasionally screwed up badly enough to merit the weeping willow switch, Dad's belt, or a shoe upside the head (thrown by mom because you weren't close enough to reach).

I was raped three times before I reached adulthood. I had a couple of boyfriends and a girlfriend who drank to much and got their rocks off by beating the crap out of me -- at least they did until I called the cops and packed my shit (which took 3 times the with the first boyfriend, four times with the girlfriend, and ONCE with the second boyfriend! I -do- learn... *LOL*) I did stupid stuff like driving while st*ned. I had a baby stillborn at 8.5 months pregnant, and a set of twins stillborn at 6 months less than a year later. I got pregnant out of wedlock and married a man that I didn't really want to be married to (though I liked him well enough) because I lived in a small town and didn't know that it was possible to be with someone, get pregnant, and -not- get married.

I grew up knowing I was strange -- but not because I lived in a dysfunctional family or got whipped or had a psychotic brother or had really crappy experiences. I was strange because, as long as I can remember, I've had stories running through my head about places and people that could never really exist, and I've been compelled to bring them to life in writing.... people on strange planets... people with weird ideas about how many people can love one another at a time...people who had powers and who used those powers out of expedience and/or compassion -- but who didn't really judge the tool by any set morality. I was weird because, even though nobody where I was from -ever- talked about alternatives to the 'status quo', I always believed that I belonged somewhere that nobody from my hometown would ever understand. I was anything but popular at school. I have fingers left over on one hand when counting my 'friends' during my school years -- but that was at least partially my fault, since I took so damned long to do the chores my parent set that everyone in the neighborhood had to go in for the evening before I finished (because I had to do everything at least twice -- sometimes three times if I was feeling stubborn -- until I would finally do it the way my mom wanted.)

I grew up equally attracted to men and women. I grew up fascinated with muscle, sinew, blood, and pain... sometimes my own, sometimes other people's... and I grew up bossy as all get-out (a talent that my ex can certainly verify that I am in full and active possession of).

Some folks might think that I should have been damaged by my life, or that I'm damaged but in denial, but you know what... when I was growing up through it, all I knew is that I got straight A's because my parents expected that -- but I knew that I was stubborn and chaotic, and I appreciate the -hell- out of my parents' persistence, because without some pretty heavy-handed discipline, I might never have developed a life-long love for learning. Sure, my mom was the occasional nutter, and when she got going, she was damn scary. I remember describing our (Sicilian and Irish) household to a friend as being "like growing up on Mt. Vesuvius. However, I also remember her being warm, and compassionate, and talking to me about things that were really freaky that I experienced -- because she had weird experiences, too, and I knew she'd understand and not laugh at me. I did freak out about some of the stuff in my life, but I faced it and moved on, and came out of it with a greater measure of compassion and very little self-pity. I stopped being a victim when I was 8 and realized that the reason I was getting beaten was because I was -choosing- to do exactly what my mom told me -not- to do... and that I wasn't going to stop doing things my way until the parental units 'got it' that my way worked as well as her way (and I liked it better), so clearly, this was more my issue than hers. (Oh... and beatings back then, at least the ones I got, hurt like hell, left marks, but were considered a normal part of growing up, not "abuse". I definitely learned from them -- if I didn't learn not to disobey my mom, I at least learned that if I was willing to accept the consequences, I could make pretty much any choice I wanted!)

I've been to doctors. It was part of my required training in pastoral care to spend a year in therapy. My doctor was a hoot. She said I was the most well-adjusted flako perverted freak she'd ever had the pleasure of knowing. Yes... I'm weird and my life has been -really- -really- hard, but damaged? -- nah, just high-mileage.

Calla Firestorm


< Message edited by CallaFirestormBW -- 8/4/2008 4:27:13 PM >


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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 5:16:37 PM   
DarkVictory


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Every human being is flawed, because that is what it is to be human.  We're all completely the same, utterly identical in our individuality.  Yet, as a subgroup, we clearly do not fit normative relationship and ethos values of the larger culture.  When softness refers to your damage, she's referring to the ethos-centric view of the majority, and what they'd see as being the source of your 'damage' or 'broken-ness'. 

Its a great question.  Mine is simple... my dad was a physically and emotionally abusive drunk who made my home life chaotic and a bit scary.  Resultantly, my home is placid and I insist on controlling myself and those in my life.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 6:20:47 PM   
petdave


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i've always been 'different' in a number of ways, and how the different aspects interact is far beyond my insight... But i will say that most of what i consider to be 'damage' comes from my BDSM/fetish needs. There's really nothing about it to embrace.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 9:13:04 PM   
Huntertn


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my dad was a drunk..my mom wasn't !  Dad screamed abuse at you till you wanted to scream..Mom just beat your ass..which stopped when I was 13 and refused to accept it anymore..Dad stopped when I put an unloaded shotgun to his head and swore to kill him ..and I ment it..Everything I have in life I had to fight for it..my school, and my college I paid for either thu the navy or lack of sleep.  I am the rock that protects what is mine. Throw crap at me and it didn't bother me..throw it on my friends or younger family and shit would hit the fan. I scared people as a kid casue I simple would not quit..and I gave up being fair at 16.  I can be standoffish,nasty sharped whitted and down right a pain in the ass..and I can teach subs what pain is all about...but Damit,be fair, I didn't get there by myself and I will deal with you now as fair as I can..I am the Rock that protects what is mine..and its enough at times,but not always

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 9:18:41 PM   
HeidiAnn


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i guess my biggest "change" came from having a father whose ideals were close to the lifestyle. The topic was never discussed in our home when i was little, but the elements were there. When my father passed away this spring, he asked me to take his documents for safekeeping. In them there is this section titled "how to be My woman." In that section father set out rules that bind his women. And it did explain a lot of things.

For instance, we had a small home and shared the same bedroom with our parents. For us it was just natural to wake up on the weekend morning to the sounds of our parents having sex. When i grew up i learned that most people have never seen their parents have sex, which to me is pretty odd. And, after father died and left me his documents i learned about the reasons behind his actions (i.e. why children should see their parents having sex, or more likely why they should see their father having sex with their mother).

And my dad had collected into his documents lot of his thoughts that were present when we were little. One that i still remember clearly is "if you are not a born leader, find someone who is and whom you wish to follow and submit your everything to him/her." A bit poor translation. i hope the thought in it still translated. This particular thought has served me well, especially in the working life. But at relationship-life too.

So for me the biggest "change" has been my father and his example.

heidi


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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 9:43:43 PM   
MadRabbit


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quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

There is always the assumption that we BDSMers must have something wrong with us to be this way … and I tend to agree … I still think some people are just plain kinky – I know I am! .. I also know that nature made me kinky, but my damage made me a slave.


Sure, there is, but that assumption, in my opinion, is presupposed by the opinion that what we do is "wrong" and therefore something "wrong" must have happened to make us who we are.

For example...

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness
My damage has made me into the girl who will happily choke on and get covered by her own vomit in order to hear “Good girl” after a blow job.


I won't attempt to speak for you, but when I read this statement, I see the act of "choking and vomiting during a blowjob for the approval of one's Owner" to be shed in a negative and derogatory light. The act is "wrong" for a person to do and therefore must be the result of something "wrong" that happened to you.

Personally, I don't think that's the only way to see such an act. History has shown many people who willingly suffered and degraded themselves in service to their Gods and their societies held them up as the pinnacle of a human being, not as someone flawed and "wrong" who is the byproduct of "damage".

When one engages in activities or a lifestyle that is deemed deviant and counter-cultural, it's common for one to engage in introspection of one's own past in an attempt to find some understanding as to why we are the way we are and not the way everyone else is. We might find some events in our past that we may to connect the dots with armchair psychology to explain how we are so "flawed". Such a theory can provide a degree of comfort, because it allows us to find some external source to blame, removing our responsibility from what we are, and thus perhaps providing a gateway to self acceptance.

It's not my fault for being what I am, it's my environment and it's out of control!

The downside of such a technique is that it ultimately demeans and negates the value of what we do. By attributing our natures to a "theory" of being the byproduct of some social or environmental damage, we, by association, are saying who we are is inherently flawed or "damaged". That we shouldn't be this way, that we aren't normal, and that we should be ashamed.

Personally, I find nothing flawed, damaged, or wrong about our dark kinky natures, because I find that the light and dark exist in everyone and nobody is immune. My "darkness" manifests itself as someone who enjoys and delights in the suffering and pain of others at my hand.

I like my "darkness" a lot better and it's release through a submissive masochist much better than the other forms of "darkness" that manifest themselves in "normal people" everyday like cheating, alcoholism, drug abuse, the exploitation and use of women, attempted suicide, spousal abuse, child abuse, and power plays! In light of such "damage", how can I not help but feel normal?

Edited to Add : As for the cause of my "darkness", I've had a few theories in the past, but they are just that....theories. I don't have the solid answers and probably never will. I just am what I am and I can live with that. Besides....I've found quite a lot of beauty in what I am, both sadist and dominant, so how can it be the cause of some childhood defect? 

Thanks for making me think. It's been awhile on these forums.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 8/4/2008 9:49:58 PM >


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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 9:54:15 PM   
jim64


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I do think that everyone suffers "damage". How we deal with it will always be different. My damage did not create my bdsm desires. It does not control my life. It has affected all aspects of my life. Whether, I like it or not. I often think about this, and your post gave me some comfort that others have these feelings.

life is a journey, enjoy the trip
jim the traveler

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 10:52:15 PM   
Leatherist


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Knowing what evil is.
 
Groking it as part of me.
 
Choosing not to unleash it on my friends.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/4/2008 11:04:02 PM   
ResidentSadist


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From: a mean old Daddy, but I like you - Joni Mitchell
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quote:

ORIGINAL: softness
So what’s your damage? … and what has it done for you?

My damage has made me into the girl who will happily choke on and get covered by her own vomit in order to hear “Good girl” after a blow job. My damage has me prepared to move halfway across the world to find someone who sees who I am and approves of me exactly as I am.

So .. can you find your own “damage” (or if you prefer another word … your own “change”) that has helped to make you what you are today?

I am super genius and a control addict.  Not in the micromanage/OCD something to death kind of way but more in the General Patton “tell people what to not how to do it and you’ll be surprised by their ingenuity” kind of way. 

That control represent security and it has made me learn about love and sex so I can use them as tools to forge strong bonds… I will be the best lay, your strongest love and your wildest fantasy.  I will give the things no one else ever has because it insures that you *need* me.

My counterpart is the type of girl that needs to be needed.  The kind that “will happily choke on and get covered by her own vomit in order to hear “Good girl” after a blow job”… even if there is 3 kinds of shrimp all over the shower floor.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 4:07:47 AM   
RCdc


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*smoochies soft*
 
I had a wonderful childhood, teenage years and adulthood.  I don't believe that everyone suffers 'damage'.  But I do believe that people have experiences both good and bad.
I had no abuse.
I had a grandmother who taught me to be myself and to trust my instincts and to be true to myself - that I never owe anyone anything.  My parents are loving, nurturng - my father and mother both taught me how to be a decent human being by example.  I have an 'interesting' family - typical east end - and grew up experiencing numerous family events, knees ups and street parties.  My male cousins all look like something out of the Kray movies and the women all look like wags...
And I love everyone of them.

 
My family is big.  Aunts, uncles, cousins, second cousins... families of 5, 7, 11 children.  There are miscarriages, divorces etc - all the things families endure.  My parents were different to their brothers and sisters - I am an only child.  Never spoilt of bailed out of trouble, out of all my family and extended family, I am viewed as the one who got everything 'right'.  I worked hard, I was never spoilt, I got the smart kids, the nice house, the happy family unit, the good education and the success.
 
The only negative occurance that has ever occured was an attack by an ex that ended up with me walking out immediately.  I never hung around for it to happen twice and he ended up with a rather swollen groin area.
But I don't see that as damage, but just another lesson I learnt from.  I completely agree that some people suffer damage or profound loss via family, abuse or expectations of others.  But the only expectation I ever had was from my nan - and that was to be myself and that the rest will just come naturally.  And it has.
 
I have a traditional mum and dad in the sense that he worked, she stayed at home.  My dad is the backbone of the family... dealing with everyones problems and the one people turn to for help.  My mum is the emotional support - the one people always cry to.  And themselves... they deal with their own problems and never get help elsewhere.  But then, they never have 'problems' - imperfections maybe but then, no one is perfect.  They simply enjoy life and love - a lot.
 
I don't believe that everyone is just one thing.  You might be one thing to one person, but not across the board.  Each person and relationship is different and causes unique reactions that make you what you are at any given moment.   You may think you are gods gift to dominancy - but think that and expect me to follow?  I would politely decline.  I may even laugh a little.
 
I am many things to Darcy.  Slave, submissive, pet, whore, girl, slut, support, partner, girlfriend.  As always, nurture plays a part - even thought it is natural and inborn in me to be predisposed to kink.  I am many things because I was taught I can be anything I want to be and not to hold back on the nature of me.  My nurturing taught me and brought out my natural desires.  I have no restraints.  No boundries, with the person and people who love me for who I am.  And those that don't like that, dissipate.  And I am cool with that.  I love company, I was brought up in it but I am comfortable alone too because I have experience of it.
 
Maybe I am an exception.  I can dig that.
 
the.dark.


< Message edited by Darcyandthedark -- 8/5/2008 4:09:32 AM >


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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 4:20:33 AM   
OnlyHisLovebug


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I think people are having problems with the word "damage".  Everyone has different experiences, some negative, some positive.  What I find intriguing about many I talk to here, is how the negatives seem (in some instances) to have been taken, embraced, and used to transform our responses into something positive, instead.  Often, I think, it's just a response to a coping mechanism, a way we learned to survive and./or thrive given less than ideal circumstances.  Think of a sapling that is planted in the shade- it either has to twist a bit to access what it needs--- or it simply won't grow to it's full potential. 

That's sort of how I see myself...lol...a little bit bent and twisted by life; but, certainly none-the-worse for it.  I adapted.  I believe it is my ability to adapt that made me stronger and more capable.  Took me a long time to realize that, though.  When I finally stopped being so concerned with being broken, I realized that I'm just different- and quite wonderfully so.  I really like who I am- and without that 'damage', I think I'd be somebody else entirely.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 4:28:05 AM   
RCdc


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I agree, people do see the word 'damage' and take it as negative.  But as every gardener knows, a good bit of shit now and then makes your plants stronger and healthier.  Providing you use it in the right way.
 
the.dark.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 4:58:36 AM   
wisteriaV


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I don't consider myself damaged at all. Its a life choice  that I embrace completely as part of who I am.  If anything  coming down with M.S. was my so called damage. Even with MS life moves forward and you cope the best you can.

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RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 5:17:33 AM   
Aneirin


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I had a good family upbringing, until a certain age where I was instilled with what is right and what is wrong, I was very popular, I had loads of friends and I was uber confident, it was always me that got things moving, I was known for my organisational and caring skills at an early age.

The teens, well, I went through the teens confused but adopting the stiff upper lip attitude, I took on the looking after my mother and sisters when the family fragmented, I kept my concerns to myself as I felt I had to be strong for my family. I worked hard at school despite all, and came out with reasonable results but was annoyed with myself for not doing better, somewhere along the line I had become very self critical.

Employment after school, what employment, I lived in an area with one in four out of work and exam results didn't mean much and as a newbie worker, that meant slave labour pay and lousy conditions if you did find a job, a job that never lasted more than a few weeks unless there was a government scheme where the employer has a monetary incentive to keep someone on. All the dreams of what one wanted to be, dissolved. I eventually got out, a peace lover, I joined the armed forces and became more confused.

I got married to a divorcee with teenage children, I got out of the forces and readopted my role as looking after the family, my new family, I felt comfortable in my role despite what came, for I had seen stuff with my parents before the family fragmented I vowed never to become. I was the head of my new family, I was the organiser, the fixer, the one that creatively sorted out problems, but I in time came in for abuse and violence from a damaged wife and equally damaged step son, but I would not retaliate, as I was not my father. Employment was ok, though dead end, but I was fixing things and I enjoyed that, but dreams of what I really wanted to do was not supported by my wife. I came to hate life, before it was just life, but I developed a real hatred of my existence and became so self critical my job became dangerous.

A breakdown, I left my wife and family, a breakdown which continued to wreak havoc for a year or two after, but now I am on the path of doing what I want to do. I have gone through blaming myself and blaming everyone around me and blaming the system, I have not found my answers in blame, now I just exist, looking for the first time to the future and my achievements to come, which I know are achievable, it is totally up to me.

The only problem now, is which mind will win, or can I merge the two, for somewhere along the way to here, I seem to have developed a split mind, I can think in two directions at the same time, I can think creatively and mathematically simultaneously, which does help somewhat with my chosen path, but it can be a pain sometimes.

Kink, that was with me from an early age, the interest, it just came, but it became a dirty little secret I kept to myself. The wife was not interested, as it echoed her past marriage of deceit and violence, she could not go there, so I tried to forget it as I loved my wife despite her abuse, for I understood her past. Marital affairs became duty as many will know being denied something which seems undeniable, is near on impossible, it will not leave the mind. In marriage, I used to think I was Dominant, true, I have a dominant personality sometimes, but I also have a submissive personality, so I am clueless to how I can define myself, it is something I will leave until I find the right person and see what comes with the interpersonal dynamics that might come to exist.

Am I damaged or not, I don't know, but I feel everything I have been through, has made me a more rounded person, some of the extremes have been ironed out and some of the more lacking things have been built up, I am for the first time not self hating and being so critical of myself, there are little blips, but on the whole, I feel I am a better person and everything was necessary to become who I am now.


< Message edited by Aneirin -- 8/5/2008 5:30:32 AM >


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 11:24:22 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

I agree, people do see the word 'damage' and take it as negative.  But as every gardener knows, a good bit of shit now and then makes your plants stronger and healthier.  Providing you use it in the right way.
 
the.dark.


Exactly.  And I feel that, as I noted in my post, that I have turned the shit into something positive...me (though I hope you will forgive me if I don't see myself as a flower.  )

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Facing your own damage ... and embracing it. - 8/5/2008 11:44:43 AM   
bigTrouble


Posts: 3
Joined: 8/4/2008
From: Philadelphia, Pa.
Status: offline
wow....great forum, thanks to all of you for participation. In one circle, it is recognized that until we feel/choose enough pain, nothing will change. Mr.&Mrs said it best in the words of St Augustine. Nothing can replace the experience of our own experience. Pain is what I was when I got here, which is not in toto a bad thing. I was going to say that pain exposed me too, and fully, but the greater truth is BDSM is what revealed me, and for that I will never regret the experience in any way.  Anyone who needs to judge the base from which we work/play/live are the students, not the teachers.
 
   ~d~

(in reply to DelightnDevotion)
Profile   Post #: 40
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