Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever...


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... Page: [1] 2 3 4 5   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 7:41:08 AM   
TallDarkAndWitty


Posts: 1893
Joined: 6/12/2004
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline 		It is a rather common notion (held by at least a few, probably many, and possibly most of the denizens of this community) that when a Master takes a slave, it only be done with the intent of making that relationship work over a very long time. "Owning" a slave is akin to traditional matrimony, and should be given at least as much respect (if not more) than that old weather-beaten institution.

This concept of "ownership" has always baffled me, and when I would present my idea of what ownership would be, I was quite astonished to find the ferocity of the defense of "ownership" as stated above. When I wrote of my desire to own a slave for a very short period of times (from mere hours to a few months) I was told that this was not "ownership" it was merely "borrowing". I was called a RolePlayer (as though that were some sort of insult, though I think that everyone plays many roles, some more seriously than others). I was told I only wanted to own a slave temporarily because I had a fear of commitment, or I hadn't found what I wanted, and that I would never really know the true joys of a Master/slave relationship until I owned a slave with the intent of owning her forever. I was told of the emotional hardships that Masters such as myself had caused on unexpecting newbie slaves.

Again, I was baffled by this response. Why did the simple idea that ownership could be ownership even if it was not forever so threaten those who held an opposing notion? Why was it so impossible for them to accept that there could be more than one kind of ownership, and that temporary ownership was as valid as long-term ownership? And then I thought about it from the "slaves" perspective...

Being "owned" (if it is forever) really isn't the risky proposition that being "owned" (in what I see as the traditional sense) would be. Knowing that you will not be sold, traded, or given away (or even returned after six months of use) gives the slave a comfort and security that rivals the happiest of marriages. Defining "ownership" as something different when refering to slaves, allows them to control the relationship.

So this made me question who is really playing at ownership, and who is really exercising it. If ownership is only ownership when it is forever, who owns whom? Would you buy a car knowing that you could never sell it, return it, or give it away? Would such a purchase make you the owner of the car, or the car the owner of you?

So by comparing real "ownership" (with its ability to sell, trade, or give away) to the "lifelong ownership", it reveals that in the typically accepted definition of Master/slave relationships, it is indeed the slave that is in possesion of the Master (and I thought it was supposed to be the other way round, silly me). Obviously, such a revelation is unacceptable, and must be battled, repressed, denied, and condemend (at least before all those "Masters" think about it too much *smile*).

Ownership has always been my primary kink. So much so, that much of what I desire doing to my slave revolves around the proof of said ownership. I would loan my slave out to those I trusted, because you can't loan something out that is not yours. I would sell my slave or trade my slave for another, as you can not sell or trade that which you do not own. I would test the limits of ownership, just to prove to myself that it was real. It is what drives me in this lifestyle.

I just never understood how this could be threatening to others...but I think I am beginning to get it.

Thoughts?

Taggard

_____________________________

A most rewarding compliment is an insult from the ill-informed.


My slave: Kat (RainaVerene on the other side) and her website: RainaVerene.com
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 7:50:22 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		For a majority of the people, D/s and M/s is a version of romantic attachment- they want it to be stable, secure, permanent, and usually based on romantic love.

Also, you have play sluts who go around getting collared to someone new every other month, and are not considered "serious slaves" because they cut out when the going gets tough, or dont really take the time to understand what they really want.

For me however, it makes perfect sense that ownership does not NEED to be permanent, Property can be sold, traded, exchanged, given or thrown away. Most masters and slaves however don't want that sort of dynamic.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 7:58:13 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		My idea and application of owning a slave in the BDSM sense is a reflection of my upbringing in a working-class world where my father's union might strike or the company lock out workers until they got concessions. Take nothing for granted because if you lose or break it we are unlikely to be able to get it back.

This is balanced with my desire (also coming from my childhood) for mutual consent and a very empowering and positive outcome in all relationships.

So I get into an owner-slave relationship slowly -- lots of formal training, lots of reflection, lots of trials for both people. Training is when I try and push the submissive and wouldbe slave in several directions so they get a sense of what being my slave might entail. I also see how serious they are, how well our interests match, and how much self-motivation they are capable of exercising.

When I decide to own someone and they accept it I consider it to be along the lines of getting a bike when I was five. I had to take care of that bike because if things didn't go well financially that year and I broke the bike, no bike for me.

Now a person, slave or not, is not a bike (even the Romans would know that) so the dynamics are more complex. Its more service and authority versus 'taking care of'.

Now while it is possible I might dismiss this slave and find another with similar skills, similar handsomeness, and perhaps even better in some things it is even more likely (I think) that I won't find someone as good and I definitely won't find someone the same as my current slave.

So no, I don't personally consider an owner-slave relationship to be a 'marriage' but its own unique relationship. I can decide to get rid of or loan out of sell a slave* but I shouldn't be surprised then if I don't have one for a while or forever. Frankly I value my ownership desires too much to take that risk.

On the other hand I also value myself too much to have a slave who isn't acting like a slave or who isn't giving me what I want. Or to paraphrase another thread "its better to have no slave than a bad/disobedient slave". I also think its better to be without an owner than to have a bad/harmful owner.

*Note: I know that legally we cannot actually sell another human being in America I'm just using TalkDarkAndWitty's words to make what I'm saying a bit more parallel.




_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 7:58:25 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline 		"Ownership" is a semantic game. What others are defending has to do with ownership as it implies long durations of time and intimacy. I think the resistance you are getting is the obvious lack of intimacy implied by the arrangements you would seem to prefer or are interested in.

To be honest, the idea of owning anything is kind of absurd. It's just a pretend game we play in life, in law, and maybe even in our private lives. But unless your owned slave is jumping in on top of the funeral pyre, I'd say you can't take him/her with you. You are just travelling through, everything is borrowed.

The tighter your grip the more that slips through your fingers...

Personally I consider ownership less important than loyalty. I like my word to be obeyed because of the devotion I have earned, not just because it has fallen from my lips.

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 7:59:09 AM   
TallDarkAndWitty


Posts: 1893
Joined: 6/12/2004
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Most masters and slaves however don't want that sort of dynamic.


That much was obvious to me from early on. What I didn't get until much more recently, was the threat that sort of dynamic posed to the "relationship image" of the those who indulged in the romantic M/s paradigm.

Again, what I don't get, is why the "Masters" sign up for such a relationship. For at least a few (probably many, and possibly most) it isn't the kinky sex, as the intensity and frequency of such fades quickly once the relationship settles in. What would possess someone who claims to want to own another to accept such a limited view of ownership? Why would you want to "own" something, when it reality it owns you? Why not just stick to the traditional form of such things, and just get a wife? Why play at the Master/slave thing, and why play with such seriousness?

I suppose, at its base, it is because many of these men would not land these women without such play...and perhaps because they really enjoy it. *smile* I begrudge no one their happiness.

Taggard

_____________________________

A most rewarding compliment is an insult from the ill-informed.


My slave: Kat (RainaVerene on the other side) and her website: RainaVerene.com

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:02:45 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		my thoughts:

1. i have seen nothing in your posts about the care of your owned slaves, about her emotional well being after giving herself to you. In my views, the girls i have known who have been given away from hand to hand, without security, and without reason or purpose to fully trust another such that he CAN get the most out of her, end up being hollowed out basket cases who do not feel valued enough to be worth keeping.

2. Ownership for 5 hours seems more like "rental" to me. And if that is acceptable to both parties, more power to you. i can not see a girl being used like that repeatedly, being a strong and happy girl in the long run.

3. Who owns whom: Master owns me. i learned what his ultimate goals and desires were before begging his ownership. i had a choice in submitting to him (ha, to a degree - tell that to my heart) before he owned me. Had he said he just wanted a girl "temporarily" or only as long as he felt like it....i would have acknowledged how nice it was to meet him and sent best wishes on finding the girl for him. However, it is HE who wants long term, and that happened to appeal to me. He likes investing time and effort into molding a slave to his liking, and then enjoying the fruits of his labor. To him, long terms means he ends up with exactly what he wants - a girl who knows his every nuance and knows just how to please him. If all he wanted was to get off sexually, there are avenues for that, outside of ownership.

4. Ownership by my Master does mean i can be sold, given away, loaned out. However why would he want to get rid of something that is so pleasing to him? So, i am confident i will not be given away, but i know if i am ever given away, it will have been done with extreme consideration and taking my ultimate welfare into account. i AM required, however, to service anyone or anything he wants me to. But his collar is always on me. It's what would inspire me to serve another as well as him, because all i do is for him.

5. Ownership as a kink? Kink seems more like play to me, so by stating ownership that way, you confirm what other posters on this thread have said.

6. i didn't see anyone being threatened by your words. Angry, possibly. Disagreeable, yes. i myself tend to get a little riled by the disregard of another human spirit, and that is what i toook away from your other thread.

Best of luck in your kink.

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:02:55 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline 		Taggard, you must be feeling especially feisty this morning *winks* to open yourself up to such controversy...lol.

quote:

Obviously, such a revelation is unacceptable, and must be battled, repressed, denied, and condemend (at least before all those "Masters" think about it too much *smile*).


You're not in the boat alone. All revelations it seems must be battled, repressed, denied and condemned. The reason being is that there will always be those who are in opposition to your view....no matter what it is. If you loudy proclaim that marshmallows are yummy you can bet you are going to get that group of marshmallow haters telling you just how wrong you are.

quote:

I just never understood how this could be threatening to others...but I think I am beginning to get it.


I don't see how your view is threatening. It's not my thing but to each's own...if it's working for you, I wouldn't worry too much about anyone else's perception of it.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:07:20 AM   
TallDarkAndWitty


Posts: 1893
Joined: 6/12/2004
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang
To be honest, the idea of owning anything is kind of absurd. It's just a pretend game we play in life, in law, and maybe even in our private lives. But unless your owned slave is jumping in on top of the funeral pyre, I'd say you can't take him/her with you. You are just travelling through, everything is borrowed.


Yes! Exactly! Ownership is a made up concept, and anyone who engages in any form of it, is engaging in a form of self-delusion.

That doesn't mean it isn't useful, powerful, or even real. It only means that it exists only in our minds, and that anyone who engages in it, engages in a form of play.

Knowing all of this, what astonishes me is how possessive people are of their own rites and rules of ownership. I have just never understood how one could have an opinion of such things other than Your Kink Is Not My Kink, But That Is OK.

I think that long-term romantic based ownership is groovy, and I am happy for those that find happiness in it. Before today, I even considered it a "valid" form of ownership, for whatever that is worth. I just never understood the feedback I got when expressing my ideas of ownership.

Taggard

_____________________________

A most rewarding compliment is an insult from the ill-informed.


My slave: Kat (RainaVerene on the other side) and her website: RainaVerene.com

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:08:13 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin



You're not in the boat alone. All revelations it seems must be battled, repressed, denied and condemned. The reason being is that there will always be those who are in opposition to your view....no matter what it is. If you loudy proclaim that marshmallows are yummy you can bet you are going to get that group of marshmallow haters telling you just how wrong you are.




i happen to really like marshmallows so i'll be on your side of that debate. Now, if you like SMORES....mmmmm..... Hahahaha...

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:09:10 AM   
Jasmyn


Posts: 1234
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: New Zealand
Status: offline 		Always the thinker Taggard ;) now will try and do your thoughts justice.

I too am big on the ownership deal. I own them. Every inch of them. But ownership is not a stagnant thing with the major still water running deep is I have to want to own them as a constant. That I could revoke ownership at anytime is something they would do well to remember.

It is one of the reasons I enjoy issuing contracts with set periods of time, three weeks, then three months, then six months, then a year. The respect they show for their contracts is what I am looking for, not to just prove they have an ability to commit to something but that they have a desire to commit as much as an ability. They want to keep pleasing and worshipping and honouring and devoting themselves to me.

Now, a lifelong ownership deal, would be with someone I loved, in love with, having him take my name in marriage.

I often discussed d/s dynamics falling into two catergories, reciprocal love and non-reciprocal love ... the former mutual love needs to be present, the latter the bottom may love deeply their owner but would never expect a similar love in return, a fondness absolutely, but not love in a conventional sense. These two catergories for simplification and because it seems quite prevellent in the gender mixes, male dom/fem sub = reciprocal love, fem dom/male sub = non-reciprocal love ... or to look at another way ... master/mistress/owner = superior = non-reciprocal love ... or master/mistress/owner = non superior = reciprocal love ... hence the gender mixes being fem dom/male sub falling into the non-reciprocal love dynamic when so many men seek fem supremacy ... and being male dom/fem sub falling into the reciprocal love dynamics when so many women seek the love of master they can submit to.

The lifelong ownership of forever fits a great deal with the non superior mistress/master/sub/slave dynamic ... my slaves I have the superior dynamic with, the man I love, we will have the non superior dynamic.

Hope you can make sense of my ramblings ;)



_____________________________

quote:

"To learn the art of submission a slave must first give up the desires that drew him to submission in the first place." Mistress Jasmyn Jan 2005.


Visit My Website


(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:11:21 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Again, what I don't get, is why the "Masters" sign up for such a relationship. For at least a few (probably many, and possibly most) it isn't the kinky sex, as the intensity and frequency of such fades quickly once the relationship settles in.


Ah, now I find this line interesting and possibly revealing? as to why you may have take the stand you do. If this has been your reality I can understand much better the reasons why long term, "forever" type ownership may not be appealing to you.

It is not always the case that this occurs. If you found yourself in a relationship that didn't *fizzle* down but continued to build and grow in intensity, frequency and emotion...would that change your view at all?

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:12:07 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty
What would possess someone who claims to want to own another to accept such a limited view of ownership? Why would you want to "own" something, when it reality it owns you? Why not just stick to the traditional form of such things, and just get a wife? Why play at the Master/slave thing, and why play with such seriousness?

The subject of marriage and breeding within Ds has always fascinated me and has given a lot of light to me on this subject.

This is my answer right now:
Most people into M/s and D/s like the romantic trappings of average life, like the benefits of normal life, and really want the classical ideal notion of life...with the cool funky edge of calling it Ds or Ms because they really don't fit into mainstream culture.

This is why so many male doms/fem subs idealize and compared themselves to "old fashioned relationships." That's what they really want. They don't really want to be treated as owned property. They want the romantic trappings of a pretty collar, with the comfortable trappings of a middle/upper class lifestyle, AND fun kinky toys and sex.

It's not bad to want those things- I know I enjoy them. But D/s M/s and O/p relationships have a lot of shades to them, and as the majority of people actually want what I described above, they don't understand a master who WOULD make a slave sleep in a separate room all the time, bear a child with someone else, order the slave to marry only for financial gain, etc- and in fact call it wrong.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:13:00 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty
Again, what I don't get, is why the "Masters" sign up for such a relationship. For at least a few (probably many, and possibly most) it isn't the kinky sex, as the intensity and frequency of such fades quickly once the relationship settles in.


I don't know you, but that strikes me as the classic statement of someone that has never had good sex in his entire life - kinky or otherwise. Do you foolishly imagine that time and intimacy have no rewards? Here's a cookie...

The best sex I have ever had so far in my life was 7 years into a mostly vanilla but occasionally kinky relationship. Sex is exciting on the first night, but it is actually hugely better on the 1000th occasion and better still on the 2000th occasion. If you don't know that, you don't know that, and I can't help you to know it - all I can do is assert the truth of it.

As to the rest, life issues eventually get in the way of being too carefree for too long. LA said "...stable, secure, permanent..." but what she's talking about is not any possible relationship, but people's own lives. I have never considered it, but I couldn't live out of a suitcase for too long - I have things I have in mind to do with my life. I assume most slaves/subs do too.

BTW, I am not bashing your chosen lifestyle. I don't actually care what you do. I am just trying to explain something from the other side.


< Message edited by Chaingang -- 2/17/2006 8:18:16 AM >

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:21:42 AM   
TallDarkAndWitty


Posts: 1893
Joined: 6/12/2004
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

However why would he want to get rid of something that is so pleasing to him?


To prove that his ownership is more than just lip service.

Perhaps this doesn't matter to you or your Master, but then why call it ownership, and not call it marriage? If one has no intention of ever taking advantage of the benefits and proiviledges of ownership, then why even use the term? There are other, more appropriate terms for what you have.

(I really have no axe to grind, other than making interesting conversation, and, in fact, I understand why many use the terms "slave" and "ownership" in talking about relationships for which, to my literal mind, they do not apply. Those words are powerful, and add an element of excitement to traditional relationships. My issue is with those who call what I do "play" while refusing to acknowledge their own "play".)

Taggard

_____________________________

A most rewarding compliment is an insult from the ill-informed.


My slave: Kat (RainaVerene on the other side) and her website: RainaVerene.com

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:22:38 AM   
Driver1961


Posts: 459
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		He enters, dips His lid,

Very interesting Taggard,,, along with the first reply!

It boils down to clear communication of your expectations and the true acceptance of your views by the other (slave in this case).

We all have personal beliefs many that are jointly (community) shared and so the use of a word such as 'ownership' immediately brings to mind the general accepted view of ownership. (This view of ownership you have obviously been informed of)

You can tell others till you are blue in the face of your 'ownership' view but they have to turn off the magical little 'information filtering brain' that exists on our shoulders that mixes the new information with the old (in the case) community view of ownership. Otherwise the little filtering brain rejects all or chunks getting into the brain for logical ratification . I often say to my girls, Now sorry, but what words have you got stuck on cos you're being negative on what I am trying to assist you with?

I consider a nilla relationship similarly to this; is the situation of a guy (normally guys) saying to a girlfriend whom he has just told is an ex- saying, I can't commit to you, I like you alot but I cant do this anymore. Ok, a fair enough common type of words, but what happens then? She (could be he) then suggests sex, so it is and the next morning he leaves. The average girl in these circumstances then believes and acts over the next days as though they are still together- Why? Cos she got stuck principally on the word 'COMMIT' So he left and she then thinks and tells all how he loves her but has a committment phobia but she understands and will work it out with him cos after all, he made LOVE to her and stayed the night. The actions/use of his (ex)girlfriend indicates that he is connected to her. He's hardly going to get up in the morning and tell her again, instead he talks, kisses the cheek and leaves somewhat like normal.

TAGGART and L/A I hear what you are both saying but the actions/use of Taggart or others with a slave indicate all to many of what TAGGART has presumeably been flamed for in past.

In short, tell the slave/sub to turn off the filtering head and repeat back to you their understanding of what you have explained to them.


Warm regards Driver1961

_____________________________

Dance as though nobody is watching!

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:32:32 AM   
TallDarkAndWitty


Posts: 1893
Joined: 6/12/2004
From: Rochester, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross
they don't understand a master who WOULD make a slave sleep in a separate room all the time, bear a child with someone else, order the slave to marry only for financial gain, etc


That is so fricken' hot!

Taggard

_____________________________

A most rewarding compliment is an insult from the ill-informed.


My slave: Kat (RainaVerene on the other side) and her website: RainaVerene.com

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:42:37 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross
they don't understand a master who WOULD make a slave sleep in a separate room all the time, bear a child with someone else, order the slave to marry only for financial gain, etc

That is so fricken' hot!


Taggard, are you a "traditionalist"?

See:
http://www.collarchat.com/Work_in_S%26M_relationships%25/m_250252/tm.htm


_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:46:35 AM   
kyraofMists


Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty

For at least a few (probably many, and possibly most) it isn't the kinky sex, as the intensity and frequency of such fades quickly once the relationship settles in.

Taggard


When exactly is the intensity of sex supposed to fade? My Lord and alandra have been intimite together for almost 19 years and I dare say their sex is more intense and kinky than when their relationship first started. But then again, our Lord is rather creative and inventive when it comes to sex and play and he keeps growing and learning and taking us to new heights.

If you really want to get into a semantics discussion on ownership, then no one really owns another person because at any time that "owned" person can choose not to obey and legally there is nothing that you can do about it. An inanimate object does not have that choice. In my relationship, I have given him complete authority over my life. The depth of my submission is there only because of the commitment and devotion that we have to make this a life long relationship. I would not surrender everything to him if this was only going to last a few hours or months. No one will ever reach the core of who I am if they only intend to use me for a few hours or months.

In your definition of M/s relationships, my Lord's bottom denika would be considered his slave, but if you look at the relationship he has with her and the relationships alandra and I have with him, there is a big difference in the level of control/authority and the depth of submission to him.

Knight's kyra



_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 8:48:40 AM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

However why would he want to get rid of something that is so pleasing to him?


To prove that his ownership is more than just lip service.

Perhaps this doesn't matter to you or your Master, but then why call it ownership, and not call it marriage? If one has no intention of ever taking advantage of the benefits and proiviledges of ownership, then why even use the term? There are other, more appropriate terms for what you have.

(I really have no axe to grind, other than making interesting conversation, and, in fact, I understand why many use the terms "slave" and "ownership" in talking about relationships for which, to my literal mind, they do not apply. Those words are powerful, and add an element of excitement to traditional relationships. My issue is with those who call what I do "play" while refusing to acknowledge their own "play".)

Taggard


We dont' call it marriage because it isn't marriage. i do not live with him, as that is his choice. When i AM with him, we do not hold hands, snuggle on the bed, etc., i serve him. i sleep on the floor. When i am privileged, i feed him while he works. We do not do most things that occur in traditional marriages, because that is not what he wants from me.

i understand your statement about proving ownership. But then haven't you have cut off your nose to spite your face? Because once you give her away, you don't have her anymore. i don't understand it, but i won't argue it. Everyone has their own way. my Master's ownership is proven in his way, and it is not by disrupting the service he receives from me, nor is it by disrupting the internal security he helped me find within myself. If it works for you and your slaves....to each their own.

i agree fully with LA's post also, as i have found that many who prefer more traditional types of relationships do not understand my service to him. And i understand that. All too often i see eyes widen when i say Master has considered breeding me with someone, and has considered pairing me with another (for reasons of his own) for when he passes....they think it is absurd.

On that note, i'm off to work - tgif, tgif, tgif.....


(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... - 2/17/2006 9:00:44 AM   
Archer


Posts: 3207
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline 		Ah wonderfull to see a misquote being used as a subject.

The point made in the other post was not that ownership had to be forever (that was you adding your own thought of what they ment) it was that ownership was not really ownership if the time being held was 5 hours or 5 days.

The thought was not fully fleshed out, but to flesh it out a bit more here so that it is not mischaraterized as something it is not here we go.

To be ownership the option (read that word OPTION two or three times) of forever has to be there. If the contract (verbal or written) has a closeing date then it is not ownership it is borrowing/ leaseing. The central thought objecting to the idea that a 5 hour or even day M/s relationship simply isn't anything except a roleplay game, is that idea that it lacks the Option to be forever.

In Leather

Archer

(in reply to TallDarkAndWitty)
Profile   Post #: 20
Page:   [1] 2 3 4 5   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> Ownership is not ownership, unless it is forever... Page: [1] 2 3 4 5   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.105