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RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 8:57:09 AM

Posts: 25
Joined: 8/7/2009
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Ask any vanilla person if they do 1/10 of what a sub person does in a relationship and you'll get a no 9 x out of 10. Unless your D/s is more like a vanilla relationship to begin with.

I'm taking about Master and slave/submisive here. Not vanilla relationships.

"Once a relationship is formed both sides of the flogger must put the relationship responsibilities first. "

I'm not talking about relationship responsibilities here. I'm just talking about a submissive and their motivation to serve a certain person. I never brought up the issues of who brings what and how much into a relationship, and I'm not really sure why you find it necessary to bring this up. I'm also not saying anything about relationship responsibilities, I'm just talking about why a submissive decides to serve a dom and all I'm saying is a submissive person must find something in the dom to make her want to serve him. If she's not one of those women who'll give it up to anyone who'll be kind enough to take her (you claim you know some), then she is going to evaluate the dom and decide if he's worth serving. If she does decide to surrender to him, so then obviously there was something special about him that inspired her.

"Another reason why relationships fail. One party, doesn't matter if it's the dominant or submissive half, believes they are putting more into it than their partner. What result other than frustration and resentment can be expected with that mindset? "

What does this have to do with a submissive finding a dom who inspires her submission? You're talking about other issues. I can't seem to understand how this relates to my simply saying a submissive person finds something within the dom that makes her want to give him control over her. We can talk about why relationships fail if you want, but for now, I'm just talking about why she wants to give up everything to him.

"Yes, I know people who have an inclination to serve "just anyone and everyone" - Yes "Really". "

It's unfortunate you know submissives who will surrender their control to just anyone. I don't think that's the safest or wisest thing to do. But for other submissives, they need to see something within the dom that inspires their submission, that inspires them to want to give up control to that dom and that inspires them to want to obey and serve that dom. I guess it depends all upon the person.

< Message edited by JonasTellas -- 10/14/2009 8:59:00 AM >

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 9:07:30 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JonasTellas

Your right and it's true but people serving in a D/s relationship are giving so much more up that a vanilla partner isn't. There's way much more a submissive person does physically and emotionally that a vanilla partner doesn't. A submissive person gives up a great amount more of themselves and dedicates themselves to their dom on a level no other vanilla partner can touch.

That I and many people disagree with. What you are suggesting is that Ds relationships are far superior and I know from experience that is just not true. Just by claiming that alone, that then - in a chain - assumes that Ms relationships are again, higher than all. My parents never had a Ds relationship yet they gave all of themselves to each other. I have seen Ds relationships that are intense and loving, that fall and fail in a short few months or years and so-called vanilla relationships last for numerous decades. Relationships last because of the people involved and because of the compatability - NOT because of their orientation or label.

quote:

And so in order for a human being to surrender their entire self power and self being to the control of another person, they have to be inspired to give up all that, they don't just surrender to anyone just because they are submissive.

Except for those that do.

quote:

Forgive me for not understanding but from where we sit, you seem to say they're born submissive and so they then have this inclinge to serve. But so just anyone and everyone? Really? Maybe i'm in the minority here but imho just because a person's nature is to please and serve, that doesn't mean they want to serve and please just any person.

And that is you. Just because you cannot relate to it, does not mean it does not exist. And yes, unfortunately, a person of such 'talent' is likely to have their talent abused if they are unable to harness it in a positive manner.

quote:

They have to first meet someone who inspires their submissive tendencies because not just anyone will cause ignite them to serve.They need to see and feel something special about a dom to bring out those submissive desires or else any dom will do. And that's not the case. I'm certain they don't enter a room full of doms and want to submit to each and everyone of them.

And again, service does not = submission. I really find it an important key is to forget the word 'want'. To 'want' is not something that all s-types (nor d-types) have the choice over.

quote:

Ask any vanilla person if they do 1/10 of what a sub person does in a relationship and you'll get a no 9 x out of 10. Unless your D/s is more like a vanilla relationship to begin with.

I'm taking about Master and slave/submisive here. Not vanilla relationships.

Then I challenge you to list some of 'what a sub person does in a relationship' that non Ds relationships do not.

the.dark.

< Message edited by Darcyandthedark -- 10/14/2009 9:11:28 AM >

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 9:23:33 AM

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Joined: 8/7/2009
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"That I and many people disagree with."

Okay, so why do you feel the need to segregate yourself with those that agree with you, from me? LOL.

"What you are suggesting is that Ds relationships are far superior and I know from experience that is just not true. "

I didn't say they were superior. Where did you get that from?? If you could kindly show me where I made that "claim". I'm not talking about superiority between vanilla and d/s. I'm talking about submission and what ignites it. D/s relationships are more demanding on the submissive then vanilla relationships. I'm not talking about relationship 101, I'm talking about a submissive and her decision to submit to a dom, to give up her life to, to give up control to, etc.. and that in order to make that decision, the dom has to be someone she's motivated by, inspired by.

"And that is you. Just because you cannot relate to it, does not mean it does not exist. "

Again, tell me where I said it does NOT exist? You can stop making statements for me now. I'm not certain it does exist because I never met any one who blindly submits to any dom. I won't say it NEVER happens, but on the flip side you can't say no women need to be inspired by a dom before they decide they want to serve him.

"Then I challenge you to list some of 'what a sub person does in a relationship' that non Ds relationships do not. "

Has to have sex whenever the master says.
Cleans like a slave.
Doesn't get a final say in decision making.
Gets punished.
Gets disciplined.
Has to obey.
Has to have sex with other men or be in a poly relationship if master says so.
Has to ask for permission to do things.
Gives up control over her money.

(in reply to RCdc)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 9:28:58 AM

Posts: 376
Joined: 12/20/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

If Himself had told me up front that he was into foot worship (as in worship of *my* feet), I wouldn't have gotten started into this relationship in the first place and because of my past experience with Pete (my second dominant), that was a question I specifically asked 'before' Himself collared me. I view foot worship as a submissive action in the same way that I view groveling as a submissive action. There are a lot of other things I view as specifically dominant or specifically submissive that don't mean a rat's ass to anyone but Himself because he is the one with whom I share a relationship. That we are quite compatible on what we both view as dominant and submissive actions speaks, in part, to one of the reasons for our longevity together.

Reasonable logic, Truble. I have a funny feeling more submissive women may be checking in with this question like you did in the beginning of a relationship as a result of this thread.

(in reply to BitaTruble)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 9:38:41 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JonasTellas

"That I and many people disagree with."

Okay, so why do you feel the need to segregate yourself with those that agree with you, from me? LOL.

It's not segregation, just stating that it's not something that everyone agrees with. Who said I was segregating - to quote you

"What you are suggesting is that Ds relationships are far superior and I know from experience that is just not true. "

quote:

I didn't say they were superior. Where did you get that from?? If you could kindly show me where I made that "claim".

By insinuation -
Your quote -

quote:

A submissive person gives up a great amount more of themselves and dedicates themselves to their dom on a level no other vanilla partner can touch.

quote:

Again, tell me where I said it does NOT exist? You can stop making statements for me now.

If you do, I will.

quote:

I'm not certain it does exist because I never met any one who blindly submits to any dom. I won't say it NEVER happens, but on the flip side you can't say no women need to be inspired by a dom before they decide they want to serve him.

Absolutely! No one can make the claim either way. But there are definately those types of s-types and d-types on both sides.

quote:

Has to have sex whenever the master says.
Cleans like a slave.
Doesn't get a final say in decision making.
Gets punished.
Gets disciplined.
Has to obey.
Has to have sex with other men or be in a poly relationship if master says so.
Has to ask for permission to do things.
Gives up control over her money.

I asked for things that non s-types do. People routinely do all of the above withouth being in a Ds relationship.
I would also ask you remove all BDSM activities and then challenge you a second time to list those things subs do that non subs do not - IYO. As not all Ds relationships are sexual nor do they include BDSM activities.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 9:47:40 AM

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Joined: 5/10/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JonasTellas
"Then I challenge you to list some of 'what a sub person does in a relationship' that non Ds relationships do not. "

Has to have sex whenever the master says.

Plenty of nilla women believe that if you don't take care of your man, he'll get his needs met elsewhere. Beyond that, if you love someone, wouldn't you want to do what it takes to make them happy, even if it is sometimes inconvenient for you?

quote:

Cleans like a slave.

Single mothers do this every day. You don't need a master in the picture, or even a boyfriend.

quote:

Doesn't get a final say in decision making.
Has to ask for permission to do things.
Gives up control over her money.

These are common complaints (sometimes joking, often serious) about nilla husbands about their relationships with their wives. I even heard a nilla man with a new girlfriend congratulated recently with the phrase: "You finally found someone to be the boss of you!" Women have been giving up this kind of control to men for generations. Again, there's no particular D/s component here.

These other things...

quote:

Gets punished.
Gets disciplined.
Has to obey.
Has to have sex with other men or be in a poly relationship if master says so.

Greek Orthodox wedding vows explicitly include a promise by the wife to obey her husband, and there are Taken-in-Hand schools of thought, coming mainly out of fundamentalist Protestantism, that say the man is the head of the household and has the right to discipline his wife whenever he sees fit... and oh yeah, that BDSM stuff is sick. Finally, swingers who are otherwise vanilla probably do a lot more gangbanging than you do. People who don't identify with BDSM engage in all of these activities you mention.

I agree with the posters who believe that subs "give more" than nillas are taking a position on relationships that is incorrect, and tends to lead to relationship failure.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 10:12:30 AM

Posts: 376
Joined: 12/20/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

As not all Ds relationships are sexual nor do they include BDSM activities.

That's true, DD. BDSM activities are BDSM activities. I would say that it probably would be a good idea to differentiate between a popularly understood marriage arrangement vs. m&s. If most here in this thread really see no difference between the two, I think that's fairly telling, not to mention humerous on many counts.

(in reply to RCdc)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 10:25:53 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac
That's true, DD. BDSM activities are BDSM activities. I would say that it probably would be a good idea to differentiate between a popularly understood marriage arrangement vs. m&s. If most here in this thread really see no difference between the two, I think that's fairly telling, not to mention humerous on many counts.

Oh absolutely. However I do feel that people get lost in the miriad of acronyms. I don't believe all people - when talking about their being no difference of 'vanilla' and 'Ds' equate BDSM in that equasion and it is important to make clear just what Ds means when you talk about it. I have come into contact with many a person who are under the assumption that to be a(for example) dominant, one must also be sadistic... and end up playing a role that they neither understand nor have much control over - it's like, going through the motions because it is expected. And unrealistic expectations are the downfall of many a relationship.(please forgive my edit - I seem to be prone to spelling and typos today).
That said, I know one of my best friends and her husband whom have been together 20 odd years, whom I have known since school, relish spanking and the discipline that enhances their relationship - yet are both as 'vanilla' as you could get and are not in a Ds relationship in any form.

the.dark.

< Message edited by Darcyandthedark -- 10/14/2009 10:27:26 AM >

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to SimplyIsaac)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 10:35:08 AM

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

I'm not talking about relationship responsibilities here. I'm just talking about a submissive and their motivation to serve a certain person

Submission or 'service' in a vacuum? Even cyber submission, outside of one handed web-surfing, requires interaction with another individual. That interaction requires another person. When another person is involved it is called a 'relationship'. Needing payback, inspiration, cash or some other personal gratuity, doesn't change that basic fact. However, if you take the need of a relationship out of the equation you'll arrive at my basic point. An individual can be, and some are, submissive - period.

"Another reason why relationships fail. One party, doesn't matter if it's the dominant or submissive half, believes they are putting more into it than their partner. What result other than frustration and resentment can be expected with that mindset?"

quote:

What does this have to do with a submissive finding a dom who inspires her submission?

Everything. You've yet to answer the question; what happens when inspiration wanes. Now you can't reconcile the focus of the individual on the success of the relationship being more important than selfish focus. Your inability to grasp these key components of a relationship, whether addressing the single issue of submission or any critical aspect, dooms any discussion to failure.

quote:

We can talk about why relationships fail if you want, but for now, I'm just talking about why she wants to give up everything to him.

You have to eliminate the goal to prove your point? Why not turn the equation around? Why would he want to take everything from her? Is it possible that the sum of the taking/giving produce a result greater than what either individual gives/gets? Yes it is. Yes it does happen that way, no inspiration or zero sum game needs to be played.

quote:

I can't seem to understand how this relates to my simply saying a submissive person finds something within the dom that makes her want to give him control over her.

You inability to grasp a concept is the reason you point to for something not to exist? An obvious, and fundamental, 'you' problem. I sincerely hope that someday you'll have the ability to understand how some people maintain successful relationships in the future.

quote:

It's unfortunate you know submissives who will surrender their control to just anyone.

See, that is a clear distinction between us. I am happy to have you provide a negative example. How else would people be able to see so clearly what not to do?

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 10:54:21 AM

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JonasTellas:

I had Carol kneel next to me and we talked about this. As I suspected, you have framed these things in a very, very different and much darker way than she does. Because you have framed it in such a way, it seems like all these things should be such an incredible imposition to her.

What he is talking about is not us. I don't agree that I am subjected to this list. Many of these things are just plain couched poorly, implying some sort of insensitive, uncaring relationship. My husband has never run rough-shod over my heart or life. He has always cared for me. I cannot imagine a situation in which he would knowingly hurt me. So then why would I fear him having all this authority? We watch each other's back... even to the point of not playing practical jokes on each other. We are pals.

When you get down to it, we are a team. This is not my husband dragging me along by my hair. He isn't "taking" things from me. Rather, he has offered up his skills to compliment my own and together we achieve things that individually we could not have. I could not have achieved this current place in my life where things are generally warm, loving, nurturing and supportive without his leadership to blaze the path.

When we were first married, I was worried about sharing our money. He said, "All right, how about if I just give you my checks and you do with it as you see fit?" From the very beginning, he has insisted on trust, openness, and honesty and has been willing to put his money where his mouth is.

To your specific points, for each I have indicated whether it is true or false to me and how I think about it.

I have to have sex whenever he says: (TRUE) But you say that like it's a bad thing. Again, let's remember that I love him and he's a considerate lover. And for those times when I'm not in the mood.... do you honestly believe I am the first woman on the face of the planet to "put out" to satisfy the man she loved? And you know what, I like serving him in such a deeply important way to him... imagine that.
Cleans like a slave: (????) I always ended up doing more of the housework. Nothing's changed since the collar. Apparently I always cleaned "like a slave"
Doesn't get a final say in decision making: (TRUE) But I get to speak my piece first. I never really wanted the final say so this isn't much of a sacrifice.
Gets punished: (FALSE) Hasn't happend yet. He's not a big believer in punishment as a useful tool.
Gets disciplined: (????) Neither of us understands what this word means. He has always painted a vision of our goals. From time to time he clarifies that vision. He expresses preferences for how he wants things done and if I do it differently than that, he let's me know. Don't all spouses do that? Isn't that just "good communication?"
Has to obey: (TRUE) So what? If I didn't want a final say to start with and I cannot imagine a command done without love & consideration, then what's the rub?
Sex with other men/poly: (Unknown). We aren't really poly and he's not big into sharing so it hasn't come up yet. He's asserted that he wants this authority, at least in theory and I want to give it to him. At this point it's an unknown whether I would actually obey or not, but again, I don't really think of him as being an insensitive and uncaring.
Has to ask for permission to do things: (TRUE) In general, I dont' see this as a problem. It's how we tune in and stay close with each other. He doesn't squelch me.
Give up control over her money: (???) How about if we reframe this to "give up control over my poverty." He's made me financially secure and given my a lifestyle I am unaccustomed to in terms of financial freedom and safety.

So there you have her perception of our reality. You can decide for yourself whether that matches your conception of M/s or not. More importantly though is the understanding that many of the things you seem to think of as sacrifices, she thinks of as either "not worth worrying about" or a benefit. The only thing on your list that is truly troublesome to her is the whole "have sex with a person she found distasteful" concept. For that one, she's settled into "I trust him to not be an idiot". Beyond that, it'd take a specific situation before we would know one way or the other whether she would obey.

In my opinion, you are stuck in a mindset which says "submission is bad" and so therefor must be endured by the poor slave girl. Why on earth would anyone willingly enter into an arrangement they thought "must be endured"?

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 10:54:29 AM

Posts: 376
Joined: 12/20/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac
That's true, DD. BDSM activities are BDSM activities. I would say that it probably would be a good idea to differentiate between a popularly understood marriage arrangement vs. m&s. If most here in this thread really see no difference between the two, I think that's fairly telling, not to mention humerous on many counts.

Oh absolutely. However I do feel that people get lost in the miriad of acronyms. I don't believe all people - when talking about their being no difference of 'vanilla' and 'Ds' equate BDSM in that equasion and it is important to make clear just what Ds means when you talk about it.

Agreed, tenfold. To that end, domination and submission is physical and emotive, involving two minds and two perceptions.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

That said, I know one of my best friends and her husband whom have been together 20 odd years, whom I have known since school, relish spanking and the discipline that enhances their relationship - yet are both as 'vanilla' as you could get and are not in a Ds relationship in any form.

There's discipline involved? For the sake of your example, who does the disciplining and why, or do you mean to say it's more like an enjoyable adult hobby more than actual domination and submission?

(in reply to RCdc)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:03:29 AM

Posts: 25
Joined: 8/7/2009
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First, what's up with turning this personal? Seriously? Have I make an personal accusation against you? If so, please point me in that direction.

"You inability to grasp a concept is the reason you point to for something not to exist? An obvious, and fundamental, 'you' problem."

Look at how you turn this personal. What does "relationships" have to do with what I'm saying? All I'm saying is she needs to be inspired to give up control to him. You're saying a woman needs no inspiration to surrender to a dom, and I'm saying she does. I'm not talking about what responsibilities are applicable, or how much a person brings into the relationship. I'm saying a submissive needs to be inspired by a dom before she gives up control. You say some women give up control blindly to just anyone. And, good for you. Me personally, I know no woman who acts that recklessly. In my opinion, that's reckless behavior.

"I sincerely hope that someday you'll have the ability to understand how some people maintain successful relationships in the future. ""

Umm, you don't know what abilities I have or don't have so please stop with the accusations and try to not get personal.

"what happens when inspiration wanes. "

If the inspiration waned, the relationship has changed. Life goes on. Still doesn't invalidate the fact she had to be inspired by something within him to serve and submit to him.

"Why would he want to take everything from her?"

Don't stress it, I'm saying she can be a dud. Maybe that's why you're getting personal on me. Saying I have an inability to grasp something is a sign you're turning this personal. Don't talk about me, keep to the issue.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:05:04 AM

Posts: 25
Joined: 8/7/2009
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Sure single mothers do that every day, but they don't do it when a man commands "Do it."

Could it be your relationship is more vanilla with a twist of sexual kink and that's why you see no difference between an m/s relationship and a vanilla one?

Your average american woman of today does not get punished, or disciplined by her husband, nor does she obey him or accept infidelity or poly even if the bible (written by a men with political agendas) says so.

(in reply to RedMagic1)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:07:56 AM

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Joined: 8/7/2009
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You do practice BDSM, right? I noticed your partner (or is it "wife") is wearing a collar and leash and is on her knees. I doubt the average american woman wears a leash and collar and gets punished and disciplined by her husband. And as far as sex, it's usually the woman - wifey - who controls when and how often the husband gets sex.

"in my opinion, you are stuck in a mindset which says "submission is bad" "

Please, if you care enough, paste something which I wrote that says submission is bad.

< Message edited by JonasTellas -- 10/14/2009 11:10:09 AM >

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:18:35 AM

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

what's up with turning this personal?

I thought you were giving personal opinion, as am I assuming you are drawing from experience, as am I - you weren't?

quote:

What does "relationships" have to do with what I'm saying? All I'm saying is she needs to be inspired to give up control to him.

What's she "inspired" by if not another person? Another person indicates there is a "relationship". What does inspiration have to do with other than in the context of a relationship?

quote:

If the inspiration waned, the relationship has changed. Life goes on. Still doesn't invalidate the fact she had to be inspired by something within him to serve and submit to him.

Points to the 'submissive' having ultimate control of the dynamic Fundamentally that is not submission it is being served ('inspired'), not being served ('inspired') any longer, and moving on. Which is exactly my point.

quote:

Saying I have an inability to grasp something is a sign you're turning this personal. Don't talk about me, keep to the issue.

I got the idea from you when you said; "I can't seem to understand how this relates to my simply saying a submissive person finds something within the dom that makes her want to give him control over her." You talked about your inability to grasp the concept - I agree. How is that personal?

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:24:58 AM

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Joined: 8/7/2009
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"By insinuation -
Your quote -
quote:

A submissive person gives up a great amount more of themselves and dedicates themselves to their dom on a level no other vanilla partner can touch.

I see. Still, that doesn't mean I think submissive relationships are superior. Some other poster here, Leadership, thinks I think submission is bad. You think I think it's superior. Maybe you two should help each other out. lol.

"if you do, I will"

Please paste where I made up something you said.

"But there are definately those types of s-types and d-types on both sides. "

Yes, and I never said there definitely were not.

"then challenge you a second time to list those things subs do that non subs do not -"

I'm talking about D/s relationships. Is your d/s relationship very vanilla with a little kink added in? If so, maybe that's where the confusion is happening. I'm talking about master-slave-submissive relationships, not kinky vanilla where each side does things equally for the other side. I don't your average house wife gets disciplined and punished by her husband. There's a reason they call our lifestyle a lifestyle. "

(in reply to RCdc)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:27:38 AM

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Joined: 6/2/2008
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EDITED TO ANSWER THE FIRST QUESTION:
I have no idea whether we do BDSM or not. First, you'd need to give me some definition of what BDSM means. But I can tell you that I'm not a sadist. She's not a masochist. Neither of us knows what "discipline" means and the bondage that happens is so lightweight that I doubt it'd qualify. I boss her around. She obeys. Some of the stuff we do in the bedroom is unusual but most of it is not.

She is my wife who wears my collar, get's leashed, kneels and obeys. I am the LAST person on earth to think she is "average". I think she's the most wonderful human on the face of the planet which is pretty much the diammetric opposite of "average". As she pointed out, she doesn't get punished and neither of us truly understands that word "discipline" so I cannot speak to whether or not she gets disciplined by me. (Yeah yeah, I know the dictionary definition of discipline, it's just every time I hear it in the BDSM context it seems to mean something different and I've never gotten a solid working definition of what that different thing is so I just ignore it).

The reason I SPECULATED on your mindset is only in the way that you framed all of those things. If I'm wrong, that's fine. But as you can see from Carol's responses, she doesn't see those things as being particularly onerous excepting "have sex with this guy you dislike".

I'm not wanting to argue with you here Jonas. No really. I haven't read any of your other posts here... certainly not enough to know whether or not I agree I think you're right or wrong about something. I just suspected Carol wouldn't process that list the same way you seem to be so I queried her, wrote down her responses and posted. I was hoping that her responses, coming out of an apparently different door, would maybe shed some light on the whatever is going on here (as such things are wont to do). If not, that's cool.

< Message edited by leadership527 -- 10/14/2009 11:33:19 AM >

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to JonasTellas)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:30:19 AM

Posts: 25
Joined: 8/7/2009
Status: offline

"I got the idea from you when you said; "I can't seem to understand how this relates to my simply saying a submissive person finds something within the dom that makes her want to give him control over her." You talked about your inability to grasp the concept - I agree. How is that personal?
"

You took my statement out of context and used it as a personal attack. It came off as getting personal with me and you know it. You took the opportunity to make a snicker statement.

You think a dom doesn't have to inspire submission in a woman. I say he does.

You say women give up control to just any dom and so she needs no inspiration. That's the exception to the rule, I believe. Most women, need to feel something from the dom which moves them to chose them as their dom and submit to him.

Like I said, don't stress it. The dom has to find her desirous and want her submission too.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:31:57 AM

Posts: 25
Joined: 8/7/2009
Status: offline

No, I'm saying she's average. I'm sure she's amazing!

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: Foot worshiping Dom - 10/14/2009 11:37:28 AM

Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline

I realise that i am being a bit thick here, but how does one clean like a slave??

(in reply to JonasTellas)

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